The **OFFICIAL** Denon AVR-XX12 Model Owner's Thread - Page 3 - AVS Forum
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post #61 of 19143 Old 05-15-2011, 03:53 PM
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Originally Posted by mjpearce023 View Post

^^^^^

We were hoping it would have XT32 and I was pretty disappointed when I saw it was not included in the 3312. I think it would be better to keep the 3312 at 1200 and add XT32 to it but I guess they want us to get the 4311.

Everyone I have talked to LOVES their 4311CI for sure. It weighs in at 38.2 Pounds, does that say something vs. 26 Pounds for the 3312? To me it does...but will cost you 1/2 again as much.

With the new In-Command Series they are after the Streaming and Enhanced Net features (DLNA, AirPlay, RadioDenon, etc.), and the front end GUI Wizard looks great also.

What do you think of OPEN BOX Buys? You've had experience with those, since you have made a few right -- great idea?
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post #62 of 19143 Old 05-15-2011, 04:26 PM
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I am looking to buy a new receiver I have read both of these manuals and everything I could about them. And I am pretty sure the 1712 is the right one for me. But my question is. Other than the networking capabilities which I dont ever see myself using. Is there any other advantages that I am missing that should make me change my mind and get the 1912?
Thanks
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post #63 of 19143 Old 05-15-2011, 04:40 PM
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^^
If you don't need the features offered on the 1912, then the 1712 will offer better audio fidelity with the more advanced version of Audyssey MultEQ XT. A benefit all the networking models do offer is they are able to be firmware updated by the user, although the lower level models (non-networking) tend not to have/need updates as much as the networking models do. Last year's models 2311 and below only had one firmware update so if there was an update for the 1712 it would only involve sending it to a repair facility to install the update at your own expense for the shipping, unless there is a local repair facility in your area.

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post #64 of 19143 Old 05-15-2011, 05:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post

^^
If you don't need the features offered on the 1912, then the 1712 will offer better audio fidelity with the more advanced version of Audyssey MultEQ XT. A benefit all the networking models do offer is they are able to be firmware updated by the user, although the lower level models (non-networking) tend not to have/need updates as much as the networking models do. Last year's models 2311 and below only had one firmware update so if there was an update for the 1712 it would only involve sending it to a repair facility to install the update at your own expense for the shipping, unless there is a local repair facility in your area.

Alight sounds good thank you very much
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post #65 of 19143 Old 05-15-2011, 09:26 PM
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I have been roaming this forum for the past 2 months since I was in the market for my first av receiver. I initially started with the pioneer 1021-K but since all my friends and family are Denon fans they convinced me to start looking elsewhere. So after 2 months and a lot of reading I am now down to the following 2:
AVR-2312
AVR-2112


The main difference between the 2 models seems to be the video upscaling and this is where I am having the hardest time deciding. I have a PS3 and an upscaling DVD player and a 2 year old Sharp LCD TV plus a HD DirecTV receiver. They all do some form of upscaling but I wasnt sure if that is good enough or whether the upscaling in the Denon would really get me something else.

I haven't bought my speakers yet but am looking at a couple of different Martin Logan options. The room I will be using this in is a combined living room and kitchen with the following dimensions: 30'x15'
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post #66 of 19143 Old 05-16-2011, 05:17 AM
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^^
The new Analog Devices video chip in the 2312CI is brand new with no comparisons out yet, however, as long as you've got HD sources, there's really no reason to select an AVR with a video chip. If the 2112CI has the inputs that you require then it would be the better buy of the two. However, keep in mind that Martin Logan's are generally 4Ω speakers and as such will require you to limit the AVR volume to average/moderate volume only (ie. -20db). If you prefer loud volume during movies then you'll want to consider the 3311CI or it's replacement the 3312CI so you can add an external amp if required for more power as neither the 2112CI nor the 2312CI have preouts for an external amp.

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post #67 of 19143 Old 05-16-2011, 06:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DenPureSound View Post

Everyone I have talked to LOVES their 4311CI for sure. It weighs in at 38.2 Pounds, does that say something vs. 26 Pounds for the 3312? To me it does...but will cost you 1/2 again as much.

With the new In-Command Series they are after the Streaming and Enhanced Net features (DLNA, AirPlay, RadioDenon, etc.), and the front end GUI Wizard looks great also.

What do you think of OPEN BOX Buys? You've had experience with those, since you have made a few right -- great idea?

Yea my Denon 3310 was an open box and so was my 1508. I've had good luck with them and have no problem buying them from a store. I do like to be able to see the receiver before I buy it so I've never bought an open box receiver online. I bought my parents a Samsung BD player from Amazon Warehouse Deals and it looked brand new so I might consider buying one online if they have a good return policy.
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post #68 of 19143 Old 05-16-2011, 11:34 AM
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This is probably a stupid question, but can the same source be sent to all 3 zones on the 3312? I would assume so...
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post #69 of 19143 Old 05-16-2011, 11:37 AM
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Yes, providing the source is either analog or PCM 2.0 over optical/coax digital (ie. in addition to an HDMI cable for the main zone, also connect either an analog cable or optical/digital coax as well for Zones 2/3).

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post #70 of 19143 Old 05-16-2011, 11:41 AM
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Thank you. I plan to have a PC hooked up to it with access to my music lubrary that I would like to be able to stream all through the house.
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post #71 of 19143 Old 05-16-2011, 12:16 PM
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I'm in the market for a new receiver. Because I will be controlling it with my iPad using iRule, RS232 or network control is key. Based on that criteria, I'm solidly in the 1912, 2112, 2312, and 3312 range. My other criterria are at least 4 HDMI 1.4 inputs and enough power to drive my speakers.

It will be driving Artison Portrait speakers, which are 6 ohm and 87dB sensitivity.

My room is 13' x 25' and is part of an open floor plan, but the critical viewing and listening seats are only 12' from the plasma screen.

SO, my critical question is whether the 90W of power in the 1912 and 2112 would be sufficient for my speakers and room, or even whether the 105 watts in the 2312 and 3312 would be enough. If not, then I'm forced to the 3312 and outboard amplification, b/c it's the only model with pre-outs.

Thoughts? Thanks!
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post #72 of 19143 Old 05-16-2011, 12:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mjpearce023 View Post
Yea my Denon 3310 was an open box and so was my 1508. I've had good luck with them and have no problem buying them from a store. I do like to be able to see the receiver before I buy it so I've never bought an open box receiver online. I bought my parents a Samsung BD player from Amazon Warehouse Deals and it looked brand new so I might consider buying one online if they have a good return policy.
Nice thing about the Samsung and/or LG BD Players is that they will stream Napster with over 12 Million songs.
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post #73 of 19143 Old 05-16-2011, 12:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by K-Wood View Post
I'm in the market for a new receiver. Because I will be controlling it with my iPad using iRule, RS232 or network control is key. Based on that criteria, I'm solidly in the 1912, 2112, 2312, and 3312 range. My other criterria are at least 4 HDMI 1.4 inputs and enough power to drive my speakers.

It will be driving Artison Portrait speakers, which are 6 ohm and 87dB sensitivity.

My room is 13' x 25' and is part of an open floor plan, but the critical viewing and listening seats are only 12' from the plasma screen.

SO, my critical question is whether the 90W of power in the 1912 and 2112 would be sufficient for my speakers and room, or even whether the 105 watts in the 2312 and 3312 would be enough. If not, then I'm forced to the 3312 and outboard amplification, b/c it's the only model with pre-outs.

Thoughts? Thanks!
- Ken
Ken --

I am running the 3311CI in an 18 x 24 x 10' room and open on a couple sides, and it did not to me have enough output power (125W per ch.) to give me what I wanted even driving High-Effy Klipsch spkrs. (92db), and my listening positions are 12 ft. from Flat Panel HDTV.

So I would start with the 3312CI, and see if you like what it will produce in SPL out with your speakers/room, as it certainly has all the other features most all would want, and if not enough you have the PreOuts on the Rr. Panel of the 3312 to drive an External Amp(s), as your case may be.

In fact, I am going to get the 3312CI for my other HT room (16x18x8') and see if it has enough output for this room size, which I feel it will since it is a smaller room and not open to other areas compared to our larger room, but if not, I will add an amp later on.

So go w/ the 3312CI, and Add later if you feel fit to.
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post #74 of 19143 Old 05-16-2011, 01:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by K-Wood View Post

SO, my critical question is whether the 90W of power in the 1912 and 2112 would be sufficient for my speakers and room, or even whether the 105 watts in the 2312 and 3312 would be enough. If not, then I'm forced to the 3312 and outboard amplification, b/c it's the only model with pre-outs.

Although you're in a med/large sized room it really depends on how loud you like to listen to music and movies as the lower level models should more than sufficient. Do you have another AVR that you can use to test for volume purposes? Or perhaps just go to Best Buy and check out the 1912 when it's available in your area as the 3312CI won't even be released for another month or so.

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post #75 of 19143 Old 05-16-2011, 01:40 PM
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JDS --

Just noticed a NEW Denon AVR-3312CI at $843.75 -- NICE.

When I called them, they "STATE THEY HAVE THEM IN STOCK -- 3312CI's -- BRAND NEW IN FACTORY UNOPENED BOX"

But after calling them, they are not an Authorized Dealer/Dist.

What do you lose by purchasing thru a company like that?
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post #76 of 19143 Old 05-16-2011, 01:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post

Although you're in a med/large sized room it really depends on how loud you like to listen to music and movies as the lower level models should more than sufficient. Do you have another AVR that you can use to test for volume purposes? Or perhaps just go to Best Buy and check out the 1912 when it's available in your area as the 3312CI won't even be released for another month or so.

^^ Totally agree JDS, well stated.

But since his speakers are not real high in Sensitivity (87db) 2.83V/1m and are also 6 Ohm, I think he should go with the 3312 w/ 125W / Ch.
I just feel he will be able to use what the 3312CI has to offer in Power Output, when driving all Five Channels for Movies, or seven channels later if he wants to go with either Front WIDES or Front HEIGHTS.

In fact, he might be in the Amp Camp after setting it up in that Med+/Lg. room w/ the Openings.

Just like my room Med+ w/Openings and I ended up in the External AMP Camp, but never looked back and NOW A TOTAL HAPPY CAMPER.

Just my TWO Cents worth.
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post #77 of 19143 Old 05-16-2011, 02:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DenPureSound View Post

JDS --

Just noticed a NEW Denon AVR-3312CI at $843.75 -- NICE.

When I called them, they "STATE THEY HAVE THEM IN STOCK -- 3312CI's -- BRAND NEW IN FACTORY UNOPENED BOX"

But after calling them, they are not an Authorized Dealer/Dist.

What do you lose by purchasing thru a company like that?

No warranty of course, although I just spoke with them and the guy said "nope .. not in stock yet and no ETA." AFAIK, the CI series are not due to be released until June sometime.

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post #78 of 19143 Old 05-16-2011, 02:51 PM
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A certain store has the 1912 posted online for pre-roder at $529.99, and the 2112 at $649.98...that can't be right, right? The Denon site suggests retail of the 2112 at $599.99, or so I thought.

Replacing an old AVR-791, for those of you who might be familiar. That thing lasted forever. I wonder how these newer units stack up against the old ones in terms of build quality. I don't want to have to replace a receiver for a long, long time.
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post #79 of 19143 Old 05-16-2011, 03:00 PM
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Stores generally sell at MSRP (or lower) although occasionally you'll find a reseller that sells for more than MSRP. Authorized reseller's high price is MSRP. Amazon currently has the 3312CI incorrectly listed at the 3311CI MSRP price which is incorrect.

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post #80 of 19143 Old 05-16-2011, 03:43 PM - Thread Starter
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Replacing an old AVR-791, for those of you who might be familiar. That thing lasted forever.

I'm confused -- the AVR-791 came out LAST YEAR

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post #81 of 19143 Old 05-16-2011, 03:50 PM
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In reading through the owner's manual for the 2112CI, it appears that the back surround channels are assignable to Zone 2.

But I'm confused over the language, "It is not possible to play the digital audio signals input from the HDMI, COAXIAL or OPTICAL connectors in ZONE2. Play using analog connections (in stereo)." (page 70). So if I have an HTPC connected via HDMI, can I not output to Zone 2? Does this only apply to the pre-outs or also to the amplified (assigned) speaker outs, too?
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post #82 of 19143 Old 05-16-2011, 03:53 PM
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No HDMI or digital .... analog only and it applies to both the speaker posts and pre outs. The only AVRs available that can pass HDMI audio to Zone 2 are the Aventage A1000, A2000, and A3000.

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post #83 of 19143 Old 05-16-2011, 04:12 PM - Thread Starter
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for once the language is crystal clear in the manual, so nothing to be confused about. For almost every AVR in the world (not just Denon), Zone 2/3 is going to be analog only.

for more info see the Zone 2 section of my FAQ: http://batpigworld.com/fadq.html#multizone

AFAIK the Yamaha's that can play HDMI audio to Zone 2 can only do it in a "party mode" where the same signal that is broadcast to Main Zone also goes to other zones. They still don't have "true" independent Zone 2 signal for HDMI... that would require a second HDMI decoder built into the receiver, which believe me the manufacturers aren't going to spring for out of the goodness of their hearts.

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post #84 of 19143 Old 05-16-2011, 04:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post

I'm confused -- the AVR-791 came out LAST YEAR

Good point, how could it have lasted forever if it is only a year old?

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post #85 of 19143 Old 05-16-2011, 05:55 PM
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Oops. I don't know why I wrote that! My friend has a 791, maybe I was thinking about his?! I meant to say AVR-3300. I had the thing for like 10 years, and it just started to fizzle out. I loved it, so I am hoping for something at least as reliable. Since the 3300, I've been using an older HK AVR-335. I must say, I do like the warmth of the HK, but I really miss my Denon. When I finally get around to buying one - it looks like either the 1912 or the 2112. The jury's still out until more people post!
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Quote:
Originally Posted by **OptimusPrime** View Post

A certain store has the 1912 posted online for pre-roder at $529.99, and the 2112 at $649.98...that can't be right, right? The Denon site suggests retail of the 2112 at $599.99, or so I thought.

Crutchfield has the 2112 pre-order at $599.99.

http://www.crutchfield.com/s_033AV21..._2112&skipvs=T

Speaking of which, anything one should consider when looking for speakers to pair with this unit?
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Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post

for once the language is crystal clear in the manual, so nothing to be confused about. For almost every AVR in the world (not just Denon), Zone 2/3 is going to be analog only.

for more info see the Zone 2 section of my FAQ: http://batpigworld.com/fadq.html#multizone

AFAIK the Yamaha's that can play HDMI audio to Zone 2 can only do it in a "party mode" where the same signal that is broadcast to Main Zone also goes to other zones. They still don't have "true" independent Zone 2 signal for HDMI... that would require a second HDMI decoder built into the receiver, which believe me the manufacturers aren't going to spring for out of the goodness of their hearts.

If you have a networked model with AirPlay, can it output that source through both zones? I didn't realize zone2 is analog only which foils my plans to stream to multiple zones via an appletv.
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post #88 of 19143 Old 05-17-2011, 04:27 AM
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^^
Yes, Airplay can go to both zones, however, cannot play independently to Zone 2. Also, all you need is an optical to analog converter between the ATV 2 and the AVR and you can then send that audio to Zone 2.

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post #89 of 19143 Old 05-17-2011, 04:54 AM
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Do the new Denons decode Apple Lossless?
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post #90 of 19143 Old 05-17-2011, 05:12 AM
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If zone 2 is analog only, why do the new Denons (afordable models anyway) seem to be so light on analog inputs? Comparable Onkyos seem to have much more in the way of analog connections. Really seriously considering a 2112CI when it is available.

Dave
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