The **OFFICIAL** Denon AVR-XX12 Model Owner's Thread - Page 22 - AVS Forum
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post #631 of 19332 Old 06-04-2011, 02:08 PM
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AJAXAZ --

Consider the 4311CI for a room that large also, but it will be around 2X in cost over the 3312CI. If you are the kind of person that very rarely upgrades, I would consider the 4311CI so you can reach up to 11.2 in that very large room, assuming the cost will fit your Budget.

The 4311CI - MSRP = $1999.99
The 3312CI - MSRP = $ 999.99
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post #632 of 19332 Old 06-04-2011, 02:13 PM
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Originally Posted by SocalSD View Post

Hi - quick question regarding setup of a new 1612. I can stream Netflix on my TV; how can I get the sound to play through my speakers? The AVR is only connected to the TV via the OUT on the AVR. Do I need to use another HDMI cable to connect the TV to the AVR?

Thanks

To be more specific, I noticed that there is a TV source for the AVR, which plays sound through the TV speakers. If I want content from the TV to play through my AVR, I guess I have to connect the TV and AVR with a 2nd HDMI cable (the first one is on the OUT of the AVR to the TV)
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post #633 of 19332 Old 06-04-2011, 02:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SocalSD View Post

To be more specific, I noticed that there is a TV source for the AVR, which plays sound through the TV speakers. If I want content from the TV to play through my AVR, I guess I have to connect the TV and AVR with a 2nd HDMI cable (the first one is on the OUT of the AVR to the TV)

On the 1612 try to send the tv audio back to the receiver using the toslink optical connection. Actually labeled tv in on receiver next to hdmi in.
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post #634 of 19332 Old 06-04-2011, 02:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SocalSD View Post

To be more specific, I noticed that there is a TV source for the AVR, which plays sound through the TV speakers. If I want content from the TV to play through my AVR, I guess I have to connect the TV and AVR with a 2nd HDMI cable (the first one is on the OUT of the AVR to the TV)

You have a couple options ... if you have a newer 3D HDMI 1.4 TV that supports ARC, then you can turn it ON and set HDMI Control to ON on the 1612 and pass the audio from the TV back to the 1612 via the same HDMI cable that connects from the HDMI Monitor Out on the 1612 to the TV. Simply press TV on the remote and you'll get the audio from the TV. If you have an older TV, then connect an optical cable from the TV audio out to the optical input on the 1612 and again press TV on the remote to get the audio from the TV.

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post #635 of 19332 Old 06-04-2011, 04:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post

You have a couple options ... if you have a newer 3D HDMI 1.4 TV that supports ARC, then you can turn it ON and set HDMI Control to ON on the 1612 and pass the audio from the TV back to the 1612 via the same HDMI cable that connects from the HDMI Monitor Out on the 1612 to the TV. Simply press TV on the remote and you'll get the audio from the TV. If you have an older TV, then connect an optical cable from the TV audio out to the optical input on the 1612 and again press TV on the remote to get the audio from the TV.

Perfect - HDMI Control ON the 1612 did the trick. Many thanks
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post #636 of 19332 Old 06-04-2011, 05:05 PM
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I was experimenting today with converting .mp3 over to .flac and .wav to see the differences in filesizes, and Sound Quality (SQ) differences and whether I could notice a human ear perceivable difference when playing them into the Denon 33XX, using an 8GB USB Flash Drive.

FileSizes

.mp3 = 11,143KB
.flac = 61,423KB
.wav = 200,545KB

Knowing .flac is lossless, but compressed somewhat, I was amazed at the filesize difference from .flac to .wav, shown above.

I used the "Switch Sound File Converter" (Excellent Free Program) to convert files, and it was set as follows:

.wav -- 96KHz./24bits/Stereo

.flac -- Encoder Compression = 4
Sampling Rate = 96K
Stereo

The Denon would NOT play .wav files set for 96KHz./32bits/Stereo, but did work on the next lower setting being 96KHz./24bits/Stereo !!

Before I convert 1,000 of .mp3's to another Higher SQ Format, wanted to know if anyone else has something to add to this... Pls. chime in JD, and BP ++...

Looks like I most likely will convert to .flac and serve up the audio files via DLNA server on home net.

Always something NEW...
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post #637 of 19332 Old 06-04-2011, 05:12 PM - Thread Starter
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wait -- you are converting MP3 into FLAC? you do know that the SQ will not be better right? you can't start with the lossy version and convert it back to the lossless version -- the data is already gone!

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post #638 of 19332 Old 06-04-2011, 05:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DenPureSound View Post

I was experimenting today with converting .mp3 over to .flac and .wav to see the differences in filesizes, and Sound Quality (SQ) differences and whether I could notice a human ear perceivable difference when playing them into the Denon 33XX, using an 8GB USB Flash Drive.

FileSizes

.mp3 = 11,143KB
.flac = 61,423KB
.wav = 200,545KB

Knowing .flac is lossless, but compressed somewhat, I was amazed at the filesize difference from .flac to .wav, shown above.

I used the "Switch Sound File Converter" (Excellent Free Program) to convert files, and it was set as follows:

.wav -- 96KHz./24bits/Stereo

.flac -- Encoder Compression = 4
Sampling Rate = 96K
Stereo

The Denon would NOT play .wav files set for 96KHz./32bits/Stereo, but did work on the next lower setting being 96KHz./24bits/Stereo !!

Before I convert 1,000 of .mp3's to another Higher SQ Format, wanted to know if anyone else has something to add to this... Pls. chime in JD, and BP ++...

Looks like I most likely will convert to .flac and serve up the audio files via DLNA server on home net.

Always something NEW...

I'm assuming your using the original higher Rez source to convert from. Converting to flac from a mp3 isn't correct.

Edit: see bp beat me to it..

In search of video bliss...
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post #639 of 19332 Old 06-04-2011, 06:04 PM
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Hi Denon users,

I'm thinking of getting some Monitor rx8s. Heard them at the store and thought they were great sounding. My concern is that they are 4 ohms. My receiver is a 2112 which officially supports 8 and 6 ohms. Will it be powerful enough to play these? Will my speakers be as loud as they would with comparable 8 ohm speakers?

Are other people running 4ohm fronts strait off the receiver without a separate amp? How is the distortion?

Thanks guys!
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post #640 of 19332 Old 06-04-2011, 06:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post

wait -- you are converting MP3 into FLAC? you do know that the SQ will not be better right? you can't start with the lossy version and convert it back to the lossless version -- the data is already gone!

You are 100% correct indeed. Must of been brain dead... but believe it or not, it seemed to me that the .flac was better than the .mp3 in SQ, maybe just Placebo effect.
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post #641 of 19332 Old 06-04-2011, 06:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mariob33 View Post

I'm assuming your using the original higher Rez source to convert from. Converting to flac from a mp3 isn't correct.

Edit: see bp beat me to it..

Mariob33, Your right on again and 100% correct. What Higher Res. source should I use, .wav to start out with or ?? then convert to .flac or ?
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post #642 of 19332 Old 06-04-2011, 06:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mbman81 View Post

Hi Denon users,

I'm thinking of getting some Monitor rx8s. Heard them at the store and thought they were great sounding. My concern is that they are 4 ohms. My receiver is a 2112 which officially supports 8 and 6 ohms. Will it be powerful enough to play these? Will my speakers be as loud as they would with comparable 8 ohm speakers?

Are other people running 4ohm fronts strait off the receiver without a separate amp? How is the distortion?

Thanks guys!

What is the sensitivity of those speakers in db (2.83V/1M)? Use this for starters to determine How Loud It Will go :

http://myhometheater.homestead.com/splcalculator.html
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post #643 of 19332 Old 06-04-2011, 06:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DenPureSound View Post

What Higher Res. source should I use, .wav to start out with or ?? then convert to .flac or ?

Either .wav or .flac compressed from the original source (if CD or vinyl).

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post #644 of 19332 Old 06-04-2011, 06:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mbman81 View Post

Hi Denon users,

I'm thinking of getting some Monitor rx8s. Heard them at the store and thought they were great sounding. My concern is that they are 4 ohms. My receiver is a 2112 which officially supports 8 and 6 ohms. Will it be powerful enough to play these? Will my speakers be as loud as they would with comparable 8 ohm speakers?

Are other people running 4ohm fronts strait off the receiver without a separate amp? How is the distortion?

Thanks guys!

Every XX12 model is designed to support 6Ω and 8Ω speakers, although at average volumes and in small/med sized rooms can usually run 4Ω speakers as well. If you are in a larger room or prefer to listen to your movie or music audio at reference volume (0db), then you would either want to look at 8Ω speakers or consider an AVR with preouts to add an external amp. And no, the RX8's would not be as loud at the same volume as 8Ω speakers (which is why you would be limited to a volume of only about -20db as if you tried to get the same higher volume as the 8Ω speakers, you would push the AVR into protection mode which would cause it to shut down). Think of it like two hoses ... an 8Ω speaker is like a 1/2" hose where the water flowing through it has pretty good force/pressure while water flowing at the same pace from the source through a 2" hose would have much less force/pressure (ie. 4Ω speakers).

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post #645 of 19332 Old 06-04-2011, 07:01 PM
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That is disheartening. I finally found some speakers that the misses and I both enjoyed the sound from. So basically a 4 ohm speaker requires that additional power to keep a similar sound DB level? I already got the 2112 so guess I have to find another speaker since therecis no pre outs. Doh!
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post #646 of 19332 Old 06-04-2011, 07:06 PM
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Keep in mind, that only the two towers would be 4 ohms, the other channels would be 6 ohms. Since it's just two it may have enough power to keep going?
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post #647 of 19332 Old 06-04-2011, 07:13 PM
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The front 3 speakers require the most power. See if the store you demo'd them in will let you take them home to demo. You can then see for yourself how they manage in your room and just how high you can raise the volume before they shut the AVR down in protection mode.

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post #648 of 19332 Old 06-04-2011, 07:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mbman81 View Post

That is disheartening. I finally found some speakers that the misses and I both enjoyed the sound from. So basically a 4 ohm speaker requires that additional power to keep a similar sound DB level? I already got the 2112 so guess I have to find another speaker since therecis no pre outs. Doh!

1. Isn't your 2112 still in the return window?

2. If you love the speakers then try them out...a good dealer should let you take a pair home overnight to audition them.
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post #649 of 19332 Old 06-04-2011, 07:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post

^^
Just to confirm ... you also have the sub connected via the sub preout? Otherwise the AVR won't recognize the sub as being present and Audyssey won't apply any filtering to it.

Yes, I had both connected, thanks.

(The manual for the speakers says to set it up this way as the crossovers are installed in the subwoofer. So the amplifier is connected to the inputs on the subwoofer and the satellites are connected to the outputs on the subwoofer).
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post #650 of 19332 Old 06-04-2011, 07:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DenPureSound View Post


Mariob33, Your right on again and 100% correct. What Higher Res. source should I use, .wav to start out with or ?? then convert to .flac or ?

If you have them available the original CD..

In search of video bliss...
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post #651 of 19332 Old 06-04-2011, 08:04 PM
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So what's with the 3312 inventory?...

Any reviews out for it yet?...
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post #652 of 19332 Old 06-04-2011, 08:12 PM
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Originally Posted by moshock View Post

So what's with the 3312 inventory?...

Not sure what you mean? I was able to call around and several dealers had them in stock. I wound up going with ABT but I would also try AVS forum sponsor.

In search of video bliss...
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post #653 of 19332 Old 06-04-2011, 09:15 PM
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Is anybody streaming there music to their Denon Receiver.

I have a 1912 and am trying to use Windows Media Player to stream music to the receiver.

I had everything set up and working. Now for some reason it can only detect 4 albums from my library.

I have streaming enabled in WMP.
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post #654 of 19332 Old 06-04-2011, 09:37 PM
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Heeelp! Can anyone tell me what I shall be losing out on if I go with a closeout deal on the 3311 instead of getting the 3312? I am mostly interested in sound quality, great 2d/3d pq, and good networking capabilities. I have been waiting for the 3311 prices to come down since the xx12 models were announced.... i would even consider getting the 991 (except that they do not have pre-outs, which even my current 989 does)... The pre-outs are not absolutely necessary for me at the moment... I just want them for purely "just in case" reasons. Still, if there is no really compelling reasons to jump on the 3312 wagon, then I'd rather target the 3311/991. Any helpful tips would be very welcome.
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post #655 of 19332 Old 06-04-2011, 10:15 PM - Thread Starter
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not much in the way of new features on 3312 vs. 3311. the most important functional changes are:

1) a more colorful "advanced" GUI (more like what was in the 4311, 4310 etc)
2) the GUI can overlay on 3D video (the 3311 can overlay only on 2D video)
3) you can have both HDMI outs active simultaneously (3311 is one or the other)
4) Airplay is built in (it's a $49 upgrade on the 3311)
5) 1 extra HDMI input (6 on the back, 1 on front vs 5/1 on the 3311)
6) cheesier looking front fascia; the 3311 has the slicker front end with the drop-down door.

PQ and SQ should be the same. Both use MultEQ XT, have Audyssey DSX, 3 zones, plenty of HDMI inputs, video conversion, 125W/ch, etc and have the same 3-year warranty.

BTW -- there are color images of the new 3312 GUI posted on the 3312 product page (scroll right in the photo thingy). The 3311 GUI is the same as the 3310 GUI in this youtube video.

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post #656 of 19332 Old 06-04-2011, 10:18 PM
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Quote:
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Heeelp! Can anyone tell me what I shall be losing out on if I go with a closeout deal on the 3311...

Get the 3311 if you ask me. I consider the 3312 inferior.
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post #657 of 19332 Old 06-04-2011, 10:28 PM
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Get the 3311 if you ask me. I consider the 3312 inferior.

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post #658 of 19332 Old 06-04-2011, 10:44 PM
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Anyone do a video quality comparison from last years' models? I read a review that says the picture quality was "blurry" on a satellite feed though the 1912. However, no info on whether or not it was through HDMI or component cable.
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post #659 of 19332 Old 06-04-2011, 11:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sahmen View Post

Heeelp! Can anyone tell me what I shall be losing out on if I go with a closeout deal on the 3311 instead of getting the 3312? I am mostly interested in sound quality, great 2d/3d pq, and good networking capabilities. I have been waiting for the 3311 prices to come down since the xx12 models were announced.... i would even consider getting the 991 (except that they do not have pre-outs, which even my current 989 does)... The pre-outs are not absolutely necessary for me at the moment... I just want them for purely "just in case" reasons. Still, if there is no really compelling reasons to jump on the 3312 wagon, then I'd rather target the 3311/991. Any helpful tips would be very welcome.

In addition to batpig's fine summary differences, the 3312CI also uses a new Analog Devices video chip (not as yet compared to the ABT chip in the 3311CI) and also uses a new design on the network card, so hopefully more reliable then the one installed on the 3311CI which had some issues that were resolved with firmware updates.

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post #660 of 19332 Old 06-05-2011, 12:37 AM
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Batpig and jdsmoothie...great job taking the bull by the horns with this thread. When I was looking at avr's in the past it was so annoying to see different avr's "official" threads first few posts having no substantial info. That's ridiculous and lazy.

You guys have done a great service for future and current avr owners. I'm sure it will also facilitate a more precise and better flowing thread.

I hope you guys never decide to just pack up and leave us!

The great support you two offer the avs Denon community is irreplaceable and absolutely one of the main reasons I have purchased a Denon for myself and my parents.

I hate to eat up space on this thread but feel like letting, not only you guys, but the rest of the avs community to know my feelings about it.
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