Official Harman Kardon AVR 1600/2600/3600 owner's thread - AVS Forum

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Receivers, Amps, and Processors

blackmax2k1's Avatar blackmax2k1
06:18 PM Liked: 10
post #1 of 2843
09-11-2009 | Posts: 1,189
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Yay, my first time starting a new receiver thread!

Just received the AVR 2600 from jr.com. I currently have the previous gen 254. Out of the box the 2600 the first thing I noticed was the rounded corners, a first for HK. Reminds me of the new Marantz. Here are some pics of the unit and the GUI. Pardon the dust!
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blackmax2k1's Avatar blackmax2k1
06:25 PM Liked: 10
post #2 of 2843
09-11-2009 | Posts: 1,189
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Just some quick observations-

Notice the Dolby Volume in a couple of areas. The overlay has the symbol and the calibration on the GUI.

Also the buttons are smaller than previous gens. Seem kinda cheap. The text description is above them and hard to read in low light compared to the dark text on the aluminum buttons on the previous models.

I do like the jack covers. Never a fan of seeing the connections on front.

Not that this means anything but out of the box without running EzSet it sounds better than the 254.

One thing I didn't include in a pic is that on the bottom is a "system info" area with the software version and "upgrade" for firmware using the USB port! Much better than going to Radio Shack for a stupid cable.
blackmax2k1's Avatar blackmax2k1
06:33 PM Liked: 10
post #3 of 2843
09-11-2009 | Posts: 1,189
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Two pics that will make many people happy! Awesome! No volume overlay though is a bummer. Can't have everything! In my experience with the 254 the first pic with the source menu "resolution from source" always said 1080p because of the processing always on. But with the processing on with the 2600 it now says 720p for both as you can see in the pic. Makes no sense.
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bommai's Avatar bommai
08:30 PM Liked: 19
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09-11-2009 | Posts: 4,518
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blackmax2k1 View Post

Two pics that will make many people happy! Awesome! No volume overlay though is a bummer. Can't have everything! In my experience with the 254 the first pic with the source menu "resolution from source" always said 1080p because of the processing always on. But with the processing on with the 2600 it now says 720p for both as you can see in the pic. Makes no sense.

What TV are you using? May be the receiver thinks that you are connected to a 720p display. That is why it is using 720p as output.
blackmax2k1's Avatar blackmax2k1
08:39 PM Liked: 10
post #5 of 2843
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The 2600 is displaying it correctly at 720p but the 254 said 1080p which the TV is not.
PIRSQUARED's Avatar PIRSQUARED
09:12 PM Liked: 10
post #6 of 2843
09-11-2009 | Posts: 401
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I'm sure we'd all like to hear what experience you have with the HDMI compatibility and reliability. Based on your pics, I assume you're running HDMI from your Cable/Sat box via the 2600, then HDMI out to your display. Any significant delays, or drop outs, when changing channels? How about a Blu-ray device connected via HDMI, etc...eager to hear about it!

I've been a fan of H/K's U.I., so I'm hoping they've fixed the HDMI issues...
BAMAVADER's Avatar BAMAVADER
01:59 AM Liked: 13
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09-12-2009 | Posts: 885
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Guys that are owners of these three, please keep us informed on any problems that you run into or any potential problems. As well as what has and has not been corrected compared to the 54 series. I am very interested in the 2600 or 3600.

thanks guys...
M Code's Avatar M Code
06:37 AM Liked: 133
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09-12-2009 | Posts: 9,968
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blackmax2k1 View Post

Two pics that will make many people happy! Awesome! No volume overlay though is a bummer.

The Volume Level overlay bitmap is generated by the OSD part within the video processor. If you turn OFF the video processor then there is NO volume level ovelay available. If you want this feature keep the video processor ON..

Next question..

Just my $0.015..
blackmax2k1's Avatar blackmax2k1
03:25 PM Liked: 10
post #9 of 2843
09-12-2009 | Posts: 1,189
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M Code, I figured that. Makes sense. At least you have the option unlike the 54 series.

As far as Dolby Volume and audio dropping out I'll test that thoroughly tonight when the wife is gone. The audio is delayed a bit after pressing play but not as bad as previous models.

One other little thing I noticed, I guess HK didn't fork over enough cash to have Dolby Volume and Dolby Headphone! It's now called "Harman Headphone". I will try that out too. M Code, you know anything about that?

I have to say the little bit it's been used, a nice upgrade from the 254 I had considering the price I paid. No quirks as of yet.
M Code's Avatar M Code
06:26 PM Liked: 133
post #10 of 2843
09-12-2009 | Posts: 9,968
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blackmax2k1 View Post

One other little thing I noticed, I guess HK didn't fork over enough cash to have Dolby Volume and Dolby Headphone! It's now called "Harman Headphone". I will try that out too. M Code, you know anything about that?

I have to say the little bit it's been used, a nice upgrade from the 254 I had considering the price I paid. No quirks as of yet.

Have you tried Harman Headphone yet?
This was developed by Harman engineers, I heard it several months back and thought it sounded pretty good..

Just my $0.015...
blackmax2k1's Avatar blackmax2k1
10:00 PM Liked: 10
post #11 of 2843
09-12-2009 | Posts: 1,189
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Alright, I used my PS3 tonight to watch a BR movie. Well the processor was on, (had the overlay) and when I used the bypass I didn't get any picture. It said the resolution from the source was 1080p even though my PS3 doesn't have that resolution checked. So I turn the processor back on (no HDMI bypass) and the picture comes on again. Why won't it accept my 720p from my PS3 to go through directly to the 720p TV I have? But with my Directv box the bypass works fine with those resolutions.

On another note, Dolby Volume is working great with commercials. I think it works better than the Denon I had with Dynamic Volume. I can actually tell a difference with Dolby.
jzonta's Avatar jzonta
03:00 PM Liked: 10
post #12 of 2843
09-14-2009 | Posts: 17
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Ordered a 1600 from J&R for $339 and free shipping about 3 weeks ago. When are online retailers getting them? Ive been checking everyday in anticipation....
blackmax2k1's Avatar blackmax2k1
05:47 PM Liked: 10
post #13 of 2843
09-14-2009 | Posts: 1,189
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Should be any day. Killer deal btw.
blackmax2k1's Avatar blackmax2k1
08:02 AM Liked: 10
post #14 of 2843
09-15-2009 | Posts: 1,189
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I tried out "Harman Headphone" last night. Sounded great. I don't miss Dolby Headphone. They did a good job with it.
jzonta's Avatar jzonta
11:10 AM Liked: 10
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09-15-2009 | Posts: 17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blackmax2k1 View Post

On another note, Dolby Volume is working great with commercials. I think it works better than the Denon I had with Dynamic Volume. I can actually tell a difference with Dolby.


Must be nice using the dolby volume during football games...I was just over a friends house yesterday watching a football game and it was very annoying having to lower the volume during commercials. I kinda wanted the 2600 for the dolby volume but i just couldnt pass up the deal on the 1600.

I also noted that best buy now carries onkyo...ive heard some people say that they replaced it with harman kardon? just asking cuse i know some people are waiting for best buy to get them.
blackmax2k1's Avatar blackmax2k1
11:31 AM Liked: 10
post #16 of 2843
09-15-2009 | Posts: 1,189
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jzonta View Post


I also noted that best buy now carries onkyo...ive heard some people say that they replaced it with harman kardon? just asking cuse i know some people are waiting for best buy to get them.

I saw that too. Definitely a possibility since they have nothing on their site. CircuitCity got rid of them, maybe Best Buy will too. Though it does look like Onkyo will be Magnolia only so they might have the lower model HK's.
KLee's Avatar KLee
11:42 AM Liked: 11
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09-15-2009 | Posts: 1,716
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So I might as well just ask:

Does the 2600/3600 have the ability to overlay Logic7 7.1 processing on normal multichannel sources such as DVDs(Dolby Digital,dts) Blu Ray movies (DD+,LPCM Lossless, dts HD Master Audio, Dolby TrueHD)and games (PS3/Xbox360)?

I know Lexicon products can do this and I believe back in the day the HK AVR7200 could apply L7 to DVDs but ever since then HK recievers can only apply L7 processing to 2 channel sources, making this feature inferior to Pro Logic IIx in my eyes...

It would be really nice to know if the new HKs can do L7 processing across ALL audio sources via HDMI.....otherwise it looks like an Onkyo 3007 is in my future
M Code's Avatar M Code
11:57 AM Liked: 133
post #18 of 2843
09-15-2009 | Posts: 9,968
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KLee View Post

So I might as well just ask:

Does the 2600/3600 have the ability to overlay Logic7 7.1 processing on normal multichannel sources such as DVDs(Dolby Digital,dts) Blu Ray movies (DD+,LPCM Lossless, dts HD Master Audio, Dolby TrueHD)and games (PS3/Xbox360)?

I know Lexicon products can do this and I believe back in the day the HK AVR7200 could apply L7 to DVDs but ever since then HK recievers can only apply L7 processing to 2 channel sources, making it inferiro to Pro Logic IIx in my eyes

NO..
The L7 found in the 1600/2600/3600 can output 5.1 or 7.1 when the audio source stream is either 2-CH analog or PCM..
The L7 overlay feature requires much more DSP power/resources, this is found on the step-up HK AVRs such as the 435, 635, 445, 645, 745 and the just released AVR7550HD..

Just my $0.015...
KLee's Avatar KLee
12:04 PM Liked: 11
post #19 of 2843
09-15-2009 | Posts: 1,716
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M Code View Post

NO..
The L7 found in the 1600/2600/3600 can output 5.1 or 7.1 when the audio source stream is either 2-CH analog or PCM..
The L7 overlay feature requires much more DSP power/resources, this is found on the step-up HK AVRs such as the 435, 635, 445, 645, 745 and the just released AVR7550HD..

Just my $0.015...

Thanks for the reply Mcode......to clarify the features I want are:

A) L7 and DPL2x/z processing of 5.1 sources over HDMI

B) Dolby Volume

and C) DD+, Dolby TrueHD,dts MA decoding



Therefore my only solution is the AVR 7550HD, correct?
M Code's Avatar M Code
12:28 PM Liked: 133
post #20 of 2843
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KLee View Post

Thanks for the reply Mcode......to clarify the features I want are:

A) L7 and DPL2x/z processing of 5.1 sources over HDMI

B) Dolby Volume

and C) DD+, Dolby TrueHD,dts MA decoding

Therefore my only solution is the AVR 7550HD, correct?

Firstly..
As of now HK does not have an AVR with DPL2z..
The 2600/3600 do B & C. I think they also can overlay DPL2x on 5.1 sources through HDMI but you better double check for this point with the HK guys..
Only the 7550HD can do A, B & C minus the DPL2z..

Just my $0.015...
blackmax2k1's Avatar blackmax2k1
11:03 AM Liked: 10
post #21 of 2843
09-18-2009 | Posts: 1,189
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PIRSQUARED View Post

I'm sure we'd all like to hear what experience you have with the HDMI compatibility and reliability. Based on your pics, I assume you're running HDMI from your Cable/Sat box via the 2600, then HDMI out to your display. Any significant delays, or drop outs, when changing channels? How about a Blu-ray device connected via HDMI, etc...eager to hear about it!

I've been a fan of H/K's U.I., so I'm hoping they've fixed the HDMI issues...

After playing with it more it does have the same delays and dropouts. Like when I fast forward a commercial and then come back to the show the first couple words are not there. I don't see why they never fix this problem. As far as having any handshaking issues I haven't had any.
Talon884's Avatar Talon884
11:36 AM Liked: 10
post #22 of 2843
09-18-2009 | Posts: 275
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blackmax2k1 View Post

After playing with it more it does have the same delays and dropouts. Like when I fast forward a commercial and then come back to the show the first couple words are not there. I don't see why they never fix this problem. As far as having any handshaking issues I haven't had any.

I don't know of ANY AVR's that don't have some sort of dropouts ... are their any that I haven't heard yet?
blackmax2k1's Avatar blackmax2k1
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post #23 of 2843
09-18-2009 | Posts: 1,189
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Talon884 View Post

I don't know of ANY AVR's that don't have some sort of dropouts ... are their any that I haven't heard yet?

Never had a problem with Pioneer.
KLee's Avatar KLee
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09-19-2009 | Posts: 1,716
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M Code View Post

Firstly..
As of now HK does not have an AVR with DPL2z..
The 2600/3600 do B & C. I think they also can overlay DPL2x on 5.1 sources through HDMI but you better double check for this point with the HK guys..
Only the 7550HD can do A, B & C minus the DPL2z..

Just my $0.015...

to be honest i dont really need dpl2z..... dpl2x is good enough for me actuality, the 2600 is looking better all the time to me because the7550hd, at $2000 is way out of my price range, whereas $500 for a 2600 is much more like it
Scott101's Avatar Scott101
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09-20-2009 | Posts: 33
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Hi,

Can anyone confirm the exact model number of the Faroudja DCDi Cinema Torino chipset in the AVR 2600/3600 models?
Is it the FLI30436 chipset?

I called HK and they said the video processing is using a different chipset than the x54 series. They said it is better but would not state the model number

Can anyone confirm how the AVR 2600 video processing and sound quality compares to a HK AVR 254?

Thanks.
M Code's Avatar M Code
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post #26 of 2843
09-20-2009 | Posts: 9,968
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scott101 View Post

Hi,

Can anyone confirm the exact model number of the Faroudja DCDi Cinema Torino chipset in the AVR 2600/3600 models?
Is it the FLI30436 chipset?

I called HK and they said the video processing is using a different chipset than the x54 series. They said it is better but would not state the model number

Can anyone confirm how the AVR 2600 video processing and sound quality compares to a HK AVR 254?

Thanks.

The video processor in the 2600/3600 is the FLI30436A, same as 254/354 and 7550HD. But the 2600 video PCB has been revised along with later firmware. Regarding the audio side of the 2600 and 254, both use the Cirrus Logic CS49702 but the 2600 has an additional DSP (CS48DV8) for the Dolby Volume feature...

Next question..

Just my $0.015...
jsleonardo's Avatar jsleonardo
08:31 AM Liked: 10
post #27 of 2843
09-22-2009 | Posts: 31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M Code View Post

The video processor in the 2600/3600 is the FLI30436A, same as 254/354 and 7550HD. But the 2600 video PCB has been revised along with later firmware. Regarding the audio side of the 2600 and 254, both use the Cirrus Logic CS49702 but the 2600 has an additional DSP (CS48DV8) for the Dolby Volume feature...

Next question..

Just my $0.015...

Hi M Code,

Checking on the Cirrus Logic website, the DSP with Dolby Volume technology is CS49DV8 not CS48DV8.
mr.zero's Avatar mr.zero
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post #28 of 2843
09-22-2009 | Posts: 5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blackmax2k1 View Post

After playing with it more it does have the same delays and dropouts. Like when I fast forward a commercial and then come back to the show the first couple words are not there. I don't see why they never fix this problem.

so, for example, if i skip commercials on my tivoHD connected via HDMI thru the AVR2600 i should expect dialogue drop-outs? i'm looking to replace my 5-year old marantz sr5500 (no hdmi in/outputs) and interested in the HK but a bit gun-shy... if it works as advertised the dolby volume alone looks like a huge +, but my sr5500 basically "just works" invisibly so i hate to get a new piece of hardware that introduces annoyances. thanks in advance for any advice anyone can offer. the depth of knowledge on this forum blows my mind!!
blackmax2k1's Avatar blackmax2k1
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post #29 of 2843
09-22-2009 | Posts: 1,189
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Yeah the audio doesn't come back instantly so you miss words sometimes. To work around it I make sure I stop soon enough before the show starts for the audio to come back on. I mean is the Cirrus Logic posted above only used in HK's? I doubt it but HK is the worst when it comes to instant anything.
mr.zero's Avatar mr.zero
01:26 PM Liked: 10
post #30 of 2843
09-22-2009 | Posts: 5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blackmax2k1 View Post

Yeah the audio doesn't come back instantly so you miss words sometimes. To work around it I make sure I stop soon enough before the show starts for the audio to come back on. I mean is the Cirrus Logic posted above only used in HK's? I doubt it but HK is the worst when it comes to instant anything.

hmmm, i wonder if tivo's "smart" FF/REW feature would make the dropouts irrelevant... or worse.
i've heard some folks rave about their HKs... but in reality are they not all they're cracked up to be? seems like a lot of the 254/354 owners have major gripes...

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