Onkyo tx nr1007 owners' thread - Page 22 - AVS Forum
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post #631 of 2619 Old 11-04-2009, 04:23 AM
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I am looking for a pre pro to mate with my Emotiva MPS-2 (200 watt per channel amp). I was looking at the Onkyo 5507 since it has 2 sub outs and I will have dual subs. But I am becoming more intrigued by the cost savings of going for a receiver to use as a pre pro.

My requirements are :
Multi xt
2 sub pre outs
amp pre outs


This receiver seems to fit the bill, but I am worried about sound quality. Why is a receiver cheaper than a pre pro? The receiver includes amps, so you would think it is more expensive. Will I be sacrificing sound quality by going with the 1007 over the 5507 pre pro? Thanks
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post #632 of 2619 Old 11-04-2009, 09:02 AM
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There's an interesting thread going on talking about all the reasons why a low-cost pre-pro based on an AVR architecture doesn't exist... the mains reason is pre-pros are sold in far lower quantities, meaning margins have to be higher and manufacturing costs end up being higher. Those two factors together offset the savings you would expect from simplified material/component costs. Also, MFGs will charge as much as they can and sustain sales, and pre-pros have a higher-end clientèle that are more willing to open their wallets up a little wider.

One other thing you might want to note, the NR1007 doesn't share the same video processing as the 5507, though the NR3007 does.

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post #633 of 2619 Old 11-04-2009, 09:19 AM
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Every receiver in the x007 line has the features you list above. If the build quality concerns you, then keep in mind that the 3007 and 5007 use separate power supplies for the amp, preamp, and video processing stages and are more like separate components in a single chassis than the 1007.

The Onkyo/Integra pre-pros are basically the receivers with the amplifier stages replaced by a balanced output stage. If you look on the back panels, the layouts are almost identical, with XLR jacks where the speaker binding posts would be on an AVR. I think it is very likely that all of the other circuitry is substantially the same, if not completely identical.

All receivers are cheaper in part because AVRs are a mass-produced commodity that sells into a market that is extremely price-sensitive. This encourages lower MSRPs from the manufacturers on these units and encourages retailers to offer them for sale at substantial discounts. The pre/pro market is much, much smaller than the AVR market and tends to sell to people who are much less price sensitive. This is at least part of the reason why pre/pros have generally higher prices.

The only way you'll really be able to tell for sure if the sound quality is very different is to get an AVR and a pre/pro and compare the two with material that you are already familiar with. That should help you understand if the difference in price is worth it to you.
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post #634 of 2619 Old 11-04-2009, 10:47 AM
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Thanks guys. I don't care about video processing as my PJ will do that. All I care about is sound quality. I noticed that the 5507 uses 32 bit DAC's and the 1007 uses 24 bit DAC's. Also, since I won't be using the amps in the 1007, there shouldn't be any issue with the amp's power supply interfering with the sound quality. I have a feeling that the 1007 would sound much the same as the 5507, but part of me feels like biting the bullet and paying the extra money for peace of mind. That is probably a big part of why pre pros sell.....obsessive purists who "want to be sure".
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post #635 of 2619 Old 11-04-2009, 10:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gamelover360 View Post

Thanks guys. I don't care about video processing as my PJ will do that. All I care about is sound quality. I noticed that the 5507 uses 32 bit DAC's and the 1007 uses 24 bit DAC's. Also, since I won't be using the amps in the 1007, there shouldn't be any issue with the amp's power supply interfering with the sound quality. I have a feeling that the 1007 would sound much the same as the 5507, but part of me feels like biting the bullet and paying the extra money for peace of mind. That is probably a big part of why pre pros sell.....obsessive purists who "want to be sure".

Find a local dealer, buy both, see if you can hear the difference. I suspect you won't, but if you're the type that will always wonder "what if", this may be the only way to alleviate that.

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post #636 of 2619 Old 11-04-2009, 11:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gamelover360 View Post

Thanks guys. I don't care about video processing as my PJ will do that. All I care about is sound quality. I noticed that the 5507 uses 32 bit DAC's and the 1007 uses 24 bit DAC's. Also, since I won't be using the amps in the 1007, there shouldn't be any issue with the amp's power supply interfering with the sound quality. I have a feeling that the 1007 would sound much the same as the 5507, but part of me feels like biting the bullet and paying the extra money for peace of mind. That is probably a big part of why pre pros sell.....obsessive purists who "want to be sure".

The 5007 also has the 32-bit DACs. I was planning on buying a 5507 (the pre/pro) but I am pretty much convinced there is little difference between it and the 5007 (the receiver) other than amps and XLR outputs. The big difference I am noticing is that it's very easy to get the 5007 discounted. The 5007 (and most pre/pros in my experience) are much harder to discount because they are sold by far fewer retailers (B&M and online). I finally decided on the 5007 last Saturday and should have it in my hands today.
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post #637 of 2619 Old 11-04-2009, 12:02 PM
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You should strongly consider the 3007. If you are a premium member, go check out the found deals forum. You can get one for a song right now (or at least you could yesterday when I bought mine... have not checked today). Sign up for Bing cash back and go through Bing for more savings.

I too will be using mine as a pre/pro to replace my Anthem AVM30. Thus, I am losing virtually nothing (other than an 8th HDMI port which I will never need) from the 5007. I opted for the tried and true 24-bit DACs used in the famed 9.8 and 9.9s as opposed to the new 32 bit DAC. If there is any difference, it is likely not audible to human ears. I think others have tested these receivers against eachother and found no audible difference.

One more thing, added benefits of an AVR as a pre/pro are:

1) Can function on its own when you upgrade in a few years. 3007 is worth it over the 1007 (at this price) because you get the better video chip if you ever move this out of your projection room.
2) Has amps in it to use for the High/Wides so you don't have to buy another 2 channel amp (this is what ultimately won me over the Onkyo/Integra pre/pros).
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post #638 of 2619 Old 11-04-2009, 12:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chexi1 View Post

You should strongly consider the 3007. If you are a premium member, go check out the found deals forum. You can get one for a song right now (or at least you could yesterday when I bought mine... have not checked today). Sign up for Bing cash back and go through Bing for more savings.

What does it mean "You can get one for a song right now"
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post #639 of 2619 Old 11-04-2009, 01:01 PM
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It means the price is very low. Let's just say it's somewhere in the neighborhood of the normal price for the 1007.
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post #640 of 2619 Old 11-04-2009, 01:28 PM
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Originally Posted by chexi1 View Post

It means the price is very low. Let's just say it's somewhere in the neighborhood of the normal price for the 1007.

May I know what is the price that you got for 3007 right now?

Thanks.
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post #641 of 2619 Old 11-04-2009, 01:43 PM
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You have a PM on the price, but you will have to check the Great Found Deals thread to find out who the online dealer is. I do not mean to be a jerk, but AVS has given us all so much, I think giving a little back by way of the membership fee is the least we can do.
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post #642 of 2619 Old 11-04-2009, 02:13 PM
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TX-NR1007 Audyssey DSX;

Have you guys seen any issues with Audyssey and our receiver?

I noticed that when I run the setup my left front speaker is louder then the rest of them; Audyssey in turn; reduces the volume level on that speaker more than others.

Just seeing if anyone is having issues; another issue I have seen is where the soundstage gets uneaven; voices come out of one speaker and not others.

I have double checked my wiring, and speakers are new and work fine when checked against a sound meter.
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post #643 of 2619 Old 11-04-2009, 02:15 PM
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Have your tried running Audyssey calibration more than once? A problem with the initial measurement can skew things very badly.
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post #644 of 2619 Old 11-04-2009, 05:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by callott View Post

Have your tried running Audyssey calibration more than once? A problem with the initial measurement can skew things very badly.

I have run it twice, thinking about doing it again.

Do you leave THX Volume control on?

Also the first time I ran it with 8 positions, but I dont have back surrounds, so the second time I ran it with 6 positions.
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post #645 of 2619 Old 11-04-2009, 08:47 PM
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If the calibration routine has set it at the same level on both occasions, then something is making Audyssey think that output from that speaker is down. You could try temporarily changing the position of the speakers and/or the sampling positions to see if the room boundaries are affecting it in some way.

You might also try checking for a blown driver. Play pink noise and cup your hand over each tweeter and woofer to make sure they are all working.

Make sure you are not holding the microphone or putting it in a place where it will vibrate when a speaker plays.

You might also try posting in the Audyssey megathread if you haven't already done so. There are a lot more people who know the products much better following that conversation.
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post #646 of 2619 Old 11-04-2009, 10:03 PM
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I got my 1007 and I thought everything was great, until I put in a blu-ray. There is a clicking noise towards the back by the power plug. It sounds like I am switching inputs, from my Oppo blu-ray player to my HD-DVD player. When I am watching a movie using only Dolby Digital, it rarely clicks. But when I switch to Dolby TrueHD or DTS-HD, it clicks like every 5 seconds. And every time it clicks the is a split second gap or pause in the audio. Because it draws so much current (almost 12 amps), I thought maybe my surge protector/battery back-up wasn't supplying enough power. So I disconnected it from the battery backup and plugged it straight into the wall. It still had the same problem. I tried regular dvd's and hd-dvd/blu-rays. No matter which player I used, whenever I went to a high resolution format the clicking at the back of the receiver started up. Maybe I have a setting wrong? Has anyone else had this problem before? Any ideas? Please help.

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post #647 of 2619 Old 11-04-2009, 10:25 PM
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I'm using an Oppo BDP-83 with a TX-NR1007 right now and it is rock solid.

I think it is possible that the receiver is losing the lock on the HDMI audio signal and clicking because it is trying to renegotiate the correct surround sound decoding mode when the signal re-establishes. Basically, the theory is that your HDMI signal is marginal for the higher-bandwidth codecs and is dropping out occasionally.

Things you can try:
-1) A different HDMI cable between the Oppo and the Onkyo.
-2) A different HDMI input on the back of the receiver.
-3) Disconnecting all of your other HDMI inputs and outputs, including your display. If this fixes it, then add the HDMI connections back one at a time to figure out which one is the problem child.
-4) Make sure no power cables or speaker cables are crossing over or near your HDMI cable. I don't think inductance is likely (especially with the ferrite cores on the HDMI cable that Oppo ships with the BDP-83), but it is possible.

If none of this works, then you can try multichannel analog RCA inputs to take HDMI issues out of the loop entirely.
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post #648 of 2619 Old 11-04-2009, 10:34 PM
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stereowise,

Are you using HDMI cables? Are they fairly new and of good quality? I was having similar issues and bought new 1.3c HDMI certified cables. Replaced the two year old ones and most of it has gone away. Most it it, not all. I don't have any problems with bluray now. Some problems with Direct TV. But not bad enough to bother me. Maybe once or twice in 5 hours of watching. I have the 5007, but I think these new Onkyos using the 1.3 HDMI are having HDMI handshake issues of cable bandwidth problems. New cables may fix the bandwidth problem. It will take new firmware to fix the handshake problems.

Good luck.

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post #649 of 2619 Old 11-04-2009, 11:14 PM
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I did not try new HDMI cables. The cables I am using are all the same...BelkinAV, their premium cable. But they are around 4 years old. I want to continue using HDMI. I tried switching inputs on the back and it did not work. I took down all my gear cuz my theater roomis under construction (running some flatwire for front height speakers. I will let you know once it is done and if the new cables and firmware update has fixed the problem. Has anyone had any problems doing a firmware update? I have never done one on a receiver before. Thanks guys!

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post #650 of 2619 Old 11-05-2009, 12:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Burningcoals View Post

Also the first time I ran it with 8 positions, but I dont have back surrounds, so the second time I ran it with 6 positions.

Uh? the number of measurement positions has nothing to do with either
the number of speakers or listening positions. For best results, it should
be the max 8 to cover the whole listening area. Some guidelines: Put the mic for the first measurement in the middle of the listening area
to split the differences (levels, delays) for all positions and then take the rest of the measurements to cover the
listening area while staying away (at least 50cm) from side walls/seat backs and extreme off-axis
positions. And note that the measurement positions don't need to be actual seating positions.
And please don't hold the mic in your hand or put it on a chair or a cushion, use a tripod.
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post #651 of 2619 Old 11-05-2009, 03:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rickardl View Post

And please don't hold the mic in your hand or put it on a chair or a cushion, use a tripod.

What is a good inexpensive tripod to use for this purpose?
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post #652 of 2619 Old 11-05-2009, 03:27 AM
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Originally Posted by Happy_Macomb View Post

What is a good inexpensive tripod to use for this purpose?

I got mine really cheap from Walmart.
LL

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post #653 of 2619 Old 11-05-2009, 03:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rickardl View Post

Uh? the number of measurement positions has nothing to do with either
the number of speakers or listening positions. For best results, it should
be the max 8 to cover the whole listening area. Some guidelines: Put the mic for the first measurement in the middle of the listening area
to split the differences (levels, delays) for all positions and then take the rest of the measurements to cover the
listening area while staying away (at least 50cm) from side walls/seat backs and extreme off-axis
positions. And note that the measurement positions don't need to be actual seating positions.
And please don't hold the mic in your hand or put it on a chair or a cushion, use a tripod.

Definitely correct. The more info the better calibration.

For my latest Reviews and Stuff google -> Joe Rod Home Theater .Com
Check out my Dolby Atmos/Surround first take:
http://hstrial-jrodriguez996.homeste...=1409517748063
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post #654 of 2619 Old 11-05-2009, 03:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chexi1 View Post

You have a PM on the price, but you will have to check the Great Found Deals thread to find out who the online dealer is. I do not mean to be a jerk, but AVS has given us all so much, I think giving a little back by way of the membership fee is the least we can do.

What have they given us?

For my latest Reviews and Stuff google -> Joe Rod Home Theater .Com
Check out my Dolby Atmos/Surround first take:
http://hstrial-jrodriguez996.homeste...=1409517748063
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post #655 of 2619 Old 11-05-2009, 07:08 AM
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I am wondering if it really could be my cables? i was getting the hi-res audio to my old Yammy RX-V2600 from my PS3. Maybe it is just an HDMI handshake problem? Has anyone had issues with the HDMI cable that came with the Oppo blu-ray player? And has anyone had issues doing a firmware update? Maybe that is what I need to do?

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post #656 of 2619 Old 11-05-2009, 08:17 AM
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I use the cable that came with the Oppo in my system.

A firmware update shouldn't hurt.
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post #657 of 2619 Old 11-05-2009, 08:29 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stereowise View Post

I got my 1007 and I thought everything was great, until I put in a blu-ray. There is a clicking noise towards the back by the power plug. It sounds like I am switching inputs, from my Oppo blu-ray player to my HD-DVD player. When I am watching a movie using only Dolby Digital, it rarely clicks. But when I switch to Dolby TrueHD or DTS-HD, it clicks like every 5 seconds. And every time it clicks the is a split second gap or pause in the audio. Because it draws so much current (almost 12 amps), I thought maybe my surge protector/battery back-up wasn't supplying enough power. So I disconnected it from the battery backup and plugged it straight into the wall. It still had the same problem. I tried regular dvd's and hd-dvd/blu-rays. No matter which player I used, whenever I went to a high resolution format the clicking at the back of the receiver started up. Maybe I have a setting wrong? Has anyone else had this problem before? Any ideas? Please help.

are you sure it's not just the dsps switching for differenct codecs causing the noise? there is some lock-on with hdmi that can momentarily cause a drop iun audio.

check the listening mode presents in the menu and ensure that you've got some organization to what listening/processing modes you are applying to different codecs.
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post #658 of 2619 Old 11-05-2009, 09:25 AM
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Anyone having problems with Audio and Video drop outs and possible handshake issues over HDMI please go read this post.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showp...&postcount=263

Action is required to get Onkyo to do something about this.

Regards,
Adamg
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post #659 of 2619 Old 11-05-2009, 12:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rickardl View Post

Uh? the number of measurement positions has nothing to do with either
the number of speakers or listening positions. For best results, it should
be the max 8 to cover the whole listening area. Some guidelines: Put the mic for the first measurement in the middle of the listening area
to split the differences (levels, delays) for all positions and then take the rest of the measurements to cover the
listening area while staying away (at least 50cm) from side walls/seat backs and extreme off-axis
positions. And note that the measurement positions don't need to be actual seating positions.
And please don't hold the mic in your hand or put it on a chair or a cushion, use a tripod.

Thanks for the clarification rickardl!
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post #660 of 2619 Old 11-05-2009, 01:31 PM
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I was having problem with Audessy as well with fronts bi-wired(Polk LSI 25"s). First time I would run, the display showed every possible speaker that you can have in a room, although I am only running a 5.1. The second time, or second positions, it would give an error. Also, a humming noise would come out of one of the surrounds. I finally realized that I did not have the speakers set for 4 ohm. After correcting, the hum went away. I called Onkyo and they told me to bi-wire AFTER running Audessy. What say you guys?
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