The "Official" Denon AVR-4311CI/AVR-A100 thread [NO PRICE TALK] - Page 562 - AVS Forum
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post #16831 of 23297 Old 04-27-2012, 11:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FilmMixer View Post

Tom.. I would dedicate a separate 20amp for my AVR and another 20 amp for the subs...

Then another for your source equipment and another for your display... if you can, of course...

Isn't that a bit of overkill? A dedicated 20 amp circuit for the source equipment and ANOTHER for the display? What display requires its own 20 amp circuit (unless it's a power hungry projector maybe?) And for the sources, a bunch of shiny disc players, HTPCs, etc.? Those things have minimal draw. I understand having a dedicated circuit for power amps (subs, receivers, external amps) but having one circuit to cover display and source components seems more than plenty.

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post #16832 of 23297 Old 04-27-2012, 11:57 AM
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Thanks all.
There will be a subpanel in the neighboring storage room so we should be able to get whatever we need.
Plan on using a Denon 4311, cable box, Oppo BDP93 and possibly a Behringer amp for the subs. It looks like one 20A for the 4311/oppo/cable box, one for the Behringer and one for the flat screen should do it.
I can't wait!
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post #16833 of 23297 Old 04-27-2012, 11:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by duc135 View Post

This is what I'm going through now. When I first envisioned my setup, I thought all I needed was a single 20A circuit in the closet and a few scattered around the room for my sub. Four additional pro amps and extension cords running around the room later and I've decided that rather than have my electrician pull more circuits to the closet I'd have him put in a sub panel so it'll be much easier to add additional circuits in the future. I just hope a 100A sub panel will be enough.

oh yea, that would be MORE than enough... a 60A panel would be more than enough... i would be willing to bet that at least half the houses in my town have no more than 60 at the main service entrance...

i wish i had had the forethought to do what you are doing...

- chris

 

my build thread - updated 8-20-12 - new seating installed and projector isolation solution

 

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post #16834 of 23297 Old 04-27-2012, 12:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post

Isn't that a bit of overkill? A dedicated 20 amp circuit for the source equipment and ANOTHER for the display? What display requires its own 20 amp circuit (unless it's a power hungry projector maybe?) And for the sources, a bunch of shiny disc players, HTPCs, etc.? Those things have minimal draw. I understand having a dedicated circuit for power amps (subs, receivers, external amps) but having one circuit to cover display and source components seems more than plenty.

i would say, "yes, that's a bit of overkill"...

it would have to be a REALLY power hungry pj...

fwiw, i run my pj, avr and everything else in the rack on a 20A circuit, and both the subms on another... i have been known to occasionally, ummm, whomp, on my system (for scientific testing purposes only, of course ), and that causes no power related issues...

- chris

 

my build thread - updated 8-20-12 - new seating installed and projector isolation solution

 

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post #16835 of 23297 Old 04-27-2012, 12:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sam S View Post

Back on topic to the 4311CI.. I ordered one for myself I am certain I'm the only fellow going to use the 4311CI in a 2.0 configuration with smallish bookshelf speakers. What can I say? I typically go for overkill every time.

I am certain that you're incorrect because that's exactly how my 4311CI gets used .
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post #16836 of 23297 Old 04-27-2012, 12:25 PM
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I am certain that you're incorrect because that's exactly how my 4311CI gets used .

Haha, nice!
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post #16837 of 23297 Old 04-27-2012, 12:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post

Isn't that a bit of overkill? A dedicated 20 amp circuit for the source equipment and ANOTHER for the display? What display requires its own 20 amp circuit (unless it's a power hungry projector maybe?) And for the sources, a bunch of shiny disc players, HTPCs, etc.? Those things have minimal draw. I understand having a dedicated circuit for power amps (subs, receivers, external amps) but having one circuit to cover display and source components seems more than plenty.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ccotenj View Post

oh yea, that would be MORE than enough... a 60A panel would be more than enough... i would be willing to bet that at least half the houses in my town have no more than 60 at the main service entrance...

i wish i had had the forethought to do what you are doing...

Quote:
Originally Posted by ccotenj View Post

i would say, "yes, that's a bit of overkill"...

it would have to be a REALLY power hungry pj...

fwiw, i run my pj, avr and everything else in the rack on a 20A circuit, and both the subms on another... i have been known to occasionally, ummm, whomp, on my system (for scientific testing purposes only, of course ), and that causes no power related issues...

So I guess I went overboard when I installed one of these balanced power sub-panels in my theater equipment room?

Mark
LL
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post #16838 of 23297 Old 04-27-2012, 12:49 PM
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Well, I think it's fair to say that you have just a bit more "subwoofage" than the typical dude

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post #16839 of 23297 Old 04-27-2012, 12:49 PM
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I ordered a refurb from eCost for $999 + $35 shipping. I'm kind of nervous about a refurb with a 90 day warranty, but the price is hard to beat.

I'm going to use a 5 channel NAD amp for the front 3 and main surrounds and internal amps for the other 6. I also have 2 subs. Hopefully the NAD will take most of the load and keep the 4311 cool and working.

I'm sure i'll have some setup questions for everyone.
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post #16840 of 23297 Old 04-27-2012, 12:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ccotenj View Post

oh yea, that would be MORE than enough... a 60A panel would be more than enough... i would be willing to bet that at least half the houses in my town have no more than 60 at the main service entrance...

i wish i had had the forethought to do what you are doing...

1 LG clone - 220V/20A
1 QSC RMX5050 - 120V/30A
1 Behringer EPX4000 - 120V/20A
1 Denon 4311 and Emotiva XPA-2 - 120V/20A
Everything else: Commercial grade Cisco router and switches, several BD players (all A/V sources are fed from closet), IR extenders, cable modem, closet fan and lights, etc - 120V/20A

Doesn't leave much room for any more amps. I was already thinking of adding another three or five channel amp for my center and surround speakers or maybe another LG clone for more subs.
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post #16841 of 23297 Old 04-27-2012, 12:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by giomania View Post

So I guess I went overboard when I installed one of these balanced power sub-panels in my theater equipment room?

Mark

Wait! You did it wrong! It should be made of wood!


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post #16842 of 23297 Old 04-27-2012, 01:00 PM
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Wait! You did it wrong! It should be made of wood!


And the wood should have been sanded and a coat of polyurethane applied. Repeat until you get the sound you are happy with.
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post #16843 of 23297 Old 04-27-2012, 01:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by giomania View Post

So I guess I went overboard when I installed one of these balanced power sub-panels in my theater equipment room?

Mark

oh, that is sexxxxxxxy... the cool factor of that is off the charts...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nethawk View Post

Wait! You did it wrong! It should be made of wood!


specially harvested from trees carefully grown to increase their musical character...

Quote:
Originally Posted by duc135 View Post

And the wood should have been sanded and a coat of polyurethane applied. Repeat until you get the sound you are happy with.

by tibetan monks, of course...

- chris

 

my build thread - updated 8-20-12 - new seating installed and projector isolation solution

 

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1332917/ccotenj-finally-gets-a-projector

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post #16844 of 23297 Old 04-27-2012, 01:27 PM
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Originally Posted by ccotenj View Post


specially harvested from trees carefully grown to increase their musical character...

I've searched for days trying to determine whether maple is acoustically correct wood, because I'm torn between matching my speakers and optimal sound. I suppose if I use brass or gold-plated screws it will help...


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post #16845 of 23297 Old 04-27-2012, 01:43 PM
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Originally Posted by ccotenj View Post

specially harvested from trees carefully grown to increase their musical character...



by tibetan monks, of course...

(slapping forehead with palm) Of course... how could I have forgotten that part. I wonder if it would improve the sound any if you were to supervise the monk while being tended to by 40 virgins? Can't hurt I suppose.
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post #16846 of 23297 Old 04-27-2012, 01:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KidHorn View Post

I'm going to use a 5 channel NAD amp for the front 3 and main surrounds and internal amps for the other 6.

sounds like you are going full 11ch splendor? I would use the 5ch amp for the front 5 (L/C/R + Wides) and not the surrounds, let the Denon power the 4 surrounds and 2 heights. The Wides get a ton of content especially in big soundtrack action flicks.

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post #16847 of 23297 Old 04-27-2012, 02:42 PM
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no the power goes completely out in the room it doesnt dim. I need to figure out if I should replace breakers, run dedicated outlet, sub panel whatever dont know but I am willing to pay to make it all right and tight
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post #16848 of 23297 Old 04-27-2012, 03:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by duc135 View Post

(slapping forehead with palm) Of course... how could I have forgotten that part. I wonder if it would improve the sound any if you were to supervise the monk while being tended to by 40 virgins? Can't hurt I suppose.

no, we need to save the virgins for the ritual "save/load" sacrifice... they can sometimes be in short supply...

- chris

 

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post #16849 of 23297 Old 04-27-2012, 03:36 PM
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Originally Posted by Nethawk View Post

I've searched for days trying to determine whether maple is acoustically correct wood, because I'm torn between matching my speakers and optimal sound. I suppose if I use brass or gold-plated screws it will help...


you've only gone that far? geez, you've yet to begin to tweak...

clicky

- chris

 

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post #16850 of 23297 Old 04-27-2012, 03:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by duc135 View Post

Are your breakers tripping or are the lights just dimming? I believe there are new building codes that requires special breakers for bedrooms that detect an open circuit or something like that. Very similar to GF circuits breakers, but the are very sensitive.

I lived for a while in a newly built condo that had these breakers. The bedroom closet had a new fluorescent fixture that was NOT shorting out in any way, but every time I turned it on, the bedroom breaker would cut out. BIG aggravation...

AT&T U-Verse Northeast Ohio

Denon x4000, Samsung LED TV, B&W 704 mains, two M&K subwoofers, Oppo 103, etc.
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post #16851 of 23297 Old 04-27-2012, 04:53 PM
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Everyone,

when inputting a 2-channel SACD signal, over Denon Link 3rd, if speakers are set to small, will the subwoofer be engaged for frequencies below the crossover (e.g. 2.1) when in DSD direct? Or should you build a custom 2CH listening preset to get this to work (if you can)?

Any information greatly appreciated.

Thanks in advance. Cheers.
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post #16852 of 23297 Old 04-27-2012, 05:01 PM
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^^
No, as noted on the spreadsheet on p. 126 in the Owner's manual.

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post #16853 of 23297 Old 04-27-2012, 05:06 PM
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^^
No, as noted on the spreadsheet on p. 126 in the Owner's manual.

Ok, thanks for the quick reply it is most appreciated.

So I gather the 4311CI forces the front left and right speakers into full range mode then? Does it disengage Audyssey as well for DSD Direct signals over Denon Link 3rd?

Cheers.
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post #16854 of 23297 Old 04-27-2012, 05:12 PM
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^^
Yes ... DIRECT or PURE DIRECT disengage Audyssey.

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post #16855 of 23297 Old 04-27-2012, 05:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post

^^
Yes ... DIRECT or PURE DIRECT disengage Audyssey.

So playing an SACD over Denon Link means you get the full effect of any standing waves etc. Wow! I didn't realize that.

Cheers.
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post #16856 of 23297 Old 04-27-2012, 08:54 PM
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After trying several different readings. Some with 8 points, some with 5 points, etc, I find that bass is very weak for 2 channel stereo ( all speakers set to small, 80hz).

Movies sound tight and great, but 2 channel sounds thin.

I tried turning up sub level for 2 channel, but it does not add body to the sound, only low end.

If I turn OFF the bass management on the a-100, and therefor main speakers are set to large and no sub ( tried this with PURE mode) and bass is very good.

Some background on hookup.

Using a SVS AS-EQ1 to control 2 subs. Have single sub out of denon going into #1 sub in on SVS.

Should I maybe NOT have denon try to also correct bass? And use the SVS method to fool the denon there is a perfect sub hooked up therefore denon will not EQ?

Note: prior I had a pioneer sc-57 and the SVS. Same hookup as denon. The bass was awesome. Full and deep.

Seems denon is doing something wrong with bass managent...

My room is the unfinished basement. I put safe and sound in joists In ceiling, and have a small rug on concrete floor.

Maybe this impossible room is making audyssey turn bass down too much in denon?

Or maybe the SVS is mis-reading the 2 subs distances wrong? And therefore this overall distance between both subs is messing with denon audyssey??

Hope someone can help.

I'm waiting the shipment of my pro kit. Maybe this will help?
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post #16857 of 23297 Old 04-27-2012, 10:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by muad'dib View Post

After trying several different readings. Some with 8 points, some with 5 points, etc, I find that bass is very weak for 2 channel stereo ( all speakers set to small, 80hz).

Movies sound tight and great, but 2 channel sounds thin.

Hope someone can help.

I'm waiting the shipment of my pro kit. Maybe this will help?

It's quite possible it will help given the better microphone involved. My experience was a notable increase in bass quantity and quality going from a consumer Audyssey calibration on the 4311 to a pro calibration. In fact, I was amazed how much I needed to turn up the subs (a good 1/4 turn each) on the 75db level setting screen during the pro calibration. However, last time I discussed this experience on the forum, my findings were atypical in that most folks who have gone from consumer to pro on the 4311 did not have to adjust the level knobs on their subs at all--75 db for consumer equaled 75 db for pro.

Let me know if your bass returns after you do a pro calibration! Good luck!

Edit: Have you tried hooking up both subs directly to the AVR and running a calibration that way?
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post #16858 of 23297 Old 04-27-2012, 11:07 PM
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Originally Posted by muad'dib View Post

Using a SVS AS-EQ1 to control 2 subs. Have single sub out of denon going into #1 sub in on SVS.

The 4311CI includes SubEQ HT which does the same thing as the stand alone SVS AS-EQ1 so there's no reason to use the SVS-AS-EQ1 as well. As tandy1000rl suggests, try taking the SVS AS-EQ1 out of the mix.

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post #16859 of 23297 Old 04-28-2012, 12:26 AM
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Hello,

To start here is my current setup
Current HT Rig
Speakers- RTi A5 Fronts, CSi A6 Center, RTi A3 Rears
Speaker Cable-Belden 5T00UP(10 AWG)Bluejeanscable
Subwoofer- SVS 20-39PC+ 16 Hz Tune
AVR- Denon 4311CI
Blu-ray- PS3 (Slim)
Display- Panasonic TC-P65VT25
Remote- Harmony 880
I have 3 big dogs and they keep knocking over my speaker stands that the A3's are on when they are rough-housing so my solution is to buy RTI A7's for the front and move the RTI A5's to the back so they can't knock them over, which allows me to add the RTI A3's to surround backs to increase the system to 7.1. My question is, is that too much to push for the 4311 and should I add an amp such as an XPA5 to push the 5.0 and let the Denon just push the surround backs? Also by using an external amp will I lose audyssey or any other benefits that the Denon offers. Thank you in advance.
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post #16860 of 23297 Old 04-28-2012, 01:21 AM
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^^
An external amp shouldn't be required as the RTia5 and RTia7 speakers are both 8Ω and fairly efficient at 90db and 89db respectively. However, should you decide to add an external amp, doing so will not impact the ability to use Audyssey.

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