The Audyssey Pro Installer Kit Thread (FAQ in post #1) - Page 28 - AVS Forum
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post #811 of 5625 Old 12-18-2011, 02:06 PM - Thread Starter
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^YMMV in both results and bang for the buck for the Pro kit/license.

I figured it this way: I have found great bargains in high quality HT gear. So far I've invested about $10K total, considering the unneeded stuff I sold on Agon which I use to partially finance my upgrades. I currently have well over $20K MSRP in gear and I believe I am reaching asymptotic curves for the amount of $ I'd need to invest to get any significant SQ improvements in amps, player, processor and speakers in my fam rm HT. My wife does not want formal acoustic treatments in there so IMO XT32 was a must. Turned out to be a good choice. I thought a second good sub might smooth the bass. Good chice, especially with XT32. And rather than do a dedicated basement HT build (mebbe someday...), I was damn well gonna try Pro! The worst case scenario was that it might not make much difference and I'd end up selling the kit at a bit of a loss (easy to do, used ones are hard to find). The license cannot be resold but would add some resale value to my AVR A100, itself a Denon 100th Anniv limited edition.

Turns out Pro was well worth it for me. And I haven't even started to fiddle with custom curves...

Yes, I still like playing with Dalis.

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post #812 of 5625 Old 12-18-2011, 02:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nezff View Post

I could be expecting too much from pro. This is the reason why I'm currently debating on purchasing pro

If you consider your ears and brain to be much more sophisticated and capable of "measuring" than $300-$400 worth of software and hardware, e.g. REW and calibrated mic w/pre-amp/phantom power supply, then consider Audyssey MultEQ XT 32 to be for measuring and a Pro calibration over it for your head. You can't measure the subtle differences with gear, but you sure can hear it. IMO.

Jeff
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post #813 of 5625 Old 12-18-2011, 05:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pepar View Post

If you consider your ears and brain to be much more sophisticated and capable of "measuring" than $300-$400 worth of software and hardware, e.g. REW and calibrated mic w/pre-amp/phantom power supply, then consider Audyssey MultEQ XT 32 to be for measuring and a Pro calibration over it for your head. You can't measure the subtle differences with gear, but you sure can hear it. IMO.

Jeff

Just dont want to expect it to be the cure all, thats what I meant.
Of course, if it is, then great!
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post #814 of 5625 Old 12-19-2011, 02:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nezff View Post

I could be expecting too much from pro. This is the reason why I'm currently debating on purchasing pro

I am in a similar position but have already decided to buy the Pro kit. I am expecting only subtle improvements. I think it is the usual business of diminishing returns. XT32 is very, very good (a definite and easily heard improvement on XT) and I am not expecting the same incremental gain when I move up to Pro. It's an act of faith for me to drop $700 on this, because of course, there is no way I can know what improvement I will hear until I install it. Based on the views of people here whose opinions I respect, I am prepared to make this leap of faith. But like I say, the differences, I expect, will be subtle. But there nonetheless.
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post #815 of 5625 Old 12-19-2011, 02:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SoundofMind View Post

^YMMV in both results and bang for the buck for the Pro kit/license.

I figured it this way: I have found great bargains in high quality HT gear. So far I've invested about $10K total, considering the unneeded stuff I sold on Agon which I use to partially finance my upgrades. I currently have well over $20K MSRP in gear and I believe I am reaching asymptotic curves for the amount of $ I'd need to invest to get any significant SQ improvements in amps, player, processor and speakers in my fam rm HT. My wife does not want formal acoustic treatments in there so IMO XT32 was a must. Turned out to be a good choice. I thought a second good sub might smooth the bass. Good chice, especially with XT32. And rather than do a dedicated basement HT build (mebbe someday...), I was damn well gonna try Pro! The worst case scenario was that it might not make much difference and I'd end up selling the kit at a bit of a loss (easy to do, used ones are hard to find). The license cannot be resold but would add some resale value to my AVR A100, itself a Denon 100th Anniv limited edition.

Turns out Pro was well worth it for me. And I haven't even started to fiddle with custom curves...

That's interesting SoM because, like me, you don't have an ideal room and I am heartened that you have found a good improvement. I have been a little concerned that Pro will only show benefits over XT32 if the room itself is already very good (treated etc). Like you, I am damn well gonna try Pro!
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post #816 of 5625 Old 12-19-2011, 05:08 AM - Thread Starter
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^

As part of our constant striving to offer the best in vague reassurances to our loyal readers, we are proud to announce the unofficial:

"Official Audyssey Pro Installer Thread" PRO KIT (not-quite-all-your) MONEY BACK GUARANTEE.

Buy your kit with the confidence and peace of mind born of knowing that if you are not completely satisfied with your purchase, there's probably some guy still on the fence, waiting for a deal on your used kit!*

*Must be an audiophile to participate. Certain other terms and conditions may apply.

Yes, I still like playing with Dalis.

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post #817 of 5625 Old 12-19-2011, 05:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by soundofmind View Post

^

as part of our constant striving to offer the best in vague reassurances to our loyal readers, we are proud to announce the unofficial:

"official audyssey pro installer thread" pro kit (not-quite-all-your) money back guarantee.

Buy your kit with the confidence and peace of mind born of knowing that if you are not completely satisfied with your purchase, there's probably some guy still on the fence, waiting for a deal on your used kit!*

*must be an audiophile to participate. Certain other terms and conditions may apply.

lol!!
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post #818 of 5625 Old 12-19-2011, 06:17 AM
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post #819 of 5625 Old 12-19-2011, 07:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kbarnes701 View Post

I am in a similar position but have already decided to buy the Pro kit. I am expecting only subtle improvements. I think it is the usual business of diminishing returns. XT32 is very, very good (a definite and easily heard improvement on XT) and I am not expecting the same incremental gain when I move up to Pro. It's an act of faith for me to drop $700 on this, because of course, there is no way I can know what improvement I will hear until I install it. Based on the views of people here whose opinions I respect, I am prepared to make this leap of faith. But like I say, the differences, I expect, will be subtle. But there nonetheless.



Stop talking about it and hurry up and get the Pro Kit going already will ya!

I wanna hear your subjective experience feedback!


...Glenn
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post #820 of 5625 Old 12-19-2011, 07:59 AM - Thread Starter
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^

Don't be so hard on him. IIRC Keith has to wait until his new Onkyo model gets an anxiously-awaited FW update before it will even be actually be Pro-ready. But meanwhile if a used Kit comes up, I bet he'll be all over it!

Yes, I still like playing with Dalis.

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post #821 of 5625 Old 12-19-2011, 08:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Glenn Baumann View Post

Stop talking about it and hurry up and get the Pro Kit going already will ya!

I wanna hear your subjective experience feedback!


...Glenn

I can't, Glenn! Pro won't be available for my 5509 until Onkyo make available the new firmware to support it. Audyssey say to expect this in January - let's hope they're on time! Once I have installed it, I guarantee you'll be hearing from me
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post #822 of 5625 Old 12-19-2011, 08:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SoundofMind View Post

^

Don't be so hard on him. IIRC Keith has to wait until his new Onkyo model gets an anxiously-awaited FW update before it will even be actually be Pro-ready. But meanwhile if a used Kit comes up, I bet he'll be all over it!

You know me too well....
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post #823 of 5625 Old 12-19-2011, 08:37 AM
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For those with access to the right database/knowledge: Is the Integra DTR-70.3 supported or does it, too, require a firmware update not released yet (since it is a new model like Keiths Onkyo)?

Thanks.
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post #824 of 5625 Old 12-19-2011, 09:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigCoolJesus View Post

For those with access to the right database/knowledge: Is the Integra DTR-70.3 supported or does it, too, require a firmware update not released yet (since it is a new model like Keiths Onkyo)?

Thanks.

http://www.audyssey.com/products?ins...=120&ptype=All

Now you have access, too!
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post #825 of 5625 Old 12-19-2011, 09:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pepar View Post


http://www.audyssey.com/products?ins...=120&ptype=All

Now you have access, too!

Voodoo black magic! How'd you do that? lol

I checked the "Installer Ready" page about two weeks ago and the 70.3/80.3 were not listed. Guess I should have checked the page again before posting. Looks like I'm good to go once I have funds for the pro kit. Unless of course someone wants to part ways with theirs (don't tell Keith though)
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post #826 of 5625 Old 12-21-2011, 05:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SoundofMind View Post

Hi, welcome. Kudos for reading the thread first. I often find that in doing so I pick up valuable info not necessarily related to my initial question. BTW for longer threads "Search this Thread" in the upper right is particularly useful, though not in this case.

I agree with Jeff's advice to contact Luke. He is very patient and helpful. He invited me to call any time with questions so your call will be welcomed. Turns out Pro has been fairly straightforward for me, so I've not had to take Luke up on his offer, "I can be your new best friend, call anytime." as he good-naturedly put it.

Ok, as a follow up. Thank you all for your input and advice, I figured I would report back my findings and success. For anyone with a Crestron unit, this is important reading for you.

Contacted Luke and I am glad I did, very informative. Crestron has developed their own "Pro Calibration Kit" and you HAVE to use their kit (CSSTK). Luke said they have made specific hardware and software changes that force you to use their kit to calibrate any of the Crestron units that have Audyssey built-in.

Second, you need "Crestron Toolbox" software (hard to come by unless you are a certified dealer) to access and calibrate your Crestron unit. The CSSTK kit does not come with this software, but comes with a very important microphone file on a CD that is serial matched to the supplied microphone.

Lastly, WOW!, what a difference, OMG, I could not believe my ears, my 5.1 AMS unit sounds to balanced and smooth. This was well worrth the effort.

Thanks again to all and I hope my updates help someone else down the road.

Regards,
Vipz
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post #827 of 5625 Old 12-21-2011, 08:21 AM
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Thanks, Vipz. YOu have added to our knowledgebase. Not that we get all that many Crestron owners here.

Is there a "consumer" calibration procedure with Crestron, or only the Pro variety? (I seem to remember NAD is like that.)

Anyway, welcome to the next level.

Jeff
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post #828 of 5625 Old 12-21-2011, 11:48 PM
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NAD works like the other consumer gear. Normal XT(32) with PRO availiable for the higher end units. NAD have their own default target curve, though.

"Unplugging the signal cable is pretty much the ultimate in component isolation. Now if you removed the AC power and it still did it you should look for the little blond girl saying "they're he-re."
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post #829 of 5625 Old 12-22-2011, 04:56 AM
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question, and its very possible i get yelled at for asking as i am sure its in here somewhere in depth, but in re: getting a pro licence for my integra 80.2. 1 - can i get the licence myself, i.e. pay audessey direct, and do the set up and all myself (i am somewhat knowledgeable and tech savvy, not overly but not dense), or 2 should i pay a professional to install and set up. Been tossing around the idea for some time. My system sounds fantasic, used primarily for home theatre in a dedicated theatre room.
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post #830 of 5625 Old 12-22-2011, 05:00 AM
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The licence is on epart of the cost, the kit is another. I highly recommend it, though. If you can do the normal setup you can most likely do the PRO. The extra options you get along with the increased quality of correction is definetly worth it.

"Unplugging the signal cable is pretty much the ultimate in component isolation. Now if you removed the AC power and it still did it you should look for the little blond girl saying "they're he-re."
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post #831 of 5625 Old 12-22-2011, 05:49 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by D69stang2 View Post

question, and its very possible i get yelled at for asking as i am sure its in here somewhere in depth, but in re: getting a pro licence for my integra 80.2. 1 - can i get the licence myself, i.e. pay audessey direct, and do the set up and all myself (i am somewhat knowledgeable and tech savvy, not overly but not dense), or 2 should i pay a professional to install and set up. Been tossing around the idea for some time. My system sounds fantasic, used primarily for home theatre in a dedicated theatre room.

Hi, welcome. No worry about getting yelled at here, we're a civil bunch on this thread. It's not a long thread and much can be gained by skimming through it at some point.

To expand on atledreier's post, yes you can buy the license direct (for the same $150 installers pay) but it does you no good without a kit ($550). Installers usually obtain the license for you but once you get a kit you'll registered it and will be considered an "installer" yourself. It is very nice to have your own kit as you can rerun the calibration anytime if things change in the room, you can do your own custom curves at your leisure, etc. It's not hard to do the Pro calibration for someone like yourself. The tech Pro kit support from Luke @ Audyssey is great, and this thread has experienced kit users who can help with your questions as well.

On the other hand, I don't discount the possibility that an experienced Pro Installer may well bring value to the equation. But additional later recalibration visits, if needed, come at additional cost. I don't think anyone on the thread has had an actual pro come out, we're kinda DIY guys here.

Yes, I still like playing with Dalis.

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post #832 of 5625 Old 12-22-2011, 05:57 AM
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Also, for things like the BBC dip it's really hard to determine which is best after listening for a few minutes. A target curve usually take some time to settle in, at least in my head.

"Unplugging the signal cable is pretty much the ultimate in component isolation. Now if you removed the AC power and it still did it you should look for the little blond girl saying "they're he-re."
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post #833 of 5625 Old 12-22-2011, 06:19 AM
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I agree with what has been said. I suspect that a comprehensive professional calibration would cost as much as the kit plus license. And if you change anything, the calibration is no longer valid. Once you get the kit, you will use it many times. It is easy to use, and you will have many helpful friends here, and on the Audyssey thread. Take the plunge!
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post #834 of 5625 Old 12-22-2011, 06:40 AM
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So i get the licence (150$) and the kit (550$) from whome? I think the integra 80.2 is pro capable, i.e. do i need the kit? i thought i only needed the licence.
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post #835 of 5625 Old 12-22-2011, 06:48 AM
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I have to wonder what a Pro would bring to the table. Certainly nothing with respect to taking the measurements? That's too simple, isn't it? I know I varied my measurements a bit, and needed to change my height for the front three seats when I moved my seating group forward 6". I knew I needed to change the height because the results were brittle; would another non-Pro not notice that? I don't know.

Maybe they bring experience which translates into custom curve edits that a non-Pro wouldn't come up with?

Jeff
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post #836 of 5625 Old 12-22-2011, 06:58 AM
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Regarding what a pro might bring, I think one would ask the pro to "optimize the listening environment". This might include assisting in speaker placement, assessing the need for room treatments using measurement techniques, etc. A Pro calibration would be a last step in a number of activities, IMO. Otherwise, not a lot of value to the visit.

Traveling today--don't know how you tolerate posting from an iPhone, Jeff. I have sent this reply three times by mistake...
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post #837 of 5625 Old 12-22-2011, 07:06 AM
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Quote:
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Traveling today--don't know how you tolerate posting from an iPhone, Jeff. I have sent this reply three times by mistake...

Autocorrect can produce some hilarious rutabagas.
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post #838 of 5625 Old 12-22-2011, 06:12 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by D69stang2 View Post

So i get the licence (150$) and the kit (550$) from whome? I think the integra 80.2 is pro capable, i.e. do i need the kit? i thought i only needed the licence.

Yes the 80.2 is Pro capable but to activate the Pro feature every unit you wish to calibrate must have its own license. Grasshopper, you will find that the path to the answers you seek begins with post 2.

Yes, I still like playing with Dalis.

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post #839 of 5625 Old 01-01-2012, 10:16 AM
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I just installed Audyssey 3.5 on my laptop to do my upgraded AVP (now XT32 Pro compliant).
When I did, the installer site said you had to install Net Framework 2.0 but when I tried I'd get a "won't run on 64 bit" error and it wouldn't install.
I installed the 3.5 anyways and calibrated the AVP. (It sounds great although I haven't had much time with it yet, plus it's in a different room than I had prior to the upgrade so it's hard to tell how much difference XT32 is making.)

Anyways, the pings seemed to be quicker, but everything else seemed dreadfully slow, the "transferring response" might have taken between 5 to 10 minutes for each position.
Plus the calculating and optimzing filters after seemed really slow as well. It's been a while since I've done a calibration but I don't recall it being anywhere near this slow.

Is this typical with XT32? Or could I be having an issue related to not being able to download Net Framework 2?
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post #840 of 5625 Old 01-01-2012, 11:05 AM
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Pinging around the system was faster on my 5508, but as you observed transferring took a while ... seemingly longer than 885 and MultEQ XT. And the 885 was USB/serial while the 5508 is ethernet. I would have thought that data would transfer faster, but then I thought that it may bery well be doing that, but there is more data due to the additional resolution of XT 32. Speculation, though, on my part. Might be a good question for Ask Audyssey ... headed there now.

Re .NET, if you have a 64-bit version of Windows, then my guess is that it requires a 64-bit .NET. That Pro worked suggests that .NET is already installed. Had MultEQ Pro complained that .NET was not installed, or did you just see it on the site and thought you needed it (without knowing you had it)?
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