The "Official" Pioneer VSX-1020-K Owner's Thread - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 4546 Old 04-26-2010, 01:39 PM - Thread Starter
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Just received my new Pioneer VSX-1020 receiver (pre-ordered direct from Pioneer)

Here are a few pics of the exterior:





After spending an hour or so with the unit, I've noticed the following:

Positives
  • Gorgeous GUI for main menu (After Denon AVR1909, this is appreciated!)
  • Very detailed auto-calibration using multiple patterns
  • Very granular adjustments (overall)

Negatives
  • Awful remote
  • Input switching takes longer than Denon it replaced
  • (So far) Don't see any way to control crossover for individual channels

Although it isn't fair to compare the sound of the Denon AVR-1909 and this unit yet as I spent a TON of time calibrating and adjusting the Denon and have only played with this unit an hour, I did notice a few things after the initial auto calibration:
  • MCACC has odd distances for my wall-mounted rear surrounds. They're about 2ft away, but MCACC sees as ~6ft
  • MCACC dials the sub level much lower than Denon's Audyssey
  • A filter of some sort is being applied to LFE channel as the Rythmik F12 sounds very different (lacking detail) than when I used the Denon. This is 110% a setting someplace I just haven't seen.

After going through the manual, I now see there's an Advanced MCACC (Manual) mode that has a TON of adjustments. More importantly, there seem to be some incredible tools at your disposal. I'll be playing with this soon and will post some images/results.
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post #2 of 4546 Old 04-26-2010, 01:55 PM
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Looks good. I have one pre-ordered on Amazon. Can't wait. I have a VSX-1019 to hold me over. I wll be taking that one back when the 1020 ships.
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post #3 of 4546 Old 04-26-2010, 03:16 PM - Thread Starter
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So I've just connected everything and ran a quick calibration. Compared to the Audyssey calibration on my previous Denon unit, this new Pioneer was incredible. Rather than one pass of "blips" through each channel, the Pioneer has several different patterns and steps.

You can also output the results to USB which I found to be pretty slick.

I'll take some pics shortly.
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post #4 of 4546 Old 04-26-2010, 03:30 PM - Thread Starter
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First hurdle:

Trying to add AVR to Harmony One and it seems the VSX-1020 isn't in the Harmony database yet.

Anyone have a workaround?
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post #5 of 4546 Old 04-26-2010, 03:44 PM
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^^^

try using the 1019... the remote codes tend not to change from model year to the next....

nice dog...

- chris

 

my build thread - updated 8-20-12 - new seating installed and projector isolation solution

 

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post #6 of 4546 Old 04-26-2010, 05:19 PM - Thread Starter
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OK, so we're up and cooking with gas.

Overall, a few hangups but overall extremely impressed.

Remote was a non-issue as I was able to just use the "learn" function to grab the necessary codes for the AVR.

The first screen you see when you enter the menu or hook up the mic is:


One of my biggest negatives (so far, still researching) is the lack of control over the crossover for each individual channel. Instead, you have one "blanket" crossover setting as seen here:

(Again, the setting is likely there - just haven't seen yet. Time to read the manual)

Once the calibration is done, you get a TON of cool info to help you see what you're dealing with. Check this out!


You also have a few odd features like this:
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post #7 of 4546 Old 04-26-2010, 10:30 PM
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^ ^ ^ ^
The GUI looks similar to last year's models. And Pioneer does employ a global crossover. There are no individual crossovers for different sets of speakers.

EDIT: 2 things I noticed in the first photo and did not like, 245W power input and the "Made in China" tag. My last year's model, the VSX-919 is 350W and "Made in Malaysia". Pioneer cost-cutting? Although, if the unit sounds great, then those two factors bear no weight.
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post #8 of 4546 Old 04-27-2010, 02:36 AM
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Boy....that is one lucky Dog!!

Anyone order from J&R get notification yet?
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post #9 of 4546 Old 04-27-2010, 07:43 AM
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Any one order from ABT get notification yet?
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post #10 of 4546 Old 04-27-2010, 08:42 AM
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Still no one else???

Hopefully Pioneer did make more than one!

Sorry....just can't wait much longer!!
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post #11 of 4546 Old 04-27-2010, 09:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by la9ers View Post

Any one order from ABT get notification yet?

Yesterday, Mark at Abt told me they *expect* to ship the 1020's middle to late next week, FWIW. I have 2 on order.
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post #12 of 4546 Old 04-27-2010, 11:19 AM
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I'm waiting on delivery as well, but after reading the new Denon receivers press release, I realized I overlooked one feature that would be really nice to have...

Does the 1020 provide some sort of video volume level overlay graphic via hdmi to the so if the unit is hidden you can still see representation of the level? I'm not seeing anything in the manual as far as I can tell.

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post #13 of 4546 Old 04-27-2010, 11:26 AM
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Pelly_NV,

Congratulations and thanks for starting the thread.

Looking forward to hearing more about the 1020 and seeing more pictures.

"you're just jealous 'cause the voices only talk to me"
Questions about the SC-07 or SC-05? start here
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post #14 of 4546 Old 04-27-2010, 12:01 PM
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I'm coming off an Onkyo 607, what more should I expect from the new Pio 1020?
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post #15 of 4546 Old 04-27-2010, 12:20 PM
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Pelly, do you know by chance what kind of DAC he 1020 uses?
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post #16 of 4546 Old 04-27-2010, 12:28 PM
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Older Pioneers had a universal crossover setting. Moreover, they apparently cutoff LFE info at that same point. I'd be interested to know if Pioneer changed the basic design here, although footnote 2 to page 102 of the 1020 manual suggests otherwise:

"This setting decides the cutoff between bass sounds playing back from the speakers selected as LARGE, or the subwoofer, and bass sounds playing back from those selected as SMALL. It also decides where the cutoff will be for bass sounds in the LFE channel."

For more, see

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1232328
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post #17 of 4546 Old 04-27-2010, 12:47 PM
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^^^

correct, and i'd bet it's unlikely they've changed this year...

i've been wrong before though...

- chris

 

my build thread - updated 8-20-12 - new seating installed and projector isolation solution

 

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1332917/ccotenj-finally-gets-a-projector

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post #18 of 4546 Old 04-27-2010, 02:08 PM
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Can anyone tell me if there's any reason why I shouldn't or couldn't send my front three channels (L/C/R) and send them to an external amp via the pre-amp outputs, and then power my two surround channels with the receiver's build in amp? I know the Pioneer doesn't put out nearly as much power as my dedicated amp but I'm hoping that since they're just surround channels they'll get plenty of power. Plus since I'm guessing Pioneer designs their amps to 'share' power among channels, the surround channels will have plenty of juice to play with since the L/C/R will not be used.

Basically what I want to do is take the Zone 2 preamp outputs from the 1020 and send them to the 4th and 5th channels on my HT amp so that I can power my 'whole house' (multiple pairs of speakers) system using my amp, rather than the receiver.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pelly_NV View Post

After going through the manual, I now see there's an Advanced MCACC (Manual) mode that has a TON of adjustments. More importantly, there seem to be some incredible tools at your disposal. I'll be playing with this soon and will post some images/results.

So can you or can you not change the cross-over point Fronts vs center vs surrounds separately? It seemed your initial impression was the crossover setting was universal, but then you followed up with this comment.

Is this something they've allowed to be adjustable on the Elite models in the past? Or are Pioneers in general basically not capable of this?
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post #19 of 4546 Old 04-27-2010, 02:19 PM
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^^^

i don't see why you couldn't... that being said, i'd probably try it with just the avr first... fwiw, the amplifiers share a power supply, yes... which would likely give you "more power available" with the avr driving only 2 channels vs. 5, as only 2 amplifiers are drawing from the "current bank" (so to speak)...

see the two posts right before yours in reference to the xover... pioneer has never had anything but a global xover, regardless of elite or non-elite...

- chris

 

my build thread - updated 8-20-12 - new seating installed and projector isolation solution

 

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1332917/ccotenj-finally-gets-a-projector

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post #20 of 4546 Old 04-27-2010, 02:36 PM
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Wait a darn second... I just noticed when looking at the manual for the 1020 that there are no pre-amp outputs for an external amp!?

How is it that in all the reading I did about this comparing the 1020 and 1120... including articles from engadget, cnet, and long threads here, that I never noticed anyone mentioning the 1020 would not work with an external amp whereas the 1120 would?

That's a 100% deal breaker for the 1020 for me.
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post #21 of 4546 Old 04-27-2010, 02:41 PM
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It's pretty amazing to me that a receiver with such crazy advanced audio calibration capabilities such as advanced MCACC and the ability to output detailed graphs to USB, etc, etc... still employs a universal crossover point for all speakers.

It's not an absolute deal breaker for me since my fronts ideally would cross over at 65, center at 75 and rears at 85... I'll just cross them all over at 75 and that's good enough. But still, that does surprise me.
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post #22 of 4546 Old 04-27-2010, 02:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Threxx View Post

How is it that in all the reading I did about this comparing the 1020 and 1120... including articles from engadget, cnet, and long threads here, that I never noticed anyone mentioning the 1020 would not work with an external amp whereas the 1120 would?

It's not my fault. I mentioned it several times.

Greg Lee
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post #23 of 4546 Old 04-27-2010, 03:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Threxx View Post

Wait a darn second... I just noticed when looking at the manual for the 1020 that there are no pre-amp outputs for an external amp!?

How is it that in all the reading I did about this comparing the 1020 and 1120... including articles from engadget, cnet, and long threads here, that I never noticed anyone mentioning the 1020 would not work with an external amp whereas the 1120 would?

That's a 100% deal breaker for the 1020 for me.

well, that would be a reason why you wouldn't be able to do what you asked about...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Threxx View Post

It's pretty amazing to me that a receiver with such crazy advanced audio calibration capabilities such as advanced MCACC and the ability to output detailed graphs to USB, etc, etc... still employs a universal crossover point for all speakers.

It's not an absolute deal breaker for me since my fronts ideally would cross over at 65, center at 75 and rears at 85... I'll just cross them all over at 75 and that's good enough. But still, that does surprise me.

you aren't going to cross them at 75 on a pioneer avr... 80 will be the closest you get...

there's darn good reasons for using a global xover... regardless of calibration abilities... if you search in the sc-09 thread (and the 05/07 thread, for that matter), we've discussed this at length... others may feel differently of course, and i won't tell them they are wrong...

you are a better man than i if you can xover your speakers at 3 different points and still integrate the sub correctly... i'd pull out my (non-existent) hair trying to do that...

- chris

 

my build thread - updated 8-20-12 - new seating installed and projector isolation solution

 

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1332917/ccotenj-finally-gets-a-projector

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post #24 of 4546 Old 04-27-2010, 07:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ccotenj View Post

well, that would be a reason why you wouldn't be able to do what you asked about...

Hah... yeah. But I guess the same question now applies to the 1120.


Quote:


you aren't going to cross them at 75 on a pioneer avr... 80 will be the closest you get...

there's darn good reasons for using a global xover... regardless of calibration abilities... if you search in the sc-09 thread (and the 05/07 thread, for that matter), we've discussed this at length... others may feel differently of course, and i won't tell them they are wrong...

you are a better man than i if you can xover your speakers at 3 different points and still integrate the sub correctly... i'd pull out my (non-existent) hair trying to do that...

Would you mind giving me a quick recap on what issues using non global crossovers can cause?

I think your last paragraph may hint to at least part of the issue.
If I set my center to crossover at 80Hz and L/R at 60Hz, the bass management is going to route everything below 80 from the center to my sub and everything below 60 from my front L/R to my sub. I'm guessing the issue is in that 60 to 80 range where my sub is playing the 60 to 80 range of my center and my L/R fronts are playing the 60 to 80 range themselves, which is very unlikely to 'match'.

Am I getting warm here?

Anything else to consider?
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post #25 of 4546 Old 04-28-2010, 05:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by babino View Post

I'm waiting on delivery as well, but after reading the new Denon receivers press release, I realized I overlooked one feature that would be really nice to have...

Does the 1020 provide some sort of video volume level overlay graphic via hdmi to the so if the unit is hidden you can still see representation of the level? I'm not seeing anything in the manual as far as I can tell.

Pelly, will you check this out if you get a chance? Thx
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post #26 of 4546 Old 04-28-2010, 06:41 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by todhuntj View Post

Pelly, will you check this out if you get a chance? Thx

Haven't seen an option for this and doesn't have by default. I'll try poking around more today.
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post #27 of 4546 Old 04-28-2010, 11:43 AM
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Pardon me for posting in the wrong thread, but since I am getting a 1020 this might be the appropriate audience.
What speakers would you suggest if I just want a left & right and maybe a sub? 70% of the use will be for movies and the rest for music and TV. I am starting off and don't have any speakers currently.
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post #28 of 4546 Old 04-28-2010, 11:46 AM
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^^^

yes. buy the sierra 1's i have for sale in the classifieds...

you need to post your question in the speaker forum. post your budget/room size/expectations and you'll get more suggestions than you can shake a stick at...

- chris

 

my build thread - updated 8-20-12 - new seating installed and projector isolation solution

 

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1332917/ccotenj-finally-gets-a-projector

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post #29 of 4546 Old 04-28-2010, 03:36 PM - Thread Starter
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Minor update...

After you do the complete calibration, you do get a ton of data to see how things change. Here's an example using the center channel:

Before doing...


and after...


Unfortunately, there is only a single crossover afterall. If I had to point to a single thing being my main complain, that would be it. Minor in the grand scheme of things as the fronts and center should be find at either 80Hz or 100Hz. (Using 100Hz for now with PM 800 F/R and ProCenter 1000. Will drop to 80Hz once I update to PM 1000 F/R and ProCenter 2000.)
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post #30 of 4546 Old 04-28-2010, 04:18 PM
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still doesn't EQ the subwoofer correct?
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