The "Official" Denon AVR-4311CI/AVR-A100 thread [NO PRICE TALK] - Page 777 - AVS Forum
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post #23281 of 23567 Old 06-17-2014, 11:06 AM
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^ +1
and Bill please quit posting over on the surround thread, I have a paypal credit after selling my old Elite receiver last week, you are a bad influence
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post #23282 of 23567 Old 06-21-2014, 06:42 AM
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Hi Folks.
I have found the specifications for my speakers(Cerwin Vega 1215MkII special edition).
When the specs say "RECOMMENDED CONTINUOUS POWER: 500 watts" is that suggesting that I should be using an external 500 rms amp to take advantage of the massive 12 & 15" woofers?
The specs are a little off, my set has 2 MIDRANGE DRIVER: 6.5” Cones and does not have a rear firing tweeter also the cabinet size is a little off but other than that it's the same.

MODEL 1215 Mk II…
Circa: 1991
FREQUENCY RESPONSE: 30 Hz –24 kHz
RECOMMENDED CONTINUOUS POWER: 500 watts
SENSITIVITY: 100dB (1 watt @ 1 meter)
IMPEDANCE: 4 ohms
BASS DRIVER: (1) AIW12 12” Die-Cast frame (front firing)
(1) 15” Die-cast frame (down firing)
MIDRANGE DRIVER: (1) 6.5” Cone
TWEETER DRIVER: DT-54 1” Voice-coil Polymerdome Horn
REAR TWEETER: 3/4” Voice-coil Horn (rear firing)
CROSSOVER POINTS: 100/600/3000/12,000 Hz.
DIMENSIONS HWD: 48-7/16” X 17-1/8” X 15-3/4” (123 X 43.5 X 40 CM)
WEIGHT: 99lbs. / 45kg.


Please don't pay attention to the wiring call outs, they have since been corrected.

Any suggestions on powering the woofers would be gratefully received. Cheers! Paul K
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post #23283 of 23567 Old 07-09-2014, 12:35 PM
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So how many of you guys are experiencing the distortion on DD+?

Dolby Digital Plus and Netflix on Various AVRs

Looks like no update for the 4311

I called Denon today to see if they would consider allowing me to upgrade (for a price) to a 4520 without this issue. They we less than helpful. They basically said I would have to bring it into a Service Center for repair, wait for a diagnosis, then we'd discuss options. I'm not even sure my local service center would be able to properly diagnose this issue, without ripping my 4311 all to pieces, and keeping it for 2 weeks.

Anyone have any contacts at Denon that would be sympathetic to this issue?
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post #23284 of 23567 Old 07-09-2014, 01:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sam S View Post
So how many of you guys are experiencing the distortion on DD+?

Dolby Digital Plus and Netflix on Various AVRs

Looks like no update for the 4311

I called Denon today to see if they would consider allowing me to upgrade (for a price) to a 4520 without this issue. They we less than helpful. They basically said I would have to bring it into a Service Center for repair, wait for a diagnosis, then we'd discuss options. I'm not even sure my local service center would be able to properly diagnose this issue, without ripping my 4311 all to pieces, and keeping it for 2 weeks.

Anyone have any contacts at Denon that would be sympathetic to this issue?
Everyone that streams a DD+ track via Netflix should experience it...it is a known issue.
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post #23285 of 23567 Old 07-09-2014, 01:26 PM
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Everyone that streams a DD+ track via Netflix should experience it...it is a known issue.
True enough... I guess I shoulda asked how many of you experience this issue with your 4311 and want (got?) Denon to do something about it without dragging your 4311 to a service center, first?
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post #23286 of 23567 Old 07-09-2014, 01:28 PM
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Originally Posted by Sam S View Post
True enough... I guess I shoulda asked how many of you experience this issue with your 4311 and want (got?) Denon to do something about it without dragging your 4311 to a service center, first?
Last I heard, Denon is sending out a firmware update to correct this sometime "soon".
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post #23287 of 23567 Old 07-09-2014, 01:30 PM
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Last I heard, Denon is sending out a firmware update to correct this sometime "soon".
Not, apparently, for the 4311.

Per this post:
Dolby Digital Plus and Netflix on Various AVRs
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post #23288 of 23567 Old 07-09-2014, 02:03 PM
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Not, apparently, for the 4311.

Per this post:
Dolby Digital Plus and Netflix on Various AVRs
Weak. I guess I will be contacting them...
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post #23289 of 23567 Old 07-09-2014, 02:08 PM
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I watch a number of shows on Netflix using my 4311 and have never heard any distortion. Known issue yes, all hearing not yet.
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post #23290 of 23567 Old 07-09-2014, 02:20 PM
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Weak. I guess I will be contacting them...
Maybe you'll have luck taking to a supervisor? I talked with David at Denon, and was not at all satisfied with his suggestions to take it in for repair, first. It did not appear that he was familiar with the issue.
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I watch a number of shows on Netflix using my 4311 and have never heard any distortion. Known issue yes, all hearing not yet.
It's a warbling issue that I hear, mainly on the center channel/dialog. Make sure your netflix device is actually bitstreaming DD+, i.e. not AppleTV.
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post #23291 of 23567 Old 07-09-2014, 02:23 PM
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I watch a number of shows on Netflix using my 4311 and have never heard any distortion. Known issue yes, all hearing not yet.
It is not a problem on all DD+ streams. There are several episodes of House of Cards that will exhibit the problem. Some precise episodes can be found by searching this forum.
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post #23292 of 23567 Old 07-09-2014, 02:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Sam S View Post
Maybe you'll have luck taking to a supervisor? I talked with David at Denon, and was not at all satisfied with his suggestions to take it in for repair, first. It did not appear that he was familiar with the issue.


It's a warbling issue that I hear, mainly on the center channel/dialog. Make sure your netflix device is actually bitstreaming DD+, i.e. not AppleTV.
Thanks Sam - I knew I should have pointed that out. I always bitstream Netflix from my Oppo and I do know the difference between DD+ and stereo
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post #23293 of 23567 Old 07-09-2014, 02:38 PM
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It is not a problem on all DD+ streams. There are several episodes of House of Cards that will exhibit the problem. Some precise episodes can be found by searching this forum.
Actually my favorite show and didn't notice an issue watching the first two seasons - a number of episodes more than once. No doubt it is there, just so for not for me so far and I'm not one to go looking for problems. Like looking for DSE on my plasma, better things to focus on with my a/v time. Regardless I am buying a new Atmos receiver later this year, my 4311 has been an outstanding performer for past 3 years I have been using it. Bug or not it will be a non-issue for me, but I wouldn't hesitate to recommend a well maintained used 4311 for anyone looking for a very good used receiver option now or later.
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post #23294 of 23567 Old 07-09-2014, 02:55 PM
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Originally Posted by smurraybhm View Post
Actually my favorite show and didn't notice an issue watching the first two seasons - a number of episodes more than once. No doubt it is there, just so for not for me so far and I'm not one to go looking for problems. Like looking for DSE on my plasma, better things to focus on with my a/v time. Regardless I am buying a new Atmos receiver later this year, my 4311 has been an outstanding performer for past 3 years I have been using it. Bug or not it will be a non-issue for me, but I wouldn't hesitate to recommend a well maintained used 4311 for anyone looking for a very good used receiver option now or later.
If you don't notice, then more power to you. Your cookie is in the mail.

At the low volume levels it might not be noticeable...however, at the higher volume levels it is like nails on a chalkboard...hard to miss.

For those wanting to hear the issue, just add "The Nightmare Before Christmas" to your Instant Queue and the issue will exhibit itself right as the title of the movie is showing (you can hear it in the center channel). Again, the AVR needs to be doing the decoding.

Last edited by Nickff; 07-09-2014 at 06:35 PM.
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post #23295 of 23567 Old 07-09-2014, 05:11 PM
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Once you hear it you can't unhear it. Whether the volume is low or high you can still hear it.
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post #23296 of 23567 Old 07-10-2014, 01:18 PM
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Regarding the DD+ issue:

I have chatted, called several times, spoken with a product-support manager, and emailed...

They all say a firmware update has addressed the issue for the 4311. I updated my firmware this morning and the issue is still there (I knew it would be but just so I could tell them I did it).

The product support team truly believes all affected AVRs were fixed via firmware updates.

I don't see this going anywhere.

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post #23297 of 23567 Old 07-13-2014, 02:00 PM
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For the price of this unit Denon should offer at the very least a firmware update. This is NOT some entry level AVR. They want us to continue spending our money and upgrading every few years to the "newer" avr's. They better show some customer support, their are many other manufacturers we could spend on our money on.
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post #23298 of 23567 Old 07-13-2014, 03:11 PM
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For the price of this unit Denon should offer at the very least a firmware update. This is NOT some entry level AVR. They want us to continue spending our money and upgrading every few years to the "newer" avr's. They better show some customer support, their are many other manufacturers we could spend on our money on.
IMHO, the price is largely irrelevant. What's relevant to me is that there are still a bunch of 4311's out there (including mine) that are still under warranty. While there are still units under warranty, Denon should be providing bug fixes through firmware updates when needed (again, IMHO). If they're unable to do so, they should offer people a low cost way to replace the product with the closest equivalent current product, which would be the AVR-4520CI. If fact, 2 people have posted in the other thread that covers the Dolby Digital Plus bug (across all products, not just Denon) that Denon offered to replace their AVR-4311CI's with AVR-4520CI's for $100 for a refurb with a 1 year warranty or $300 for a brand new one with a 3 year warranty. To me, that's a perfectly reasonably resolution and one that I will take Denon up on if they agree to it (I sent them a request to do this late last week).
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post #23299 of 23567 Old 07-13-2014, 03:35 PM
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That is a heck of a deal to be able to get the 4520 refurb for $100 or a new one for $300. I would think everyone would jump on that to replace their 4311.

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post #23300 of 23567 Old 07-13-2014, 03:52 PM
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That is a heck of a deal to be able to get the 4520 refurb for $100 or a new one for $300. I would think everyone would jump on that to replace their 4311.
I did!
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post #23301 of 23567 Old 07-13-2014, 04:37 PM
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I did!
Do you mind to elaborate?


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post #23302 of 23567 Old 07-13-2014, 04:50 PM
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Do you mind to elaborate?
Sure. <cut and paste from my post on another thread>

I tried for a couple of months via their phone support to get a timeline on when the patch for the AVR-4311 would be available without any success. So I then opened a ticket via:

http://usa.denon.com/us/myaccount/pages/login.aspx

I explained that I have had this DD+ issue for 6 months and no one at Denon support is able to tell me if or when it will be resolved. I would like to know when this will be resolved or I would like to be able to purchase a AVR-4520 for a small upgrade charge. After many weekly updates of "We haven't been able to get an firm date from Japan", they finally offered me a new AVR-4520 for $300 which included shipping. I said "Where do I sign!" and 5 days later I'm enjoying my new receiver.

Let know if you have any other questions.
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post #23303 of 23567 Old 07-13-2014, 06:15 PM
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Sure. <cut and paste from my post on another thread>

I tried for a couple of months via their phone support to get a timeline on when the patch for the AVR-4311 would be available without any success. So I then opened a ticket via:

http://usa.denon.com/us/myaccount/pages/login.aspx

I explained that I have had this DD+ issue for 6 months and no one at Denon support is able to tell me if or when it will be resolved. I would like to know when this will be resolved or I would like to be able to purchase a AVR-4520 for a small upgrade charge. After many weekly updates of "We haven't been able to get an firm date from Japan", they finally offered me a new AVR-4520 for $300 which included shipping. I said "Where do I sign!" and 5 days later I'm enjoying my new receiver.

Let know if you have any other questions.

Thanks Dan!

Was your 4311CI still under warranty? My unit was purchased at Magnolia and it is still under warranty. Few more months left. Hence the concern that I have this issue is not going to be resolved.

Of course, if they are not planning on doing anything about fixing the issue, then this is a valid option to avoid further issues for them and hopefully a chance for us to have an updated unit.

Since you submitted your question, how long did you have to wait until they give you an answer? You said many weeks, is that 2, 4, 6 weeks?

Sorry for all the questions, is just that warranty is running out!

Thanks in advance for your response.


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post #23304 of 23567 Old 07-13-2014, 06:38 PM
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Thanks Dan!

Was your 4311CI still under warranty? My unit was purchased at Magnolia and it is still under warranty. Few more months left. Hence the concern that I have this issue is not going to be resolved.

Of course, if they are not planning on doing anything about fixing the issue, then this is a valid option to avoid further issues for them and hopefully a chance for us to have an updated unit.

Since you submitted your question, how long did you have to wait until they give you an answer? You said many weeks, is that 2, 4, 6 weeks?

Sorry for all the questions, is just that warranty is running out!

Thanks in advance for your response.

Hey cr136124,

Yes my unit was still under warranty, I purchased it February of 2012.

After I submitted my issue in April of 2014 they replied the next day:

The AVR-4311CI will indeed be receiving a firmware update for the Dolby Digital Plus issue. However, we have inquired about this since we were wondering the same thing and have been told that the schedule for the 2011 models is currently being adjusted.
We will keep this ticket in process and when we hear of a release date for the AVR-4311CI firmware, we will be in contact with you.


Then after prompting for an update in May, they would update the ticket weekly with:

We are still waiting to hear on the DD+ update. We will continue to keep you posted.

Then near the end of June they said "since they didn't have a date for the fix....

If I were you, knowing that my warranty was about to expire I would be honest with them and say "I've had this issue for almost 6 months and I am really concerned that when my warranty expires I will be stuck with a receiver that has a serious bug in its firmware. What options can you offer me?"

Denon appears to be doing the right thing and I think you will be successful.

Good luck, definitely let me know what happens.

Dan
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post #23305 of 23567 Old 07-13-2014, 06:54 PM
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Thanks Dan!

I went to the Denon website using the link you provided. I didn't find a specific place to open an incident. I found the support section and used it to ask a question. Is that what you used too?


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post #23306 of 23567 Old 07-13-2014, 07:03 PM
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Thanks Dan!

I went to the Denon website using the link you provided. I didn't find a specific place to open an incident. I found the support section and used it to ask a question. Is that what you used too?
That's weird it gives me a login.

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post #23307 of 23567 Old 07-13-2014, 07:54 PM
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^^^

Right, and as I already have an account with them, I was able to login without problems. Then I clicked at the Support box, and in there I made my question.
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post #23308 of 23567 Old 07-15-2014, 07:01 PM
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Sure. <cut and paste from my post on another thread>

I tried for a couple of months via their phone support to get a timeline on when the patch for the AVR-4311 would be available without any success. So I then opened a ticket via:

http://usa.denon.com/us/myaccount/pages/login.aspx

I explained that I have had this DD+ issue for 6 months and no one at Denon support is able to tell me if or when it will be resolved. I would like to know when this will be resolved or I would like to be able to purchase a AVR-4520 for a small upgrade charge. After many weekly updates of "We haven't been able to get an firm date from Japan", they finally offered me a new AVR-4520 for $300 which included shipping. I said "Where do I sign!" and 5 days later I'm enjoying my new receiver.

Let know if you have any other questions.
For the upgrade, did you have to return the AVR-4311 first? Mine is still under warranty, and I'm going to open a support case for this issue. Did they offer advance replacement, bill your CC for the total, then credit back the difference, after they receive your 4311?

Thanks,
Ben
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post #23309 of 23567 Old 07-15-2014, 07:29 PM
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For the upgrade, did you have to return the AVR-4311 first? Mine is still under warranty, and I'm going to open a support case for this issue. Did they offer advance replacement, bill your CC for the total, then credit back the difference, after they receive your 4311?

Thanks,
Ben
Hey Ben,

Advanced replacement. They emailed me a label for the Fedex shipping and i returned the unit after receiving the 4520. They did not charge me for the total just the $300. YMMV.

Good luck. Let me know what happens.
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post #23310 of 23567 Old 07-16-2014, 01:25 PM
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Hey Ben,

Advanced replacement. They emailed me a label for the Fedex shipping and i returned the unit after receiving the 4520. They did not charge me for the total just the $300. YMMV.

Good luck. Let me know what happens.
Customer support was not helpful. The support person said "at this time the release for the 4311 has not been released. We do not have a date when this will be released."

I explained my concerns about my warranty expiring, and then being left with an AVR with a broken DD+ implementation for a primary source of content (Netflix).

He was slightly sympathetic. And did apologize for the "inconveniences". I asked if he could at least commit that it would eventually be fixed on the 4311. He said, " I can not commit to anything, because, they are still working on the issue.", and "Sir, Unfortunately, I can not state anything further than We are working on the issue "

I informed him about the reports here, of other warrantied customer's receiving an option to upgrade for a fee, to a newer model that includes the fix. I told him I would appreciate the same option, since it would alleviate my concerns about the warranty expiring.

His response was "I do not believe that is an option." and "We can not believe everything on the Internet".

At this point, it was clear he is either unable, or unwilling to help me. This has been my first experience with Denon gear. I'm not sure I would recommend them to others, at this point.
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