Audyssey vs. MCACC vs. Ypao - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 25 Old 09-25-2011, 08:41 PM - Thread Starter
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Which of the two other room correctors, from Pioneer and Yamaha comes closer to Audyssey's room correction capability? Just sold my Onkyo TX-NR905 and going to look at offerings that are HDMI 1.4.

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post #2 of 25 Old 09-25-2011, 08:52 PM
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I've always been a Pioneer fan, but MCACC still doesn't do much for subwoofer frequencies.... which are the ones that need the most help! If I was going to get a Pioneer, I'd add the price of a SVS Audyessy sub EQ unit ($700?) if comparing it to a reciever with Audyessy MultiEQ XT or XT32.

As for YPAO, someone else will have to chime in, although the last time I looked, it was not in the same league as Audyessy.

I wish these companies would just include Audyessy or something that actually can compete with it.
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post #3 of 25 Old 09-25-2011, 08:59 PM
 
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Originally Posted by S_rangeBrew View Post

I've always been a Pioneer fan, but MCACC still doesn't do much for subwoofer frequencies.... which are the ones that need the most help! If I was going to get a Pioneer, I'd add the price of a SVS Audyessy sub EQ unit ($700?) if comparing it to a reciever with Audyessy MultiEQ XT or XT32.

As for YPAO, someone else will have to chime in, although the last time I looked, it was not in the same league as Audyessy.

I wish these companies would just include Audyessy or something that actually can compete with it.

Spending $700.00 dollars on something you might use once or twice is a bad investment.
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post #4 of 25 Old 09-25-2011, 09:30 PM
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If you get a Yamaha receiver with the updated multi point YPAO it will EQ the sub. It EQ'ed mine fine but I like a little more bass so I adjusted it a little after YPAO changed it.

The one good thing about YPAO that I don't think Audyessy and MCACC allow you to do is make EQ adjustments after running it.
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post #5 of 25 Old 09-25-2011, 09:48 PM
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Originally Posted by ObsceneJesster View Post

If you get a Yamaha receiver with the updated multi point YPAO it will EQ the sub. It EQ'ed mine fine but I like a little more bass so I adjusted it a little after YPAO changed it.

The one good thing about YPAO that I don't think Audyessy and MCACC allow you to do is make EQ adjustments after running it.

You can indeed tweak the settings after running either MCACC or Audyssey.

I've been a big Pio fan for a long time. But I'm in the midst of trying units with Audyssey. Anything other than XT or even more preferable, XT 32, I'd give the nod to MCACC.

Can't comment about YPAO as I've never used it.

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post #6 of 25 Old 09-25-2011, 10:52 PM
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Originally Posted by graphicguy View Post

...

I've been a big Pio fan for a long time. But I'm in the midst of trying units with Audyssey. Anything other than XT or even more preferable, XT 32, I'd give the nod to MCACC.

....

Just curious: Are you comparing XT to MCACC Advance (9-band) and do you mean that you like XT better? If so, why?

I have not found a definite comparison and have not experimented with both. Audyssey seems to get the nod from the majority, but it may simply be that Audyssey simply has a larger installed base and thus more users chiming in.

I Just ordered a Marantz SR5006 with Audyssey XT, but am now thinking that the Pioneers may be a better match for me, since they have room correction memory at lower price points. I plan to run both my 7.1 movie set up (using Speakers A), and my music (stereo) set up (using Speakers B).

With the room correction memory setting MCAACC provides, I am assuming I can calibrate my 7.1 TV room (Speakers A) separately from my 2 channel music room (Speakers B), which would be a great advantage for MCACC, if the room correction quality is comparable.

Any thoughts?
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post #7 of 25 Old 09-26-2011, 04:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Auditor55 View Post

Spending $700.00 dollars on something you might use once or twice is a bad investment.

???? It's used everytime you use your system, like any EQ.

Unless you mean it would only last for one or two recievers until something better comes along. Personally, I just got a reciever with Audyessy XT32, which has dual sub EQ built in.
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post #8 of 25 Old 09-26-2011, 04:42 AM
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I've used Audyssey XT with an Onkyo 876 and am now using the newer version of YPAO that comes in the Yamaha A3000. I prefer YPAO a lot more than Audyssey. It eq's the subs, is tweakable as much as you want and just does a better job in my application. Have never used MCACC. I'll take the newer multi-point YPAO any day over Audyssey's version of XT. Also can't comment on Audyssey XT32, it seems to have a very good following.
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post #9 of 25 Old 09-26-2011, 06:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryan1 View Post

Just curious: Are you comparing XT to MCACC Advance (9-band) and do you mean that you like XT better? If so, why?

I have not found a definite comparison and have not experimented with both. Audyssey seems to get the nod from the majority, but it may simply be that Audyssey simply has a larger installed base and thus more users chiming in.

I Just ordered a Marantz SR5006 with Audyssey XT, but am now thinking that the Pioneers may be a better match for me, since they have room correction memory at lower price points. I plan to run both my 7.1 movie set up (using Speakers A), and my music (stereo) set up (using Speakers B).

With the room correction memory setting MCAACC provides, I am assuming I can calibrate my 7.1 TV room (Speakers A) separately from my 2 channel music room (Speakers B), which would be a great advantage for MCACC, if the room correction quality is comparable.

Any thoughts?

Ryan.....I have compared Audyssey to "Advanced" MCACC. I've been swapping out AVRs to try. My reference AVR is a Pioneer Elite SC27, which I've had for over a year.

I tried the AnthemMRX 700 first. Nice AVR. Unfortunately, ARC did not play well with my all MAC house to set up. So, I didn't have it long and wasn't able to do a proper comparison.

Next up was a Marantz SR7005....another nice piece, utilizing Audyssey XT. That was probably the closest to MCACC as I've found as far as room/speaker correction. XT was supposed to EQ my subs, but was way off and set them (I have two) way too hot. So, that feature was of little use to me. MCACC doesn't equalize the subs, so I do it manually (SPL meter + room crawl). Given that, I would probably change my thinking and give the nod to MCACC as I'd much rather have no sub EQ than wrong sub EQ.

Right now, I'm evaluating a Denon 4311 with XT32. It's done a much better job on my subs. So, I'll give XT32 the nod over MCACC.

Long and short of this, when you get into the very upper end of AVRs, their room/speaker correction is all top notch.

The only other room/speaker correction I've ever used was setting up a friend's "EZ set" on an HK AVR he had. That scheme was woeful and got just about everything wrong.

As I said, YPAO is one I've never used. But, given it's Yamaha, I suspect it does a pretty decent job.

One thing I do like about the Yamahas, they have a big LCD screen that's easy to read (vs the small little ones in both the Denon and, even smaller, in the Marantz.

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post #10 of 25 Old 09-26-2011, 06:19 AM
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Does anyone have any measurements of the changes any auto-calibration routine has made?
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post #11 of 25 Old 09-26-2011, 02:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jonnythan View Post

Does anyone have any measurements of the changes any auto-calibration routine has made?

Did one recently as I bought a sub that had auto eq ability and I wanted to see if it was better than the Audyssey MultiEQ XT in my Onkyo pre/pro.

I'm planning on buying an Onkyo with XT32 soon so I'll re-run the chart then.
LL
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post #12 of 25 Old 09-26-2011, 02:39 PM
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Originally Posted by jonnythan View Post

Does anyone have any measurements of the changes any auto-calibration routine has made?

i've done them, but have been too lazy to actually save them...

there are lots of them in the subwoofer subforum though...

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post #13 of 25 Old 09-26-2011, 03:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ccotenj View Post

i've done them, but have been too lazy to actually save them...

there are lots of them in the subwoofer subforum though...


We have many, many plots of the various Room EQ schemes..
Incredible...
The one most often mentioned for accuracy has the wackiest EQ curve, especially for its handling of the low frequencies..
We have talked to a number of the CE publications that do Test Reports this would be an excellent performance comparison, they all expressed resentment maybe it is connected to their advertising revenue..

Just my $0.02..
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post #14 of 25 Old 09-26-2011, 03:33 PM
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^^^

what's intriguing about those wacky curves is that only a few people seem to be able to produce them... i don't get those in my room, with my equipment....

i agree, it would be nice to see some independent testing....

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post #15 of 25 Old 09-26-2011, 05:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by graphicguy View Post

Ryan.....I have compared Audyssey to "Advanced" MCACC. I've been swapping out AVRs to try. My reference AVR is a Pioneer Elite SC27, which I've had for over a year....

Thanks! The SR5006 is arriving in the next day or two, i"ll try it on the weekend, probably.

I am wondering if XT will improve my current sub's room correction, which is not bad at all.

I am less worried about correcting my stereo speakers (Speakers B), since in my limited experience, most room correction is less than stellar on stereo setups. Any thoughts on that?
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post #16 of 25 Old 09-26-2011, 05:58 PM
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I could be wrong, but I thought YPAO only EQs the sub on models A20x0 and A30x0 and not on the lower series even the ones that use multipoint.
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post #17 of 25 Old 09-26-2011, 06:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rnatalli View Post

I could be wrong, but I thought YPAO only EQs the sub on models A20x0 and A30x0 and not on the lower series even the ones that use multipoint.

Don't know where the sub eq's start on the A0010 series from Yamaha, but its on the A2000/A3000 and not the A1000. None of the RXV series from Yamaha do any sub eq'ing.
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post #18 of 25 Old 09-26-2011, 06:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phantom52 View Post

Don't know where the sub eq's start on the A0010 series from Yamaha, but its on the A2000/A3000 and not the A1000. None of the RXV series from Yamaha do any sub eq'ing.

The reason certain AVRs cannot EQ the subwoofer is due to limited DSP resources (MIPs & memory)..
Many AVRs especially price-point ones are simply out of resources when processing DTS Master Audio plus additional processing for EQ, bass manager, DPL2x or DPL2Z...

Just my $0.02..
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post #19 of 25 Old 09-26-2011, 07:47 PM
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I am a Yamaha fan, as any reg can tell you, but I never heard a provable improvement from YPAO.

I just switched back and forth between Flat and Through on YPAO on a Tori Amos song for a bit.

I guess Flat could be a bit clearer sounding. It sounds a bit less congested in spots. So maybe it's doing something helpful. But I would not call that any sort of proof.

Sadly, I have never had a receiver with Audyssey in my apartment to test. Would be interesting, maybe.

I am not sure receiver room correction by itself should be the first line solution. Having measured my room response a few times, and having noted the large variation in response, even above the subwoofer range, I think a clear argument could be made for adding some bass traps.

As a quick experiment, I shoved quilts and blankets into one corner and re-ran my test, and I saw a flattening of the bass response just from that. Hardly proof, but definitely an indication that bass traps could help.

Some people feel bass EQ is not a great option, because of the large nulls due to room modes. 10 dB or more is possible, and making up a 10 dB null takes a LOT of power. This is another argument for bass traps.

Of course there are acoustic issues besides standing waves.

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post #20 of 25 Old 09-27-2011, 06:04 AM
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Michael have you tried this same little experiment with the AVR set to natural? On most things I prefer the "natural" setting as opposed to through or flat. Give a try and see if it makes a difference to you.
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post #21 of 25 Old 09-27-2011, 06:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryan1 View Post

Thanks! The SR5006 is arriving in the next day or two, i"ll try it on the weekend, probably.

I am wondering if XT will improve my current sub's room correction, which is not bad at all.

I am less worried about correcting my stereo speakers (Speakers B), since in my limited experience, most room correction is less than stellar on stereo setups. Any thoughts on that?

Ryan....nice piece. I've always liked Marantz gear. I've had a few of their AVRs and CD players in my rack. Always great sounding....alway rock solid operationally.

Only one way to tell if it improves LFE performance...hook up the mic and run Audyssey.

Generally speaking, Audyssey is one of the big room/speaker correction schemes that a lot of companies use. Others "roll their own" (as in Pioneer with MCACC and Yamaha with YPAO). As mentioned, I've found Audyssey XT to be very similar (sonically) to MCACC.
Let us know how you like it when it's set up.

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post #22 of 25 Old 12-31-2011, 05:28 PM
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how important is Audyssey?

reason i ask is because i never owned a receiver yet, building my first home theatre and i've decided on 3 brands of receivers, but willing to listen to other suggestions

Marantz
Pioneer Elite
and Yamaha.

I was told Denon is good, if someone can confirm that.

receiver i would need, would be for a bedroom and to power a set of Kef T205's.
I was also told get a receiver with as much power, so it helps avoiding damaging speakers.

I would also like Airplay with my receiver, but its not a deal breaker

Pioneer Plasma 151fd
Oppo BDP-93
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post #23 of 25 Old 01-01-2012, 01:52 PM
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If you have an external eq for your sub, then YPAO or MCACC will do well. However, if you don't, I would go with MultEQ or above as it will eq lfe. Bass has loads of issues in a typical room and eq does wonders.
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post #24 of 25 Old 01-01-2012, 03:54 PM
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The best thing about YPAO in my Yamaha RX-A3000 is you can turn it off!
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post #25 of 25 Old 01-10-2012, 08:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DDailey View Post

The best thing about YPAO in my Yamaha RX-A3000 is you can turn it off!

i just purchased the same receiver...do you think better audio quality can be achieved by switching it off? your comment suggests that- if so what do you do to gain the best audio quality from the yamaha

also for some reason when i'm listening to music my sub does not work...but it does for movies i dont get it

i just got a new subwoofer and now i want another one...what in the world is wrong with me?!
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