Denon AVR-3311CI vs. Marantz SR5006/SR6005 vs Onkyo TX-NR709 - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 37 Old 01-06-2012, 10:32 AM - Thread Starter
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I was wondering how these 3 receivers compared. I currently have a TX-NR509 that I am very happy with, but I recently changed my plans and need something with more power, ability to connect an external amp for the fronts, and 7.1 capable. Those are really the only things that matter to me. Features don't, as this will only be used for watching Blu-ray movies and Netflix streaming through my Panny ST30.

I naturally directed myself towards the Onkyo 709 since I was happy with my 509 (for the short time I had it), and because it satisfies all those needs. I had also been searching around this forum and saw the DENON AVR-3311CI suggested in another thread, as well as the Marantz SR5006. My budget puts me in the $500-$600 price range, and I found that Denon refurbished for $620, the Marantz refurbished for $530, and the Onkyo for $550. And then I found the Marantz SR6005 for the same price as the SR5006 online.

Is the Denon refurb worth the extra $100? If not, how do the 2 Marantz and Onkyo compare to each other? And lastly, is there really anything wrong with buying a refurbished receiver?

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post #2 of 37 Old 01-06-2012, 12:16 PM
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As for Denon vs Onkyo, the former has much better quality control, but the latter sometimes has more features (e.g. 4K video, but only in the 809+). That particular series of Onkyo has been somewhat unreliable if user reviews on various sites (e.g. Newegg) are to be believed. I was interested in the 809 at first myself, but I'm not touching it with a 10 foot pole after reading about all of the problems people have had with them. I've never been a fan of Onkyo (they tend to run hot, they've had HDMI board issues in the past, and popping sound issues) but the 4K video support got my interest.

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post #3 of 37 Old 01-06-2012, 12:17 PM
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FYI, The 709 can be found new at several locations for ~$550. Google is your friend.
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post #4 of 37 Old 01-06-2012, 02:10 PM
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Do not buy an Onkyo.
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post #5 of 37 Old 01-06-2012, 02:19 PM
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The 709 would be my choice. You can find it or the 370 which is basically the same for 499. Another option is the Pioneer 1121 which I have seen for 399 at times.
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post #6 of 37 Old 01-06-2012, 02:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DonoMan View Post


As for Denon vs Onkyo, the former has much better quality control, but the latter sometimes has more features (e.g. 4K video, but only in the 809+).

The 709 and 609 have the Qdeo video processor like the 809 and they all three do 4k upscaling. The 809 also has the HQV Vida but the Vida only handles the scaling to 1080p in the 809; the 4k uses the Qdeo.
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post #7 of 37 Old 01-06-2012, 03:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Davecraze View Post

The 709 and 609 have the Qdeo video processor like the 809 and they all three do 4k upscaling. The 809 also has the HQV Vida but the Vida only handles the scaling to 1080p in the 809; the 4k uses the Qdeo.

Noted. I was specifically looking for both, but I thought the features were linked together. I stand corrected.

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post #8 of 37 Old 01-06-2012, 09:37 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by DonoMan View Post

Uhhh... You're in an apartment? You don't need more power than the 509... period. Even if your speakers were 80dB/1W/1m (somewhat bad), that 509 would get them too loud for apartment living.

Not sure where you got your info from, but I do not live in an apartment...

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post #9 of 37 Old 01-06-2012, 09:39 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tedsti View Post

FYI, The 709 can be found new at several locations for ~$550. Google is your friend.

Care to share a link? I have been all over Google and the only prices I saw that low were for refurbished units (Accessories4Less).

Quote:
Originally Posted by slyko View Post

Do not buy an Onkyo.

Why not?

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post #10 of 37 Old 01-06-2012, 09:40 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks to all who have shared their input so far. Seems like I am getting much more negativity towards the 709 than I expected...makes me glad I asked!

Anyone have anything to say about how the DENON AVR-3311CI compares? Is it a good deal priced at $620 shipped?

Is buying a refurbished unit "bad"?

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post #11 of 37 Old 01-06-2012, 09:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KtrainHurricane View Post

Care to share a link? I have been all over Google and the only prices I saw that low were for refurbished units (Accessories4Less).

Try Amazon or Onecall or Newegg.
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post #12 of 37 Old 01-06-2012, 09:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KtrainHurricane View Post

Care to share a link? I have been all over Google and the only prices I saw that low were for refurbished units (Accessories4Less).


Why not?

New Egg is currently $549 for the Onkyo 709.
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post #13 of 37 Old 01-06-2012, 10:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KtrainHurricane View Post

Thanks to all who have shared their input so far. Seems like I am getting much more negativity towards the 709 than I expected...makes me glad I asked!

Anyone have anything to say about how the DENON AVR-3311CI compares? Is it a good deal priced at $620 shipped?

Is buying a refurbished unit "bad"?

Only place I see that 620 price on the 3311 is a refurb at A4L. Why not just get the refurb 709 for $489 or the 809 for $649, then?
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post #14 of 37 Old 01-06-2012, 10:39 PM
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From my own personal experience.

I spent $600 on a TX-SR707 just to have it stop working 2 years later. I am not alone.

Don't take my word for it, just simply read some of the "official" threads.

Further research on this board uncovers numerous owners of other models with a nightmare experience.

Problems I've read include: TX-SR706, TX-NR809, TX-NR807. I've also read numerous accounts of terrible customer service.

I am not a happy camper.
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post #15 of 37 Old 01-06-2012, 11:09 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Davecraze View Post

Only place I see that 620 price on the 3311 is a refurb at A4L. Why not just get the refurb 709 for $489 or the 809 for $649, then?

Because I don't know if the 709 for $489 or the 809 for $649 is a better deal than that refurb Denon...which is why I asked the question. The only receiver I have ever owned is the Onkyo 509 and I only had it for 2-3 weeks.

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post #16 of 37 Old 01-06-2012, 11:11 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slyko View Post

From my own personal experience.

I spent $600 on a TX-SR707 just to have it stop working 2 years later. I am not alone.

Don't take my word for it, just simply read some of the "official" threads.

Further research on this board uncovers numerous owners of other models with a nightmare experience.

Problems I've read include: TX-SR706, TX-NR809, TX-NR807. I've also read numerous accounts of terrible customer service.

I am not a happy camper.

Point taken.

I was happy with the 509 for the short time I had it...and most threads I have read on this forum (and other websites) rave about the Onkyos.

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post #17 of 37 Old 01-07-2012, 10:13 AM - Thread Starter
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*Note: changed the title/OP of this thread around a little bit to be more specific, so any new help + info is greatly appreciated! Looking to pull the trigger by this weekend...

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post #18 of 37 Old 01-07-2012, 06:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KtrainHurricane View Post

Point taken.

I was happy with the 509 for the short time I had it...and most threads I have read on this forum (and other websites) rave about the Onkyos.

If you liked the 509, it sounds to me like you should just get the 809. It is 7 channels, has preouts and excellent video processing. There is going to be no appreciable real world difference in power between the 709, 809 and 3311. You already know you like the onkyo sound and the 809 meets your stated requirements.

The 809 and the 3311 are aimed at the same market and have comparable feature sets and specs. It is like choosing between Coke and Pepsi.
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post #19 of 37 Old 01-07-2012, 07:10 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Davecraze View Post

If you liked the 509, it sounds to me like you should just get the 809. It is 7 channels, has preouts and excellent good video processing. There is going to be no appreciable real world difference in power between the 709, 809 and 3311. You already know you like the onkyo sound and the 809 meets your stated requirements.

The 809 and the 3311 are aimed at the same market and have comparable feature sets and specs. It is like choosing between Coke and Pepsi.

If there isn't a huge difference between the 709 and 809 then why wouldn't I save the money and just buy the former? I have also read about the 809 having problems, but have not seen any with the 709 yet.

And if you are saying that the 3311 is more similar to the 809 than the 709, are you saying it is better than the 709? If so, would that be my best choice?


...Anybody have any input on either of the Marantz models?

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post #20 of 37 Old 01-07-2012, 07:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KtrainHurricane View Post

If there isn't a huge difference between the 709 and 809 then why wouldn't I save the money and just buy the former? I have also read about the 809 having problems, but have not seen any with the 709 yet.

And if you are saying that the 3311 is more similar to the 809 than the 709, are you saying it is better than the 709? If so, would that be my best choice?


...Anybody have any input on either of the Marantz models?

Yes, I am saying the 3311 ($1199 MSRP) is more similar to, and is a more direct competitor to, the 809 ($1099 MSRP), not the 709 ($899 MSRP).

Look, the 709 is a fantastic value and has a ton of features (including audyssey XT, networking, 4k scaler, preouts etc) for a very reasonable price. I would get the 809 myself just because of the Vida video processor as I still watch a lot of non-HD content with my toddlers and it is worth 100 extra dollars to me.

If the 100 dollar price delta between the 709 and 809 is enough to steer you toward the 709, it would be a still be a great choice and meets all your criteria. You would not be missing anything.

Onkyo sells hundreds of thousands of these mid level receivers so there will always be some problems with a small percentage of units, just like every other manufacturer. Here are even some negative reviews of the 709 for you on newegg, since you said you have not seen any - http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16882120179
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post #21 of 37 Old 01-08-2012, 01:16 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Davecraze View Post

Yes, I am saying the 3311 ($1199 MSRP) is more similar to, and is a more direct competitor to, the 809 ($1099 MSRP), not the 709 ($899 MSRP).

Look, the 709 is a fantastic value and has a ton of features (including audyssey XT, networking, 4k scaler, preouts etc) for a very reasonable price. I would get the 809 myself just because of the Vida video processor as I still watch a lot of non-HD content with my toddlers and it is worth 100 extra dollars to me.

If the 100 dollar price delta between the 709 and 809 is enough to steer you toward the 709, it would be a still be a great choice and meets all your criteria. You would not be missing anything.

Onkyo sells hundreds of thousands of these mid level receivers so there will always be some problems with a small percentage of units, just like every other manufacturer. Here are even some negative reviews of the 709 for you on newegg, since you said you have not seen any - http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16882120179

Thanks again for the reply...but I am still not certain what I should do in this situation.

As far as I know - the Vida processor that you mentioned is for making SD content look better (??). If so, that does not really effect me since I am using this 95% Blu-ray movies.

^For this application, does the extra $100 for the 809 or the Denon 3311 get me anything over the 709, other than a few advertised watts per channel?

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post #22 of 37 Old 01-08-2012, 09:39 AM - Thread Starter
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And is there any input on how the Marantz fits into this comparison?

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post #23 of 37 Old 01-08-2012, 10:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KtrainHurricane View Post

Thanks again for the reply...but I am still not certain what I should do in this situation.

As far as I know - the Vida processor that you mentioned is for making SD content look better (??). If so, that does not really effect me since I am using this 95% Blu-ray movies.

^For this application, does the extra $100 for the 809 or the Denon 3311 get me anything over the 709, other than a few advertised watts per channel?


Audioholics says the Vida cleans up HD streams also. Is it worth an extra 100 dollars? It is to me but, everyone's priorities are different.

http://www.audioholics.com/education...ida-processing
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post #24 of 37 Old 01-08-2012, 10:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Davecraze View Post

Onkyo sells hundreds of thousands of these mid level receivers so there will always be some problems with a small percentage of units, just like every other manufacturer. Here are even some negative reviews of the 709 for you on newegg, since you said you have not seen any - http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16882120179

Is it because Onkyo sells so many more units than the competitors is why they seem to have more problems or do they in fact have a higher failure rate? It would seem logical. Let's say if they sell 3 times as many units as competitor x and the failure rate is the same across the board then...

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post #25 of 37 Old 01-08-2012, 12:57 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Davecraze View Post

Audioholics says the Vida cleans up HD streams also. Is it worth an extra 100 dollars? It is to me but, everyone's priorities are different.

"HD streams" meaning things like Netflix, NOT Blu-ray discs, right?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jtenn View Post

Is it because Onkyo sells so many more units than the competitors is why they seem to have more problems or do they in fact have a higher failure rate? It would seem logical. Let's say if they sell 3 times as many units as competitor x and the failure rate is the same across the board then...

Interesting.
____________

And anything on the Marantz?


Thanks again to all who are helping me choose!

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post #26 of 37 Old 01-08-2012, 01:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KtrainHurricane View Post

"HD streams" meaning things like Netflix, NOT Blu-ray discs, right?



Interesting.
____________

And anything on the Marantz?


Thanks again to all who are helping me choose!

No, I don't mean only a streaming 1080p signal. I mean that it processes any and all 1080p signals, according to the Vida literature. Should be doing something to a blu-ray video, but probably not nearly as much as it does to low bit rate streamed "HD" content.
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post #27 of 37 Old 01-08-2012, 02:10 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Davecraze View Post

No, I don't mean only a streaming 1080p signal. I mean that it processes any and all 1080p signals, according to the Vida literature. Should be doing something to a blu-ray video, but probably not nearly as much as it does to low bit rate streamed "HD" content.

Ok, thanks for clearing that up!


This decision is getting harder and harder to make...

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post #28 of 37 Old 01-11-2012, 01:43 PM
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I'm in this with you. I have a 709 which I've only tested for one weekend and it seems great. However, it has features I don't need (phono input) that my daughter does, so I'm thinking of giving it to her. Since I bought it, a friend convinced me that Marantz was worth looking at. So in replacing the 709, I'm also looking at the Marantz 5006, which has all the features I need. There are not a lot of Marantz reviews out there, so I was hoping that the knowledgeable folks on this forum would chime in with what they know or feel about Marantz vs. Onkyo. Not seeing much except that the Onkyo has had problems...But this one seems fine, and many people seem to be huge fans of the NR709..so, to me its an issue of whether the Marantz is a quality improvement over Onkyo, and I can't seem to find input on that.

I know that Marantz and Denon are now owned by the same company, but are their design and production different still? Is Marantz still the same high quality it used to be?
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post #29 of 37 Old 01-11-2012, 03:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hippiedave View Post

I'm in this with you. I have a 709 which I've only tested for one weekend and it seems great. However, it has features I don't need (phono input) that my daughter does, so I'm thinking of giving it to her. Since I bought it, a friend convinced me that Marantz was worth looking at. So in replacing the 709, I'm also looking at the Marantz 5006, which has all the features I need. There are not a lot of Marantz reviews out there, so I was hoping that the knowledgeable folks on this forum would chime in with what they know or feel about Marantz vs. Onkyo. Not seeing much except that the Onkyo has had problems...But this one seems fine, and many people seem to be huge fans of the NR709..so, to me its an issue of whether the Marantz is a quality improvement over Onkyo, and I can't seem to find input on that.

I know that Marantz and Denon are now owned by the same company, but are their design and production different still? Is Marantz still the same high quality it used to be?

Mini-review of the 5006 below.

http://www.audioholics.com/reviews/r...z-sr5006-video
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post #30 of 37 Old 01-12-2012, 11:57 PM
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I purchased the Onkyo 807 from A4L 2 years ago and it is still going strong. I'm in the market for a new reciever myself. After researching the same one's you have, I think I'm going with the 809 new for just under $700 dollars from Amazon, only $50 more than the refurb from A4L. I would not hesitate buying another reciever from A4L.

I think the upscaling, Audyssey XT and bang for the buck are pretty much the reasons for choosing the 809.

I agree with a previous poster in the reason you see complaints about the Onkyo is there are alot more owners than the others.
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