"Official" Onkyo TX-NR809 Thread - Page 7 - AVS Forum
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post #181 of 6012 Old 07-17-2011, 07:28 PM
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Hooked up the 809 to my Pioneer speakers and elemental designs a2-300 sub. Sounds fantastic with one exception.....I can not get my subwoofer to stop bottoming out on bass heavy scenes. The one I am using to tweak the receiver settings is Battle Los Angeles where the team engages the control center in the sewer system. When the control center shoots back at the marines, those shots bottom my sub out every time. I have turned Dynamic EQ off, adjusted the the LFE LPF, lowered the sub level to the point where it does't bottom out, but then it is almost like I have no sub. I've switched the speakers to full range, and now they are currently set to 80. No difference. Any other ideas?

Now, this same scene playing through my Pioneer Elite 23 and these same Pioneer speakers sounds perfect. Sub DOES NOT bottom out at all. Now, I have had 4 Elite receivers in a row so I am a lot more familiar with them. I'm hoping I'm just missing something because I really like the features and sound of the 809. I am very satisfied with the sound quality. When the sub doesn't bottom out, it all blends perfectly.

Another scene where the sub bottoms out with the 809 is in GI Joe. When they are transporting the weapons and they engage the enemy in the beginning of the film. The laser guns that shout down the marine helicopters also cause it to bottom out. With the Pioneer in place, that is actually my favorite LFE in all the movie!! I'm getting stressed out but am willing to keep tweaking. Any suggestions are welcome.
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post #182 of 6012 Old 07-17-2011, 07:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tlwizard View Post

I read on a review site that the receiver draws 38W while in Standby mode if the HDMI Through Mode is active. With the recent firmware updates, is this still the case? Anyone have experience with this? Thanks.

Where did you read that? Just curious but at any rate that is far less than my VSX-23 which has no pass through at all that I can figure out or that works worth a crap. My wife hates that unit even though she admits it sounds good, she cannot and will not use it. While she is not happy I am replacing the unit after a year and a half, she gave me little grief about it when I explained how it was going to work. She saw that with the Yammy 867 I tried for a short while but returned for a lack of power in my opinion. (Not really an opinion because I could get it to shut down via protection way too early). I will not get in a rant about Pioneer because they made the bed they currently lie in, bought out by Sharp. I hope the Onkyo unit works out for me because it looks like an excellent value for performance. I will certainly post about any problems/dislikes I have as folks from the VSX-23 thread can testify to. I will not laud anything just because I bought it.
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post #183 of 6012 Old 07-17-2011, 08:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joeyvaz View Post

Hooked up the 809 to my Pioneer speakers and elemental designs a2-300 sub. Sounds fantastic with one exception.....I can not get my subwoofer to stop bottoming out on bass heavy scenes. The one I am using to tweak the receiver settings is Battle Los Angeles where the team engages the control center in the sewer system. When the control center shoots back at the marines, those shots bottom my sub out every time. I have turned Dynamic EQ off, adjusted the the LFE LPF, lowered the sub level to the point where it does't bottom out, but then it is almost like I have no sub. I've switched the speakers to full range, and now they are currently set to 80. No difference. Any other ideas?

Now, this same scene playing through my Pioneer Elite 23 and these same Pioneer speakers sounds perfect. Sub DOES NOT bottom out at all. Now, I have had 4 Elite receivers in a row so I am a lot more familiar with them. I'm hoping I'm just missing something because I really like the features and sound of the 809. I am very satisfied with the sound quality. When the sub doesn't bottom out, it all blends perfectly.

Another scene where the sub bottoms out with the 809 is in GI Joe. When they are transporting the weapons and they engage the enemy in the beginning of the film. The laser guns that shout down the marine helicopters also cause it to bottom out. With the Pioneer in place, that is actually my favorite LFE in all the movie!! I'm getting stressed out but am willing to keep tweaking. Any suggestions are welcome.

Audyssey and MCACC do very different thinks with LFE. Callibration is the difference my friend.
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post #184 of 6012 Old 07-17-2011, 08:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikes2cents View Post

Where did you read that? Just curious but at any rate that is far less than my VSX-23 which has no pass through at all that I can figure out or that works worth a crap. My wife hates that unit even though she admits it sounds good, she cannot and will not use it. While she is not happy I am replacing the unit after a year and a half, she gave me little grief about it when I explained how it was going to work. She saw that with the Yammy 867 I tried for a short while but returned for a lack of power in my opinion. (Not really an opinion because I could get it to shut down via protection way too early). I will not get in a rant about Pioneer because they made the bed they currently lie in, bought out by Sharp. I hope the Onkyo unit works out for me because it looks like an excellent value for performance. I will certainly post about any problems/dislikes I have as folks from the VSX-23 thread can testify to. I will not laud anything just because I bought it.

HDMI passthrough is the biggest farce of the home theater in the past five years. You end up spending cash on a receiver only to not use it to theoretically save a few pennies when watching the news. Most receivers end up running 3W to 30W at standby with passthrough, completely negating the alleged green factor. To boot, you're only going to shorten the lifespan of your receiver by keeping the hdmi board juiced all the time.

Idiotic in my opinion.
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post #185 of 6012 Old 07-17-2011, 08:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joeyvaz View Post

Hooked up the 809 to my Pioneer speakers and elemental designs a2-300 sub. Sounds fantastic with one exception.....I can not get my subwoofer to stop bottoming out on bass heavy scenes. The one I am using to tweak the receiver settings is Battle Los Angeles where the team engages the control center in the sewer system. When the control center shoots back at the marines, those shots bottom my sub out every time. I have turned Dynamic EQ off, adjusted the the LFE LPF, lowered the sub level to the point where it does't bottom out, but then it is almost like I have no sub. I've switched the speakers to full range, and now they are currently set to 80. No difference. Any other ideas?

Now, this same scene playing through my Pioneer Elite 23 and these same Pioneer speakers sounds perfect. Sub DOES NOT bottom out at all. Now, I have had 4 Elite receivers in a row so I am a lot more familiar with them. I'm hoping I'm just missing something because I really like the features and sound of the 809. I am very satisfied with the sound quality. When the sub doesn't bottom out, it all blends perfectly.

Another scene where the sub bottoms out with the 809 is in GI Joe. When they are transporting the weapons and they engage the enemy in the beginning of the film. The laser guns that shout down the marine helicopters also cause it to bottom out. With the Pioneer in place, that is actually my favorite LFE in all the movie!! I'm getting stressed out but am willing to keep tweaking. Any suggestions are welcome.

Have you calibrated the receiver?

-ResonantEcho

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post #186 of 6012 Old 07-17-2011, 08:57 PM
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Winston,
Well at the price point this receiver is at I don't think we get to bitch about price point for any feature it has. And I'm thinking farce wise the pointless 4k upscaling might give your passthrough a serious run for its money.

By the time we all have 4k displays, we all know our onkyo's will be dead from the next(yet unknown) onkyo bug.

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post #187 of 6012 Old 07-17-2011, 09:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ResonantEcho View Post

Have you calibrated the receiver?

Yes. I ran Audessy and chose 4 different spots to run it.
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post #188 of 6012 Old 07-17-2011, 09:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joeyvaz View Post

Yes. I ran Audessy and chose 4 different spots to run it.

What are your settings on the sub itself for level, bandpass frequency, and phase? How do you have it connected to the receiver?

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post #189 of 6012 Old 07-17-2011, 10:24 PM
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Where did you read that?

Found the 38W thing here: http://blog.hekkers.net/2011/06/15/k...on-acceptable/
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post #190 of 6012 Old 07-18-2011, 03:26 AM
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Originally Posted by tlwizard View Post

Apparently Amazon matched it. I had been looking at getting a 709 and then was just cruising this thread. Looks like I'm getting an 809 now!

When did Amazon match this? It is showing as $869 on my shopping car??
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post #191 of 6012 Old 07-18-2011, 03:49 AM
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When did Amazon match this? It is showing as $869 on my shopping car??

The 699 price was on amazon last night. they must have changed it today.
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post #192 of 6012 Old 07-18-2011, 03:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ResonantEcho View Post

What are your settings on the sub itself for level, bandpass frequency, and phase? How do you have it connected to the receiver?

Sub is connected via subwoofer cable to the sub out on the receiver, phase is set to zero (on the receiver as well), and bandpass frequency is set to the highest on the sub, and LPF of LFE is set to 80 on the receiver. All speakers are crossed over at 80 as well.
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post #193 of 6012 Old 07-18-2011, 05:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joeyvaz View Post

Yes. I ran Audessy and chose 4 different spots to run it.

Did you adjust the crossover of your sub and volume of your sub before/after the switch.
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post #194 of 6012 Old 07-18-2011, 05:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by winston9332 View Post

Did you adjust the crossover of your sub and volume of your sub before/after the switch.

Definitely adjusted the volume on the sub AND the receiver. I didn't adjust the sub's crossover point. I did adjust the receiver's sub XO point from 80-120 and still the same results.
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post #195 of 6012 Old 07-18-2011, 05:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joeyvaz View Post

Definitely adjusted the volume on the sub AND the receiver. I didn't adjust the sub's crossover point. I did adjust the receiver's sub XO point from 80-120 and still the same results.

Maybe MCACC is superior in this setting - does seem strange that the lfe has roll-off though
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post #196 of 6012 Old 07-18-2011, 08:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joeyvaz View Post

Sub is connected via subwoofer cable to the sub out on the receiver, phase is set to zero (on the receiver as well), and bandpass frequency is set to the highest on the sub, and LPF of LFE is set to 80 on the receiver. All speakers are crossed over at 80 as well.

Since the receiver will be managing the subwoofer you need to disable all the subs features except the volume. The receiver will select the x-over frequency, etc. prior to the subwoofer. Set the volume (on the sub) to the 9 o'clock position to start with. Once you have done this rerun the calibration and see if that helps.

Do you have a link to you sub's manual?

I have a Velodyne powered sub. I set the "Internal X-Over" switch to "Direct" to let the receiver handle everything.

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post #197 of 6012 Old 07-18-2011, 08:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ResonantEcho View Post

Since the receiver will be managing the subwoofer you need to disable all the subs features except the volume. The receiver will select the x-over frequency, etc. prior to the subwoofer. Set the volume (on the sub) to the 9 o'clock position to start with. Once you have done this rerun the calibration and see if that helps.

Do you have a link to you sub's manual?

I have a Velodyne powered sub. I set the "Internal X-Over" switch to "Direct" to let the receiver handle everything.

If no direct.... set the sub crossover as above the AVRs selected point and then the sub's crossover is out of play.
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post #198 of 6012 Old 07-18-2011, 12:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ResonantEcho View Post

Since the receiver will be managing the subwoofer you need to disable all the subs features except the volume. The receiver will select the x-over frequency, etc. prior to the subwoofer. Set the volume (on the sub) to the 9 o'clock position to start with. Once you have done this rerun the calibration and see if that helps.

Do you have a link to you sub's manual?

I have a Velodyne powered sub. I set the "Internal X-Over" switch to "Direct" to let the receiver handle everything.

Quote:
Originally Posted by neworder71 View Post

If no direct.... set the sub crossover as above the AVRs selected point and then the sub's crossover is out of play.

sub only has phase (set to zero), crossover 50-150 (set at 150) and volume. When running Audessy, it said to set the sub's volume until the receiver read 75db. I did that and it was at around 3-4 o'clock position. Audessy ran without a problem. But at that volume on the sub side, it was almost non existent when listening to music or watching GI Joe and Battle Los Angeles. So I obviously had to tweak from there.

I'm going to rerun Audessy tomorrow afternoon when my new Jamo setup comes in. Frustrating part is that Pioneer's MCAC works flawlessly with the sub and it sounds fantastic. So I know it's not the sub. We'll see what happens tomorrow when I rerun Audessy on the new setup.
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post #199 of 6012 Old 07-18-2011, 01:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joeyvaz View Post

sub only has phase (set to zero), crossover 50-150 (set at 150) and volume. When running Audessy, it said to set the sub's volume until the receiver read 75db. I did that and it was at around 3-4 o'clock position. Audessy ran without a problem. But at that volume on the sub side, it was almost non existent when listening to music or watching GI Joe and Battle Los Angeles. So I obviously had to tweak from there.

I'm going to rerun Audessy tomorrow afternoon when my new Jamo setup comes in. Frustrating part is that Pioneer's MCAC works flawlessly with the sub and it sounds fantastic. So I know it's not the sub. We'll see what happens tomorrow when I rerun Audessy on the new setup.

When you say TWEAK what exactly did you do? I wasn't totally satisfied with what I heard after watching a few movies. I went into speaker setup/level calibration and turned the sub up a few additional dbs and liked what I heard.

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post #200 of 6012 Old 07-18-2011, 02:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joeyvaz View Post

sub only has phase (set to zero), crossover 50-150 (set at 150) and volume. When running Audessy, it said to set the sub's volume until the receiver read 75db. I did that and it was at around 3-4 o'clock position. Audessy ran without a problem. But at that volume on the sub side, it was almost non existent when listening to music or watching GI Joe and Battle Los Angeles. So I obviously had to tweak from there.

Hi joeyvaz, its probably non existent due to sub volume setting (3-4 o'clock). After running auto setup what was the subwoofer trim level calibration result? If the result is -15dB then you need to turn down the sub volume to about 9 o'clock position as ResonantEcho suggested, rerun auto setup again and recheck subwoofer trim level result.
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post #201 of 6012 Old 07-18-2011, 03:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ResonantEcho View Post

When you say TWEAK what exactly did you do? I wasn't totally satisfied with what I heard after watching a few movies. I went into speaker setup/level calibration and turned the sub up a few additional dbs and liked what I heard.

By tweak I mean changing the sub level on the receiver so that I can actually hear it during music and movies. But on CERTAIN LFE it would cause the sub to overwork and make the actual driver make a popping sound. If I lower it at the sub, then the sub seems non existent.


Quote:
Originally Posted by JChin View Post

Hi joeyvaz, its probably non existent due to sub volume setting (3-4 o'clock). After running auto setup what was the subwoofer trim level calibration result? If the result is -15dB then you need to turn down the sub volume to about 9 o'clock position as ResonantEcho suggested, rerun auto setup again and recheck subwoofer trim level result.


Correction: I said 3-4 o'clock but I meant 9-10 o'clock. I tweak it from above because it is in a corner. If I lower it to 9 o'clock, then it's hard to tell it's even connected. At the receiver, Audessy set the sub level to -5.5db initially I believe. I will leave the sub at 9 o'clock tomorrow when I rerun Audessy with the new Jamo setup.

Thank you all for the help thus far. I will definitely keep the thread updated as I tweak further and get the new setup running tomorrow.
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post #202 of 6012 Old 07-18-2011, 03:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sschen View Post

When did Amazon match this? It is showing as $869 on my shopping car??

Quote:
Originally Posted by rinconmike View Post

The 699 price was on amazon last night. they must have changed it today.

I guess with NewEgg, you can have NewEgg tell you when a product gets to a certain price. Hopefully NewEgg will be contacting me in a couple days telling me the receiver is $699
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post #203 of 6012 Old 07-18-2011, 04:53 PM
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I guess with NewEgg, you can have NewEgg tell you when a product gets to a certain price. Hopefully NewEgg will be contacting me in a couple days telling me the receiver is $699

you might want to check daily. I think I read a poster that said by the time he got the alert, it was sold out.
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post #204 of 6012 Old 07-18-2011, 05:44 PM
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Newegg has been running that deal every other week for the last 6 weeks...missed out the first 2 times, but picked one up this past weekend. I would suggest getting up early on Saturdays and check the price frequently.
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post #205 of 6012 Old 07-18-2011, 07:39 PM
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[quote=joeyvaz;20710299]sub only has phase (set to zero), crossover 50-150 (set at 150) and volume. When running Audessy, it said to set the sub's volume until the receiver read 75db. I did that and it was at around 3-4 o'clock position. QUOTE]

Did you tell the 809 that you have a THX subwoofer in the THX Audio setup? (Say no to THX subwoofer and Boundary Gain Compensation if you did.)
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post #206 of 6012 Old 07-18-2011, 07:42 PM
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[quote=½Baked;20711986]
Quote:
Originally Posted by joeyvaz View Post

sub only has phase (set to zero), crossover 50-150 (set at 150) and volume. When running Audessy, it said to set the sub's volume until the receiver read 75db. I did that and it was at around 3-4 o'clock position. QUOTE]

Did you tell the 809 that you have a THX subwoofer in the THX Audio setup? (Say no to THX subwoofer and Boundary Gain Compensation if you did.)

Tried with it off and on...same results.
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post #207 of 6012 Old 07-18-2011, 07:46 PM
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[quote=joeyvaz;20711996]
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Originally Posted by ½Baked View Post


Tried with it off and on...same results.

Did you run Audyssey calibration with it turned off? (It does make a difference in my system, but you have to re-calibrate after every change)
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post #208 of 6012 Old 07-18-2011, 08:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by winston9332 View Post

HDMI passthrough is the biggest farce of the home theater in the past five years. You end up spending cash on a receiver only to not use it to theoretically save a few pennies when watching the news. Most receivers end up running 3W to 30W at standby with passthrough, completely negating the alleged green factor. To boot, you're only going to shorten the lifespan of your receiver by keeping the hdmi board juiced all the time.

Idiotic in my opinion.

I cannot find much fault with this post except the part where I spend cash on a unit to not use it. I am buying this unit for 3d use, for more power, and yes the passthrough. All HDMI passthrough AVRs these days are basically switches that strip the sound when on and send that through when in standby or through. There is no way I am going to watch the news in the early hours even on low volume with my 3 subs and speakers.

Idiotic? I agree because instead of audio return they should make a trigger that turns passthrough on when you simply power on the TV or whatever display you have. I don't feel HDMI was ever my friend to help me. It was made for copyright purposes and is a total PITA with it's handshake picture fluctuating and sound drop out BS issues. Not to mention unintended HDMI units powering on when not wanted and unwanted switching. So I have elected to hitch my wagon to the 809 horse and we will see how things go. While my man cave is mine, I have to accomodate the wife and when she cannot simply turn on the TV and watch a program, I have grief. So if the equivalent of a 40W light bulb does the trick for me, well then we will just have to see how much it shortens the units life. This is the world we live in today. You are not going to find a non HDMI unit any more so like it or not you have to pick one.

Now if you are basically saying the same thing, then I agree with you. If you are saying something else I don't know what it is and perhaps you would share your solution with us here because I think I agree with what you are saying.
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post #209 of 6012 Old 07-18-2011, 08:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joeyvaz View Post

Correction: I said 3-4 o'clock but I meant 9-10 o'clock. I tweak it from above because it is in a corner. If I lower it to 9 o'clock, then it's hard to tell it's even connected. At the receiver, Audessy set the sub level to -5.5db initially I believe. I will leave the sub at 9 o'clock tomorrow when I rerun Audessy with the new Jamo setup.

Thank you all for the help thus far. I will definitely keep the thread updated as I tweak further and get the new setup running tomorrow.

Ok, suggest visiting the eD thread and ask about adding polyfill to your A2-300 sub. As other has done so to help reduce the possibility of bottoming out.
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post #210 of 6012 Old 07-19-2011, 12:31 AM
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A little off topic here but it is Onkyo TX-NR809 related.

I've been holding off for a while buying the Onky receive primarily because my Pioneer rear projection monitor (CRT) doesn't have HDMI. I'm kind of surprised that others haven't mentioned this as I assume I can't be the only one who has a pre-HDMI monitor.

I finally took the plunge and bought the 809 (after missing it once a week or so ago after NewEgg was "out of stock"). And I think I've found the solution to my HDMI problem: HDFury2 or HDFury3. I'm about to pull the trigger on this (and avoid having to buy a new monitor now) and thought I'd ask if anyone is using one of these units?



www.MoomeCard.com >



From their site:

No HDMI? No problem! The HDfury2 upgrades any TV or projector by adding HDMI! Works with any display that accepts either Component (YPbPr/YCbCr) or RGB/VGA! Don’t be stuck watching Blu-ray, DVD, Satellite/Cable at only 480p! Add an HDfury2 and watch hi-def at up to FULL HD 1080p resolution!


Why do I need HDfury2?

How old is your HDTV or projector? If it was bought before 2005 it does not have an HDMI input. This means that you’ll never be able to use the full potential of your expensive projector, plasma display, or PC screen with new sources like the PS3, Xbox360, Blu-ray players, Cable TV / Satellite boxes, or PC graphics cards at up to 1080p FULLHD resolution.

Without an HDMI input your display will be limited to 480p in most cases – that’s only 1/6th the resolution of 1080p FULLHD! You need HDfury2 to unlock the full potential of your display! Why buy an expensive new HDTV when your existing one works perfectly well? Enhance your display’s compatibly and value with HDfury2!

Designed by a group of home theater videophiles, the HDfury2 delivers a razor sharp picture with unprecedented colour from HDMI sources, supporting all resolutions up to 1080p FULL HD. The picture quality improvement when using HDfury2 is immediately obvious, providing an amazingly clear and detailed picture!

http://dme.ghost2.net/hdfury/hdfury-iii/specs-iii/
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