The **OFFICIAL** Denon AVR-XX13 Model Owner's Thread & FAQ - Page 211 - AVS Forum
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post #6301 of 10593 Old 03-12-2013, 04:14 PM
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Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post

The cable box issue can be resolved likely by connecting HDMI to the TV with optical to the AVR, otherwise, give Denon a call and exchange it. frown.gif

ok, thanks JD.
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post #6302 of 10593 Old 03-12-2013, 04:25 PM
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Originally Posted by bradwill View Post

Is there a known way to downgrade firmware? If nothing else, I'd like to verify whether my delay issue goes away with the previous version. As it sits now, zone 2 audio is ahead of main zone audio by a good half second unless I use Pure Direct on my AVR-1713. This only started happening after the update last week.

Sorry, but no, not possible. On the higher models there is a "Video Mode" setting which can be used to reduce the delay difference when a video source is passed to the main zone. You may want to try the video connection direct to the TV with audio only to the AVR.

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post #6303 of 10593 Old 03-12-2013, 04:37 PM
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Originally Posted by rlg212 View Post

Hey guys,

I purchased a 2113ci from Accessories4less about 3 weeks ago. I've had some initial headaches and I've had to reset the device because I was not getting picture out of a couple of the hdmi inputs. The most annoying problem however, is that at 4 seemingly random times my speakers will all of a sudden begin to get nothing but a loud hiss and some popping noises coming through them. The first time it happened I could still hear some of the audio coming through the speakers when watching tv thorough the Time Warner Cable box and while checking for loose connections and whatnot I found that the ethernet cable plugged into the back of the AVR seemed to be the culprit as moving it slightly when it was plugged into the AVR changed the tone and frequency of the hisses and pops coming through my speakers. Well I unplugged it and the noise stopped. I plugged it in and it started. So I did a reset and all was fine. Then a few days later it happened again this time the ethernet cable had nothing to do with it. I was annoyed with the various headaches I was having and kicking myself for trying to save $150 and ordering a refurb and in my frustration I gave th Denon and good whack on the right side and there was a click and everything returned to normal. Yay! I had Fonzied it back into perfect working shape. I thought all was good until one day with just the receiver on and no other inputs on the hissing and popping came from the speakers again. This time I just cursed and unplugged everything and dealt with it a few hours later. I did a complete reset, reattached the speakers, redid the Audessy, everything from scratch hoping that would fix it and it did... temporarily. Well today it happened again and I lost picture through the media player input while watching a movie on AppleTV having had to pause the movie for 20-30 minutes- It was right after the AppleTV shut itself off that everything disappeared and the system began to hiss again. I did the whole reset thing again and it's working. Any ideas what I should do here? Should I be calling Denon everytime this stuff happens and build a case to send it back and get something brand new? I would pay whatever the !$%& I need to pay just to not have to worry about this anymore. It's just becoming a hassle. I really don't want hassle with my HT. I just want to turn it on and relax... not turn it on and stress out for 30 minutes unplugging and redoing everything. Also the most recent firmware update had knocked out my airplay until I did the whole reset this morning. In fact, the Denon app didn't recognize my 2113 under devices after the FW update so I had no control of it from my iPhone. Any thoughts on a good course of action here?

Thanks much, guys!
I feel your pain! I too recently purchased the same receiver from acc4less bout 3 weeks ago and sending it back to Denon. It was working perfectly fine until I attempted to download the update. From there I had to reset it and was never able to get any kind of connection from HDMI not one little sound or pic. Ruined my weekend as I finally had time to enjoy my surround sound. Now I just hope Denon doesn't take there sweet time on sending me a new one. Hope you find a solution.
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post #6304 of 10593 Old 03-12-2013, 04:41 PM
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Originally Posted by batpig View Post

No way that I'm aware of. The delay sync with Zone 2 is widely reported, because Zone 2 is NOT delayed (being a pure analog path) compared to all the digital processing going on in Main Zone. Surprised it only cropped up recently for your unit....

Thanks, batpig. The issue that cropped up for me with the firmware update last week was that the main zone is delayed from a separate amplifier playing the same analog input split into both units. This is for a whole-house audio system where I've been using the Denon in my living room and AudioSource amps for the ceiling speakers in adjacent rooms. This has been working perfectly since September but now is unusable unless I select Pure (and of course the sound is poor then).

I figured the zone 2 delay was the same issue, but it sounds like that's a separate known issue.

Any pointers for the issue I described back in post 6133 would be appreciated. So far no response on my written support request via the Denon site.

Cheers,
Brad
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post #6305 of 10593 Old 03-12-2013, 05:42 PM
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Quote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by jlpowell84

... I have recently noticed a humming sound that is coming from the top right corner of tv when facing it. If you put your ear back there you can really hear it. Of course no sound is on when I can hear it. I actually noticed it when running the Audyssey room calibration for the surround sound. It's not bothersome by any means but just sounds like something is being over worked and doesn't sound good. Maybe that's just how the hdmi board sounds? I didn't notice it with my previous Onkyo receiver but my new Denon 3313 seems to give it some noise. Also it only happens when the receiver is on. If I have the tv on but the receiver off it makes no sound. Should I get a new hdmi cable? Any similar scenarios?


It sounds to me like you have a ground loop. Getting rid of a ground loop the correct way can be tricky.
You may want to ask in your AVR's owners thread too. You will need to describe your entire setup including how every component is connected to power. It's going to wind up being related to your homes grounding and how your components are reacting to that. If I go any further it will expose my ignorance about ground loops.

Help!
ReplyQuote Multi
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post #6306 of 10593 Old 03-12-2013, 05:54 PM
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Originally Posted by avs28312 View Post

attempted to update mine on Fri and well if you've read a few pages back you'll find out its now collecting dust! Can't stress this enough.. Don't do it!!

Please. You've posted of your issue (which is apparently limited to only a few members). There's no call for this sort of outcry as well as continuing to post of the same issue.

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post #6307 of 10593 Old 03-12-2013, 06:24 PM
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With all the issues posted in this thread I thought I would share my configuration as I have not experienced any problems since first installing the 3313CI. As has already been mentioned normally it is people with problems that post, some more than necessary, while the ones without issues really have no need to post. This can make the minority seem like the majority.

I am using the following source components:

Blu-ray
DVD
LaserDisk
CD
HTPC
DTV
Dune
XBox
PS3

Originally I had all the video source components connected to an iScan Duo with the Duo going to the CBL/SAT HDMI input and i/p Scaler disabled for that input. HDMI Monitor 1 went to a Darblet and from the Darblet to a 70" Sharp. HDMI Zone 2 also went to the Sharp so that we could watch TV while listening to music. The Duo would not pass DVD-Audio or SACD so I ran the DVD output to a splitter. One output of the splitter went to the Duo for DVDs and the other output to the HDMI DVD input of the 3313 for music (DVD-Audio/SACD).

I have since switched out the Duo for a Radiance Mini 3d. Now all source components go to the 3313. Being short an input the XBox and PS3 go to a switch and the output of the switch to the 3313. The LaserDisk is connected to the DVD composite input on the 3313. When the DVD player is on DVDs, DVD-Audio and SACD can be played. When the DVD player is off the LaserDisk is usable. I/P Scaling is turned off for all inputs except DVD which is set to analog only to scale the LaserDisk input so it can be sent out over HDMI. HDMI Monitor 1 goes to the Mini 3d and from there to the Darblet and from the Darblet to the Sharp. HDMI Zone 2 still goes to the Sharp.

The pre-outs are used for the main speakers driving two 200W amplifiers with the remaining 5 speakers using the 3313 amps. Sub out is to a pair of SVS subwoofers. All HDMI cables are 6ft RedMere with the exception of the two going to the Sharp which are 10ft RedMere. Networking is through 2 switches and a router with built-in WiFi which are all Cisco enterprise models. No issue with updates (including the one last night), AirPlay or playing FLAC files from a Synology NAS.

System control is done with a MX-980 remote. I have programmed it so any source can be used with a single button press with all other unneeded devices being turned off.
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post #6308 of 10593 Old 03-12-2013, 06:42 PM
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Is there not a way to adjust the volume of surrounds on the 1913? Audssey keeps setting them too hot to the point they outweigh my mains/center. I've searched through the menus and only see level control for sub and center. Thanks
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post #6309 of 10593 Old 03-12-2013, 06:47 PM
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I haven't noticed any difference since the update on my 1913, but I haven't had much time to mess with it.
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post #6310 of 10593 Old 03-12-2013, 06:52 PM
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Originally Posted by mario64 View Post

Is there not a way to adjust the volume of surrounds on the 1913? Audssey keeps setting them too hot to the point they outweigh my mains/center. I've searched through the menus and only see level control for sub and center. Thanks

You must go into Manual Setup (Levels - p. 115 OM) to adjust the volume level. Note however, that if you are using Dyn EQ, the bass and surround volume is boosted and can be reduced by using the Reference Level Offset (p. 103 OM) set to 10 or 15.

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post #6311 of 10593 Old 03-12-2013, 08:02 PM
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Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post

Please. You've posted of your issue (which is apparently limited to only a few members). There's no call for this sort of outcry as well as continuing to post of the same issue.
last time i checked this is the denon avr forum. I will post my issues with my avr as much as I want to. Furthermore, I've only been responding to people who are having the same issues and to ultimately find a solution. So all respect get off your hi horse
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post #6312 of 10593 Old 03-12-2013, 09:04 PM
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Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post

You must go into Manual Setup (Levels - p. 115 OM) to adjust the volume level. Note however, that if you are using Dyn EQ, the bass and surround volume is boosted and can be reduced by using the Reference Level Offset (p. 103 OM) set to 10 or 15.
Thanks jd. Didn't try that because when I go into that it says something about begin level tests. Thought it was just a test tone generator. Will give it a try. If I adjust offset will that also lower my bass volumes?
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post #6313 of 10593 Old 03-12-2013, 10:11 PM
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I still can't get my 3313CI to update. Keeps going into the loop of restart and retry. I can perform the network reset trick and the unit will work normally. But I cannot locate the firmware to do a flash by USB. I'm thinking this will be my last Denon product as I'm sick of stupid firmware updates that contribute nothing of meaning and only make life frustrating in their product usage. Integrate a wifi card into their own devices and a better processor. My TV, Xbox, playstation, apple tv, and every other device has this.

Going to call their worthless customer service in the morning. Sorry for the rant, but I'm tired of jacking with this after 2 hours. Technology in this day and age shouldn't perform like this is the first product to receive a software update.
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post #6314 of 10593 Old 03-12-2013, 10:18 PM
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Jdsmoothie or batpig do either of you know why the hdmi board on my tv is making excessive noise when receiving a signal from my 3313? It is surely isolated to as soon as the signal is received from the avr on any input. Apple TV, cable, blu ray.
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post #6315 of 10593 Old 03-12-2013, 11:54 PM
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Now I remember that with the (returned) Yamaha 673 upon updating the firmware by internet, by the end of the installation process I've got an error message. Checked with the manual and it said to do the update by USB memory stick, after downloading the corresponding file from Yamaha site. I did that and all went well with no error message (not to mention it took much less - about 2-3 minutes).

The update file for Denon 2113 is at Denon/Downloads/Firmware download, and there after completing the specifics for 2113 you can download the latest firmware, then put it to USB stick (make sure there are no other files on it and that the USB is FAT 32 formated).

Strange though that on AVR you cannot downgrade the firmware - for example on my TV (4 years old) I can do it, if unhappy after the latest firmware update.

Denon AVR-2113, Monitor Audio BX2/BXC/BXFX, Pioneer BDP-150K, LG 37LH5000, Sennheiser PC-350
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post #6316 of 10593 Old 03-13-2013, 02:32 AM
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Hi everyone,

Is it possible to flash the firmware of the Denon 2113 through USB?
i have downloaded the file, put it on a FAT 32 formatted USB stick but I don't know how to launch the upgrade.

Thanks!!
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post #6317 of 10593 Old 03-13-2013, 02:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BarrettF77 View Post

I still can't get my 3313CI to update. Keeps going into the loop of restart and retry. I can perform the network reset trick and the unit will work normally. But I cannot locate the firmware to do a flash by USB. I'm thinking this will be my last Denon product as I'm sick of stupid firmware updates that contribute nothing of meaning and only make life frustrating in their product usage. Integrate a wifi card into their own devices and a better processor. My TV, Xbox, playstation, apple tv, and every other device has this.

Going to call their worthless customer service in the morning. Sorry for the rant, but I'm tired of jacking with this after 2 hours. Technology in this day and age shouldn't perform like this is the first product to receive a software update.


Have you tried unplugging the power for 10 minutes and then restarting the unit? Also note that USA/CA Denon AVRs do not feature USB firmware update capabiltilty.

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post #6318 of 10593 Old 03-13-2013, 02:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mario64 View Post

Thanks jd. Didn't try that because when I go into that it says something about begin level tests. Thought it was just a test tone generator. Will give it a try. If I adjust offset will that also lower my bass volumes?

Yes, it will, although doing so will generally also improve the dialogue from the center channel in the process. smile.gif

Also, if you have an android phone you may want to try using the AVR-Remote app ...

https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=de.pskiwi.avrremote&hl=en

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post #6319 of 10593 Old 03-13-2013, 03:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jlpowell84 View Post

Jdsmoothie or batpig do either of you know why the hdmi board on my tv is making excessive noise when receiving a signal from my 3313? It is surely isolated to as soon as the signal is received from the avr on any input. Apple TV, cable, blu ray.

Hard to say whether it's the TV (w/sensitive HDMI board) or something off in the AVR. Have you tried every HDMI input on the TV? What happens if you disable Dyn EQ? MultEQ?

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post #6320 of 10593 Old 03-13-2013, 05:32 AM
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UPDATED MY 3313 THIS MORNING NO PROBLEMS
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post #6321 of 10593 Old 03-13-2013, 05:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post

Have you tried unplugging the power for 10 minutes and then restarting the unit? Also note that USA/CA Denon AVRs do not feature USB firmware update capabiltilty, rather this only exists on the models in other regions of the world.

I've tried unplugging, which results in it starting back up in retrying update endlessly. I've tried reset of factory reset and also the network reset. When I perform the network reset, it is usable, but I still cannot get it to update by means of the internet. And when I try to go to denon's site, it says that I need the serial number. I can't get behind the unit because of the enclosure to read that off of it. Everything about this whole thing screams PITA. Waiting for Denon to open their customer service and make it so I can get this working again. I miss the days of no firmware updates. The pressure was on them to get it right the first time. If they didn't, then too bad. Stuff like this irritates me because I do IT work for a living and situations like this show how little engineers care about the consumer or how the company takes a stance of being cheap. I've owned Denons for a long time, this is seemingly the straw breaking the camel's back.
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post #6322 of 10593 Old 03-13-2013, 06:16 AM
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Just got off the phone with Denon USA. Like it was said, no USB update is allowed. Instead, the service guy was a complete joke and a waste of my time. I'll keep trying to do the download intermittently, but this is the last Denon I purchase. Absolutely amazing how terrible their service is!
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post #6323 of 10593 Old 03-13-2013, 06:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post

Hard to say whether it's the TV (w/sensitive HDMI board) or something off in the AVR. Have you tried every HDMI input on the TV? What happens if you disable Dyn EQ? MultEQ?

I will do some more trouble shooting. Mostly from you experienced ones I was hoping to perhaps hear of some kind of similar case in the past. Perhaps I have a unique case. Thanks, ill check back later with more defined results.
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post #6324 of 10593 Old 03-13-2013, 07:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BarrettF77 View Post

I've tried unplugging, which results in it starting back up in retrying update endlessly. I've tried reset of factory reset and also the network reset. When I perform the network reset, it is usable, but I still cannot get it to update by means of the internet. And when I try to go to denon's site, it says that I need the serial number. I can't get behind the unit because of the enclosure to read that off of it. Everything about this whole thing screams PITA. Waiting for Denon to open their customer service and make it so I can get this working again. I miss the days of no firmware updates. The pressure was on them to get it right the first time. If they didn't, then too bad. Stuff like this irritates me because I do IT work for a living and situations like this show how little engineers care about the consumer or how the company takes a stance of being cheap. I've owned Denons for a long time, this is seemingly the straw breaking the camel's back.

The serial no should be on the card box too.
The times of simple components have long passed. Those AVRs of today are mostly multimedia computers with a lot of DSP specific software (firmware) on board and they have to handle an awful lot of peripheral components and combinations from different manufacturers too. This screams for software updates because no one really can test everything completely unless your competition will pass you quite fast. And this for each and every model per year. The days of one new model once and a while have passed too, because almost each and every year a complete new line springs to life to keep the revenue coming in. Thus an easy and fool proof way of updating is needed for everyday use.
It's just consumer electronics with no life saving or threatening critical features.
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post #6325 of 10593 Old 03-13-2013, 07:52 AM
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Originally Posted by gurkey View Post

The serial no should be on the card box too.
The times of simple components have long passed. Those AVRs of today are mostly multimedia computers with a lot of DSP specific software (firmware) on board and they have to handle an awful lot of peripheral components and combinations from different manufacturers too. This screams for software updates because no one really can test everything completely unless your competition will pass you quite fast. And this for each and every model per year. The days of one new model once and a while have passed too, because almost each and every year a complete new line springs to life to keep the revenue coming in. Thus an easy and fool proof way of updating is needed for everyday use.
It's just consumer electronics with no life saving or threatening critical features.

Here's the problem, I spoke to a different person who had a few checks run. I can steam pandora just fine. So when I go to get online with an update, I am thinking its their servers. But here is the thing. The firmware should only be 20 megs at the most. But I'm stuck now again at this authenticating screen. And I am told they have all units now designed only to take a update by network. So what's that say about their networks? I'm just put off by the fact Denon doesn't inform their reps of the updates and what they do. His words, we just guess they are feature updates. But no clue to what's in them. He also stares, just turn off the update feature if you are not having issues and don't update. If this is their stance, why not make this the default for the units? Point being, their higher ups have no clue as to what customer service and the engineers that write this stuff, it would be nice to know what the point of an update is. Apple does this with their computers a lot. And many in my family are done with Apple for the very same reason. Bad software and poor support equal loss of customers. Gah!
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post #6326 of 10593 Old 03-13-2013, 08:35 AM
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The firmware should only be 20 megs at the most. But I'm stuck now again at this authenticating screen. And I am told they have all units now designed only to take a update by network. So what's that say about their networks?

Doubtful the issue lies solely with Denon's network. Too many users are reporting not only no issues but also that the update completed within a minute or two of the estimated time. More likely it is an issue with the infrastructure the receiver is connected to or somewhere between the location the receiver is at and Denon's server location. Denon should have fail-safes in place though in anticipation of the shoddy network installations some of these receivers will be connected to.
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post #6327 of 10593 Old 03-13-2013, 09:24 AM
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Doubtful the issue lies solely with Denon's network. Too many users are reporting not only no issues but also that the update completed within a minute or two of the estimated time. More likely it is an issue with the infrastructure the receiver is connected to or somewhere between the location the receiver is at and Denon's server location. Denon should have fail-safes in place though in anticipation of the shoddy network installations some of these receivers will be connected to.

They would make it a lot easier on themselves if they simply incorporated WIFI into these units. My router is on the other side of the house, and unhooking the unit isn't an option to take it to the router. So, you can see that it's not a uncommon dilemma many of their customers will face. While I do have a second router that it generally pulls off of, I would think if pandora works fine, the update should too. I've tried taking the firewall down and that didn't help either.
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post #6328 of 10593 Old 03-13-2013, 09:49 AM - Thread Starter
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What makes you think built-in WiFi would be any more reliable? A wired connection is nearly always going to be more robust. Most of the time these update failures or other network problems (like inconsistent Airplay) have to do with the rest of the network infrastructure, like the wireless router or the WiFi bridge used to deliver the ethernet to the receiver.

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post #6329 of 10593 Old 03-13-2013, 10:02 AM
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I've updated my 3313 three times without issue. My post is not intended to brag, but rather to just share my positive experience. My AVR is connected to a Netgear WN2500RP Wireless Expander.

HT Setup
TV: Samsung UN65ES8000
AVR: Denon AVR-3313CI
Front Speakers: Polk Audio LSi15 x 2 | Center Speaker: Polk Audio LSiC | Rear Speakers: Polk Audio LSiF/X x 2
Subwoofers: Polk Audio PSW-505 x 2
Amp: Emotiva XPA-5
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post #6330 of 10593 Old 03-13-2013, 10:36 AM
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Done 2 updates in my 2113 which was purchased 3 weeks ago, using D-link powerline adapter, no issues so far

AVC-A1SE with mission speakers and REL sub
AVR-2113CI with Polk TL350s and Polk sub
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