Integra DHC-80.3 - Page 40 - AVS Forum
Forum Jump: 
 1Likes
Reply
 
Thread Tools
post #1171 of 4286 Old 02-20-2012, 08:31 PM
Member
 
badbenzz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Marina Del Rey
Posts: 190
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Liked: 13
Prior to the 80.3 I had a been using a 80.1 as a stop gap measure as I had a Halcro and a Theta Casablanca III. I have been waiting for a replacement for sometime now and frankly, the Integra filled the bill and after hearing the 80.3on Directv only, there is a night and day difference than the 80.1. Currently I plan to use the 80.3 and wait a couple more years until somethng else comes out. I considered the Mcintosh MX150 prior to my 80.1 but it lacked duel HDMI outs and the Classe lacked an EQ and distinct zone 2. More recently I was going to get the Mcintosh MX121 but it looks too familiar to the Marantz piece that sells for $1600.00, so I decided to give the new Integra a try. Frankly I thought the 80.1 was hoorible for 2 channel and used it only for movies. Since I have a separate 2 channel room that isn't as important anymore. Hopefully the 80.3 will surprise me for 2 channel.
badbenzz is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #1172 of 4286 Old 02-20-2012, 08:52 PM
AVS Special Member
 
N8DOGG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Canada
Posts: 5,734
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 142 Post(s)
Liked: 301
I've always wished I had a chance to hear a Casablanca III. I've always though they were really sharp looking. I've fumbled around with a dreadnaught II but never a Casa. Very nice gear you've had badbenzz.

Blasting brown notes for 10 years and counting!

N8DOGG is offline  
post #1173 of 4286 Old 02-20-2012, 10:07 PM
Member
 
badbenzz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Marina Del Rey
Posts: 190
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Liked: 13
The CBIII was hands down the best sounding 2 channel processor I ever owned. Too bad it took them 4 years to finally get HDMI. Actually it still may be a consideration after they put an EQ in it, which should be soon....
badbenzz is offline  
post #1174 of 4286 Old 02-21-2012, 01:02 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
Johnla's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 11,515
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 16 Post(s)
Liked: 23
Quote:
Originally Posted by MUDCAT45 View Post

Not a step down if you do not like Audyssey, YPAO or EmoQ. If you like RC then I suppose that feature is a step down.


No, the UMC1 is indeed a massive step down. And in more ways than just one!
Johnla is online now  
post #1175 of 4286 Old 02-21-2012, 08:35 AM
AVS Club Gold
 
tigerhonaker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: TN. USA
Posts: 661
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 13

I have a question.

I will be running 4-subs with a Integra DHC 80.3.

How does the Audyssey XT32 handle this?

I know from reading it has the ability for 2-subs.

I'm sure many-many members run 4-subs in their HT like me.
The 4-subs are the Mirage BPS400.
2 are placed in the rear facing forward to the screen.
2 are placed in the front facing the rear.

I'm thinking I might not be able to get them to where the 2 rear & 2 front are the exact same distance from the seating area.
Going to have to get with the A/V installing dealer on that and see what they have to say.
Sometimes you just cannot place speakers exactly where you prefer.

So I would really appreciate any input from those that have already been there and done this with 4-subs and XT32.

Yes I have read over a 100-Post on here but did not see where this had been discussed.

For those willing to take your Time to reply to this Post I thank-you.

Terry

My "New" Home Theatre Pics 3/22/2012.

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
tigerhonaker is offline  
post #1176 of 4286 Old 02-21-2012, 08:57 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
kbarnes701's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Main Listening Positon
Posts: 17,850
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1383 Post(s)
Liked: 1677
Quote:
Originally Posted by tigerhonaker View Post


I have a question.

I will be running 4-subs with a Integra DHC 80.3.

How does the Audyssey XT32 handle this?

I know from reading it has the ability for 2-subs.

I'm sure many-many members run 4-subs in their HT like me.
The 4-subs are the Mirage BPS400.
2 are placed in the rear facing forward to the screen.
2 are placed in the front facing the rear.

I'm thinking I might not be able to get them to where the 2 rear & 2 front are the exact same distance from the seating area.
Going to have to get with the A/V installing dealer on that and see what they have to say.
Sometimes you just cannot place speakers exactly where you prefer.

So I would really appreciate any input from those that have already been there and done this with 4-subs and XT32.

Yes I have read over a 100-Post on here but did not see where this had been discussed.

For those willing to take your Time to reply to this Post I thank-you.

Terry

XT32 can handle your four subs, but there are some limitations.

You will need to connect one pair of subs to Sub A on your AVR, using a Y Splitter and the other pair to Sub B on your AVR, also using a Y splitter.

XT32 will now see 'two' subs, but they will each consist of two 'pieces'.

You need to tell the AVR that you have two subs, using the relevant menu.

You will need to place pair A, ideally, so that they are equidistant from the MLP and pair B also equidistant from the MLP. Pair A and Pair B can be at different distances from the MLP but each sub in each pair should ideally be equidistant. The reason for this will become clear below. So to clarify that with an example, Pair A can have each sub at, say, 10 feet from the MLP and Pair B can have each sub at, say, 8 feet from the MLP.

Now you can run XT32, using all 8 mic positions.

XT 32 will first ask you to set levels for each sub. It asks you to set each sub in turn so that it measures 75dB. You may want to set yours to 72dB because you are using more than two. You can experiment with it - the purpose of this is to enable your AVR to set trim levels that are within then operating range of the trims your AVR can handle - usually -15dB to +15dB for subs. Ideally you want your final trims to be in the range of -4dB to +4dB.

Now you can start the measurements, with the mic for position one at your MLP.

XT32 first measures each sub for level and distance. In your case it will measure Pair A for level and distance, treating the pair as 'one' sub. Then it will measure pair B for level and distance in the same way. Once that has been done it then EQs the two subs (or two pairs in your case) as one, taking account of how they interact with the room and with each other, which is really cool.

Take the other 7 measurements, at 2 feet intervals around you listening space, keeping at least 18 inches - 2ft away from any walls or reflective surfaces and also within the left/right boundaries of the front L & R speakers. Mic should point to the ceiling and be at ear height supported by a tripod or mic stand (v. important).


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
kbarnes701 is offline  
post #1177 of 4286 Old 02-21-2012, 09:27 AM
AVS Special Member
 
g_bartman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: cleveland, oh
Posts: 3,230
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 34 Post(s)
Liked: 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by tigerhonaker View Post


I have a question.

I will be running 4-subs with a Integra DHC 80.3.

How does the Audyssey XT32 handle this?

I know from reading it has the ability for 2-subs.

I'm sure many-many members run 4-subs in their HT like me.
The 4-subs are the Mirage BPS400.
2 are placed in the rear facing forward to the screen.
2 are placed in the front facing the rear.

I'm thinking I might not be able to get them to where the 2 rear & 2 front are the exact same distance from the seating area.
Going to have to get with the A/V installing dealer on that and see what they have to say.
Sometimes you just cannot place speakers exactly where you prefer.

So I would really appreciate any input from those that have already been there and done this with 4-subs and XT32.

Yes I have read over a 100-Post on here but did not see where this had been discussed.

For those willing to take your Time to reply to this Post I thank-you.

Terry

I just posted the exact same question on the 80.2 thread. I read the answer from Kbarnes701 which is pretty much what I thought. I paired my 2 nearfield subs together and the subs on the front and rear walls together. Took 7 measurements and thought the results came out good.

g_bartman is offline  
post #1178 of 4286 Old 02-21-2012, 03:09 PM
AVS Special Member
 
fitzcaraldo215's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,003
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 17 Post(s)
Liked: 22
Quote:
Originally Posted by toddtrues View Post

Help..
I got my 80.3 installed. Very excited but I have a problem with 1080p content..

I replaced my Denon 3808 with the 80.3. I was using my Denon as a processor. I am having major syncing problems that I have never had before on 1080p content ONLY. Everything else works fine. I have an Oppo BR and using DirecTV as TV content. I can't get 1080p to sync everytime. Sometimes it works for my Oppo but never got it to work for DirecTV 1080p content. I hear the sound but the video doesn't come through. I have reset it to factory defaults, etc, etc..I have changed out cables, double-checked connections, etc.. 1080p content with the Denon was NEVER a problem.

It seems that the 80.3 does not like a 1080p source.

Any thoughts before I return this bad boy back? Anybody else having major syncing problems with 1080p content.

Thanks!!

Nope, never, ever had a lip synching issue, and this is my third Integra starting with a 9.8.
fitzcaraldo215 is offline  
post #1179 of 4286 Old 02-21-2012, 03:37 PM
AVS Club Gold
 
tigerhonaker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: TN. USA
Posts: 661
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 13
Quote:
Originally Posted by kbarnes701 View Post

XT32 can handle your four subs, but there are some limitations.

You will need to connect one pair of subs to Sub A on your AVR, using a Y Splitter and the other pair to Sub B on your AVR, also using a Y splitter.

XT32 will now see 'two' subs, but they will each consist of two 'pieces'.

You need to tell the AVR that you have two subs, using the relevant menu.

You will need to place pair A, ideally, so that they are equidistant from the MLP and pair B also equidistant from the MLP. Pair A and Pair B can be at different distances from the MLP but each sub in each pair should ideally be equidistant. The reason for this will become clear below. So to clarify that with an example, Pair A can have each sub at, say, 10 feet from the MLP and Pair B can have each sub at, say, 8 feet from the MLP.

Now you can run XT32, using all 8 mic positions.

XT 32 will first ask you to set levels for each sub. It asks you to set each sub in turn so that it measures 75dB. You may want to set yours to 72dB because you are using more than two. You can experiment with it - the purpose of this is to enable your AVR to set trim levels that are within then operating range of the trims your AVR can handle - usually -15dB to +15dB for subs. Ideally you want your final trims to be in the range of -4dB to +4dB.

Now you can start the measurements, with the mic for position one at your MLP.

XT32 first measures each sub for level and distance. In your case it will measure Pair A for level and distance, treating the pair as 'one' sub. Then it will measure pair B for level and distance in the same way. Once that has been done it then EQs the two subs (or two pairs in your case) as one, taking account of how they interact with the room and with each other, which is really cool.

Take the other 7 measurements, at 2 feet intervals around you listening space, keeping at least 18 inches - 2ft away from any walls or reflective surfaces and also within the left/right boundaries of the front L & R speakers. Mic should point to the ceiling and be at ear height supported by a tripod or mic stand (v. important).

Keith,

I just want to say to you how much I appreciate the info. on your Post.
It is exact and to the point.
It is so good in fact I passed it on to my A/V dealer.
They liked what you said also.

I also took the time to Print the Post out for reference later on.

This gives me and them a base that they can work from once the install takes place.

At this time my 4-Subs are not together in pairs.
But they can be with rerouting the cable to them.
This is probably going to be the Very Best that my HT will sound.



Thanks again,
Terry

My "New" Home Theatre Pics 3/22/2012.

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
tigerhonaker is offline  
post #1180 of 4286 Old 02-21-2012, 03:54 PM
AVS Addicted Member
 
kbarnes701's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Main Listening Positon
Posts: 17,850
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1383 Post(s)
Liked: 1677
Quote:
Originally Posted by tigerhonaker View Post

Keith,

I just want to say to you how much I appreciate the info. on your Post.
It is exact and to the point.
It is so good in fact I passed it on to my A/V dealer.
They liked what you said also.

I also took the time to Print the Post out for reference later on.

This gives me and them a base that they can work from once the install takes place.

At this time my 4-Subs are not together in pairs.
But they can be with rerouting the cable to them.
This is probably going to be the Very Best that my HT will sound.



Thanks again,
Terry

Hi Terry,

Glad to be of help. Hope it all works out for you. I have run one pair of subs in the past in similar fashion to how I described it to you, and it worked well. XT32 is essential for EQ-ing two subs, or in your case, two pairs of subs. Just think of each pair as one sub and you won't go wrong (hence the need for them to be equidistant from the MLP - no way to set the distance otherwise. Good luck with it - I am sure it will sound terrific.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
kbarnes701 is offline  
post #1181 of 4286 Old 02-21-2012, 04:51 PM
 
LeonardoP's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 28
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by kbarnes701 View Post

Hi Terry,

Glad to be of help. Hope it all works out for you. I have run one pair of subs in the past in similar fashion to how I described it to you, and it worked well. XT32 is essential for EQ-ing two subs, or in your case, two pairs of subs. Just think of each pair as one sub and you won't go wrong (hence the need for them to be equidistant from the MLP - no way to set the distance otherwise. Good luck with it - I am sure it will sound terrific.

Can anyone PM me for a dealer or source I can buy a 80.3? Also, are these still on backorder? Thanks!
LeonardoP is offline  
post #1182 of 4286 Old 02-21-2012, 07:52 PM
AVS Club Gold
 
tigerhonaker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: TN. USA
Posts: 661
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 13
Quote:
Originally Posted by LeonardoP View Post

Can anyone PM me for a dealer or source I can buy a 80.3? Also, are these still on backorder? Thanks!

No the backorder is over mine just arrived at my dealer last Friday.

You don't say where you are located.
As in regards to the purcahse of the 80.3.

Terry

My "New" Home Theatre Pics 3/22/2012.

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
tigerhonaker is offline  
post #1183 of 4286 Old 02-21-2012, 08:34 PM
AVS Club Gold
 
tigerhonaker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: TN. USA
Posts: 661
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 13
Quote:
Originally Posted by kbarnes701 View Post

Hi Terry,

Glad to be of help. Hope it all works out for you. I have run one pair of subs in the past in similar fashion to how I described it to you, and it worked well. XT32 is essential for EQ-ing two subs, or in your case, two pairs of subs. Just think of each pair as one sub and you won't go wrong (hence the need for them to be equidistant from the MLP - no way to set the distance otherwise. Good luck with it - I am sure it will sound terrific.

Keith,

Question?
You seem to me to know what you are talking about in reference to the multiple subs and running XT32.

The important thing is that the front & rear pairs are in the same line not necessarily right up against each other.

Example in Line like this _______________________________

But not right against one another which is not possible with my center speaker.

See picture below and notes on it.
Just trying to get a handle on this before the install takes place.




Terry

My "New" Home Theatre Pics 3/22/2012.

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
tigerhonaker is offline  
post #1184 of 4286 Old 02-22-2012, 02:59 AM
Advanced Member
 
GPBURNS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Halifax, Nova Scotia
Posts: 556
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Liked: 72
are you able to measure your reponse? all Keith can give you is guideline
to decent start. without measuring its a shot in the dark

15400 Watts of Seaton Power -Quad SubMersived
GPBURNS is offline  
post #1185 of 4286 Old 02-22-2012, 03:04 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
kbarnes701's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Main Listening Positon
Posts: 17,850
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1383 Post(s)
Liked: 1677
Quote:
Originally Posted by tigerhonaker View Post

Keith,

Question?
You seem to me to know what you are talking about in reference to the multiple subs and running XT32.

The important thing is that the front & rear pairs are in the same line not necessarily right up against each other.

Example in Line like this _______________________________

But not right against one another which is not possible with my center speaker.

Hi Terry,

The most important thing is that the subs in each pair are equidistant from the MLP. This is because they cannot be set for distance/delay as individual subs when they are connected via a Y connector off the AVR. Setting them at equidistant from the MLP gets around that - the distance setting will be the same for both subs in the pair.

Where the subs are placed 'along the line' will depend on where they cause the least worst problem with room modes. There's no hard and fast solution to that and some experimentation may be needed. Hopefully, your dealer will have some measuring equipment which will enable him to see precisely where the peaks and nulls are - I use OmniMic, a lot of people use REW. If you have no means of measuring then it has to be trial and error.

A general 'rule of thumb' I have seen mentioned for 4 subs is that each should be placed in the spot that represents one quarter of the room dimension (see attached diagram to make that clearer). If you want some heavy theory to give your dealer before the install, this paper from Harman will do the trick!
http://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct...635jng&cad=rja
LL


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
kbarnes701 is offline  
post #1186 of 4286 Old 02-22-2012, 03:09 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
kbarnes701's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Main Listening Positon
Posts: 17,850
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1383 Post(s)
Liked: 1677
Quote:
Originally Posted by GPBURNS View Post

are you able to measure your reponse? all Keith can give you is guideline
to decent start. without measuring its a shot in the dark

Absolutely. Hopefully his dealer will have some measuring gear.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
kbarnes701 is offline  
post #1187 of 4286 Old 02-22-2012, 06:15 AM
AVS Special Member
 
fitzcaraldo215's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,003
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 17 Post(s)
Liked: 22
Quote:
Originally Posted by kbarnes701 View Post

Hi Terry,

The most important thing is that the subs in each pair are equidistant from the MLP. This is because they cannot be set for distance/delay as individual subs when they are connected via a Y connector off the AVR. Setting them at equidistant from the MLP gets around that - the distance setting will be the same for both subs in the pair.

Where the subs are placed 'along the line' will depend on where they cause the least worst problem with room modes. There's no hard and fast solution to that and some experimentation may be needed. Hopefully, your dealer will have some measuring equipment which will enable him to see precisely where the peaks and nulls are - I use OmniMic, a lot of people use REW. If you have no means of measuring then it has to be trial and error.

A general 'rule of thumb' I have seen mentioned for 4 subs is that each should be placed in the spot that represents one quarter of the room dimension (see attached diagram to make that clearer). If you want some heavy theory to give your dealer before the install, this paper from Harman will do the trick!

http://www.harman.com/EN-US/OurCompa...s/multsubs.pdf

Actually, the most important thing about the two subs in each pair is that they be identical, in addition to being equidistant. Most subs have a DSP input network that delays the signal acoustically. That is why their acoustic distance is not equal to their tape measure distance. That distance is usually greater by mike measurement because of the internal delay. Different subs will have a different amount of delay, but nobody publishes the delay factor.

If they are not identical, the best you can do is calibrate each one of the pair individually to get their true acoustic distance. Then you recalibrate with both and override the distance setting with an average of the two for that Y connected pair. This might be more accurate distance-wise than a straight calibration with both subs.
fitzcaraldo215 is offline  
post #1188 of 4286 Old 02-22-2012, 06:49 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
kbarnes701's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Main Listening Positon
Posts: 17,850
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1383 Post(s)
Liked: 1677
Quote:
Originally Posted by fitzcaraldo215 View Post

Actually, the most important thing about the two subs in each pair is that they be identical, in addition to being equidistant. Most subs have a DSP input network that delays the signal acoustically. That is why their acoustic distance is not equal to their tape measure distance. That distance is usually greater by mike measurement because of the internal delay. Different subs will have a different amount of delay, but nobody publishes the delay factor.

He has 4 identical Mirage BPS 400 subs. I was replying to his specific issue. You are right - in general multiple subs should, IMO, be identical.

Quote:
Originally Posted by fitzcaraldo215 View Post

If they are not identical, the best you can do is calibrate each one of the pair individually to get their true acoustic distance. Then you recalibrate with both and override the distance setting with an average of the two for that Y connected pair. This might be more accurate distance-wise than a straight calibration with both subs.

Agreed. But none of that applies to Terry.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
kbarnes701 is offline  
post #1189 of 4286 Old 02-22-2012, 08:48 AM
AVS Club Gold
 
tigerhonaker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: TN. USA
Posts: 661
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 13
Quote:
Originally Posted by kbarnes701 View Post

Hi Terry,

The most important thing is that the subs in each pair are equidistant from the MLP. This is because they cannot be set for distance/delay as individual subs when they are connected via a Y connector off the AVR. Setting them at equidistant from the MLP gets around that - the distance setting will be the same for both subs in the pair.

Where the subs are placed 'along the line' will depend on where they cause the least worst problem with room modes. There's no hard and fast solution to that and some experimentation may be needed. Hopefully, your dealer will have some measuring equipment which will enable him to see precisely where the peaks and nulls are - I use OmniMic, a lot of people use REW. If you have no means of measuring then it has to be trial and error.

A general 'rule of thumb' I have seen mentioned for 4 subs is that each should be placed in the spot that represents one quarter of the room dimension (see attached diagram to make that clearer). If you want some heavy theory to give your dealer before the install, this paper from Harman will do the trick!

http://www.harman.com/EN-US/OurCompa...s/multsubs.pdf

Quote:
Originally Posted by kbarnes701 View Post

Absolutely. Hopefully his dealer will have some measuring gear.

Keith, ... thanks and I will pass the info. on.
The link does not work just so you know.
(The one to the pdf Harman)

Quote:
Originally Posted by fitzcaraldo215 View Post

Actually, the most important thing about the two subs in each pair is that they be identical, in addition to being equidistant. Most subs have a DSP input network that delays the signal acoustically. That is why their acoustic distance is not equal to their tape measure distance. That distance is usually greater by mike measurement because of the internal delay. Different subs will have a different amount of delay, but nobody publishes the delay factor.

If they are not identical, the best you can do is calibrate each one of the pair individually to get their true acoustic distance. Then you recalibrate with both and override the distance setting with an average of the two for that Y connected pair. This might be more accurate distance-wise than a straight calibration with both subs.

All idential subs.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kbarnes701 View Post

He has 4 identical Mirage BPS 400 subs. I was replying to his specific issue. You are right - in general multiple subs should, IMO, be identical.



Agreed. But none of that applies to Terry.

Correct as the subs are idential.

Terry

My "New" Home Theatre Pics 3/22/2012.

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
tigerhonaker is offline  
post #1190 of 4286 Old 02-22-2012, 08:59 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
kbarnes701's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Main Listening Positon
Posts: 17,850
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1383 Post(s)
Liked: 1677
Quote:
Originally Posted by tigerhonaker View Post

The link does not work just so you know.
(The one to the pdf Harman)


Sorry about the link... try this:

http://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct...635jng&cad=rja


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
kbarnes701 is offline  
post #1191 of 4286 Old 02-22-2012, 09:07 AM
Member
 
CElee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Kleinburg, ON
Posts: 119
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
sold my Marantz Av7005 and just placed an order for the 80.3 with the Rack mount. Excited..
CElee is offline  
post #1192 of 4286 Old 02-22-2012, 09:14 AM
AVS Special Member
 
Theresa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 2,430
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by CElee View Post

sold my Marantz Av7005 and just placed an order for the 80.3 with the Rack mount. Excited..

I have its older cousin, the PR-SC5508, and am most pleased with it. Audyssey XT32 is really nice.
Theresa is offline  
post #1193 of 4286 Old 02-22-2012, 09:30 AM
Member
 
CElee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Kleinburg, ON
Posts: 119
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by Theresa View Post

I have its older cousin, the PR-SC5508, and am most pleased with it. Audyssey XT32 is really nice.

I was also debating the PR-SC5508, as it looks a thousand times better.

But for the price difference, i just went with the 80.3

knowing my luck, in 1 week after i receive it, Onkyo will announce the 5509 will be available immediately lol.

yes XT32 is really what i'm after with the addition of the new sub.
CElee is offline  
post #1194 of 4286 Old 02-22-2012, 09:50 AM
AVS Special Member
 
Theresa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 2,430
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by CElee View Post

I was also debating the PR-SC5508, as it looks a thousand times better.

But for the price difference, i just went with the 80.3

knowing my luck, in 1 week after i receive it, Onkyo will announce the 5509 will be available immediately lol.

yes XT32 is really what i'm after with the addition of the new sub.

It came down to price and looks for me, with the 80.3 costing much more than I got the 5508 for and the looks being better. Since I was coming from the Emotiva UMC-1 I wanted working room EQ (since the UMC-1 has none that works) and XT32 was the version of Audyssey to get. I have not been disappointed regardless of what the Onkyo haters say (and their are many in the Emo camp).
Theresa is offline  
post #1195 of 4286 Old 02-22-2012, 12:09 PM
Member
 
CElee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Kleinburg, ON
Posts: 119
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by Theresa View Post

It came down to price and looks for me, with the 80.3 costing much more than I got the 5508 for and the looks being better. Since I was coming from the Emotiva UMC-1 I wanted working room EQ (since the UMC-1 has none that works) and XT32 was the version of Audyssey to get. I have not been disappointed regardless of what the Onkyo haters say (and their are many in the Emo camp).

I haven't seen you in the Emo site for a while. Bob (LOTR) is no longer there neither. I have a different username on here.

it's good to know that you enjoy the 5508 as it makes me really excited to hear that. Especially since the UMC-1 is "supposed" to be better in music then the Marantz AV7005.
CElee is offline  
post #1196 of 4286 Old 02-22-2012, 03:08 PM
AVS Club Gold
 
bobpaule's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: US
Posts: 1,397
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 12 Post(s)
Liked: 25
I thought i would share my weirdest and most difficult audio problem in the 15 years that i have been part of the hobby.

I upgraded simultaneously to:
DHC-80.3
Second hand King Cobra XLRs
Dual Sherbourn 5/1500A 9 channels used,
Feeding my old Paradigm Reference v.2 top
7.1 system, biamped Studio 100v.2.

Problem: random, totally unpredictable timing R tweeter
buzz, then dropouts, then silence, then back to normal, totally
unpredictable. Could go hours without it at times, other times
it would come on at startup or minutes after start.

Diagnostic path:
1. Switched amp channels, then interconnect, FAIL

2. Swapped tweeters, FAIL, problem did not transfer to L.

3. Opened Paradigm crossover, cleaned up contact, contact paste, FAIL.

CORRECTION: 02-24-12, removed incorrect statement about crossovers and biamping.

3. Swapped speakers, R to L fed by interconnects from the other side, problem transferred!!!

4. OK, so now I am pulling my hair out, a master reset on my tweaked
processor would put me days behind. So I opened it, all connections solid,
closed, went into the "Speaker Setup" menu and swapped several times between
"Bi-Amp" and "Normal" and did notice that the relay click got louder the second
time i switched, then stayed the same.

Now 2 days without any buzz, or dropouts.

Thoughts? Bad relay, jammed relay, wtf happened? All i know is that i had the toughest two weeks and i am now much relieved, but still puzzled.

My system:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
bobpaule is offline  
post #1197 of 4286 Old 02-22-2012, 05:14 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Steve Goff's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 1999
Location: Olympia, WA, USA
Posts: 1,434
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
Liked: 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by bobpaule View Post

I thought i would share my weirdest and most difficult audio problem in the 15 years that i have been part of the hobby.


Feeding my old Paradigm Reference v.2 top



Interesting discovery: the Paradigm crossover is only involved with the midrange and woofer, once the connecting plate at binder posts is removed the signal goes directly to tweeter completely bypassing the crossover. This makes use of external crossover and biamp truly worth it, nixing the claim that unless the internal crossover is disabled biamping is useless and redundant and creates distortion.

This discovery is so unusual that I find it hard to accept. No Paradigm speaker I've looked at connects the tweeter directly to the amplifier without some crossover component in between. At the least a capacitor is placed in series with the driver. Usually Paradigm used quasi-butterworth crossovers in these speakers., which would include some filtering of the signal going to the tweeters. The description I've found suggests that the crossover board for the midrange and tweeter is in the top of the cabinet, and the crossover for the woofer is near the bottom. And measurements show that one set of connectors goes to the woofer and the other goes to the midrange and tweeter. Here is a passage from the Stereophile review:

The crossover is still a simple quasi-Butterworth design, with the same crossover frequencies, but almost everything else about it is different. In particular, the midrange crossover is all new, both high- and low-pass sections being revised to take into account off-axis measurements. Similarly, the tweeter high-pass was changed to blend better with the midrange, both on- and off-axis. The crossover's physical layout has been changed, with the midrange and tweeter filters moved to the top of the cabinet and the woofer filter to the bottom, reducing interference between the circuits. The crossover's inductors and resistors are much larger and are now placed farther apart for optimal cooling, and the quality of components is higher.


Steve Goff
Steve Goff is online now  
post #1198 of 4286 Old 02-22-2012, 05:40 PM
AVS Club Gold
 
bobpaule's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: US
Posts: 1,397
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 12 Post(s)
Liked: 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Goff View Post

This discovery is so unusual that I find it hard to accept. No Paradigm speaker I've looked at connects the tweeter directly to the amplifier without some crossover component in between. At the least a capacitor is placed in series with the driver. Usually Paradigm uses third-order crossovers, though the topology may not include all three elements of a classic third-order filter.

Let me explain then. I unscrew the tweeter at front, blue and black cable, leave it hanging (i wanted to do the cleaning job and apply paste everywhere on the second run), then open the binding post plate, behind which are:

1. Upper (high) terminals connected directly to black and blue wires, i pull on them, the tweeter moves at the front.

2. Lower (low) terminals soldered straight into the PCB holding what appear two capacitors and a transformer, the opposite end of that PCB has 4 terminals. imprint on one side reads "To Woofer", i assume the other pair go to the midrange.

Could there be another PCB hanging loose in the cabinet somewhere between the tweeter and posts? Possible. I don't claim to know it all, and i am just an amateur, but i am certain there are experts on the topic on the forum.

Anyway i sent Ziso Mitchell at Paradigm an email on this issue, he earlier had emailed me that he was confident that with clean amp power and a good processor the Studio 100s would sound better biamped. I 100% agree, coming from a biwired setup with a Marsh A400s earlier (helluvan amp) i see a definite improvement.

My system:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
bobpaule is offline  
post #1199 of 4286 Old 02-22-2012, 06:57 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Steve Goff's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 1999
Location: Olympia, WA, USA
Posts: 1,434
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
Liked: 12
You may have noticed that I significantly revised my post while you replied.

Steve Goff
Steve Goff is online now  
post #1200 of 4286 Old 02-23-2012, 03:41 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
kbarnes701's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Main Listening Positon
Posts: 17,850
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1383 Post(s)
Liked: 1677
Quote:
Originally Posted by bobpaule View Post

Anyway i sent Ziso Mitchell at Paradigm an email on this issue, he earlier had emailed me that he was confident that with clean amp power and a good processor the Studio 100s would sound better biamped. I 100% agree, coming from a biwired setup with a Marsh A400s earlier (helluvan amp) i see a definite improvement.

When you say 'biamped', I am assuming you mean that you have a) disabled the crossover in the speaker itself and b) you are using an external, active crossover between the pre and power amps. Is that assumption of mine correct (just so I can try better to understand the issue)? Thanks.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
kbarnes701 is offline  
Reply Receivers, Amps, and Processors

Tags
Onkyo Integra

User Tag List

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off