Onkyo New AVR's TX-NR818,717,616 official Discussion [No Price Talk]Thread - Page 4 - AVS Forum
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post #91 of 1115 Old 04-18-2012, 12:40 PM
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Originally Posted by KidHorn View Post

Plural can mean one of two things. It can eq both subs as one unit or it can eq both subs independently.

That is true, I might be grasping for straws here because I want it have the full XT32/SubEQ HT package. I'm ok with it not being pro compatible but I wouldn't want one without the SubEQ HT.
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post #92 of 1115 Old 04-18-2012, 04:43 PM
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Originally Posted by 3AMRecords View Post

You are correct! I will edit my post.



One thing that really makes me excited about this model, and *Hopeful* that Onkyo does, that I have seen other receiver, component, and even car manufactures do; is to build a few base models, with layout and a skeleton of parts, and then build on that for several different models.

Seeing all of the new "Hi-Fi" amps that Onkyo has produced in the past year means good things, not just for those amps, but for ALL of their equipment.
This is due in part to the fact that at the factory they are going to be used to the higher build quality standards, they will be using better parts, and usually, those parts will all be purchased in bulk, so they will use them in more than one model.

A good example of this is in the automotive industry. For example:
Infinity G35 and the Nissan 350Z share the save drivetrain, and even a some of the underpinnings, and suspension.
The same applies for the Infinity G37 and the Nissan 370Z.
Look at the GM Chevy/Pontiac LT1 and LS1 motors. Those were used in the Chevy Camero, Pontiac Firebird/Firehawk, and of course the Corvette.
The Vette of course had different heads, valves, and hardened internals etc. But GM used quite a few of the same parts in the manufacturing process.
What this means is: That the base performance, and build quality of the standard z28 Camero (and thus upgrade potential) was on par with that of a vehicle costing 2-3x the cost.


I know this will generate a bit of debate, but the TX-SR805 is THX Ultra 2 certified, and the NR818 is only Select 2 certified.
There were a few discussions on this when the 806/7/8/9's came out. about this and they were pretty heated.

If you notice that the 818, 717 and 616 are all Select 2 Plus.
So, they may contain similar amp sections.
Last year's models to be Ultra 2 Certified were the 5009 and 3009, whereas the 1009 and the 809 were Select 2 certified.
I am by no means saying that all of the receivers above had the same amplifier sections, but that they probably share the same components, and physical layout.


Joerod, while performing your review of the 818, would you be able to get any good pictures of the internals of the receiver?
You don't have to take the case off, but that would be extremely helpful in determining how the amp section is laid out.
If it is comparable to the 515/616 models, then we know it will sound good, but if it is comparable to the higher end models* then we know it will sound great.

References:

Comparison of current models: Link
THX Link
Audioholics THX Select 2 and Ultra 2 Questions: Link
^ An older link
Wikipedia THX: THX
The TX-8050 TX-8030
Neither of these have any THX Certification at all.
Onkyo's current "Hi-Fi" offerings.
Source: Onkyo Hi-Fi
Nor do any of these carry a THX Certification.
Onkyo AV Separates: Link
I *Think* these are last years models, but I could be mistaken.
They are ALL Ultra 2 certified. Which would correspond with the 5009 and 3009 respectively.

I owned two 805s. They were great receivers. The amp section was downgraded in the 806/807/808/809, as you state. Select certification is only meeting thx spec in a 2000 cubic foot room - that is a small space.

For most people, it won't matter. Even if the 805 doubled the real world watts of its successors (it doesn't), that is only 3db of difference. It will not be noticeable in everyday use by 99.9% of the purchasers. Most of the time your system is using less than 5-10 watts per channel.

Regarding the 709 series and the 809 series - I think they contain very different amp sections even though they are both select certified - that is part of the reason that the 809 is 13 pounds heavier. The rest is probably the larger chassis and power supply.
I expect the 717 and 818 will also have markedly different amp sections also.
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post #93 of 1115 Old 04-19-2012, 05:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mjpearce023 View Post

That is true, I might be grasping for straws here because I want it have the full XT32/SubEQ HT package. I'm ok with it not being pro compatible but I wouldn't want one without the SubEQ HT.

I want the same.

What needs to be done is for someone to look in the menu and see if there are separate settings for each sub. I.e. Level for sub 1: +2db, level for sub2: +4db. If it has that, then I would guess it will eq each sub independently. Otherwise, I have doubts.
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post #94 of 1115 Old 04-19-2012, 06:10 PM
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Just pre-ordered the 818.

Hopefully I get it by the end of May.

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post #95 of 1115 Old 04-19-2012, 09:48 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by UNICRON-WMD View Post

Just pre-ordered the 818.

Hopefully I get it by the end of May.

who did you order from ?? I see Vann's is taking pre-orders , PLZ share yout thoughts on the AVR when you get the beast !

Mike

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post #96 of 1115 Old 04-19-2012, 11:48 PM
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Originally Posted by Fastslappy View Post

who did you order from ?? I see Vann's is taking pre-orders , PLZ share yout thoughts on the AVR when you get the beast !

Amazon. I also applied for a Amazon CC and got $50 off. So I got it for $1,049 and I should have it paid off before I get it. lol

http://www.amazon.com/Onkyo-TX-NR818.../ref=de_a_smtd

Yeah, i'll definitely let you guys know what I think when I get it.

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post #97 of 1115 Old 04-20-2012, 05:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UNICRON-WMD View Post

Amazon. I also applied for a Amazon CC and got $50 off. So I got it for $1,049 and I should have it paid off before I get it. lol

http://www.amazon.com/Onkyo-TX-NR818.../ref=de_a_smtd

Yeah, i'll definitely let you guys know what I think when I get it.

Congrats on your purchase! I have a feeling you'll love it.

In case you could afford to wait a little longer, Onkyos have a reputation for rapidly falling below the MSRP. If you can't wait or it doesn't matter then, cool.

Upgraditis Anonymous
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post #98 of 1115 Old 04-20-2012, 06:15 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by nlpearman View Post

Congrats on your purchase! I have a feeling you'll love it.

In case you could afford to wait a little longer, Onkyos have a reputation for rapidly falling below the MSRP. If you can't wait or it doesn't matter then, cool.

that might not be the case as Onkyo has started a pricing policy much like what Sony & Sammy has done with their new displays .
Where they are holding Vendors to a minimum advertised pricing policy .
Sharp has started this same policy as well .
But I'm NOT saying this will hold ... but I myself am not seeing the discounts that were once seen just months ago on the upper & middle price ranges of the Onkyo AVR's .
With the economy heating up the MFGer's are trying to hold profits up ....

Mike

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post #99 of 1115 Old 04-20-2012, 08:13 AM
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With the economy heating up the MFGer's are trying to hold profits up ....

I think it's more accurate to state 'With the economy continuing to suck, manufacturers are trying to minimize losses.'
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post #100 of 1115 Old 04-20-2012, 08:36 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by KidHorn View Post

I think it's more accurate to state 'With the economy continuing to suck, manufacturers are trying to minimize losses.'

that's half glass empty view & I have a half glass full view . I don't wish to argue this point so let it go plz.

Mike

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post #101 of 1115 Old 04-20-2012, 09:01 AM
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What would you think about getting a 3009 for a good price, just a few hundred more than the new 818?
The 3009 has Ultra 2 and the DAC's are 32 bit. The 818 is getting that mobile phone thing. Other than that, is it pretty close?
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post #102 of 1115 Old 04-20-2012, 09:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fastslappy View Post

that might not be the case as Onkyo has started a pricing policy much like what Sony & Sammy has done with their new displays .
Where they are holding Vendors to a minimum advertised pricing policy .
Sharp has started this same policy as well .
But I'm NOT saying this will hold ... but I myself am not seeing the discounts that were once seen just months ago on the upper & middle price ranges of the Onkyo AVR's .
With the economy heating up the MFGer's are trying to hold profits up ....

I remember always being able to pre-order at much lower than MSRP and it looks like you are right.
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post #103 of 1115 Old 04-20-2012, 09:13 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kblev View Post

What would you think about getting a 3009 for a good price, just a few hundred more than the new 818?
The 3009 has Ultra 2 and the DAC's are 32 bit. The 818 is getting that mobile phone thing. Other than that, is it pretty close?

I'd myself get the 3009 , without a hesitation, same video processor, better DAC's , more in-puts as well . 9 channels of amps
unless the smart phone thing is the deal breaker .
of coarse that's a I M H O .................but I just got TX-NR1009 (9 channels of amp as well NO XT32 thou )as well for way less than a 818 would sell for ..

Mike

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post #104 of 1115 Old 04-20-2012, 09:40 AM
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Originally Posted by Fastslappy View Post

that's half glass empty view & I have a half glass full view . I don't wish to argue this point so let it go plz.

It's neither half full nor half empty. It's twice as big as it needs to be.
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post #105 of 1115 Old 04-20-2012, 10:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fastslappy View Post

that might not be the case as Onkyo has started a pricing policy much like what Sony & Sammy has done with their new displays .
Where they are holding Vendors to a minimum advertised pricing policy .
Sharp has started this same policy as well .
But I'm NOT saying this will hold ... but I myself am not seeing the discounts that were once seen just months ago on the upper & middle price ranges of the Onkyo AVR's .
With the economy heating up the MFGer's are trying to hold profits up ....

Hmmmm... very interesting. Onkyo is following Denon's lead on this one. I think it's a good business move for them... and it makes an even stronger case for the XX09 series, which are still perfectly good receivers.

Upgraditis Anonymous
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post #106 of 1115 Old 04-20-2012, 11:50 AM
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If I don't care about Xt32 eq, or the mobile HD connection, or the video upscaling, is the 809 a better buy? I havent been able to keep up with the 809 board recently. Is the 809 problem free at this point? Does it have the same amp section as the 818? Any more HDMI board failures?

My main reason for purchase is to get the HDMI interface for blu-ray/ps3/htpc connections. That, and my HK 635 keeps resetting itself!
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post #107 of 1115 Old 04-20-2012, 11:53 AM
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Originally Posted by scsnospam View Post

If I don't care about Xt32 eq, or the mobile HD connection, or the video upscaling, is the 809 a better buy? I havent been able to keep up with the 809 board recently. Is the 809 problem free at this point? Does it have the same amp section as the 818? Any more HDMI board failures?

My main reason for purchase is to get the HDMI interface for blu-ray/ps3/htpc connections. That, and my HK 635 keeps resetting itself!

You should care about the XT32! Trust me.

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post #108 of 1115 Old 04-20-2012, 12:05 PM
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Originally Posted by joerod View Post

You should care about the XT32! Trust me.

joerod, I see you've switched to a Denon 4311. I'm curious how the Onkyo's with XT32 compare to the 4311.
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post #109 of 1115 Old 04-20-2012, 12:12 PM
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Originally Posted by nismo604 View Post

joerod, I see you've switched to a Denon 4311. I'm curious how the Onkyo's with XT32 compare to the 4311.

I am Reviewing the 4311. I have not switched to any particular brand. Of course it would help if the 4311 I had here worked...

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post #110 of 1115 Old 04-20-2012, 12:13 PM
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You should care about the XT32! Trust me.

Well, i've been ok with the HK's EQ. I'm not sure what the XT32 will do for me over the standard MultiEQ in the 809. I only run one sub, in a 5.1 config. The 809 can be had for < 700 right now. Unless anyone can come up with any reliability issues, it sounds like I can save a few hundred...
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post #111 of 1115 Old 04-20-2012, 12:55 PM
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Originally Posted by joerod View Post

I am Reviewing the 4311. I have not switched to any particular brand. Of course it would help if the 4311 I had here worked...

So what's the word on the 818? Does it have the full version of XT32 with SubEQ HT? I have dual subs so that's my main reason for wanting XT32.
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post #112 of 1115 Old 04-20-2012, 01:19 PM
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Originally Posted by joerod View Post

I am Reviewing the 4311. I have not switched to any particular brand. Of course it would help if the 4311 I had here worked...

but I thought the Denons were more reliable than Onkyo Just kidding...looking forward to your comparision. I think Film mixer preferred the Onkyo sound to the Denon and I'm interested in your take.
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post #113 of 1115 Old 04-20-2012, 01:27 PM
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Yeah joerod, when is that 818 Review gonna be released?
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post #114 of 1115 Old 04-20-2012, 01:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mjpearce023 View Post

So what's the word on the 818? Does it have the full version of XT32 with SubEQ HT? I have dual subs so that's my main reason for wanting XT32.

While having XT32 doesn't automatically mean you'll have SubEQ since this is a .2 receiver it will probably have SubEQ. SubEQ is how Audyssey measures delay and level for each sub and once that is done it's up to XT32 to set up the filters for the subs along with the other speakers.
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post #115 of 1115 Old 04-20-2012, 10:04 PM
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Threw it over the fence too...

It's nicer than the 609 so far. Haven't played with it too much but aside from a horrid hot plastic stench for a couple of hours, it wound up working pretty well.
LL
LL
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post #116 of 1115 Old 04-21-2012, 06:11 AM
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Yeah joerod, when is that 818 Review gonna be released?

I want to squeeze out th 4311 then compare the 818 to the Sony and Denon but as many know I am on a rain delay for a couple of days.

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post #117 of 1115 Old 04-21-2012, 06:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mjpearce023 View Post

So what's the word on the 818? Does it have the full version of XT32 with SubEQ HT? I have dual subs so that's my main reason for wanting XT32.

All I will say is you will be tickled pink with the 818's XT32.

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post #118 of 1115 Old 04-21-2012, 07:24 PM
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Anyone have an idea when the 818 is suposed to start shipping?
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post #119 of 1115 Old 04-21-2012, 08:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joerod View Post


All I will say is you will be tickled pink with the 818's XT32.

That's all I needed to hear. Thanks!
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post #120 of 1115 Old 04-21-2012, 10:01 PM
 
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Unfortunately, you must use an external amp to get the 818 to do all 9 channels. Sigh....we are going backwards with this stuff.
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