The Official Integra DHC-80.2 Pre/Pro Thread - Page 68 - AVS Forum
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post #2011 of 3830 Old 03-14-2011, 11:54 AM
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Have done a first calibrate of my DHC 80.2 Integra and it sounds great
But today I can not connect with EQ Pro 3.4 software to my Integra.
Everything works with network ... both web interface and network radio.
What am I doing wrong ?

I have unpluged power and reinstalled software twice

Please help !
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post #2012 of 3830 Old 03-14-2011, 01:49 PM
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Check your Internet address on the 80.2. Make sure you are using the integra 2 interface and the ip and control codes are right.
If that doesn't work, call Audyssey
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post #2013 of 3830 Old 03-14-2011, 03:35 PM
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Thanks for the input guys.
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post #2014 of 3830 Old 03-14-2011, 04:34 PM
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Hey, I've been looking at

Onkyo 5508 pre/pro
Integra 80.2

It looks like these are the same 'family' of pre/pros.

What is the rough Street price for the 80.2 Seems like the 5508 is going for $1499-$1799 online through authorized. Realize specific price shouldn't be posted, but thought you could post MSRP/Street 'ranges'.

Any advantages to the 80.2 to the 5508? Or would they be virtually the same?
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post #2015 of 3830 Old 03-14-2011, 06:22 PM
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Small differences. Virtually the same.

Kal Rubinson

"Music in the Round"
Senior Contributing Editor, Stereophile

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post #2016 of 3830 Old 03-14-2011, 07:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tjf120 View Post


Any advantages to the 80.2 to the 5508? Or would they be virtually the same?

One advantage to the 80.2 that may matter to some people, is it has a 3 year warranty compared to the 5508 only having 2 years.
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post #2017 of 3830 Old 03-14-2011, 08:33 PM
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Do they both street for about the same price?


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post #2018 of 3830 Old 03-14-2011, 09:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pepar View Post

Do they both street for about the same price?

The list price of the 80.2 is 2300. US and the 5508 is 2350. No rack ears / with rack ears, AudPro capable / non-AudPro capable, 3 yr vs 2 yr warranty...direct vs pure-is that correct ?
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post #2019 of 3830 Old 03-14-2011, 09:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tjf120 View Post

Hey, I've been looking at

Onkyo 5508 pre/pro
Integra 80.2

It looks like these are the same 'family' of pre/pros.

What is the rough Street price for the 80.2 Seems like the 5508 is going for $1499-$1799 online through authorized. Realize specific price shouldn't be posted, but thought you could post MSRP/Street 'ranges'.

Any advantages to the 80.2 to the 5508? Or would they be virtually the same?

It seems as though the musical instrument dealers (which OPro tends to sell to since the independent rep firms that represent OPro pretty much sell to dealers that concentrate on sound reinforcement/musical inst. products) are tickled making 10% on the product vs the Integra dealers would like 20-25%.
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post #2020 of 3830 Old 03-15-2011, 03:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alanl715 View Post

The list price of the 80.2 is 2300. US and the 5508 is 2350. No rack ears / with rack ears, AudPro capable / non-AudPro capable, 3 yr vs 2 yr warranty...direct vs pure-is that correct ?

The 5508 is Audyssey Pro capable.
http://www.audyssey.com/products/?f=all-installer-ready

Mine did not come with the rack kit but I did not buy it from an OnkyoPro dealer.
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post #2021 of 3830 Old 03-15-2011, 06:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alanl715 View Post

It seems as though the musical instrument dealers (which OPro tends to sell to since the independent rep firms that represent OPro pretty much sell to dealers that concentrate on sound reinforcement/musical inst. products) are tickled making 10% on the product vs the Integra dealers would like 20-25%.

Well, that was my impression from previous Integra/Onk model comparisons.

Jeff


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post #2022 of 3830 Old 03-16-2011, 11:29 AM
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for those of you listening to SACD, do you have the 80.2 DSD DAC Direct setting "on" or "off"?

The manual has me slightly confused about what the setting is doing. Can someone explain?
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post #2023 of 3830 Old 03-16-2011, 01:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tallnick View Post

for those of you listening to SACD, do you have the 80.2 DSD DAC Direct setting "on" or "off"?

The manual has me slightly confused about what the setting is doing. Can someone explain?

I use bitstream and DSD.
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post #2024 of 3830 Old 03-17-2011, 06:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tallnick View Post

for those of you listening to SACD, do you have the 80.2 DSD DAC Direct setting "on" or "off"?

The manual has me slightly confused about what the setting is doing. Can someone explain?

DSD Direct ON means if you are bitstreaming DSD from your SACD player via HDMI with the Integra set in Direct mode, the DSD will be converted to analog with no intervening conversion to PCM. If it is OFF, DSD is converted from DSD to PCM to analog in Direct mode. I think, but I am not 100% sure, that DSD Direct eliminates any possibility of using the sub channel via bass management, even if your setting is to apply bass management in Direct mode.

In my system and to my ears DSD Direct may be OK, and merely OK, for stereo SACD's, but it does not cut it for Mch at all. Even so, the possible advantages of pure DSD are far, far outweighed by the use of Audyssey and my subwoofer in normal, non-Direct listening mode with full DSD processing. After a few brief auditions of DSD Direct, I never, ever want to listen in that mode. It's not close in my view. And, I do prefer bitstreaming DSD sonically, though it is converted to PCM as I use it.
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post #2025 of 3830 Old 03-17-2011, 07:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fitzcaraldo215 View Post

DSD Direct ON means if you are bitstreaming DSD from your SACD player via HDMI with the Integra set in Direct mode, the DSD will be converted to analog with no intervening conversion to PCM. If it is OFF, DSD is converted from DSD to PCM to analog in Direct mode. I think, but I am not 100% sure, that DSD Direct eliminates any possibility of using the sub channel via bass management, even if your setting is to apply bass management in Direct mode.

In my system and to my ears DSD Direct may be OK, and merely OK, for stereo SACD's, but it does not cut it for Mch at all. Even so, the possible advantages of pure DSD are far, far outweighed by the use of Audyssey and my subwoofer in normal, non-Direct listening mode with full DSD processing. After a few brief auditions of DSD Direct, I never, ever want to listen in that mode. It's not close in my view. And, I do prefer bitstreaming DSD sonically, though it is converted to PCM as I use it.

I'm a bit confused. I thought that there were three SACD scenarios .. bitstream it to the pre/pro over HDMI and have the pre/pro decode it, decode it in the player and output PCM over HDMI or decode and convert it to analog outputted via the multichannel analog outputs. The latter would be the only method that would not use Audyssey.

With a digital source, "direct" modes seem to have lost their edge; the DAC has to take place somewhere so the signal might as well remain digital, be "processed" and be converted by the final output DACs on the pre/pro.

If the source is vinyl, then I understand the purist using "direct" ...

Jeff


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post #2026 of 3830 Old 03-17-2011, 09:36 AM
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I was of a similar view, that there are three possibilities and which one you use depends on which DAC's you want to take advantage of (those in your player or those in your pre) AND if you want to use Audyssey on the source.

if, for instance, like on the oppo bdp-95, you can set trim levels, distances, inside the player and then take advantage of it's DAC's to output analog through it's 7.1 analog output, then having DAC direct "ON" and listening in direct mode on the 80.2 would possibly be best?

yes fitz, I realize that this would NOT take advantage of Audyssey, but would the use of the superior DAC's in the oppo make up for it?

This is what I am going to experiment with. I'm just making sure I'm understanding what exactly is happening so I can adjust the settings correctly.
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post #2027 of 3830 Old 03-17-2011, 09:39 AM
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Mine and Fitz' opinion is that no DAC, regardless of how much better it is than the ones in the receiver/processor, compensates for not using Audyssey room correction.


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post #2028 of 3830 Old 03-17-2011, 09:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pepar View Post

Mine and Fitz' opinion is that no DAC, regardless of how much better it is than the ones in the receiver/processor, compensates for not using Audyssey room correction.

I concur. I have the oppo 83 . I listened to direct with sub and did not like it.

Setting the Oppo to bitstream and the 80.2 to dsd sounds very good for my SACDs

I am a bit confused by the above discussion. I did think that direct offered the option of using a sub-but not using Audessey.

Perhaps we can get more details from our resident experts.

Joel
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post #2029 of 3830 Old 03-17-2011, 01:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pepar View Post

I'm a bit confused. I thought that there were three SACD scenarios .. bitstream it to the pre/pro over HDMI and have the pre/pro decode it, decode it in the player and output PCM over HDMI or decode and convert it to analog outputted via the multichannel analog outputs. The latter would be the only method that would not use Audyssey.

With a digital source, "direct" modes seem to have lost their edge; the DAC has to take place somewhere so the signal might as well remain digital, be "processed" and be converted by the final output DACs on the pre/pro.

If the source is vinyl, then I understand the purist using "direct" ...

Jeff

You are correct about the three modes for SACD. But, what I said is also correct for DSD via HDMI depending on use of Direct with the DSD Direct parameter set to ON in the Integra. This was not an option until the 80.1/80.2. I agree with you about using Direct for digital sources. There is not much point, especially not in Mch. I only use it for testing, as I listen to analog hardly at all.
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post #2030 of 3830 Old 03-17-2011, 02:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tallnick View Post

I was of a similar view, that there are three possibilities and which one you use depends on which DAC's you want to take advantage of (those in your player or those in your pre) AND if you want to use Audyssey on the source.

if, for instance, like on the oppo bdp-95, you can set trim levels, distances, inside the player and then take advantage of it's DAC's to output analog through it's 7.1 analog output, then having DAC direct "ON" and listening in direct mode on the 80.2 would possibly be best?

yes fitz, I realize that this would NOT take advantage of Audyssey, but would the use of the superior DAC's in the oppo make up for it?

This is what I am going to experiment with. I'm just making sure I'm understanding what exactly is happening so I can adjust the settings correctly.

I have an Oppo 83, not a 93 or 95. I do not know if the restrictions on distance settings or bass crossovers are as severe and limiting on the newer Oppos or not. But, they are unacceptable to me in the 83, especially in comparison to what the Integra has.

Don't forget also that most subs have an internal network that delays the signal. So, measured linear distance is often incorrect - too short - in the sub channel. You should use the more accurate distance setting Audyssey has determined acoustically, copying the sub's distance value from your Integra calibration to the Oppo sub channel.

But, hold on a second. To use pure DSD, HDMI output from the Oppo bypasses its internal DSP anyway, so any distance or bass xover parameters in the player cannot be used with DSD output via HDMI or with the Oppo's analog output in DSD mode. There are no DSP's currently anywhere on the planet that operate in DSD mode. They are all PCM these days. This means that for Mch, your speakers need to be physically equidistant from the sweet spot. It is unavoidable. It's physically also impossible for me and most people to do. That's one reason pure DSD Mch is not going anywhere.

Stereo should work, since you do not need distance compensation for it, and you can do some comparisons that way in pure DSD, without DSP bass management. But, if you need speaker distance compensation for Mch, you would have to output PCM from the player. I see no conceivable advantage to that, and many disadvantages, as opposed to bitstreaming DSD from the player to the Integra, and using full DSP processing, including Audyssey there.

Also, using the player's DAC's and going analog into the Integra, which would have this same no-DSP problem in pure DSD, uses the Integra essentially only as a volume control. I do not think anyone will tell you that the Integra is a great device for analog signal. It's decent, but does not have high end pretensions. It will degrade the analog signal somewhat, contrary to what you are trying to achieve via pure DSD and the supposedly superior DACS in the player. The Integra is as great as it is not because of its analog prowess, but because of its processing in the digital domain, which you would be bypassing. So, 90% of what you paid for in the Integra would be wasted. A Parasound Halo P7 analog controller would be the cheapest way to go for better sound in Mch analog, but it gives up tons of very important features.

And, Pepar is right, my experiments with Audyssey on/off and DSD Direct convince me that I would not want to listen any other way than I do. I have also heard a Meitner EMM Labs player/DAC setup in a treated room in pure DSD configuration. You cannot get much better than that in terms of DACs. I may be biased, but I think my system sounded remarkably close to that, and much better, in fact, in terms of extension and evenness of bass response thanks to the DSP bass management + a sub (no such thing in pure DSD and analog-domain bass management is fraught with problems), as well as EQ provided by Audyssey.

I kill a lot of time over at the sa-cd.net forum, where there are quite a few pure DSD diehards (and blowhards), just about all of them stereo listeners. My opinion about pure DSD is that it is way, way overblown. By the way, the Meitner system owner I referred to thinks so to.

It may not be clear to you, but the reason for Oppo's analog outputs and for the SE and 95 was really about hooking up to older legacy systems, where the processor did not have HDMI inputs, only analog or coax/toslink. With newer gear, I do not think there is a contest at all - HDMI wins hands down. It is growing and Mch analog is shrinking. Those 6- or 8-cable Mch analog interconnect bundles have been rapidly disappearing from the market.

But, to each, his or her own. YMMV.
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post #2031 of 3830 Old 03-17-2011, 03:16 PM
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I am confused again. When I set straight decode with bitstream from my Oppo I get the DSD setting in the integra Is Audyssey in play with this setting?

If not what setting do you use for SACDs?

Joel
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post #2032 of 3830 Old 03-17-2011, 07:30 PM
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Anyone else lose the main audio all of a suden the only way to get it back was to unplug it ,then it returned . zone 2 and 3 were fine.Of course the pops always are there . When I tryed to listen to the test tones they were silent. How do you do a reset on this thing. Thanks
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post #2033 of 3830 Old 03-17-2011, 07:54 PM
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How hot is the back of the unit? Does it have lots of ventilation?
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post #2034 of 3830 Old 03-17-2011, 08:47 PM
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fitz, pepar, brilliant information. thanks.

in conclusion, consensus seems to be DSD/bitstream output via HDMI from player to 80.2.

80.2 processes digital signal, applies Audyssey, sends to 80.2's DACs, out to amp, then to speakers.

correct?

also, so which audio pre-set do you set the 80.2 to? "straight decode"?
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post #2035 of 3830 Old 03-17-2011, 09:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dundas View Post

The 5508 is Audyssey Pro capable.
http://www.audyssey.com/products/?f=all-installer-ready

Mine did not come with the rack kit but I did not buy it from an OnkyoPro dealer.

I stand corrected.
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post #2036 of 3830 Old 03-17-2011, 11:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tallnick View Post

fitz, pepar, brilliant information. thanks.

in conclusion, consensus seems to be DSD/bitstream output via HDMI from player to 80.2.

80.2 processes digital signal, applies Audyssey, sends to 80.2's DACs, out to amp, then to speakers.

correct?

also, so which audio pre-set do you set the 80.2 to? "straight decode"?

applies Audyssey is probably the most important part pf that!

But, yes, that sounds right.


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post #2037 of 3830 Old 03-18-2011, 12:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tallnick View Post

fitz, pepar, brilliant information. thanks.

in conclusion, consensus seems to be DSD/bitstream output via HDMI from player to 80.2.

80.2 processes digital signal, applies Audyssey, sends to 80.2's DACs, out to amp, then to speakers.

correct?

correct.
Quote:

also, so which audio pre-set do you set the 80.2 to? "straight decode"?

Listening mode? That is a matter of personal preference.


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post #2038 of 3830 Old 03-18-2011, 08:08 AM
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Originally Posted by jmschnur View Post

How hot is the back of the unit? Does it have lots of ventilation?

Yes it has good ventellation, and when I turn it on it is cool.But I will be installing a fan also when I find one that fits my rack ,Thanks.
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post #2039 of 3830 Old 03-18-2011, 08:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jmschnur View Post

I am confused again. When I set straight decode with bitstream from my Oppo I get the DSD setting in the integra Is Audyssey in play with this setting?

If not what setting do you use for SACDs?

Joel

Joel - yes, you get Audyssey as long as you are not using Direct mode in the Integra. The front panel should say DSD if that is what you are bitstreaming. If it does not say DSD, switch listening modes on the remote until you get it.

If it says Multich, you are not bitstreaming DSD. The player is set to PCM output.

In either case, the little Audyssey indicator should be on on the Integra's display.
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post #2040 of 3830 Old 03-18-2011, 08:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tallnick View Post

fitz, pepar, brilliant information. thanks.

in conclusion, consensus seems to be DSD/bitstream output via HDMI from player to 80.2.

80.2 processes digital signal, applies Audyssey, sends to 80.2's DACs, out to amp, then to speakers.

correct?

also, so which audio pre-set do you set the 80.2 to? "straight decode"?

If you are bitstreaming DSD, the front display should say DSD. That involves no synthetic processing of the signal. Just straight DSP after internal conversion to PCM, including Audyssey. I do not want to listen to SACDs any other way.
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