Official Emotiva XPA-5 Owners Thread - Page 61 - AVS Forum
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post #1801 of 2057 Old 12-20-2013, 04:25 PM
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Hi, 65Goat... glad to hear it's working out for you. Hey, is the 4311 running the back surrounds on your system, or do you have it running some other pair of speakers?

I'm using the Denon to power my front heights while the XPA-5 drives my fronts and surrounds.

~ Mike
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post #1802 of 2057 Old 12-20-2013, 05:33 PM
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Hello, Emotiva users! smile.gif

I ordered an XPA-5 amp this morning that will be integrated with my Denon AVR-4311CI, 7.2 system and hope it turns out to be a very worthy addition.

Looking forward to delivery and setup... cool.gif
[

congrates on the new amp...i love that new gear feeling.

i love my xpa-5 almost as much s my xpa-2. you are in for a real treat.

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post #1803 of 2057 Old 12-20-2013, 08:38 PM
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i love my xpa-5 almost as much s my xpa-2. you are in for a real treat.

Glad yours is working out well for you, 67jason. If I end up liking the xpa-5, I definitely plan to pick up an xpa-2 or xpa-3 the first time they go on sale.

oz
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post #1804 of 2057 Old 12-20-2013, 09:41 PM
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Originally Posted by 67jason View Post

i love my xpa-5 almost as much s my xpa-2. you are in for a real treat.

Glad yours is working out well for you, 67jason. If I end up liking the xpa-5, I definitely plan to pick up an xpa-2 or xpa-3 the first time they go on sale.

the current sale is the last traditional sale emotiva is having. starting in 2014 no more sales, but they will be implementing some sort of customer loyalty rewards program. there was some talk a while ago on the emo forums. somewhere there is a post by big dan (owner of emo) stating such.

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post #1805 of 2057 Old 12-21-2013, 09:57 AM
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the current sale is the last traditional sale emotiva is having. starting in 2014 no more sales, but they will be implementing some sort of customer loyalty rewards program. there was some talk a while ago on the emo forums. somewhere there is a post by big dan (owner of emo) stating such.

The thing is, prior to that, there was an official statement by Emotiva saying there would be no more sales at all.  I think there have been 2 sales since then.  It looks to be a work-in-progress on the "no more sales" strategy.  The loyalty program idea would exclude new-to-emotiva customers, and they wouldn't want to exclude that group of people and only reward second or third time repeat customers.  It'll be interesting to see what they come up with.

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post #1806 of 2057 Old 12-21-2013, 12:06 PM
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Originally Posted by 67jason View Post

the current sale is the last traditional sale emotiva is having. starting in 2014 no more sales, but they will be implementing some sort of customer loyalty rewards program. there was some talk a while ago on the emo forums. somewhere there is a post by big dan (owner of emo) stating such.
The thing is, prior to that, there was an official statement by Emotiva saying there would be no more sales at all.  I think there have been 2 sales since then.  It looks to be a work-in-progress on the "no more sales" strategy.  The loyalty program idea would exclude new-to-emotiva customers, and they wouldn't want to exclude that group of people and only reward second or third time repeat customers.  It'll be interesting to see what they come up with.


the only announcement iam aware of is the one talking about the current holiday sale (which started around halloween) will be the last and in 2014 things change. if they did more emo double speak stuff i didnt hear about it.

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post #1807 of 2057 Old 12-22-2013, 09:31 PM
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What this means is you do not buy all your emotiva stuff at once. If you want a few amps you buy one and get your rewards credit before you buy another one. Now that emotiva has succeeded in developing quite a customer base, they can now afford to for-go sales LOL. The prices have also been going up!!. The boys at emotiva want to CASH IN.

A Good amplifier requires a adequate power supply, It does not matter what the amplifier is capable of if the power supply will not provide the power required. Most amplifiers have under rated power supplies. It is up to you to make sure you get the ones that are
least under rated if at all.
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post #1808 of 2057 Old 12-22-2013, 11:06 PM
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What this means is you do not buy all your emotiva stuff at once. If you want a few amps you buy one and get your rewards credit before you buy another one. Now that emotiva has succeeded in developing quite a customer base, they can now afford to for-go sales LOL. The prices have also been going up!!. The boys at emotiva want to CASH IN.

disagree with this. the price of many many goods and services have gone up over the last few years. i think the pricing is right where it needs to be on most emo products.

the last price increase announced on the xpr series was due to the fact they now crate ship them instead of standard fed ex. less risk of damage this way is what they said. price went up accordingly, as we all know there is no such thing as free shipping.


i think emotiva has already "cashed in" over the last several years and are now able to offer more and varying products then ever before, with supposedly more on the way. i dont like or need many of their products, but their amps at all levels are a force to be reckoned with in the expensive world of power amps.

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post #1809 of 2057 Old 12-23-2013, 02:17 AM
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Been listening to my new XPA-5 for the last few days. Running off of an Onkyo TX-NR3009.

Quite pleased with the price/performance ratio.


Sharp Elite Pro-70x5fd Display
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Onkyo TX-NR3009 Receiver
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post #1810 of 2057 Old 12-23-2013, 02:27 AM
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Originally Posted by 67jason View Post
 
 
i think emotiva has already "cashed in" over the last several years and are now able to offer more and varying products then ever before, with supposedly more on the way. i dont like or need many of their products, but their amps at all levels are a force to be reckoned with in the expensive world of power amps.

 

So true. I have had all sorts of 'exotic' amps in the days when I was fooled by all the 'audiophile' nonsense that had filled my head via various magazines, sighted tests, advertiser-dependent 'reviews' etc etc. Some of those amps cost near as much as my entire system these days - money that was entirely and totally wasted. Then I started to wonder why, with all this expensive gear, I never seemed to be satisfied and was always looking for something new, for the next 'upgrade' which would lead me to the sonic nirvana which had so far eluded me.  I decided to study the science behind sound reproduction. And then, of course, I began to understand that the things I had been changing, so expensively, were not the things that actually made much of a difference to the sound - and the things I had not even been looking at were precisely those things that did affect the sound so much. Today, I have 4 Emotiva amps and unless they break beyond repair they will never be 'upgraded'.  And the sound I get today is the best, by some margin, than it has ever been. Why?  Speakers and room.

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post #1811 of 2057 Old 12-28-2013, 06:30 AM
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Anybody ever compared the gen1 XPA-2 with the gen2 XPA-5?
I heard the gen1 of both types next to each other last week, and preferred the XPA-2. Is the gen2 XPA-5 any close to the "old" XPA-2?
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post #1812 of 2057 Old 12-28-2013, 06:37 AM
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Anybody ever compared the gen1 XPA-2 with the gen2 XPA-5?
I heard the gen1 of both types next to each other last week, and preferred the XPA-2. Is the gen2 XPA-5 any close to the "old" XPA-2?

gen 2 xpa-5 is more like the gen 1 xpa-5 then it is like the xpa-2 of either gen. xpa-2 either gen puts out more power then the xpa-5 of either gen- that being said i cannot really tell the difference between my gen 1 xpa-2 and my gen 1 xpa-5.

the biggest difference between gen 1 and gen 2 xpa amps is the reworked gain structure - 29db vs 32db - really shouldn't make much if any audible difference though. Might be slightly less noticeable with hissing on certain speakers but beyond that nothin'.

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post #1813 of 2057 Old 12-28-2013, 06:52 AM
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gen 2 xpa-5 is more like the gen 1 xpa-5 then it is like the xpa-2 of either gen. xpa-2 either gen puts out more power then the xpa-5 of either gen- that being said i cannot really tell the difference between my gen 1 xpa-2 and my gen 1 xpa-5.

the biggest difference between gen 1 and gen 2 xpa amps is the reworked gain structure - 29db vs 32db - really shouldn't make much if any audible difference though. Might be slightly less noticeable with hissing on certain speakers but beyond that nothin'.

Thanks Jason.
I found the XPA-2 slightly more controlled in the lower regions. Actually before testing both amps, I did not expect a real improvement compared to my AVR (Onky 808), but I was quite wrong. The Tannoy S10's really got a lot more lively, bass improved a lot in tightness and sounded to have more layers.
As the center channel is a Tannoy D750, I assume this will also benefit from the extra power. Hence the search for more than 2 channels. So at this point I am somewhat confused what to do. Did a price estimate for an XPA-2 and 3, but sending both to EU is just too much.
At this point I'm more going towards the XPA-5 in overall performance in relation to budget, but still searching for some alternatives (which is almost impossible as comparing one to the other is not easy with second hand stuff).
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post #1814 of 2057 Old 12-28-2013, 06:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 67jason View Post

gen 2 xpa-5 is more like the gen 1 xpa-5 then it is like the xpa-2 of either gen. xpa-2 either gen puts out more power then the xpa-5 of either gen- that being said i cannot really tell the difference between my gen 1 xpa-2 and my gen 1 xpa-5.

the biggest difference between gen 1 and gen 2 xpa amps is the reworked gain structure - 29db vs 32db - really shouldn't make much if any audible difference though. Might be slightly less noticeable with hissing on certain speakers but beyond that nothin'.

Thanks Jason.
I found the XPA-2 slightly more controlled in the lower regions. Actually before testing both amps, I did not expect a real improvement compared to my AVR (Onky 808), but I was quite wrong. The Tannoy S10's really got a lot more lively, bass improved a lot in tightness and sounded to have more layers.
As the center channel is a Tannoy D750, I assume this will also benefit from the extra power. Hence the search for more than 2 channels. So at this point I am somewhat confused what to do. Did a price estimate for an XPA-2 and 3, but sending both to EU is just too much.
At this point I'm more going towards the XPA-5 in overall performance in relation to budget, but still searching for some alternatives (which is almost impossible as comparing one to the other is not easy with second hand stuff).

going with the xpa-5 seems like the most sense for you, especially considering you are in Europe. the 5 will offer the most options for you and is the best bang for the buck overall.

I don't need snobs to tell me how to think, thank you!
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going with the xpa-5 seems like the most sense for you, especially considering you are in Europe. the 5 will offer the most options for you and is the best bang for the buck overall.

Yep, that is where I think I am heading. Also just a couple of days till the sale ends, so "have" to make up my mind smile.gif
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post #1816 of 2057 Old 12-28-2013, 07:04 AM
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going with the xpa-5 seems like the most sense for you, especially considering you are in Europe. the 5 will offer the most options for you and is the best bang for the buck overall.

Yep, that is where I think I am heading. Also just a couple of days till the sale ends, so "have" to make up my mind smile.gif

i started with the xpa-5. got it during last years holiday sale. it was all i needed and wanted. then early this pas summer a used xpa-2 fell into my lap for a hell of a price - i just couldn't pass it up.

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post #1817 of 2057 Old 12-28-2013, 07:09 AM
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Could indeed always be an option for the future.
Guess if I will go for the 5, a renewed shootout with the xpr2 will probably be done when it has arrived. Just to get that out of the way biggrin.gif:
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Could indeed always be an option for the future.
Guess if I will go for the 5, a renewed shootout with the xpr2 will probably be done when it has arrived. Just to get that out of the way biggrin.gif:
i haven't had the opportunity to hear an xpr - they seem amazing based on their stats, but due to price and other obligations i would probably never buy one. the entire xpr series are monsters of amps though.

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post #1819 of 2057 Old 12-28-2013, 07:34 AM
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Could indeed always be an option for the future.
Guess if I will go for the 5, a renewed shootout with the xpr2 will probably be done when it has arrived. Just to get that out of the way biggrin.gif:
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i haven't had the opportunity to hear an xpr - they seem amazing based on their stats, but due to price and other obligations i would probably never buy one. the entire xpr series are monsters of amps though.

Aiai, I'm sorry, big (expensive smile.gif) typo, I ment the XPA-2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wiggies666 View Post

Could indeed always be an option for the future.
Guess if I will go for the 5, a renewed shootout with the xpr2 will probably be done when it has arrived. Just to get that out of the way biggrin.gif:
Quote:
Originally Posted by 67jason View Post

i haven't had the opportunity to hear an xpr - they seem amazing based on their stats, but due to price and other obligations i would probably never buy one. the entire xpr series are monsters of amps though.

Aiai, I'm sorry, big (expensive smile.gif) typo, I ment the XPA-2

lol - whats the difference between an "r" and an "a" - at least a $1000 or so! tongue.gif

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post #1821 of 2057 Old 12-28-2013, 07:40 AM
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lol - whats the difference between an "r" and an "a" - at least a $1000 or so! tongue.gif

Things you wish for haha
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post #1822 of 2057 Old 12-28-2013, 04:24 PM
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I am planning to get the Marantz 7008 to run a 7.2 system (B&W speakers all around; CM9 series).

Is there a need for say an Emotiva XPA-5 to provide amplification to the fronts to get better quality output OR you think the 7008 will be able to handle it all on its own.

thanks

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I am planning to get the Marantz 7008 to run a 7.2 system (B&W speakers all around; CM9 series).
Is there a need for say an Emotiva XPA-5 to provide amplification to the fronts to get better quality output OR you think the 7008 will be able to handle it all on its own.
thanks

I would say just plug them in to the receiver when you get it and listen for yourself. If it sounds good and the receiver doesn't clip then adding the external amp won't make a difference.
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post #1824 of 2057 Old 12-29-2013, 05:33 AM
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I am planning to get the Marantz 7008 to run a 7.2 system (B&W speakers all around; CM9 series).

Is there a need for say an Emotiva XPA-5 to provide amplification to the fronts to get better quality output OR you think the 7008 will be able to handle it all on its own.

thanks

 

How much power you need depends on the sensitivity of your speakers, the seating distance from them and the loudness levels you want to play the system at. The CM9s are 89dB sensitivity and have a power handling of 200 watts according to B&W's site.

 

If you plug this data into one of the online SPL calculators you will see this:

 

 

This shows that at a seating distance of about 10 feet, in order to achieve THX Reference Level playback you will need 385 watts. But as the CM9s can only handle 200 watts, this could be an issue for you.  As the 105db is 'peak' only, and as the recommended amp power for the CM9 is 200 watts, then chances are you will be OK for brief peaks. However, despite the CM9 being an excellent speaker, its limited power handling combined with its average-only sensitivity makes it a less than ideal choice for HT use.

 

Coming back to your question, you only need additional amp power if your current amp is being driven into clipping at the SPLs you require. Only you know how loud you want to listen at so no hard and fast answer can be given. If you want to listen at more moderate levels than Reference, and will never require the ability to play at Reference, then I would guess that the 7008's amps will be more than sufficient. 

 

Also bear in mind that the 7008 quotes 125 watts into 8 ohms. You needs to double amp power to get a 3dB increase in SPL,  so the Emotiva amp will only give you approximately another 2dB or so. Is this worth the money to you?  To help decide, play something at a level you like, and then advance the MV control by 2dB. Does that additional loudness sound like it's worth the price of an XPA-5?

 

And before someone says "ah yes but Emo specifies its power with all channels driven and the Marantz doesn't" - yes this is true, but these specs are for reproducing sine waves. On real life content this distinction is of less importance: the chances of your system demanding peak power into all speakers all at the same time is probably zero.

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post #1825 of 2057 Old 12-29-2013, 06:12 AM
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Quote:
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I am planning to get the Marantz 7008 to run a 7.2 system (B CM9 series).
Is there a need for say an Emotiva XPA-5 to provide amplification to the fronts to get better quality output OR you think the 7008 will be able to handle it all on its own.
thanks

How much power you need depends on the sensitivity of your speakers, the seating distance from them and the loudness levels you want to play the system at. The CM9s are 89dB sensitivity and have a power handling of 200 watts according to B&W's site.

If you plug this data into one of the online SPL calculators you will see this:




This shows that at a seating distance of about 10 feet, in order to achieve THX Reference Level playback you will need 385 watts. But as the CM9s can only handle 200 watts, this could be an issue for you.  As the 105db is 'peak' only, and as the recommended amp power for the CM9 is 200 watts, then chances are you will be OK for brief peaks. However, despite the CM9 being an excellent speaker, its limited power handling combined with its average-only sensitivity makes it a less than ideal choice for HT use.

Coming back to your question, you only need additional amp power if your current amp is being driven into clipping at the SPLs you require. Only you know how loud you want to listen at so no hard and fast answer can be given. If you want to listen at more moderate levels than Reference, and will never require the ability to play at Reference, then I would guess that the 7008's amps will be more than sufficient. 

Also bear in mind that the 7008 quotes 125 watts into 8 ohms. You needs to double amp power to get a 3dB increase in SPL,  so the Emotiva amp will only give you approximately another 2dB or so. Is this worth the money to you?  To help decide, play something at a level you like, and then advance the MV control by 2dB. Does that additional loudness sound like it's worth the price of an XPA-5?

And before someone says "ah yes but Emo specifies its power with all channels driven and the Marantz doesn't" - yes this is true, but these specs are for reproducing sine waves. On real life content this distinction is of less importance: the chances of your system demanding peak power into all speakers all at the same time is probably zero.

+1 to all....especially the bolded part.

here is what is representative of much more common spl power requirements in typical HT use:


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post #1826 of 2057 Old 12-29-2013, 08:07 AM
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There is a problem with that calculator, however. It uses 6 db as the amount of SPL loss per meter of listening distance. 6 db is the correct figure for the great outdoors or an anechoic chamber. In a listening room it is more like 3 db. In my listening room which is fairly live, it is less than 2 db per meter. So you need to cut the final power figure at least in half unless you are installing outdoor speakers. In other words the calculator is misguiding you because of its simplicity.
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post #1827 of 2057 Old 12-29-2013, 08:12 AM
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+1 to all....especially the bolded part.

here is what is representative of much more common spl power requirements in typical HT use:

 

Yep. I like to tell people I listen at 'loud' levels, and I do, but typically I listen at -5dB. Here’s what that means:

 

 

Even for me, a typical, decent AVR would be more than enough.  Even factoring in 3dB of headroom, I'd still only need 180 watts.

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post #1828 of 2057 Old 12-29-2013, 08:27 AM
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Originally Posted by FMW View Post

There is a problem with that calculator, however. It uses 6 db as the amount of SPL loss per meter of listening distance. 6 db is the correct figure for the great outdoors or an anechoic chamber. In a listening room it is more like 3 db. In my listening room which is fairly live, it is less than 2 db per meter. So you need to cut the final power figure at least in half unless you are installing outdoor speakers. In other words the calculator is misguiding you because of its simplicity.

 

Yes the calculators are only a guide I agree. There are a lot on the net and they all give different results. This one for example:

 

http://myhometheater.homestead.com/splcalculator.html

 

They all have different parameters etc.I usually use the Crown one because it is simple and it serves to illustrate a point. But yes, room gain is important. And of course, usually one has more than one speaker playing too. I don't think anything I said to the OP is negated by the calculator result.

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post #1829 of 2057 Old 12-29-2013, 03:19 PM
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They all have different parameters etc.I usually use the Crown one because it is simple and it serves to illustrate a point. But yes, room gain is important. And of course, usually one has more than one speaker playing too. I don't think anything I said to the OP is negated by the calculator result.

I don't either but the result is not very useful. I understand that the creators of the routine don't have all the information about the user and have therefore made it as conservative as possible. But I hate see someone thinking they need to buy 400 watts per channel to reach reference level that would likely drive them out of the room if they ever turned things up that high. Of course Crown does sell 400 watt amplifiers, don't they. wink.gif
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post #1830 of 2057 Old 12-29-2013, 03:30 PM
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Crown sells pro amplifiers so their calculator is aimed accordingly, rather than the living room consumer, so probably the difference in assumption about room gain, no?

Still, it doesn't do much good if your speakers can't handle the spl number you put in the calculator, let alone the power...

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