The **OFFICIAL** Denon AVR-XX13 Model Owner's Thread & FAQ - Page 40 - AVS Forum
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post #1171 of 10612 Old 07-25-2012, 03:32 PM
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better yet whats your best system for 5k total?
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post #1172 of 10612 Old 07-25-2012, 03:44 PM
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Is there any known reason why a 3rd-gen AppleTV (with 1080P) only goes up to 720P when connected to a 3313?

Shouldn't the Denon support 1080P or even 4K on all the HDMI inputs?
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post #1173 of 10612 Old 07-25-2012, 03:55 PM
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I'm running 4.1 through my 1713. Ran Audyssey and of course it recognized I didn't have a center.

I'm assuming that Audyssey automatically re-routes my center channel audio/info through the R/L fronts. However, the "Dialogue Level" setting is grayed out and I would really like to be able to adjust that. I realize there is no "physical" center speaker, but shouldn't the audio/info for that channel still be accessible/controllable? Or is my assumption incorrect and the center channel audio/info is being discarded?
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post #1174 of 10612 Old 07-25-2012, 03:58 PM
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Just as if you are running a 4.0 setup with no sub you would have no control over the LFE (0.1) channel audio, so to do you not have center channel level control when there is no center channel.

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post #1175 of 10612 Old 07-25-2012, 03:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by diddl14 View Post

Is there any known reason why a 3rd-gen AppleTV (with 1080P) only goes up to 720P when connected to a 3313?
Shouldn't the Denon support 1080P or even 4K on all the HDMI inputs?

Nope. Does it pass 1080p when connected directly to the TV?

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post #1176 of 10612 Old 07-25-2012, 04:10 PM
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Current TV connected to the 3313 is an older model, only going up to 1080i.
Maybe the problem is that whatever video-modes the TV support are passed to the HDMI inputs?

I was kind of expecting all HDMI inputs to go up to 4K and the ip-scaler than just scaling it up or down to whatever output resolution set.
So in this case, I would expect the AppleTV to detect 1080P as reported by the 3313 and than converting that to 1080i.

But I will hook up a 1080P TV tomorrow to see if that makes a change to the video resolutions reported by the AppleTV.
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post #1177 of 10612 Old 07-25-2012, 04:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post

Just as if you are running a 4.0 setup with no sub you would have no control over the LFE (0.1) channel audio, so to do you not have center channel level control when there is no center channel.

Do I have any other options for boosting dialogue?

Could I physically re-route the center-channel wiring from the AVR to the R/L fronts? Or would an Audyssey set-up process be messed up by that?
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post #1178 of 10612 Old 07-25-2012, 04:25 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Roppee View Post

better yet whats your best system for 5k total?

it's time for you to head to the speaker forum, this is now way off-topic for this thread. But I can tell you that, with that kind of budget, the answer is going to be "go to some dealers and listen and hear what you like". There are many great options and none will be "best" as speaker choices are very subjective.

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post #1179 of 10612 Old 07-25-2012, 04:27 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by diddl14 View Post

Current TV connected to the 3313 is an older model, only going up to 1080i.

that would have been useful information to report in your 1st post wink.gif

if the TV doesn't support 1080p, then the sources will not output it. HDMI devices "talk" to each other by reporting EDID info and will automatically prevent 1080p output if the TV doesn't support that input resolution.

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post #1180 of 10612 Old 07-25-2012, 04:28 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sdg4vfx View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post

Just as if you are running a 4.0 setup with no sub you would have no control over the LFE (0.1) channel audio, so to do you not have center channel level control when there is no center channel.

Do I have any other options for boosting dialogue?

Could I physically re-route the center-channel wiring from the AVR to the R/L fronts? Or would an Audyssey set-up process be messed up by that?

the wire re-routing will be a disaster, don't do that.

your best options, without a center, are to use the "Dynamic EQ Reference Level Offset" setting to tone down the boost to the bass/surrond levels, and/or to use Dynamic Volume to control the dynamic swings and bring up the dialogue relatively.

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post #1181 of 10612 Old 07-25-2012, 04:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post

the wire re-routing will be a disaster, don't do that.
your best options, without a center, are to use the "Dynamic EQ Reference Level Offset" setting to tone down the boost to the bass/surrond levels, and/or to use Dynamic Volume to control the dynamic swings and bring up the dialogue relatively.

Thanks - I'll give those a try. (No room for a center that has decent matched R/L fronts so I just got very good R/L fronts.)

You probably don't get to use the word disaster that often ; )
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post #1182 of 10612 Old 07-25-2012, 05:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post

if the TV doesn't support 1080p, then the sources will not output it. HDMI devices "talk" to each other by reporting EDID info and will automatically prevent 1080p output if the TV doesn't support that input resolution.
Thx. I'm kind of aware on EDID. Guess my misunderstanding is/was that I expected the 3313 as 'video scaler' to provide EDID information, independent of a connected TV or projector.

But digging trough the manual I found in the "video-conversion table" that there is no support at all for down-scaling.
Makes sense than than the EDID info of the main display is passed trough instead of the capabilities of the scaler..
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post #1183 of 10612 Old 07-25-2012, 05:32 PM
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just ordered the 3313ci an a pair of klipsch rf7ii,hope these babies work together:)
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post #1184 of 10612 Old 07-26-2012, 01:07 AM
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Thank you for your help on this forum. I have swapped my 1713 for a Yamaha 673 that took 2 mins to set up.
Denon sounded great but would not work with mine or my friends SONY KDL 46Z5800 with latest firmware.

SONY bottom of my list after their lack of support !
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post #1185 of 10612 Old 07-26-2012, 08:07 AM
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Ropee,

You really should schedule time to visit local audio/video stores and audition speakers before making a final decision. Other people don't have your ears or room and have different preferences. Listening to speakers in your home environment is best, but not always possible. The room equalization software provided in most moden receivers can do quite a bit to make any set of speakers more accurate, but it's not perfect. It's best to start with quality speakers to begin with.

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post #1186 of 10612 Old 07-26-2012, 08:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Roppee View Post

just ordered the 3313ci an a pair of klipsch rf7ii,hope these babies work together:)

they'll work fine together...

i hope you listened to those speakers before you bought them.....

- chris

 

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post #1187 of 10612 Old 07-26-2012, 10:21 AM
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I guess I'm joining the owners group with my purchase of the 3313ci. I'll be hooking it up this weekend. It's sort of an upgrade and downgrade for me. I wanted something current that had more HDMI switching capabilities and I wanted a ARC for the monitor audio return.

So...I'm upgrading as far as current features (my current set-up doesn't allow my to pass 3D, so I have multiple HDMI cables going to the TV).

But as far as quality....I think it is a pretty significant downgrade from my current set-up. Maybe the technology has improved over the years that I won't be able to notice much and I'll really love the Denon?

Anyone else come from the land of older separates to current receivers?

FYI - My previous processor was an Anthem AVM-50 (with Anthem Room Correction) and I was powering my 5.1 speakers set up with a B&K Reference 200.5 amp (200w x 5).
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post #1188 of 10612 Old 07-26-2012, 10:42 AM
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^^
No experience with Anthem, but will be interested in hearing your review of how Audyssey MultEQ XT compares.

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post #1189 of 10612 Old 07-26-2012, 10:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post

^^
No experience with Anthem, but will be interested in hearing your review of how Audyssey MultEQ XT compares.

I'll be coming from a $4,600 pre/pro and a $2800 amp down to a $1,100 receiver. Not sure it'll be a very fair comparison....but I'll give it a shot once I get everything hooked up.
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post #1190 of 10612 Old 07-26-2012, 10:58 AM
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Yup .. I am aware of the price difference .... wink.gif

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post #1191 of 10612 Old 07-26-2012, 11:36 AM
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Yup. JL first, then Audyssey.

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post #1192 of 10612 Old 07-26-2012, 12:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KCWolfPck View Post

I'll be coming from a $4,600 pre/pro and a $2800 amp down to a $1,100 receiver. Not sure it'll be a very fair comparison....but I'll give it a shot once I get everything hooked up.

I haven't seen this before. I'm very much looking forward to your feedback.

Upgraditis Anonymous
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post #1193 of 10612 Old 07-26-2012, 02:04 PM
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Originally Posted by ccotenj View Post

they'll work fine together...
i hope you listened to those speakers before you bought them.....

I agree with the statement that you should listen to speakers before buying. It's not an exact science. It depends on taste, room size, room acoustics, layout, etc.
Having said that, I have a pair of Klipsch Forte speakers I bought in the mid-'80s that work great as front l/r with Denon 3802. With 3802 I bought Klipsch center, dipoles, and a sub to create 5.1 system. Also have a pair of Klipsch kg4 with Denon 1906 in bedroom in a 2-channel setup. Both systems sound great. Denon and Klipsch work well together for me.

You may get lucky and like the sound as I do. Hopefully you'll be happy with your purchase.
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post #1194 of 10612 Old 07-26-2012, 02:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BartlettMike View Post

I agree with the statement that you should listen to speakers before buying. It's not an exact science. It depends on taste, room size, room acoustics, layout, etc.
Having said that, I have a pair of Klipsch Forte speakers I bought in the mid-'80s that work great as front l/r with Denon 3802. With 3802 I bought Klipsch center, dipoles, and a sub to create 5.1 system. Also have a pair of Klipsch kg4 with Denon 1906 in bedroom in a 2-channel setup. Both systems sound great. Denon and Klipsch work well together for me.
You may get lucky and like the sound as I do. Hopefully you'll be happy with your purchase.

Except for my sub, I have the same speakers as you. I love my Forte's! (They almost don't need a sub!!)

And I just became the proud owner of a 2113CI. I'm having fun programming my Harmony One right now.....

I'm sure I'll have a few questions for this board soon.

Dave

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post #1195 of 10612 Old 07-26-2012, 02:27 PM
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I just picked up a new 2113CI.

I'm wondering about the use of the colored buttons Movie/Music/Game/Pure. Does using those buttons over-ride the Audyssey settings?

Dave

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post #1196 of 10612 Old 07-26-2012, 02:51 PM
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Hi,

I recently bought 3313CI and connected it my samsung 46B650 lcd tv and also to my PS3. I noted couple of problems which i need clarifications on and would really appreciate any help in this regard.

1. When i took the receiver right out of the box and connected to TV without any inputs, i am able to view the setup menu of the AVR as part of initial setup. After i connected all the inputs (cable - comcast using RCA cable, PS3 - HDMI (bluray input on receiver)) and played all the content of PS3, i switched off the receiver and switched it on without PS3 being switched on, if i press setup on the AVR, i see "No signal" on my TV. If i switch on my PS3 then i am able to access the AVR setup menu. In short, my AVR is needing a input signal to show the setup menu of the AVR. Is this normal or something bad with the unit? If i do a soft reset (by switching all the power for all the devices and switch on the TV, AVR and press setup on AVR, i can see the setup menu).

I had the similar issue with my onkyo TX-NR709 but it was random. ( i have returned it). But with denon, this pattern stays.

2. After sometime (may be 1 to 2hrs) of playing PS3 or watching movie on TV with laptop connected to AVR (AUX 2 HDMI input), my samsung tv disconnects with message "Disconnecting AnyNet+" and switches to TV input ( i connected the AVR to HDMI 2 Input on the TV). This means the TV is not receiving the signal from the AVR. I need to put AVR in stand by mode and start it again to watch the laptop output on the TV through the AVR. Seems like denon is switching off the HDMI signal output. Is this something wrong with the unit.

3. If i play my iphone or ipod with the AVR in browse mode (two modes available in AVR 1. remote mode 2. browse mode) i see the contents of the ipod / iphone in the TV. After playing the songs after few seconds the display on my TV turns off (something like power save mode) and i need to press back button or option button on the remote to view the contents of my playing song on the TV. This is something like i need to wake up the AVR so that it signals the TV that its awake. Is there any setting (power save or something) on the AVR that is causing this?

4. I have infinity P363 tower speakers (front and surround back) with JBL balboa center channel. My living room size is approximately 12 * 15 ft with carpet floor. The volume coming out of my speakers is very low till i increase the volume on my receiver to 60. After 60 mark i can hear loud enough. Is some setting i need to check on the receiver to increase the volume levels or is it with my speakers? I heard my friend JBL studio 190 towers with onkyo TX-NR1007 and wooden flooring sound very loud with volume at 40 itself. I had the same volume issue with onkyo 709 too. Is this something with my speakers or room or carpet etc or with the receiver?

I am not sure on whether all these are issues or some setup problems on the AVR. Do i need to replace the AVR?

Appreciate anyone help in this regard.
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post #1197 of 10612 Old 07-26-2012, 03:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post

at a $300 budget level and that room size, I already know what the answer is going to be in the subwoofer forum:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16882780078
grab it today while the $200 coupon code is still valid. At $300 no sub is going to hit as hard with as much output and low end extension.
(note that you will also get people in the sub forum saying "save up another $200!" but at a $300 budget this is the current king... the only other potential option would be the BIC PL-200)

sorry for the offtopic but I am building my first HT system and after purchase of B&W 803D as mains, HTM4 as center and 805D as surrounds my next item on the list is 4520. So this and "When do the 2013 Denon's come out?" are only threads I monitor on avsforum in anticipation. The item #2 was Rythmik 15". Would be this Klipsch Reference RW-12d a decent alternative to match my B&W?
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post #1198 of 10612 Old 07-26-2012, 05:06 PM
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Originally Posted by ppvsp View Post

Hi,
I recently bought 3313CI and connected it my samsung 46B650 lcd tv and also to my PS3. I noted couple of problems which i need clarifications on and would really appreciate any help in this regard.

3. If i play my iphone or ipod with the AVR in browse mode (two modes available in AVR 1. remote mode 2. browse mode) i see the contents of the ipod / iphone in the TV. After playing the songs after few seconds the display on my TV turns off (something like power save mode) and i need to press back button or option button on the remote to view the contents of my playing song on the TV. This is something like i need to wake up the AVR so that it signals the TV that its awake. Is there any setting (power save or something) on the AVR that is causing this?
Appreciate anyone help in this regard.

The 2113 denon that I have can be set to display song titles at commencement of song for a brief period, display full time, or have no display. It is in one of the general video settings. It does this during internet radio play and also when streaming from my network. I haven't tried it with an iPod yet but I expect it is the same. Sorry I can't lead you through the menus to the settings but I am away from the HT set up for a couple of days.

Also, just thought about your item 4; the input levels can be increased individually for each source on the 2113 - I had to boost mine up about 6db.

Another thought, item 2; I recall seeing a setting for sleep mode in one of the menus and the default was 2 hours. Not sure this is relevant though.

Item 1; I find that I need to flick the AVR to NETWORK to get it to show a display on the TV (samsung 8 series), then swithch back to the other input (STB, BD etc.) I would like an answer to this one as well!!!!

Regards, David
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post #1199 of 10612 Old 07-26-2012, 06:20 PM
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Thanks a lot David for your inputs. I will try your solutions and let u know the results.

Also i remember seeing sleep mode but not sure why this would kick off while playing content through AVR. If AVR is idle then i can imagine this to kick in.

For point 1, i presume you also have the issue. I didnt try flicking it to network, but this behaviour of switching off the HDMI signal is weird. Did you try talking to Denon on this?
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post #1200 of 10612 Old 07-26-2012, 06:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Athlon646464 View Post

I just picked up a new 2113CI.
I'm wondering about the use of the colored buttons Movie/Music/Game/Pure. Does using those buttons over-ride the Audyssey settings?

These buttons had me confused at first too. I detest effects added to sound, and I thought these buttons were only for that, but it turns out that's not the case.

Pressing Pure bypasses everything and go straight to the speakers. You will get no Audyssey.

Why would you want this? Because Audyssey adds quite a bit of lag to the signal. It has to in order to correct for speaker distance and group delay between speaker cones. So, if you're, say, playing Rock Band on the X-Box, this will add audio lag that you don't want. Press pure, and presto, no Audyssey, no lag.

The other buttons are badly named IMHO. They are really presets for processing modes you would like to use for the digital content being fed to the unit.

Say you are feeding a Blu-Ray signal with DTS audio. Press and hold the green Movie button. Up pops a menu on the screen where you can select which decoding method you wish to use. Want stereo? It's at the top. Standard DTS decoding? It's there. Neo upmix? There too. Maybe you like Neo for movies. Fine. Select Neo. From now on, when you press the Movie button, you'll get Neo.

The options are a little different for each button, but not much. There seems to be a difference between Neo for movies and Neo for music. I have no idea what the difference is. There's also a Dolby game mode on the game button. Again, no clue what that means.

For some reason you can't pick a decoding mode with Pure. You'd think that just bypassing Audyssey wouldn't mean you'd have to stick to a particular decoding method, but it seems that Pure just decodes as "best available" given the digital stream.

Now you pop in an audio DVD. It also feeds DTS. You press and hold music. This time you don't want Neo. You want the pure as-mixed multi-channel audio. Fine. Select DTS. Now you can switch between Neo for movies and DTS for music by pressing the Movie/Music buttons respectively.

Personally I would have preferred dedicated decoding mode buttons on the remote, but whatever. The whole things seems overly complicated, and I don't get why there are different options for each button given the exact same input signal. Regardless, I don't care about all the FX options that are on the menu, so it's either Pure or DTS or Dolby for me... Oh, and Audyssey is amazing. My completely mismatched speakers sound like they are factory paired.
nlpearman likes this.

Chiem

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Hey, what's this silly piece for? Eh, we don't need that. *ZAAAAP!*
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