Sherwood R-972 User Thread - Page 54 - AVS Forum
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post #1591 of 3210 Old 05-24-2012, 03:43 PM
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To get my feet wet before connecting it to a bunch of speakers, I set my R-972 up in the bedroom background music system.

This system is very simple: 2.1 channel with a pair of KEF Q100's, and a DIY sub with a Peerless XLS12 driver and passive radiator in a 40L box, powered by a Dayton SA240 plate amp. Only source is an AppleTV2, connected to the R-972 via HDMI. For setup purposes, I brought in a computer monitor with a DVI input and a native resolution of 1900x1200. One pleasant surprise: it was able to pass video from the setup menu AppleTV to the monitor with an HDMI-to-DVI adapter. Not terribly relevant, because we won't be putting an infernal screen in our bedroom at any point. But nice for setup, because my only other available screen is a 46" LCD that would have to be schlepped a good distance!

With Trinnov off, the system sounds basically like it did when powered by a Meridian 551 integrated amp. I'm fairly certain I wouldn't be able to tell the difference in a blind test, with the bass management set to full-range mains augmented by a sub. (I had connected the sub to the 551's preouts, as it predates modern bass management.)

With Trinnov on, sorry Bob Stuart. This humble AVR easily trounces your cute little integrated.

Furthermore, I've never heard an auto-EQ get the sub-mains integration this right first time out. That includes MultEQ XT and ARC. (At the calibration position, at least; obviously this is a single-sub system so it screws up everything but in the calibrated spot.) Normally I have to measure and fiddle post-calibration. I'll still verify what Trinnov's done, but it sounds right.

The +6dB curve is too rich for loud listening, but works well to mitigate the lack of Dolby Volume's volume modeler (or Audyssey DynamicEQ) at softer volumes.

One funny hiccup that was pretty frustrating at first. Because it lights up red, I assumed that the speaker icon being lit meant that the speakers were off! In fact, I had half written an "I'm frustrated" post here before hitting the speaker button, seeing the red icon come on, and hearing glorious music.

To quote the song to which I'm currently listening, Radiohead's "Separator," if you think this is over then you're wrong.

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post #1592 of 3210 Old 05-25-2012, 11:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StevenLansing View Post

Depends on how awkward Trinnov finds it to be.It's not really adjustable.It gives you a result and you either like it or you don't...

Hardly.

Running setup again without changing anything can give different results, let alone changing mike and/or speaker positions/orientations.

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post #1593 of 3210 Old 05-25-2012, 01:21 PM
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Originally Posted by noah katz View Post

Hardly.

Running setup again without changing anything can give different results, let alone changing mike and/or speaker positions/orientations.

I was speaking specifically about any changes you can make through the unit after you get a result.No real ability to tweak through the unit outside of what limited selections are on the EQ screen.
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post #1594 of 3210 Old 05-29-2012, 05:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bill1908 View Post

I tried the optical cable...same delay. This delay really sucks.
I also tried the L/R analog cables out of the cable box. I lose a little lfe as to be expected but I have to say dolby movie is exceptional and you don't have any delay switching channels.

I had many avr's and a pre-pro, a couple quirks i'm used to. But I don't think I can live with these.

I'm close to pulling the trigger on the R-972. But the above issue with audio delay with my SA-8300HD DVR would be the deal breaker. Has the audio delay issue been resolved (FW upgrade)?

My SACD collection, watch it grow and my wallet shrink ;-).

 

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post #1595 of 3210 Old 05-29-2012, 06:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Mac View Post

I'm close to pulling the trigger on the R-972. But the above issue with audio delay with my SA-8300HD DVR would be the deal breaker. Has the audio delay issue been resolved (FW upgrade)?

Nope. Sorry Bill.

Wish you could experience it. I really don't think it is that bad.

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post #1596 of 3210 Old 05-29-2012, 06:20 PM
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Originally Posted by cschang View Post

Nope. Sorry Bill.

Wish you could experience it. I really don't think it is that bad.

Curtis,

As always thanks for your thoughts. I really would love to experience Trinnov but we watch quite a bit of TV (mostly sports) in our house. It would drive me crazy and my wife even more so watching me get crazy.

Bill

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post #1597 of 3210 Old 05-29-2012, 07:10 PM
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Originally Posted by Bill Mac View Post

... It would drive me crazy and my wife even more so watching me get crazy. ...

Heh, I thought that was the whole point in watching sports....
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post #1598 of 3210 Old 05-29-2012, 07:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Mac View Post

As always thanks for your thoughts. I really would love to experience Trinnov but we watch quite a bit of TV (mostly sports) in our house. It would drive me crazy and my wife even more so watching me get crazy.

I was thinking about that, and observing during the NBA and NHL playoffs. No issues that I noticed with commercial breaks

Now, if you are channel flipping, then sometimes it takes time to sync, as well on some channels when the stream changes during and after commercials. It has not been a problem on any of the shows that I watch on the major channels.

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post #1599 of 3210 Old 05-29-2012, 08:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Mac View Post

Curtis,

As always thanks for your thoughts. I really would love to experience Trinnov but we watch quite a bit of TV (mostly sports) in our house. It would drive me crazy and my wife even more so watching me get crazy.

Bill

For TV watching, there's always dedicating the analog input for that and and sending cable tv HDMI direct to the viewing devise.... You can always get it done, one way or another. Just got to weigh the tradeoffs.

This being said by one who is currently listening to a SACD playing through the Trinnov. Life is better without compromises!

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post #1600 of 3210 Old 05-30-2012, 02:22 PM
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I posted this on the user thread as well.I need to know if I have a possible defective unit.

Can anyone try this. Turn the volume control on the 972 to +0dB or higher with no audio playing through the unit and switch the unit from Trinnov position "none" to a position(1-3) and EQ or spatial mappimg don't need to be on and see if you clearly hear an audible constant interference like noise(don't know how to describe it but have never heard it before) coming from the sub when the unit is using a Trinnov position.

I only get this noise through the sub and only when the unit is set to use one of the Trinnov positions.When I switch the unit to none the sound goes away.I've confirmed that it originates from the 972 and is not the sub.I even connected the sub to the MC-12 and adjusted the volume all the way up to max and other than a very slight hiss this sound isn't present.It does this on every input when the Trinnov is engaged.The sound is very audible once I turn the volume up towards +0dB or higher from the listening position.

Also has anyone made mention of a sizzling sound coming from all the speakers after you run a calibration without the mic connected and the unit gives you a calibration error due to not picking up the test signal.I only tried this just to see if anything would work to eliminate the noise issue.

I'm starting to think my unit may be defective.

Thanks
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post #1601 of 3210 Old 05-30-2012, 02:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StevenLansing View Post

I posted this on the user thread as well.I need to know if I have a possible defective unit.

Can anyone try this. Turn the volume control on the 972 to +0dB or higher with no audio playing through the unit and switch the unit from Trinnov position "none" to a position(1-3) and EQ or spatial mappimg don't need to be on and see if you clearly hear an audible constant interference like noise(don't know how to describe it but have never heard it before) coming from the sub when the unit is using a Trinnov position.

I only get this noise through the sub and only when the unit is set to use one of the Trinnov positions....

I have mine set to 3D. Just turned the unit on, with no media playing. My Velodyne sub lit up, I turned the volume dial to 0 and stuck my ear to the sub.

Not a peep.

Try running your calibration again, just in case. I am assuming you don't have grounding issues (I did with my old Sunfire subs, but never with the Velodynes).
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post #1602 of 3210 Old 05-30-2012, 02:48 PM
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Thanks Ryan1,

It's not my sub causing the issue it's the R-972,only when Trinnov is engaged does it produce this noise.Trinnov off no noise.

I was hoping to avoid re-running the calibration.The calibration I have now is working really well.It's much better now than the first listening experience I had.I also think the first movie I used for evaluation wasn't up to par.

I did reset the unit twice before the cal. I have now because I noticed this issue with the previous calibration.The reset didn't change anything.I don't know if just running and saving another quick cal. will make any difference.It will be a little while before I can try.

If a few more could confirm that they aren't experiencing this than I'm just going to hopefully exchange it for another if they still remain in stock long enough.
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post #1603 of 3210 Old 05-30-2012, 09:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StevenLansing View Post

I posted this on the user thread as well.I need to know if I have a possible defective unit.

Can anyone try this. Turn the volume control on the 972 to +0dB or higher with no audio playing through the unit and switch the unit from Trinnov position "none" to a position(1-3) and EQ or spatial mappimg don't need to be on and see if you clearly hear an audible constant interference like noise(don't know how to describe it but have never heard it before) coming from the sub when the unit is using a Trinnov position.

I only get this noise through the sub and only when the unit is set to use one of the Trinnov positions.When I switch the unit to none the sound goes away.I've confirmed that it originates from the 972 and is not the sub.I even connected the sub to the MC-12 and adjusted the volume all the way up to max and other than a very slight hiss this sound isn't present.It does this on every input when the Trinnov is engaged.The sound is very audible once I turn the volume up towards +0dB or higher from the listening position.

Also has anyone made mention of a sizzling sound coming from all the speakers after you run a calibration without the mic connected and the unit gives you a calibration error due to not picking up the test signal.I only tried this just to see if anything would work to eliminate the noise issue.

I'm starting to think my unit may be defective.

Thanks

In these two threads there were some people reporting feedback on the sub channel. I did notice it at one time on mine and discovered it was caused by the remote. I could change the feedback by moving the remote in space. I took the batteries out of the remote and havent had further issues. Might try that, no guarantees
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post #1604 of 3210 Old 05-31-2012, 07:53 AM
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The microphone can also feedback. It should be unplugged after calibrating the system.

Jeff
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post #1605 of 3210 Old 05-31-2012, 02:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AcousticSoul View Post

In these two threads there were some people reporting feedback on the sub channel. I did notice it at one time on mine and discovered it was caused by the remote. I could change the feedback by moving the remote in space. I took the batteries out of the remote and havent had further issues. Might try that, no guarantees

That's interesting,I'm not using the supplied remote though,so it wouldn't likely be causing the issue.

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Originally Posted by Stereojeff View Post

The microphone can also feedback. It should be unplugged after calibrating the system.

Jeff

I always unplug the mic before I turn the unit back on after it saves a calibration.

The noise is only present when Trinnov position is switched from none to a calibration position and the closer the volume gets to 0dB and above..It's not a faint sound it's very easy to hear.I'm wondering if it's possibly microprocessor noise.That shouldn't be this audible unless it's a bad design or a bad unit.

Does anybody know if this unit uses a digital volume control where it's S/N ratio gets lower and looses bits when the volume is decreased or if it's a digitally controlled analog volume control?
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post #1606 of 3210 Old 05-31-2012, 09:56 PM
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Digitally controlled analog volume control.

Jeff
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post #1607 of 3210 Old 05-31-2012, 10:42 PM
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Would you guys recommend this receiver to a friend? There seems to be so many little buggy things and this doesn't seem to be a well polished receiver as of yet, but I am still very curious about it. What do you think? Is it worth a shot over say a comparable (price wise) Onkyo? I am just a little nervous about the bugs. Please advise.

Thanks!
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post #1608 of 3210 Old 06-01-2012, 12:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StevenLansing View Post

...Can anyone try this. Turn the volume control on the 972 to +0dB or higher with no audio playing through the unit...

Apologize for the late response, but I tried it and there was no feedback on/from the sub whatsoever.

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Originally Posted by Jrunr View Post

Would you guys recommend this receiver to a friend? There seems to be so many little buggy things and this doesn't seem to be a well polished receiver as of yet, but I am still very curious about it. What do you think? Is it worth a shot over say a comparable (price wise) Onkyo? I am just a little nervous about the bugs. Please advise.

Thanks!

It all depends on what you're looking for. Especially if you're a channel flipper then I would not recommend getting it. If it cost twice as much I would recommend the Denon 4311 instead.

To elaborate, it lacks so many bells and whistles (ie, no internet apps, no dynamic volume, etc.) that other $600 AVRs have but I don't care for any of these. The audio drops for 1-4 seconds (video is ok) when you flip channels, skip chapters, hit play after Fwd/Rev, etc, but I am ok with it because I don't have cable/sat to begin with. IMO the video scaler seems to be problematic so I just put it in bypass as I let my Oppo 83SE do its wonders with discs and my projector can upscale other sources quite well. Trinnov processing is so amazing (I'll let others elaborate on this 'amazing') and, for me, it out-weighs the nagging of audio drops. To be fair there are 2 other things worth mentioning: 1) this is my first experience with room correction and 2) I have not compare its 2ch bypass 'goodness' to that of my Bryston SP1.7 so I have no comments on that. Anyway, the Bryston is now out of the rack and will be on sale soon

Cheers,
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post #1609 of 3210 Old 06-01-2012, 01:31 AM
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Thanks XJ6,

It's looking more like I'm going to be returning this one for another one.By the way does the monitor aspect allow you to choose the wide setting.Mine only allows the standard setting, it won't change to anything else.Is this a known bug as well?
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post #1610 of 3210 Old 06-01-2012, 06:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by XJ6 View Post

Apologize for the late response, but I tried it and there was no feedback on/from the sub whatsoever.


It all depends on what you're looking for. Especially if you're a channel flipper then I would not recommend getting it. If it cost twice as much I would recommend the Denon 4311 instead.

To elaborate, it lacks so many bells and whistles (ie, no internet apps, no dynamic volume, etc.) that other $600 AVRs have but I don't care for any of these. The audio drops for 1-4 seconds (video is ok) when you flip channels, skip chapters, hit play after Fwd/Rev, etc, but I am ok with it because I don't have cable/sat to begin with. IMO the video scaler seems to be problematic so I just put it in bypass as I let my Oppo 83SE do its wonders with discs and my projector can upscale other sources quite well. Trinnov processing is so amazing (I'll let others elaborate on this 'amazing') and, for me, it out-weighs the nagging of audio drops. To be fair there are 2 other things worth mentioning: 1) this is my first experience with room correction and 2) I have not compare its 2ch bypass 'goodness' to that of my Bryston SP1.7 so I have no comments on that. Anyway, the Bryston is now out of the rack and will be on sale soon

Cheers,

Do they all have these audio drop-outs? Or is it just a select few? Is there a firmware upgrade in the future here? lol
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post #1611 of 3210 Old 06-01-2012, 08:24 AM
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Originally Posted by Jrunr View Post

Do they all have these audio drop-outs? Or is it just a select few? Is there a firmware upgrade in the future here? lol

As far as I know they all have the audio drop out and it is intentional to avoid "pops" or something like that.

Supposedly there will be more firmware updates for this receiver (I was actually told end of May but that obviously did not happen)

I would be very happy if they could reduce the amount of time for the audio drop and do something with the scaler to avoid the freeze up issue with certain cable boxes.
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post #1612 of 3210 Old 06-01-2012, 10:18 AM
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Do you think they will actually do this firmware update? I just want a receiver that has good power and focuses more on great home theater sound than anything else. I don't need different zones or different sound modes for stereo. I don't do any critical two channel listening. I just want GREAT home theater sound. I know some receivers are better than others and I read a review regarding the Anthem receivers saying that they are made for just pure HT bliss and are not the best at anything else. This is what I hope to get at a MUCH better price with this one.

Am I asking too much to hope this will sound better than a $1000 Onkyo, pioneer, or Yamaha for HT??
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post #1613 of 3210 Old 06-01-2012, 10:38 AM
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Originally Posted by Jrunr View Post

Am I asking too much to hope this will sound better than a $1000 Onkyo, pioneer, or Yamaha for HT??

No, you're not.

It sounds appreciably better than the $2k MSRP Denon 4311 I had.

The intrinsic SQ (w/o EQ) is better, and the EQ is better.

Noah
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post #1614 of 3210 Old 06-01-2012, 11:34 AM
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Please pm me the best place to order this that's safe.

Thanks!
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post #1615 of 3210 Old 06-02-2012, 01:24 PM
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I would be very happy if they could reduce the amount of time for the audio drop and do something with the scaler to avoid the freeze up issue with certain cable boxes.

Can you tell me more about the freeze up issue. This is the first I was aware of that. And does it affect Comcast cable boxes?


John
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post #1616 of 3210 Old 06-02-2012, 09:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by typ44q View Post

As far as I know they all have the audio drop out and it is intentional to avoid "pops" or something like that.

Supposedly there will be more firmware updates for this receiver (I was actually told end of May but that obviously did not happen)
I would be very happy if they could reduce the amount of time for the audio drop and do something with the scaler to avoid the freeze up issue with certain cable boxes.

Cany anyone confirm that the firmware update is definitely coming? Thanks.


John
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post #1617 of 3210 Old 06-02-2012, 10:00 PM
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Quote:
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Cany anyone confirm that the firmware update is definitely coming? Thanks.

John

No offense to Sherwood but I would not buy the R-972 hoping that a FW will become available to fix issues that it has. The R-972 is being sold at a huge discount at A4L and I tend to think there will not be a FW update to correct the audio delay issue. If there was a FW update to correct the audio delay released tomorrow I would order one right away.

Bill

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post #1618 of 3210 Old 06-02-2012, 10:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Mac View Post

No offense to Sherwood but I would not buy the R-972 hoping that a FW will become available to fix issues that it has. The R-972 is being sold at a huge discount at A4L and I tend to think there will not be a FW update to correct the audio delay issue. If there was a FW update to correct the audio delay released tomorrow I would order one right away.

Bill


My thoughts too, Bill.


John
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post #1619 of 3210 Old 06-02-2012, 10:55 PM
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Quote:
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Cany anyone confirm that the firmware update is definitely coming? Thanks.
John

It's discontinued, you know...
I just wonder, because that is the end of the line for the R-972. Remaining inventories are been sold out / discontinued at a hugely discounted price. Thus it is a thing "of the past". The R-972 was a huge disappointment for Sherwood, because they lost quite a bit of money on it.
I strongly doubt, that there will be anything coming for the R-972, because that would mean spending money, although no further sales volume can be generated.
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post #1620 of 3210 Old 06-03-2012, 12:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gurkey View Post

It's discontinued, you know...
I just wonder, because that is the end of the line for the R-972. Remaining inventories are been sold out / discontinued at a hugely discounted price. Thus it is a thing "of the past". The R-972 was a huge disappointment for Sherwood, because they lost quite a bit of money on it.
I strongly doubt, that there will be anything coming for the R-972, because that would mean spending money, were no further sales volume can be generated.

Agreed. I only asked because a number of people in this thread mentioned information about a firmware update that was coming, and even a date for it.

John
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