Onkyo vs pioneer - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 80 Old 02-02-2012, 07:35 AM - Thread Starter
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I am looking to build a mid range theater room and have been back and forth between the onkyo NR609 and the vsx1121k and 1021k can anyone please help with quality features between the two companies. I am getting overwhelmed by all the specs.
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post #2 of 80 Old 02-02-2012, 07:44 AM
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Onkyo has high current amps which will sound great with large full range speakers. The pioneer has alot more tweaks with the mcacc. Its hard to say which one is better for you. I would think the onkyo is easy to live with, the pioneer will cause you to tweak yourself to death, if your a geek...
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post #3 of 80 Old 02-02-2012, 07:55 AM
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I'm also looking at these 2 receivers

-TX-NR690 and the VSX-1021-K

between these 2, I see both are high current receivers the onkyo is THX certified but doesn't have airplay. The pioneer has airplay but isn't THX certified (not sure if they just didn't try for the test or if it failed the test)

but I am also interested in what other people think
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post #4 of 80 Old 02-02-2012, 07:55 AM - Thread Starter
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I can see me going down that rabbit whole. My main concern really is quality because i have heard that onkyo has had some issues with. I had a 609 that broke after 30 days and i returned it and was not sure if i just got a bad apple or if it was the company that i should worry about.
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post #5 of 80 Old 02-02-2012, 08:31 AM
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any idea if any of these use MultiEQ-XT?
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post #6 of 80 Old 02-02-2012, 08:36 AM - Thread Starter
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i dont think so the 709 does but not the 609
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post #7 of 80 Old 02-02-2012, 09:04 AM
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Whats air ""airplay"" ? And how would that make an AVR better sounding ?
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post #8 of 80 Old 02-02-2012, 09:08 AM
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Allows you to stream content from your Apple devices directly to the receiver.

Literally plug (LAN) and play. Within seconds my devices can send audio to the receiver. If you are an Apple fan, it's a game changer in my opinion!
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post #9 of 80 Old 02-02-2012, 09:21 AM
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If your ok with over compressed earbud music than any AVR would sound good.
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post #10 of 80 Old 02-02-2012, 09:33 AM
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Airplay is awesome. iPad or iPhone anywere in the house and you can dial up Pandora, Rhapsody or iTunes and listen without having to plug in. It's like Bluetooth but easier. I imagine since Apple is doing it, we'll see more use for video and other programs.

I have a SC57 and have definitely "tweeked" myself to death. The MCACC software sucks and creates a bright presention. Then you have Onkyo's sketchy reliability.

Have you looked into the lower Denon line? They have Airplay, good software and reliability.
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post #11 of 80 Old 02-02-2012, 09:39 AM
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How does Pandora sound compared to apple music ? Better, worse ?
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post #12 of 80 Old 02-02-2012, 09:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joehonest View Post

If your ok with over compressed earbud music than any AVR would sound good.

I do agree with you when it comes to Pandora or XM/Sirius. Rhapsody is CD quality and really, really good. The quantity of albums is unbelievable. I'm listening to stuff I've never heard before.

I can't wait for the release of high quality masters though. This is the next thing. Problem is the majority of listeners use "buds" and not high quality, multichannel systems.
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post #13 of 80 Old 02-02-2012, 09:40 AM
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I would move up to the 709 for XT which will EQ the sub; 2EQ and MCACC do not. Another great option is the Denon 2112 hich aso has XT and Airplay.
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post #14 of 80 Old 02-02-2012, 09:46 AM
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Rhapsody sounds better than Pandora ? Is Rhapsody a free service ? Like Pandora ? I've listened to Pandora and the SQ is very good..
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post #15 of 80 Old 02-02-2012, 09:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rnatalli View Post

I would move up to the 709 for XT which will EQ the sub; 2EQ and MCACC do not. Another great option is the Denon 2112 hich aso has XT and Airplay.

2EQ, multeq, XT and 32,, heard them all, there not the cure all, theres no good reason to buy an AVR just for that alone... Better speakers, subs and amps will have much better pay off..
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post #16 of 80 Old 02-02-2012, 09:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joehonest View Post

How does Pandora sound compared to apple music ? Better, worse ?

I got really tired of Pandora. I could have bought the non ad version but the platform isn't very good. It's radio station's and you end up having to listen to a bunch of crap you don't like and you can only skip so many times. You can't bring up albums.

I had Napster, the Best Buy version, for a while. You could dial up Billboard charts back to the 50's. You could do it for genres, bands, albums, singers or whatever you wanted to use as a search item.

Rhapsody bought Napster. I don't have the Billboard charts but the search items are still there. You can listen to whole albums. you can also save albums or songs to a playlist for future listening like on a plane or party.
There's radio stations too if you want to listen to certain genre's. I can't recommend this enough if you like to listen to music and with Airplay it's just that much more fun.

Oh, and it's only like $90/year.
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post #17 of 80 Old 02-02-2012, 09:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joehonest View Post


2EQ, multeq, XT and 32,, heard them all, there not the cure all, theres no good reason to buy an AVR just for that alone... Better speakers, subs and amps with have much better pay off..

I disagree. EQ for LFE makes an enormous difference in some rooms. Of course, better speakers in particular make a large difference as well, but even a great subwoofer will sound awful in many rooms without treatments. Moving up to XT is negligible in cost and can yield real results.
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post #18 of 80 Old 02-02-2012, 10:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rnatalli View Post

I disagree. EQ for LFE makes an enormous difference in some rooms. Of course, better speakers in particular make a large difference as well, but even a great subwoofer will sound awful in many rooms without treatments. Moving up to XT is negligible in cost and can yield real results.

Audyssey not going to make a $99 sub sound like a $500 sub, and that goes for the mains and center too.. So if the room is the acoustic equal to a stone cave or worse.. Audyssey may help and thats is a big maybe..
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post #19 of 80 Old 02-02-2012, 11:02 AM - Thread Starter
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thanks everyone for the help. I just pulled the trigger and bought the Onkyo 609. I decided that because I have no apple products for airplay and like the 2 year warranty. compared to pioneers 1 year warranty. and it sounds like a easier setup. I hope it doesnt break!
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post #20 of 80 Old 02-02-2012, 11:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joehonest View Post

Audyssey not going to make a $99 sub sound like a $500 sub, and that goes for the mains and center too.. So if the room is the acoustic equal to a stone cave or worse.. Audyssey may help and thats is a big maybe..

I never said Audyssey would make a $99 sub sound like a $500 sub. You can't make a silk purse out of a sow's ear. However, a bad room can make a $500 sub sound like a $99 one. Having been in dozens of rooms, I can safely say that Audyssey on the LFE channel improves performance about 8 out of 10 times. That is better than just maybe.
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post #21 of 80 Old 02-02-2012, 12:18 PM
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For me I have a few apple products so I still can't decide

I have an apple tv and I believe airplay works with that, so maybe I don't need the receiver to be able to play it.

I'm still having a hard time deciding, if anyone is familiar with the following 3 can you let me know maybe the pros/cons of each.

Denon 2112ci/Onkyo TX-NR609/VSX-1021k
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post #22 of 80 Old 02-02-2012, 02:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joehonest View Post

Audyssey not going to make a $99 sub sound like a $500 sub, and that goes for the mains and center too.. So if the room is the acoustic equal to a stone cave or worse.. Audyssey may help and thats is a big maybe..

Quote:
Originally Posted by rnatalli View Post

I never said Audyssey would make a $99 sub sound like a $500 sub. You can't make a silk purse out of a sow's ear. However, a bad room can make a $500 sub sound like a $99 one. Having been in dozens of rooms, I can safely say that Audyssey on the LFE channel improves performance about 8 out of 10 times. That is better than just maybe.

I would not argue with rnatalli on this one as he/she is correct. As a matter of fact, I think it should be 1 of your top 3 reason to buy a certain receiver. We're talking EQ here, not output or extension. Don't forget that LFE frequencies are in mono, EQing becomes quite important in my opinion. Just a thought...

cheers
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post #23 of 80 Old 02-02-2012, 02:35 PM
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Originally Posted by jproy13 View Post

I would not argue with rnatalli on this one as he/she is correct. As a matter of fact, I think it should be 1 of your top 3 reason to buy a certain receiver. We're talking EQ here, not output or extension. Don't forget that LFE frequencies are in mono, EQing becomes quite important in my opinion. Just a thought...

cheers

So with all being said here the denon 2112ci would be my best bet? since spec wise all 3 are very similar but the denon has the XT?
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post #24 of 80 Old 02-02-2012, 02:40 PM
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Originally Posted by Inf123 View Post

For me I have a few apple products so I still can't decide

I have an apple tv and I believe airplay works with that, so maybe I don't need the receiver to be able to play it.

I have the 2nd gen Apple TV, and I can say that airplay works very nicely with it. Not sure about 1st gen, but my impression is that it won't do HD video, but the audio should be indistinguishable.

Don't buy a receiver based on airplay if you have an Apple TV
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post #25 of 80 Old 02-02-2012, 02:41 PM
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So with all being said here the denon 2112ci would be my best bet? since spec wise all 3 are very similar but the denon has the XT?

I would. I had 2 Pioneers previously and as solid as they were, for me, Audyssey is the difference maker. Let's not forget that that is all Audyssey does, room correction and the 40000 + posts on the Audyssey thread speaks volume.
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post #26 of 80 Old 02-02-2012, 02:44 PM
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I should mention my appletv is a 2nd gen as well. At the end of the day I guess airplay isn't that big of a deal for me then...really it comes down to id like to be future proofed so a networking receiver is what I'm looking for and since this is my first home theatre purchase I just want to make sure I get the best receiver I can (btw the 5.1 speakers I'm setting up to this receiver is the KEF KHT3005SE)
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post #27 of 80 Old 02-02-2012, 03:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Inf123 View Post

I should mention my appletv is a 2nd gen as well. At the end of the day I guess airplay isn't that big of a deal for me then...really it comes down to id like to be future proofed so a networking receiver is what I'm looking for and since this is my first home theatre purchase I just want to make sure I get the best receiver I can (btw the 5.1 speakers I'm setting up to this receiver is the KEF KHT3005SE)

Trust me mate, I know how you feel. My first receiver purchase, I overanalyzed it to death. As much as you think you will keep your first receiver for a long time, from experience, it doesn't happen.

It can be a very expensive hobby. You will notice with time that the features you thought you wanted, you realize you use 'em very sporadically. So go ahead, purchase it and have fun
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post #28 of 80 Old 02-02-2012, 05:37 PM
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Originally Posted by jproy13 View Post

I would. I had 2 Pioneers previously and as solid as they were, for me, Audyssey is the difference maker. Let's not forget that that is all Audyssey does, room correction and the 40000 + posts on the Audyssey thread speaks volume.

A true testament to the fact it doesn't live up to all the hype. 40000 + posts is not about how great it is, but why it makes systems sound, less than ones likes and tasts...
Auto setup is great for distance, levels, and at times Xovers (which is debatable). More then half the time I use dolby volume or THX which takes Audyssey out of the equation, cause it just sounds better...
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post #29 of 80 Old 02-02-2012, 05:47 PM
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Unless these onkyo's have some cooling upgrades from previous models, I would not touch one.
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post #30 of 80 Old 02-02-2012, 05:54 PM
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Unless these onkyo's have some cooling upgrades from previous models, I would not touch one.


Onkyo now packs a pair of gloves with every unit.. Problem solved...
Heat can be a issue with any high current amp, good venting is needed, a small fan is an easy fix, a small price to pay..
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