The "Official" Pioneer Elite SC-55/SC-57 Owners Thread - Page 101 - AVS Forum
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post #3001 of 4006 Old 05-04-2012, 07:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jtuttle View Post

Any value to a 7.1 setup in a 3700 cubic feet room when using AppleTV with only 5.1 sound output to my SC-57?

Does AppleTV support 7.1? IDK, don't use it, just checking...

My room is 7.1 and 13'3" x 17'7" x 8'5" or so. My listening position is about halfway into the room. Works OK for me. I had 7.1, punted back to 5.1, then upgraded back to 7.1. Not a lot of content a few years ago, but much more of the new releases use 7.1.

"After silence, that which best expresses the inexpressible, is music" - Aldous Huxley
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post #3002 of 4006 Old 05-04-2012, 09:39 PM
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possible?
9.1(7.1 with bi-amped fronts spkrs) ; zone2 zone 3. all at once?
I'm thinking of buying this 57 if it can do the above without extra amps.
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post #3003 of 4006 Old 05-04-2012, 09:42 PM
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i'd like to purchase the 57 if it can bi-amp fronts spkrs, play zone 2 and 3 without xtra amps. and is it possible to get a reply to my email? thx
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post #3004 of 4006 Old 05-04-2012, 09:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by feixingyuan View Post

i'd like to purchase the 57 if it can bi-amp fronts spkrs, play zone 2 and 3 without xtra amps. and is it possible to get a reply to my email? thx

It has 9 amps so if you use 5.1 with no bi-amping (waste of time imo) then yes you have the ability to power zones 2 and 3 in stereo mode.
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post #3005 of 4006 Old 05-06-2012, 01:04 AM
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I recently purchased the SC-55. Overall, it's pretty nice. The problem is that I can't seem to get my mythtv box to work at all with this. My mythtv box is running on linux and using an on-board graphics with HDMI. For some reason, the receiver does not play nice with the SC-55. I've tried everything I could think of:

- Hook directly to the TV to verify that everything is OK (it is)
- Tried different HDMI cables (no difference)
- Tried different inputs (no difference)
- I even tried different machines. I hooked my linux laptop up to the receiver. Same results. I also had a friend bring over his linux laptop and we tried that. Still no go. Both laptops use nvidia graphics.

All other devices hooked to the receive work fine.

I think part of the problem is the EDID data coming from the receiver. For some reason, the linux box is only recognizing 1280x720@74.2 and 720x480@27. It doesn't report 1920x1080 even though it's clearly supported. I've tried building my own xorg.conf file with the modeline for 1920x1080@60, but that didn't work.

So, does anyone have any other suggestions? I'm at my wits end. I currently have a HDMI cable running through the center of my living room as a workaround. But, that's not gonna fly for much longer.
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post #3006 of 4006 Old 05-06-2012, 05:22 AM
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Unfortunately a search of the internet (and this thread) leads me to the startling conclusion you may in fact be the only person in the world trying this combination. It definitely seems like something non-standard in the software/hardware is messing things up. However, you'd probably be better served hitting this from the mythTV end. Pioneer isn't the kind of place that'll issue a patch for this. Good luck!
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post #3007 of 4006 Old 05-06-2012, 07:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jhelmer View Post

I recently purchased the SC-55. Overall, it's pretty nice. The problem is that I can't seem to get my mythtv box to work at all with this. My mythtv box is running on linux and using an on-board graphics with HDMI. For some reason, the receiver does not play nice with the SC-55. I've tried everything I could think of:

- Hook directly to the TV to verify that everything is OK (it is)
- Tried different HDMI cables (no difference)
- Tried different inputs (no difference)
- I even tried different machines. I hooked my linux laptop up to the receiver. Same results. I also had a friend bring over his linux laptop and we tried that. Still no go. Both laptops use nvidia graphics.

All other devices hooked to the receive work fine.

I think part of the problem is the EDID data coming from the receiver. For some reason, the linux box is only recognizing 1280x720@74.2 and 720x480@27. It doesn't report 1920x1080 even though it's clearly supported. I've tried building my own xorg.conf file with the modeline for 1920x1080@60, but that didn't work.

So, does anyone have any other suggestions? I'm at my wits end. I currently have a HDMI cable running through the center of my living room as a workaround. But, that's not gonna fly for much longer.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dscottj View Post

Unfortunately a search of the internet (and this thread) leads me to the startling conclusion you may in fact be the only person in the world trying this combination. It definitely seems like something non-standard in the software/hardware is messing things up. However, you'd probably be better served hitting this from the mythTV end. Pioneer isn't the kind of place that'll issue a patch for this. Good luck!

I think dscottj is on the right track. You might want to try different resolutions from the input side -- your Linux laptop and MythTV. I have a home-built HTPC with an nVidia graphics card hooked up via HDMI and it works just fine. The nVidia control panel in fact recognizes the display as a Pioneer SC-57 and configures the resolution accordingly. But that may only be because I'm running Windows 7 and can access the full panoply of nVidia control panel settings. I expect you probably have a much more streamlined suite for the Linux OS. But assuming you can access some sort of control panel equivalent for the nVidia graphics card, try going to the "change resolution" section, and see if there is a button that says "customize". That should bring up a box that says "enable resolutions not exposed by the display." From that, you can select any resolution you want, not just resolutions that the SC-55 EDID is reporting to your card. Then try to find resolutions you know are supported by the SC-55 and see what happens.
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post #3008 of 4006 Old 05-06-2012, 12:44 PM
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Noob question... I'm thinking of getting the SC-57 with either the Oppo BDP-95 or BDP-93. I understand that the BDP-95 is $500 more because it has way better audio processing than the BDP-93. Am I better off just letting the SC-57 do the decoding for blu-ray audio, or will it sound better to use the analog outputs of the BDP-95?

My gut says the BDP-95 is a good choice for people with receivers that don't have good decoders, but I'd imagine the SC-57 might have it beat. Just want to make sure I'm not missing something.
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post #3009 of 4006 Old 05-06-2012, 01:28 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pr0crast View Post

Noob question... I'm thinking of getting the SC-57 with either the Oppo BDP-95 or BDP-93. I understand that the BDP-95 is $500 more because it has way better audio processing than the BDP-93. Am I better off just letting the SC-57 do the decoding for blu-ray audio, or will it sound better to use the analog outputs of the BDP-95?

My gut says the BDP-95 is a good choice for people with receivers that don't have good decoders, but I'd imagine the SC-57 might have it beat. Just want to make sure I'm not missing something.

The 95 is only "better" if you are using analog connections to your preamp and bypassing any DSP in the receiver (including room equal, etc...)

It also has a fantastic stereo output stage... once again, not useful if using MCACC (Which would require redigitization of the analog input, which negates the benefit of the dacs in the Oppo ..)

Its not about good decoding.... they all decode the audio the same.

Its about the digital to analog converters and IMO I'd save the 500.

Just my. 02.
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post #3010 of 4006 Old 05-06-2012, 01:30 PM
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Originally Posted by jimjr View Post

I think dscottj is on the right track. You might want to try different resolutions from the input side -- your Linux laptop and MythTV. I have a home-built HTPC with an nVidia graphics card hooked up via HDMI and it works just fine. The nVidia control panel in fact recognizes the display as a Pioneer SC-57 and configures the resolution accordingly. But that may only be because I'm running Windows 7 and can access the full panoply of nVidia control panel settings. I expect you probably have a much more streamlined suite for the Linux OS. But assuming you can access some sort of control panel equivalent for the nVidia graphics card, try going to the "change resolution" section, and see if there is a button that says "customize". That should bring up a box that says "enable resolutions not exposed by the display." From that, you can select any resolution you want, not just resolutions that the SC-55 EDID is reporting to your card. Then try to find resolutions you know are supported by the SC-55 and see what happens.

Hey jimjr. Thanks for the advice.

I gave it a try again this AM, but still not having any luck. I tried using some better nvidia utils. It did allow me to force the resolution to 1920x1080@60 but I still couldn't get anything to display. I tried every resolution, refresh rate that the util supported, but nothing worked. When I checked the nvidia monitor info page (screenshot attached), it still shows that it can not read the native resolution or preferred resolution of the receiver.

Then, I booted into Windows 7 and gave that a try. Win7 was able to detect that the receiver existed, but when I would try to enable it, it would ding to indicate the device was found, the screen would flash (I assume it was configuring the new display) then I would hear the error sound and the screen would flash again (deconfigure the new display?). After it went through that cycle, it would all of the sudden redetect the new screen and the cycle would start all over again. I watched it go through this cycle about 10 times without ever working. The only good thing was that HDMI audio seemed to work in Win7 -- I've never had it work on linux (but I've never really tried that hard). I got to hear my never ending series of dings in surround!

So, I tried with vista. In vista, I could get it to detect the display, but when I tried to enable it, the screen would just flash, wait a few secs and then flash again (revert back to single display). After all that, the checkbox next to the Pioneer display would revert to being unchecked (display disabled). At least it didn't get caught in a never ending loop like Windows 7, but I could never get output through the receiver on vista either.

I must be doing something wrong, but I have *no* idea what. Usually this stuff is pretty much plug-n-play.

I guess my next choice is to get an HDMI switch, run optical audio to the receiver and just bypass the receiver entirely for video. Very frustrating!
LL
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post #3011 of 4006 Old 05-06-2012, 01:38 PM
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Originally Posted by jhelmer View Post

Hey jimjr. Thanks for the advice.

I gave it a try again this AM, but still not having any luck. I tried using some better nvidia utils. It did allow me to force the resolution to 1920x1080@60 but I still couldn't get anything to display. I tried every resolution, refresh rate that the util supported, but nothing worked. When I checked the nvidia monitor info page (screenshot attached), it still shows that it can not read the native resolution or preferred resolution of the receiver.

Then, I booted into Windows 7 and gave that a try. Win7 was able to detect that the receiver existed, but when I would try to enable it, it would ding to indicate the device was found, the screen would flash (I assume it was configuring the new display) then I would hear the error sound and the screen would flash again (deconfigure the new display?). After it went through that cycle, it would all of the sudden redetect the new screen and the cycle would start all over again. I watched it go through this cycle about 10 times without ever working. The only good thing was that HDMI audio seemed to work in Win7 -- I've never had it work on linux (but I've never really tried that hard). I got to hear my never ending series of dings in surround!

So, I tried with vista. In vista, I could get it to detect the display, but when I tried to enable it, the screen would just flash, wait a few secs and then flash again (revert back to single display). After all that, the checkbox next to the Pioneer display would revert to being unchecked (display disabled). At least it didn't get caught in a never ending loop like Windows 7, but I could never get output through the receiver on vista either.

I must be doing something wrong, but I have *no* idea what. Usually this stuff is pretty much plug-n-play.

I guess my next choice is to get an HDMI switch, run optical audio to the receiver and just bypass the receiver entirely for video. Very frustrating!

Ok. Let's go nuclear then. Check to make sure you have the most recent nVidia driver and control panel application. If not, install it. If you already have the most recent one, try uninstalling and reinstalling. Your nVidia control panel looks a bit antiquated and I am not sure I understand the reference to "server x". But in any event, let's see if this is a driver problem and go from there.
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post #3012 of 4006 Old 05-06-2012, 01:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FilmMixer View Post

The 95 is only "better" if you are using analog connections to your preamp and bypassing any DSP in the receiver (including room equal, etc...)

It also has a fantastic stereo output stage... once again, not useful if using MCACC (Which would require redigitization of the analog input, which negates the benefit of the dacs in the Oppo ..)

Its not about good decoding.... they all decode the audio the same.

Its about the digital to analog converters and IMO I'd save the 500.

Just my. 02.

Oppo provided advice to people trying to decide between the the BDP-83 and the BDP-83SE when they first came out that applies equally to the 93 and 95. If you plan to use only HDMI, then paying money for the upgraded DACS and analog outputs buys you nothing. Zippo. Totally different signal path. If you are an audiophile, and see yourself playing hi-res audio sources, then the 95 is an excellent upgrade. The 95 is really designed for people who want a super-high quality transport for playing music.
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post #3013 of 4006 Old 05-06-2012, 04:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FilmMixer View Post

The 95 is only "better" if you are using analog connections to your preamp and bypassing any DSP in the receiver (including room equal, etc...)

It also has a fantastic stereo output stage... once again, not useful if using MCACC (Which would require redigitization of the analog input, which negates the benefit of the dacs in the Oppo ..)

I am using the Oppo 95 with the SC57.
Understand your point re mcacc; to avoid this would the stream direct audio modes of the Pioneer ensure the Oppo's dac's are used.
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post #3014 of 4006 Old 05-06-2012, 05:45 PM
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^^

Hi

The only thing that will allow using the Oppo DAC's is use it's analog outputs to your SC-57's analog inputs. Setting Pure Direct, Direct, or Auto Surround as sound processing is irrelevant to using the player's DAC's.

But, using Pure Direct and turning MCACC off gives just the sound from the disc with no processing added. With Direct, you can add the EQ part of MCACC and with Auto Surround you can add Dolby PLIIx/z, THX modes.

I'm not even sure the multichannel inputs on the SC-57 can be redigitized to add processing. Some earlier models had analog-to-digital converters to redigitalize analog sound, but in some later models, that feature was dropped. If all you can select is stream direct/pure direct, then the option to add surround processing or use MCACC EQ is not there.

Even if you could add MCACC & EQ, redigitizing the signal theoretically negates some of the benefit of using the Oppo's stacked 32 bit DAC's for 2 channel, since the analog-to-digital converters in the receiver would be 24 bit. In theory, some argue that "something" can be lost in the extra analog to digital conversion step.

Plus, it's the dedicated 2 channel outputs that get the benefit of using the Oppo's single 9018 chip and all 8 of its 8 DAC's just for stereo. Even if the 9018 is "better" than what's in the 57, for multichannel there's 1 9018 for all 8 channels and one has to ask, is the extra cables, the potential loss of MCACC or if it's there, redigitizing the analog to be able to add MCACC, worth it?

If it were me, I'd connect the hi-quality 2 ch analogs and do some listening tests before deciding to go the whole way for movies & multichannel music.

Steve
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post #3015 of 4006 Old 05-06-2012, 11:36 PM
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^^ Hi Steve,
I do use the Oppo analogue outs for stereo listening.

With the Pioneer Direct gives sub output while pure direct does not. I do prefer the sub in the mix.

I will have to investigate further what happens with mcacc and EQ when engaging the direct modes in the 57.

I have been considering trying the multichannel outputs of the 95 for movies and would be interested to hear any percieved differences however my main aim in buying the 95 was for 2 channel (and the 83E before that).

Cheers Steve.
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post #3016 of 4006 Old 05-07-2012, 11:30 AM
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My SC-27 uses MCACC in Direct, not in Pure Direct. I suspect it is the same for all models since... Until I get a perfect room, I shall continue to use Pure Direct only to make measurements without preocessing, never for listening.

"After silence, that which best expresses the inexpressible, is music" - Aldous Huxley
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post #3017 of 4006 Old 05-08-2012, 06:46 AM
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Hi,
I've had my SC-55 for 5 months. I like it alot, everything has been perfect. Last night it stopped putting out audio or video from any source. It powers up fine, just no sound. I've checked all menu settings and speaker selections etc.
I've unplugged and done every trick I can think of.
Any ideas?
Thanks
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post #3018 of 4006 Old 05-08-2012, 07:57 AM
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Did you try a reset?

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post #3019 of 4006 Old 05-08-2012, 08:35 AM
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Hi All -

To recap, I have a SC-57 and am considering upgrading to a Monitor Audio GX Gold 5.1 speaker system. The dealer I had been speaking to was really pushing me to also upgrade the amps if I were to go to the Golds. My understanding was that the SC-57 is a really powerful AVR, so I was skeptical.

I've since been in contact with the technical support team at Monitor Audio and they are also suggesting upgrading the amplification, particularly if I wanted to upgrade to the GX300 floorstanders.

So my questions to the forum would be: How would it work to combine a 2-channel power amp with the SC-57 (IF I decide this is the way I want to go)? I assume there would be line-level pre-outs from the SC-57 to the power amp, and ideally I'd want the power amp to drive the 2 fronts? Would the SC-57 internal amplifiers then drive the center and 2 surrounds? Is this pretty easy to set up? Would the SC-57 be able to manage the volumes centrally, and would auto MCACC still be an option? I'd still want to control a powered sub through the LFE out on the SC-57 - I guess this wouldn't be an issue with the introduction of the separate power amp?

And finally - Have any owners actually done something similar, and how are they finding it in terms of performance.

Thanks,
JD


Quote:
Originally Posted by jd_alpha View Post

Thanks again Steve. I'll see how it goes next time I talk to him. He's been really good on pricing and service in the past, but if he really pushes for me to upgrade the amp again I'll likely move on.

I dont' know if you've had the chance to hear any of the GX series. The tweeters are amazing and the high end from them is really superb. Check them out if you get a chance.

Cheers,
JD

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post #3020 of 4006 Old 05-08-2012, 08:41 AM
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Did you try a reset?

Well, I've unplugged it for an hour or so. Is there something else require for a reset?
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post #3021 of 4006 Old 05-08-2012, 09:57 AM
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Well, I've unplugged it for an hour or so. Is there something else require for a reset?

This is something that purdyd recommended that worked for me. Turn off network standby in the menu BEFORE power cycling and see if that works. It worked for me. Something about the network card was causing the receiver to lock up occassionally. If that doesn't work, then go into the menu and do a full factory reset. Instructions for both are in the manual.
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post #3022 of 4006 Old 05-08-2012, 10:05 AM
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Originally Posted by jimjr View Post

This is something that purdyd recommended that worked for me. Turn off network standby in the menu BEFORE power cycling and see if that works. It worked for me. Something about the network card was causing the receiver to lock up occassionally. If that doesn't work, then go into the menu and do a full factory reset. Instructions for both are in the manual.

Sweet. I'll give that a whack. Thanks for your help
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post #3023 of 4006 Old 05-08-2012, 10:10 AM
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@jd_alpha...

they are blowing smoke up your posterior....

a) those aren't particularly hard to drive...

b) the gx300's are actually more efficient than their smaller brethren... which isn't surprising...

c) in order to get any material difference from an external amplifier, you would need to start at 300 watts and go from there... as your speakers would be physically destroyed if you fed them this for any period of time, that's probably not a great option...

use your sc... cross at 80hz... be happy....

- chris

 

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post #3024 of 4006 Old 05-08-2012, 12:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jimjr View Post

This is something that purdyd recommended that worked for me. Turn off network standby in the menu BEFORE power cycling and see if that works. It worked for me. Something about the network card was causing the receiver to lock up occassionally. If that doesn't work, then go into the menu and do a full factory reset. Instructions for both are in the manual.

I just realized, I won't be able to see the dang menu to turn off the network settings. It's only on screen, right?
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post #3025 of 4006 Old 05-08-2012, 12:36 PM
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Should be displayed on receiver as well
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post #3026 of 4006 Old 05-08-2012, 04:17 PM
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Originally Posted by jbusick View Post

I just realized, I won't be able to see the dang menu to turn off the network settings. It's only on screen, right?

You need to use the display on the receiver. You're right. You can't see the GUI on the tv. Should have mentioned that. Sorry.
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post #3027 of 4006 Old 05-08-2012, 05:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jd_alpha View Post

Hi All -

To recap, I have a SC-57 and am considering upgrading to a Monitor Audio GX Gold 5.1 speaker system. The dealer I had been speaking to was really pushing me to also upgrade the amps if I were to go to the Golds. My understanding was that the SC-57 is a really powerful AVR, so I was skeptical.

I've since been in contact with the technical support team at Monitor Audio and they are also suggesting upgrading the amplification, particularly if I wanted to upgrade to the GX300 floorstanders.

So my questions to the forum would be: How would it work to combine a 2-channel power amp with the SC-57 (IF I decide this is the way I want to go)? I assume there would be line-level pre-outs from the SC-57 to the power amp, and ideally I'd want the power amp to drive the 2 fronts? Would the SC-57 internal amplifiers then drive the center and 2 surrounds? Is this pretty easy to set up? Would the SC-57 be able to manage the volumes centrally, and would auto MCACC still be an option? I'd still want to control a powered sub through the LFE out on the SC-57 - I guess this wouldn't be an issue with the introduction of the separate power amp?

And finally - Have any owners actually done something similar, and how are they finding it in terms of performance.

Thanks,
JD

An external amp is easy to setup. Your pre-outs go to the amp and the speaker cables leave the amp. I have a 7.1 setup utilizing a Wyred 4 Sound 3x500 and 2x250 for LCR and rear surrounds and the Pioneer SC-57 powering my side surrounds. I used MCACC to setup. Very easy.

The sub out takes care of my SVS PB-13 just fine.
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post #3028 of 4006 Old 05-08-2012, 06:24 PM
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Originally Posted by jimjr View Post

You need to use the display on the receiver. You're right. You can't see the GUI on the tv. Should have mentioned that. Sorry.

Hi. I did a reset, cycled all that stuff and no luck.
It takes a long time to turn off. Also, when I unplug it, and only the first power up after I plug it back in, the hdmi light blinks two and a half times then goes out. After that, the light never comes back on, blinks, nothing.
What about doing a firmware reinstall?
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post #3029 of 4006 Old 05-08-2012, 07:03 PM
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Hi. I did a reset, cycled all that stuff and no luck.
It takes a long time to turn off. Also, when I unplug it, and only the first power up after I plug it back in, the hdmi light blinks two and a half times then goes out. After that, the light never comes back on, blinks, nothing.
What about doing a firmware reinstall?

Doubt fw reinstall will make any difference. You might have a conflict with one of your hdmi devices Try unplugging all of your HDMI devices and then power cycling. Then plug them in one by one and power cycle each time and see if you can find which one is causing the problem. I too am occasionally having a problem with slow power off and I had a full lockup two days ago. No responsiveness at all. Couldn't even power cycle. But unplugging the receiver did clear the problem.
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post #3030 of 4006 Old 05-08-2012, 07:52 PM
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Doubt fw reinstall will make any difference. You might have a conflict with one of your hdmi devices Try unplugging all of your HDMI devices and then power cycling. Then plug them in one by one and power cycle each time and see if you can find which one is causing the problem. I too am occasionally having a problem with slow power off and I had a full lockup two days ago. No responsiveness at all. Couldn't even power cycle. But unplugging the receiver did clear the problem.

Well I'll be darned. I was literally just about to unplug the amp and box it up. I tried unplugging the hdmi plugs and it actually fixed it! I've got Apple TV goin now, and will slowly add components t see which one tripped it.
Seems kinda crazy that Pioneer has this thing commit suicide if an hdmi is out of whack. Thanks for the idea!
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