Yamaha NEO HD = the receiver of the future? - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 66 Old 06-29-2009, 06:54 PM - Thread Starter
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Seems pretty good... http://www.yamaha.com/yec/neoHD/whatisneohd.asp

Any opinions on this new product? Looks like a perfect fit for a bedroom or small living room.

I really like the direction Yamaha is taking with this "receiver".
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post #2 of 66 Old 06-29-2009, 09:30 PM
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I just saw this mentioned today too. I also totally appreciate the simplicity concept. And integrated wireless plus USB updating is also boss. But I notice that Yamaha, or no one else for that matter, ever mentions power rating. Do you know what it is?
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post #3 of 66 Old 06-29-2009, 09:44 PM
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It's only the receiver of the future if your needs are limited - at least that's my guess.

I assume limited connectivity and limited power.

If HDMI CEC ever becomes common, and well implemented, the one remote might really work, but I doubt it. Seems there's always some exception. Look at the PS3 with their Blu-ray based controller, for example.

I love the idea of a receiver with more control capabilities. Actually, my needs are 80% served by my Yamaha RX-V3900 remote. I can turn on my TV, control volume and select my source from the 3900. I do need the Tivo remote for TV, but trust me - Logitech Harmony does not do a good job of replacing the Tivo remote, I own one.

I almost never need my TV remote, or DVD remote. For Blu-ray, which is uncommon, I pull out my PS3 remote.

It all seems pretty easy currently.

"But this one goes up to 11"
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post #4 of 66 Old 06-29-2009, 10:05 PM
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Quote:


the PS3 with their Blu-ray based controller

You meant blue tooth of course

If B&Ms push this it could sell quite well.
Bose has made a mint from a similiar concept.

 

It ain't ignorance causes so much trouble; it's folks knowing so much that ain't so

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post #5 of 66 Old 06-29-2009, 10:06 PM
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Well, 210 million iPods sold tells me that quite a few people share my appreciation for K.I.S.S.
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post #6 of 66 Old 06-29-2009, 10:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ubercool View Post

Well, 210 million iPods sold tells me that quite a few people share my appreciation for K.I.S.S.

I'm with ubercool. Let's make this damn stuff easier to use *and* more powerful at the same time. I want it all and I want it now.
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post #7 of 66 Old 06-29-2009, 10:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Milt99 View Post

You meant blue tooth of course

If B&Ms push this it could sell quite well.
Bose has made a mint from a similiar concept.

Oops! Yep

"But this one goes up to 11"
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post #8 of 66 Old 06-29-2009, 10:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ubercool View Post

Well, 210 million iPods sold tells me that quite a few people share my appreciation for K.I.S.S.

iPods have a very nice interface. So does Tivo. One would wish other designers would take a look at those two products and learn from them.

"But this one goes up to 11"
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post #9 of 66 Old 06-30-2009, 09:29 PM
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I'm looking at the size of the NeoHD and note that it only weighs 7.9 lb., according to the specsheet on Yamaha's site:

Specifications
Product Dimensions W x H x D 11-3/4" x 3-5/8" x 13-1/8"
Product Weight 7.9 lbs

I guess it's a small unit judging by its 12x4x13-inch dimensions.
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post #10 of 66 Old 06-30-2009, 10:48 PM
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Wow. Even with digital amps, it's going to be a low powered system.

It also uses spring clips for all speakers.

From everything I can read, the answer to the OP is, no, it's not the receiver of the future. Some of it's concepts would be welcome in a full featured-full powered receiver though.

"But this one goes up to 11"
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post #11 of 66 Old 07-02-2009, 06:04 AM
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I suppose it's a good bet that all future models such as the upcoming 1900 replacement will be compatible with Neo. That's fine as long as they don't force me to use on-screen menus. I don't want anything popping up on screen when I'm adjusting something while watching a movie.
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post #12 of 66 Old 07-09-2009, 03:33 PM
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I guess I just think too far outside the box, or to far ahead of it.

This is a thread I started here last year.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1095821

Does anyone know if the Yamaha has 1080/24 pass through?
How many watts?
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post #13 of 66 Old 07-09-2009, 03:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 6SN7 View Post

I guess I just think too far outside the box, or to far ahead of it.

This is a thread I started here last year.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1095821

Does anyone know if the Yamaha has 1080/24 pass through?
How many watts?

No one has been able to answer the watts question, so we'll have to wait until the manual becomes available.
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post #14 of 66 Old 07-09-2009, 07:02 PM
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I downloaded the pdf of the manual. Not wattage listed.
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post #15 of 66 Old 07-09-2009, 07:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 6SN7 View Post

I downloaded the pdf of the manual. Not wattage listed.

Ah, OK, well since it only weighs eight pounds, how about 15 watts per channel?
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post #16 of 66 Old 07-11-2009, 12:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kriktsemaj99 View Post

I suppose it's a good bet that all future models such as the upcoming 1900 replacement will be compatible with Neo. That's fine as long as they don't force me to use on-screen menus. I don't want anything popping up on screen when I'm adjusting something while watching a movie.

I don't mean to get off topic here but I could not help noticing the comment on the replacement to the 1900. I have been debating on getting a rx-v3900 or holding out for the updated version to be revealed. I was curious kriktsemaj99 do you have any sources or any furhter information on these replacements. I have been to the end of the web searching for this information over the last few days and have not been able to find anything of value so far. Thank you for your assistance.

TGR497
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post #17 of 66 Old 07-11-2009, 03:00 PM
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I've only seen the limited amount of info posted on avsforum. It seems the 2065 is due to replace the 1900 this summer, and the 3900 will not be replaced until next year (which makes sense as the 3900 has a lot more new features than the 1900). Hopefully some real details of the 2065 will leak out in the next month.
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post #18 of 66 Old 07-11-2009, 03:44 PM
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kriktsemaj99 thank you for your quick reply. Unfortunately sounds like we are in the same boat, waiting for details to leak out. I will continue to hunt this wide web and see if I can't drill any information from Yamaha some how.

TGR497
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post #19 of 66 Old 07-11-2009, 04:37 PM
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Here are a few shots of the Neo HD units.





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post #20 of 66 Old 07-11-2009, 04:52 PM
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USB, Ethernet, HDMI, multichannel, wireless.

Yep, it's the future.
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post #21 of 66 Old 07-11-2009, 06:08 PM
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If the future is all about low powered units

"But this one goes up to 11"
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post #22 of 66 Old 07-12-2009, 11:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MichaelJHuman View Post

If the future is all about low powered units

Even amplification is undergoing a revolution such as we are seeing with connectivity. Note the sub-outs on the units. These Yamahas are not designed to run rull range sound. Speaking in generalities, a probable logical conclusion for the "future" would see lower powered and much more efficient amps for the mids and highs and separate amplification for the lows. The advent of DSP *and* better designs with higher efficiency speakers is making this possible. I do quite well with 10 watts per channel on a 2.1 setup and rarely use more than 4 watts from the main amp. You just have to pair it with the right speakers and subs.

Keep in mind your speaker efficiencies: i.e, 91 dB @ 1 meter @ 1 watt. I listen to a two-channel setup from about 2 meters. You lose 3 dB per doubling of distance, which requires a doubling of power to recover, so to sustain 91 dB at 2 meters, you need 2 watts of power with transient peaks requiring about 4 watts (just guessing on that); however, everything below 60 Hz goes to the sub, so the demand on the amp is very benign. Now, sustained 91 dB is loud enough to listen to throughout the entire house and really is too loud in the same room for more than a short time. I generally listen for hours in the high-70's with transient peaks of 90 dB, which is roughly twice as loud as normal face-to-face conversation.

Having said all that, implementation of technology will always trump raw technology. Yamaha may have hit a homerun with these units or produced lemons. It all depends on how they implemented everything.
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post #23 of 66 Old 07-12-2009, 11:17 AM
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Class D amplifiers are more efficient. But there's no indication that this product uses class D amplification.

They could use something like class H/G which would improve efficiency.

Obviously we would need to wait for more information on this product. But based on what I can infer now, it looks like it will lack power.

p.s. I am well aware of factors such as speaker efficiency. You also have to take into account peak over average level. Peaks could be 20 dB or more above average level depending on the source. I am aware not all people require a lot of power. But low powered receivers don't impress me personally.

"But this one goes up to 11"
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post #24 of 66 Old 07-12-2009, 11:26 AM
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Here's some brief specs -

• Power Consumption
YMC-700 ............................................................ .................. 60 W
YMC-500 ............................................................ .................. 50 W
• Standby Power Consumption (Reference Data) ..................... 0.6 W
• Maximum Power Consumption
5 ch, 10% THD ............................................................ ....... 170 W

"But this one goes up to 11"
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post #25 of 66 Old 07-12-2009, 11:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Taperwood View Post

Keep in mind your speaker efficiencies: i.e, 91 dB @ 1 meter @ 1 watt. I listen to a two-channel setup from about 2 meters. You lose 3 dB per doubling of distance, which requires a doubling of power to recover

Inverse square law. Doubling of distance drops the SPL by a factor of 4 (6dB). But you're right that we usually don't need as many watts as we think we do. Also see the power calculator.
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post #26 of 66 Old 07-12-2009, 11:30 AM
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I don't care what amp topology they use - a max power consumption of 170 watts with 10% THD is low powered.

There's a reason they don't list a power output for this thing, not even some sort of bogus summed power figure like 250 watts

"But this one goes up to 11"
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post #27 of 66 Old 07-15-2009, 06:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MichaelJHuman View Post

I don't care what amp topology they use - a max power consumption of 170 watts with 10% THD is low powered.

There's a reason they don't list a power output for this thing, not even some sort of bogus summed power figure like 250 watts

I guess someone needs to test one of these units out on their speakers and see how they perform.

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post #28 of 66 Old 07-29-2009, 09:25 AM
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Well, I'm volunteering to be the guinea pig--I picked up a version of the neoHD at my local Myer Emco today. The sales guy claimed that its rated at 90w/channel, somehow modeled off of the yamaha 565. Looking at the spec sheet and given the discussion here, I'm pretty sure I don't believe that, but it sounded okay in the store, so I took it home for a spin. I'll let you all know how well it works.

Cheers!
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post #29 of 66 Old 07-29-2009, 02:01 PM
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Fantastic! Look forward to your feedback!
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post #30 of 66 Old 09-09-2009, 01:00 PM
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I just got the YMC-700 off ebay for a pretty good price.. And received it, but having some issues.

While they have every input I would possibly need.. The combinations are limited.

I have a Mac Mini, and I need to connect it using a DVI->HDMI cable. That works fine, but how to get sound out now? Well... Here's the problem!

You cannot use any other audio inputs when using HDMI! There is no option to change the input anywhere. I tried everything I could, updated to the latest 1.02 firmware..

I e-mailed tech support and waiting for an answer. But if you are in this situation it looks like this device would be of no use!

As a workaround I figured I could just plug the audio out to my TV set, and use the sound from there... Well, my Samsung will not accept the analog audio when HDCP is used through HDMI. So... yeah... Hopefully there is a fix for this otherwise I will have to buy something else.

I went with this unit because it is much smaller than other receivers and performs all I want. I don't want to go above 5.1 in my current setup so it was perfect.. But this 1 missing feature makes it pretty useless in my setup.
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