The "Official" TX-NR708 Owners Thread - Page 34 - AVS Forum

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jay0sun's Avatar jay0sun
09:14 AM Liked: 10
post #991 of 1639
01-28-2011 | Posts: 10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kemac View Post

What are you connecting to your pre-outs? Have you tried a factory reset? You shouldn't have any issues getting audio out of the pre-outs. You should get the audyssey test signals, have you tried running audyssey with your external amp connected?

I have run the Audyssey for the main 7.2 speaker setup but have not tried re-running it with the external amp connected to the pre-outs do you think this would help?
Has the Audyssey possibly turned the pre-outs off because it did not detect anything connected to them?

I am trying to use my Harman Kardon 3490 two channel receiver connected via the pre-outs to power two additional front speakers positioned wider than my main fronts with no success.

I have done a factory reset once but unfortunately I did not have the external receiver/amp attached when I ran through the Audyssey again.

I wonder if I should contact Onkyo again to see if I get a different response from another tech?
Some owners are stating that they are using HDMI only and getting signal from their pre-outs connected to an external amplifier but they have not clarified if they are also using the Onkyo's internal amps at the same time? IE powering 7.2 speaker setup form Onkyo and powering any additional speakers at the same time from an external amp connected to the pre-outs?
kemac's Avatar kemac
09:43 AM Liked: 13
post #992 of 1639
01-28-2011 | Posts: 722
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I dont know for sure if the pre-outs work when speakers are connected and I am not at home to even test. You could disconnect the speakers from the 708 that you are also using to drive your 2nd reciever to see if that makes a difference.

I am also suspect of the fact that your not using an external AMP but are trying to use another AVR as an amp. Not sure if that would work....
jac3600's Avatar jac3600
10:03 AM Liked: 10
post #993 of 1639
01-28-2011 | Posts: 20
Joined: Dec 2007
Confirming what Kemac told us:

So far I have the uverse box connected to the 708 thru HDMI, and then 708 HDMI out to TV. Pre-outs for front L & R go to my mono amps. The pre-outs work.

The only problem is that the TV speakers don't work anymore. I'll dig into the manual later, but in the meantime I'd appreciate any advice on getting audio out of the TV.

Thanks for the help.
jay0sun's Avatar jay0sun
10:11 AM Liked: 10
post #994 of 1639
01-28-2011 | Posts: 10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kemac View Post

I dont know for sure if the pre-outs work when speakers are connected and I am not at home to even test. You could disconnect the speakers from the 708 that you are also using to drive your 2nd reciever to see if that makes a difference.

I am also suspect of the fact that your not using an external AMP but are trying to use another AVR as an amp. Not sure if that would work....


I assumed I would be able to use the HK3490 because it is essentially a 120watt x 2 channel amp and not much of an AVR, and because it had worked well previously when using analog sources.
I am hoping to get more input from other owners that have the NR708 and are using the digital sources along with the analog pre-outs to another AVR or amp?

Maybe the problem is that you cannot use both the powered speaker outputs on a given channel and the analog pre-out on the same channel in conjunction? Hence if I am already using the internal amp of the Onkyo to power 7 speakers it will not output signal to the pre-outs because the signal is being sent to the internal amps?
dgf2002's Avatar dgf2002
10:31 AM Liked: 11
post #995 of 1639
01-28-2011 | Posts: 64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jay0sun View Post

I assumed I would be able to use the HK3490 because it is essentially a 120watt x 2 channel amp and not much of an AVR, and because it had worked well previously when using analog sources.
I am hoping to get more input from other owners that have the NR708 and are using the digital sources along with the analog pre-outs to another AVR or amp?

Maybe the problem is that you cannot use both the powered speaker outputs on a given channel and the analog pre-out on the same channel in conjunction? Hence if I am already using the internal amp of the Onkyo to power 7 speakers it will not output signal to the pre-outs because the signal is being sent to the internal amps?

From my general experience..preouts wont work if you are using regular outs. hope that is the issue and that Onkyo rep is wrong. It wouldn't make sense otherwise..

hoping for more to chime in.
jac3600's Avatar jac3600
10:33 AM Liked: 10
post #996 of 1639
01-28-2011 | Posts: 20
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I couldn't wait. Found it on page 55. Everything sounds great so far. Next time I'll check the manual before cluttering the forum with rookie questions. Thanks to all for the help.
dgf2002's Avatar dgf2002
10:39 AM Liked: 11
post #997 of 1639
01-28-2011 | Posts: 64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jac3600 View Post

I couldn't wait. Found it on page 55. Everything sounds great so far. Next time I'll check the manual before cluttering the forum with rookie questions. Thanks to all for the help.

So pre-outs are working with digital inputs (beyond just the sub?) once you use only the pre-outs?

Good news if true...... and false reports now clarified!
kemac's Avatar kemac
10:48 AM Liked: 13
post #998 of 1639
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I think jac360 is referring to his TV sound issue, he already mentioned his pre-outs are working fine with an external amp using an HDMI source.
Hayb2006's Avatar Hayb2006
11:08 AM Liked: 10
post #999 of 1639
01-28-2011 | Posts: 128
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If i have a 7.1 soundtrack do i have to plug my extra speakers into surround back or can I leave them in front high and get the same sound. Is front high only useful for dolby plIIZ?
RichB's Avatar RichB
11:22 AM Liked: 284
post #1000 of 1639
01-28-2011 | Posts: 8,955
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dgf2002 View Post

Let me spell it out for you.

Several posts citing the company and the manual have just claimed that pre-outs do not support digital sources vs. several who say that's not true, ie they are in fact doing just that.

Those are conflicting propositions. Hence, the need for clarification.

I and others have tried to clarify this for you.
If they do not work, the unit is broken.

I am not sure what else can be done to satisfy your "need for clarification"

- Rich
jac3600's Avatar jac3600
11:52 AM Liked: 10
post #1001 of 1639
01-28-2011 | Posts: 20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dgf2002 View Post

So pre-outs are working with digital inputs (beyond just the sub?) once you use only the pre-outs?

Good news if true...... and false reports now clarified!

Yes, R & L front channel pre-outs are working with an HDMI input and no speakers connected to the 708. Also, I found the setting to send the audio out thru the HDMI to the TV so the TV speakers work.

I tried connecting powered wireless headphones to the same pre-outs and they don't work, or maybe I didn't turn the volume high enough on the 708. Could that be similar to your situation with a receiver connected to pre-outs?

In any case, I haven't found a good solution for getting digital audio out to wireless headphones or other components like a soundbar. I might have to wire all the devices both HDMI and analog into the 708 in order to accomplish that. PITA.
jay0sun's Avatar jay0sun
02:02 PM Liked: 10
post #1002 of 1639
01-28-2011 | Posts: 10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jac3600 View Post

Yes, R & L front channel pre-outs are working with an HDMI input and no speakers connected to the 708.

I just got off the phone again with Onkyo technical support. They actually tried to replicate the problem that I was having with no signal from the pre-outs when using a HDMI input source. They connected a PS3 and sent music to the NR708 thru the HDMI then they hooked another two channel Onkyo to the front L/R pre-outs and got no signal or sound! Then they took my number and told me they would call me back as soon as they could figure out what a solution was. They also confirmed with multiple techs that the pre-outs are suppose to be active with any input source digital or analog. I guess I will see what they figure out ? ? ?
fotto's Avatar fotto
02:18 PM Liked: 19
post #1003 of 1639
01-28-2011 | Posts: 1,879
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Interesting. Just for the record, I am connecting FL/FR pre-outs to a 2 channel Rotel amp, with the remainder (C, SR/SL) of the speakers being driven by the 708. I have no issue (and never have) with the pre-out not functioning with HDMi input suorce (BR DVD for instance).
dgf2002's Avatar dgf2002
02:38 PM Liked: 11
post #1004 of 1639
01-28-2011 | Posts: 64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RichB View Post

I and others have tried to clarify this for you.
If they do not work, the unit is broken.

I am not sure what else can be done to satisfy your "need for clarification"

- Rich

uh, hello McFly...... the other "others" were saying otherwise, including Onkyo tech support.
jay0sun's Avatar jay0sun
02:46 PM Liked: 10
post #1005 of 1639
01-28-2011 | Posts: 10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fotto View Post

Interesting. Just for the record, I am connecting FL/FR pre-outs to a 2 channel Rotel amp, with the remainder (C, SR/SL) of the speakers being driven by the 708. I have no issue (and never have) with the pre-out not functioning with HDMi input suorce (BR DVD for instance).

fotto, have you ever tried connecting speakers to the front speaker outputs on the NR708 and playing them at the same time as the Rotel was receiving and playing input from the front L/R pre-outs?
fotto's Avatar fotto
02:55 PM Liked: 19
post #1006 of 1639
01-28-2011 | Posts: 1,879
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jay0sun View Post

fotto, have you ever tried connecting speakers to the front speaker outputs on the NR708 and playing them at the same time as the Rotel was receiving and playing input from the front L/R pre-outs?

That would be a "negative" sir. Never had a reason to do it as I've had it set up this way from the start. Would be an interesting experiment though, although I just hate inserting my 12 GA speaker wire into those connectors. If I have time to give it a try over the weekend I'll let you know though.
dgf2002's Avatar dgf2002
03:06 PM Liked: 11
post #1007 of 1639
01-28-2011 | Posts: 64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jay0sun View Post

fotto, have you ever tried connecting speakers to the front speaker outputs on the NR708 and playing them at the same time as the Rotel was receiving and playing input from the front L/R pre-outs?

I'm pretty sure that won't work. Haven't tried it on my Onkyo, but on other AVR's, its either one or the other.
dgf2002's Avatar dgf2002
03:10 PM Liked: 11
post #1008 of 1639
01-28-2011 | Posts: 64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fotto View Post

Interesting. Just for the record, I am connecting FL/FR pre-outs to a 2 channel Rotel amp, with the remainder (C, SR/SL) of the speakers being driven by the 708. I have no issue (and never have) with the pre-out not functioning with HDMi input suorce (BR DVD for instance).

Fotto - for future reference, if I upgrade.... does the pre-out feed the 5.1 signal for the L/R speakers when driven by the Rotel - 2 channel? I've never used pre-outs before.

How many watts does the Rotel output and what L/R speakers are you driving? DO you find it makes a significant difference in sound quality and volume? That will probably be the route I go if I get larger speakers and want extra power than the 708 can provide.

THX.
stikle's Avatar stikle
03:17 PM Liked: 63
post #1009 of 1639
01-28-2011 | Posts: 159
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hayb2006 View Post

If i have a 7.1 soundtrack do i have to plug my extra speakers into surround back or can I leave them in front high and get the same sound. Is front high only useful for dolby plIIZ?

They would need to go into the surround back. What happens if, for example, there is a spaceship flying from the front of the screen over the top to behind you? The sound would start at the front of the room, go down the sides, then all of a sudden be at the front of the room again.
Rickylane44's Avatar Rickylane44
04:30 PM Liked: 10
post #1010 of 1639
01-28-2011 | Posts: 24
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Having the extra power from an external amp is nice if you have power hungry speakers. I've used the L/R preouts to a Carver power amp with great results, powering Mirage OMD15's. All my other speakers are powered by the Onkyo. Works great!

I have a question maybe someone can answer. Is there an easy way on the 708 to adjust speaker levels? I know the Home button allows adjustment of the Center and Sub, but I can't find where the surrounds could be adjusted without going into setup mode.
dgf2002's Avatar dgf2002
04:33 PM Liked: 11
post #1011 of 1639
01-28-2011 | Posts: 64
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Thanks for the reply! Do you get the Front L/R of the 5.1 or 7.2 signal through the amp??

Good question on the surround volume levels! Drives me crazy going into setup every time I use the system. My Pioneer 919 makes it easy.
Rickylane44's Avatar Rickylane44
04:33 PM Liked: 10
post #1012 of 1639
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I guess I should add that I want to do it "on the fly" while watching a movie, etc. Seems that at times the Audyssey settings aren't quite loud enough on certain sources.
Rickylane44's Avatar Rickylane44
04:34 PM Liked: 10
post #1013 of 1639
01-28-2011 | Posts: 24
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Yes I get the 5.1 or 7.1 signals thru the preouts and I'm using all HDMI.
dgf2002's Avatar dgf2002
04:35 PM Liked: 11
post #1014 of 1639
01-28-2011 | Posts: 64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rickylane44 View Post

Yes I get the 5.1 or 7.1 signals thru the preouts and I'm using all HDMI.

Excellent!!! THX! Made my day which started out on bad info in this thread!.
Rickylane44's Avatar Rickylane44
04:47 PM Liked: 10
post #1015 of 1639
01-28-2011 | Posts: 24
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Sure, you should be good to go. Not sure where the confusion started on the preout issue? It's always worked for me.

No takers on the volume question though. Maybe there is no easy way to do it? I have an Onkyo TX-SR876 on another system that is a breeze to change on-the-fly, so thought maybe I've overlooked something on the 708.
fotto's Avatar fotto
06:28 PM Liked: 19
post #1016 of 1639
01-28-2011 | Posts: 1,879
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dgf2002 View Post

Fotto - for future reference, if I upgrade.... does the pre-out feed the 5.1 signal for the L/R speakers when driven by the Rotel - 2 channel? I've never used pre-outs before.

How many watts does the Rotel output and what L/R speakers are you driving? DO you find it makes a significant difference in sound quality and volume? That will probably be the route I go if I get larger speakers and want extra power than the 708 can provide.

THX.

To the best of my knowledge, the preouts feed the same signal as what would normally go to the AVR FL/FR (unamplified of course). I have an older Rotel amp (circa 1990 or so) and it's 100 watts per channel. My fronts are from the same time frame, American Acoustics DS1212 (was owned by Mitek/MTX) rated at 275W. I plan to upgrade my speakers hopefully this year to Axiom M series (I have Axiom VP150 center and QS8 surrounds) and buy another amp, maybe a Emotiva 3 channel to drive my C/SR/SL. YES, it makes a difference. For now. just using what I had available for fronts as I'm trying to recover from the cost of my build. The really do sound pretty good.
jay0sun's Avatar jay0sun
08:18 PM Liked: 10
post #1017 of 1639
01-28-2011 | Posts: 10
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Sorry for the delay, the tech from Onkyo returned my call and again confirmed that the NR708 and higher models all convert digital input sources to analog for the internal amplifier section and also supply output through the pre-outs!
I really despise the previous tech representative I spoke with for telling me that the NR708 only outputs analog input sources from the pre-outs and causing all this confusion. Sorry to all if I seemed to question your input, I appreciated all of it but was duped by an "official" Onkyo rep!

I was glad to hear that the NR708 did in fact have proper pre-outs but then I was instantly worried that the pre-out section on my receiver was bad....

Well they really dug into the issue for me and found that the HDMI signal they were sending to the receiver from the PS3 was in Bitstream format and once they switched the output to PCM on the PS3 the pre-outs started functioning. Instantly I remembered that I had read an article about how switching the output on all your devices to Bitstream vs PCM was going to provide much better sound output from the AVR and of course I did just that when I set up my new receiver
Now I need to dive into all my input devices and switch them back to PCM output to confirm the pre-outs are now functioning from the HDMI input sources with those settings.
Unfortunately I am now stuck at work and will not be able to test this out until later ... If they do in fact work properly then I want to test if you can actually output from the front L/R pre-outs and have the main front speakers powered by the Onkyo at the same time, unless someone here has already tested this for me...?
AVTrauma's Avatar AVTrauma
05:32 AM Liked: 15
post #1018 of 1639
01-29-2011 | Posts: 387
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Just an FYI for anyone interested...


hometheaterreview.com has their (Jan 10th) evaluation out. Sez what we all know, this is a great piece of hardware, with lots of features at a competitive price... they must have liked it cause they gave it "Best of 2010" status!


(Also of note... hometheater.com reviewed it's big brother, the 807 back in Nov. It gave great marks also, and has it as a "top pick".)


Makes me feel smart, and confirms I have excellent taste!
fotto's Avatar fotto
06:04 AM Liked: 19
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01-29-2011 | Posts: 1,879
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jay0sun View Post


Well they really dug into the issue for me and found that the HDMI signal they were sending to the receiver from the PS3 was in Bitstream format and once they switched the output to PCM on the PS3 the pre-outs started functioning. Instantly I remembered that I had read an article about how switching the output on all your devices to Bitstream vs PCM was going to provide much better sound output from the AVR and of course I did just that when I set up my new receiver
Now I need to dive into all my input devices and switch them back to PCM output to confirm the pre-outs are now functioning from the HDMI input sources with those settings.

LOL...well this gets even more interesting then. I am feeding Bitstream/Audiophile from my BD-C6500 BR player over HDMI to my 708. So, they're saying you can only send PCM and get pre-out signal? My set-up is proof that's not correct either. My understanding is that the only thing you suffer from doing bitstream vs. PCM is losing secondary audio from the source component.
chef jer's Avatar chef jer
01:43 PM Liked: 11
post #1020 of 1639
01-29-2011 | Posts: 648
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DDGolf View Post
I have a different model Samsung but turning "TV Control" off on the 708 fixed this problem for me.
Thank you!!! this worked for me also. It makes no sense to me though. When setting "tv control" to off and "audio tv out" to off - the 708 passes audio through to the tv when shut off.

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