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-   -   Pioneer VSX-1021-K No Subwoofer in Stereo (http://www.avsforum.com/forum/90-receivers-amps-processors/1385720-pioneer-vsx-1021-k-no-subwoofer-stereo.html)

dholcomb32 01-07-2012 10:26 PM

I just recently purchased a Pioneer VSX-1021-K as an upgrade to a Yamaha HTR-3063. I am running it 2.1 with a pair of Polk Monitor70 Series II's and a Polk PSW505. Under the speaker setup menu I set the fronts to large and the sub to yes and then ran the MCACC. When I am watching the cable box or playing a game on one of my consoles everything works great, but when I play a CD through my PS3 or try to listen to music from my Squeezebox or stream something On Demand from the cable box the LFE channel on the receiver disappears and nothing is sent to the sub. Pioneer's Knowledgebase said that standard stereo streams do not send the .1 channel and that the work around for this was to use one of the advanced surround options on the receiver to artificially create the channel. I have tried all of the different choices and none of them have worked. On my Yamaha, I ran into this same issue and I was able to use the 5ch Stereo option as a work around. I have done some research and saw that the Pioneer's EXT. STEREO option was the closest setting to this, but still no luck. Does anyone have any suggestions as to how I can get the sub to work no matter what the source?

afrogt 01-08-2012 12:03 AM

It is because you set the fronts to Large. Set them to Small and the subwoofer will work then.

Your cable shows and PS3 games actually have a .1 channel for the sub. Stereo CD's don't which is why your sub isn't working. IF you set you fronts to Small then all bass below a certain frequency will be rerouted to the subwoofer and you'll be happy.

dholcomb32 01-08-2012 05:05 PM

I changed the setting to small and still no sub. Any other suggestions?

ccotenj 01-08-2012 05:17 PM

^^^

what is your crossover set at?

dholcomb32 01-08-2012 05:31 PM

Currently 50hz. I had it at 60hz on the Yamaha and loved it, but the Pioneer goes from 80hz to 50hz and I figured with speakers that go to 40hz (-3db) the 50hz setting would allow me to get the most out of the speakers while still having the low end of sub.

ccotenj 01-08-2012 06:37 PM

^^^

set it to 80...

dholcomb32 01-09-2012 09:12 AM

So I've tried every combination of Front Small/Large, Subwoofer Yes/Plus, Xover 80/50, and listening mode there is to no avail. Any other ideas?

dholcomb32 01-09-2012 07:25 PM

Bump

jdsmoothie 01-09-2012 07:29 PM

As Chris notes ... the correct configuration is fronts to SMALL with 80hz crossover. If you're not getting much bass then there likely isn't much in the audio you're listening too.

dholcomb32 01-09-2012 09:42 PM

It's not that I am not getting much bass, it's that the receiver is not even using the sub channel at all. The on screen display on the front of the receiver only shows to be using the front stereo speakers while I play a cd, but during regular television watching or video game play, the LFE icon is illuminated and signal is sent to the subwoofer. I just want to be able to listen to my CDs or squeezebox with the accompaniment of the sub.

Tulpa 01-09-2012 10:06 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by dholcomb32 View Post

The on screen display on the front of the receiver only shows to be using the front stereo speakers while I play a cd, but during regular television watching or video game play, the LFE icon is illuminated and signal is sent to the subwoofer.

The LFE icon will only trip on if there is an LFE signal, which stereo sources do not have. CDs don't have LFE, but you can still route bass to the sub. You just won't see the indicator come on.

If your settings are correct up there (small speakers, 80hz crossover), then it must be the source. Play something bass heavy and report back.

suguru23 01-10-2012 06:40 PM

Hey all, I've found a lot of great help here and just signed up. I want to first thank everyone for contributing. I'd be lost without all of you!

I have a VSX-1121-K (one model AVR higher) but am also having the same issue. I can't figure out how to add my subwoofer (PSW505) to my stereo channel. My situation is a little different in that i'm trying to do it via analog signal as the source is my turntable (pre-amp built in) [Denon DP-300f] connected to the CD inputs as instructed by the Pioneer manual.

My end goal is to be able to listen to 5.1 with my subwoofer connected via LFE and also have my subwoofer added to my stereo (analog) listening with my turntable.

Now my subwoofer has "High Level Inputs" as well as LFE but the Polk manual says "Important Note: Use only one of these options. Never combine hookup options."

Any help would be greatly appreciated. I'm assuming if one situation is resolved, both will be given the similarity in AVR's.

@TULPA "...you can still route bass to the sub." How do you do this?

Cheers!

ccotenj 01-10-2012 06:54 PM

^^^

set your speakers to small...
set your crossover to (at least) 80hz...

do not use pure direct...

that should get you what you want...

suguru23 01-11-2012 07:24 PM

Ok, so this is what I discovered today, and apparently Chris already knew.

I actually called Pioneer I was so frustrated by this. All they told me was that I had to have the front speakers set to "LARGE" and then I could set my subwoofer to "PLUS".

QUOTE: "The only way you will be able to get sub with stereo is if you have these settings with the sub set to PLUS"

When in fact that's not even the case. I played around and ended up setting my fronts back to SMALL and my sub back to YES (their original setting).

Pioneer didn't even tell me about not using "PURE DIRECT" under AUTO/ALC/DIRECT. And THAT is the true culprit!

So I just stood there with my fingers on my sub switching all the settings till I felt it responding. As I understand it "PURE DIRECT" is just that. It is true analog (via receiver). And man does it sound sweet. But it doesn't allow for ANY modifications. Where "DIRECT" adds "calibration of the sound field by the MCACC system and the Phase Control effect".

So, in the end, I now have sub with my stereo. Unfortunately it's not quite a true analog signal, very very close, but "PURE DIRECT" sans base still sounds better to me. It's a small trade off for having a little more floor to the music.

Thanks all. Hope this works for you dholcomb32

kcbigg 01-29-2012 08:53 AM

I am having a problem connecting with AirPlay. I have a wired Ethernet connection and both my PC and my IPad have no problems seeing the VSX but when I try to play music, it won't produce sound. The music is advancing on the ipad(or iTunes) but the interface on the vsx just shows "now Playing" with 0:00 and nothing happens? Has anyone encountered this problem? Any suggestions would be much appreciated.

maddog-99 02-09-2012 11:26 PM

Help.

I'm not clear what or if there is a solution here.
I have the exact same problem: no sub on stereo yet it will spoof the 5 surround speakers just no sub. Very frustrating. Please help.

ccotenj 02-10-2012 05:00 AM

^^^

see post #13...

klipschrocker 11-17-2012 10:45 PM

I just recently purchased a Pioneer VSX-1021-K as an upgrade to a Yamaha HTR-3063. I am running it 2.1 with a pair of Polk Monitor70 Series II's and a Polk PSW505. Under the speaker setup menu I set the fronts to large and the sub to yes and then ran the MCACC. When I am watching the cable box or playing a game on one of my consoles everything works great, but when I play a CD through my PS3 or try to listen to music from my Squeezebox or stream something On Demand from the cable box the LFE channel on the receiver disappears and nothing is sent to the sub. Pioneer's Knowledge base said that standard stereo streams do not send the .1 channel and that the work around for this was to use one of the advanced surround options on the receiver to artificially create the channel. I have tried all of the different choices and none of them have worked. On my Yamaha, I ran into this same issue and I was able to use the 5ch Stereo option as a work around. I have done some research and saw that the Pioneer's EXT. STEREO option was the closest setting to this, but still no luck. Does anyone have any suggestions as to how I can get the sub to work no matter what the source?

dholcomb32,

I have owned my vsx1021 k for for about 10 months now. I can say I have spent some great deal of time getting the receiver to do what it is meant to do. I have spent nearly 90 hrs to perfect this machine. I will go through my speaker setup and options for you to gain more power for running at optimal performance. This is something I feel that everyone should know and feel at peace that someone knows how this receiver works. I have 2 front klipsch v35 tower/icon series; set at front terminals. My surround backs are kb-15 at the surround back terminal/ not zone two. This will be for my bi amped front speakers soon. I also have a regular car amp, 12 in sub powered by a PSU. I have rigged the PSU to run the car amp and sub to the receiver connected to the sub-woofer pre out. I will replace the rigged sub for a better inline klipsch sw. I have professionally installed everything myself. I use banana plugs vs bare wire. I have the back speakers on bookshelf mounts with the speaker wires behind the wall. I used wall mount plates to connect each back speaker with again banana plug wires. I have my speakers on EXT. Stereo. I am going to run my setup status and options for you to see the comparisons.

Get the remote and look for the ch level button, by pushing this you can see your db level for each speaker you have hooked up. I have mine set at +12 on all speakers even my sub.
Push the receiver button and the audio button and next push enter; you can go through each setup.
I have the following setup:
1. SACD +6
2. HDMI (AMP)
3. A. delay (on)
4. Effect = 90
5. V. height (on)
6. EQ ( ON )
7. S-wave ( On)
8. Phase C+ 0ms
9. Delay 0.0
10. S.RTRV (ON)
11. Dialog (FLAT)
12. Dual (ch1) (ch2)
13. Fixed (OFF) this I have not heard any difference
14. DRC (AUTO)
15. LFE ( 0 db or off) up to you, I have not found this any better or worse.

Go to the home menu:

Go to System setup, then HDMI setup: turn off the control. You will be able to assign your hdmi inputs.
Current firmware update: 1-151-081-111-031
Go to System setup, then Network setup: DCHP (ON) Enable Proxy Server (OFF)

Home Menu:
System setup, then Manual sp set up then Speaker system,

I have the following set up for the speakers:
Normal (SB/FW) this will vary for your speakers 5.1 or 7.1 set up.
Home Menu:
System setup, then Manual SP set up, speaker setting:
Keep your sub on either large or YES
Put your front speakers to small. This is misleading to some who might think in the wrong direction. Large is for front speaker that cam handle very low bass otherwise below 60 hz. When this is set to small this has a technology to bring the low freq to the sub. This allows for the receiver to bypass the low freq level to the sub-woofer. For any other choices you make is fine, but make sure have the x-over on 80. This helps bring the bass to the subwoofer. The x curve is up to your liking.
Next I am going to go through the freq level for the mains and the sub.
Go to the home menu, and then click on Advanced MCACC:
Do not go through the the full auto MCACC or the auto MCACC, click on Manual MCACC:
The fine ch. level was established at the beginning by putting all ref ch. levels on +12
Next the fine sP distance can be set up to your liking.





Ok, here is where it gets down to the important part of the freq levels.
Click on Standing Wave:
For all filters keep them the same set up for the mains:
Freq= 120hz or higher
Q= 8.0
ATT=0.0
After you’re done with the main click down to sub,
For all filters keep them the same set up for the sw (Subwoofer):
Freq= 63, can’t go any lower: I wish though.
Q= 8.0
ATT=0.0
Trim=+12 db
All this will have a M1. MEMORY 1
Hit return and click EQ adjust: You will want to quickly after 0 turn the volume down.
Ch. L, R, SR, SL, SBR, SBL, or any other ch. you have hooked up = all positive, use same numbers for all ch. levels
125 hz = 9
250 hz = 5.5
500 hz = 5.5
1k = 6
2k = 5.5
4k = 5.5
8k = 9
16k = 4
TRIM = +12
You can do an EQ professional if you choose but I have not. That is it, I do hope some of these adjustments help your problem with the sub and maybe have better sound too! Keep those speakers clear of any distortions, the freq’s I have given you will help. The main thing to remember is for a sub, it can get low bass between 60-80 hz, that is prime levels anything above 80 is for high freq’s

klipschrocker 11-17-2012 10:54 PM

suguru23,

See post # 18 this will get some clarification what to do,


Wish you luck!!

Klipschrocker

ccotenj 11-18-2012 05:20 AM

@klipsch...

while there are one or two things in your post that are correct (set speakers to small), the majority of it is, ummm, questionable advice... at best...

if people want to learn how to effectively set up their pioneer avr, they should start with the mcacc thread...

klipschrocker 11-21-2012 12:34 PM

@Chris....


According to your past experiences, what setup have you used? It would be nice to know your opinion about my setup, speakers, etc.. vsx-1021-k at best. Rather then just telling me I have few things right; how about expanding your thoughts little bit more to explain and back up your argument. The MCACC is a great tool, however allowing the full/auto MCACC to control your expectations for a speaker system to sound good is minimal. The software was written to calculate some aspect of acoustics, sensitivity, db, freg's but limits the full potential to maximize what the speakers are actually able to handle. For example my volume (db) to hear normal is around -72, to rock out the place, going to -35 db is overpowering. When I first set up the AVR I was not impressed at all. I had done almost every best way to make it sound great. Like I said, I have spent many hours reconfiguring to the way it sounds now. By all means, I am open to any suggestions you might have. It is always better to hear others experiences, setup, speakers setup and how they feel what works for them. It would be nice to get your feedback.

Thanks,
Klipschrocker

ccotenj 11-21-2012 03:22 PM

^^^

all of what you seek is in the mcacc thread, and you could also glean some useful indirect knowledge by reading the audyssey setup guides...


the incorrect advice in your post is extensive (your "important part" is very wrong, and even if it was by some miracle correct for your room and speakers, it would have NO relevance to anyone else... NONE...)... and (trying to be being gentle) it's rather obvious that you don't understand what many of the controls do, or some real basic room acoustics...

if you'd like to learn, realize that i can't explain everything you are incorrect about (and as importantly, why you are incorrect and what to really do) in a few paragraphs... read the documents and information that is available to you, and once you understand a few basic things, then i (and others) can help tie things together for you...

klipschrocker 12-22-2012 09:05 AM

your an idiot..

lonwolf615 12-22-2012 11:38 AM

no, he isn't.

Justind123 02-06-2013 11:18 AM

Thanks

andreakobe44 08-05-2013 05:54 PM

I know this thread is old but I'm having this similar problem. I set all speakers to small and it still doesn't detect the subwoofer. I set the sub to yes but when it goes through volume control there is nothing and when I do mcacc it changes the sub to no. I had this sub working about 10 days ago and I moved and now it won't work. I've got the one subwoofer cable connected. I'm not sure what I'm doing wrong.

mrwhatever 01-06-2014 06:08 AM

I am having the same problem. No matter what setting I put my receiver at the woofer DOES NOT WORK!!!! I was told by a tech that if you have a hi end receiver and everything else works except the woofer? than your system is blown and needs to be replaced.


-JJJ- 03-28-2014 04:22 PM

This is what is happening to me as well.  I have the crossover set to 80, speakers set to small and I have no sub woofer output at all.  I've had my system up and running for about two years now, and the other day I turned on the basketball game and no bass.  I changed no settings and now no bass.  Does this mean my pre-out is "fried"?  Any help/input is greatly appreciated.


duc135 03-28-2014 05:00 PM

Could be so many things. You don't give enough information other than to say it stopped working. What receiver do you have? What have you ruled out if anything? Have you verified your sub still works? Have you measured the pre-out for any type of voltage? Did you accidentally hit the Pure Direct button? Have you tried watching or listening to content that has a true 5.1 signal like a Blu-ray movie?

FMW 03-28-2014 05:11 PM

Go into manual speaker setup in MCACC. If your speakers are set to small then make the subwoofer the "yes" option and adjust the crossover appropriately. If they are set to large then make the subwoofer the "Plus" option. That's all there is to it.


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