The **OFFICIAL** Denon AVR-XX13 Model Owner's Thread & FAQ - Page 61 - AVS Forum
Forum Jump: 
Reply
 
Thread Tools
post #1801 of 10594 Old 09-02-2012, 10:01 PM - Thread Starter
AVS Addicted Member
 
batpig's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: San Diego
Posts: 23,723
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 93 Post(s)
Liked: 894
2113ci Review / Part 3 - iPhone app, streaming and web control

Part 1 - Unboxing and Hook-up
Part 2 - Setup and Basic Use
Part 4 - Audyssey calibration and Sound Quality

I'm going to mostly focus on the iPhone app and AirPlay, plus the app's ability to work with Internet Radio and Pandora. A few words initially about the web interface....

I've used the web interface before when setting up a 4311ci and it's essentially the same experience with the 2113ci. You can easily control basic function like volume, surround mode, input, etc. very easily but I think the smartphone app is much slicker for that kind of on-the-fly control.

The real use of the web interface IMO is to be able to quickly access essentially any area of the GUI setup menus directly, without the GUI appearing on screen and annoying other viewers. It's so much faster to work with a mouse/keyboard and a web page interface when doing things like reassigning multiple inputs, renaming inputs or zones, changing video processing or Audyssey settings, logging into your Pandora account (on-screen virtual keyboard = yuck!), and especially checking the Information menu for current input signal, surround mode, HDMI in/out signal status, etc. Plus of course the ability to SAVE/LOAD settings profiles, which honestly I haven't gotten around to doing yet (but have done before on other models). Those of you who haven't looked into this yet, check it out, the added functionality and ease of interface with the deeper functions of the receiver is a real boon.

So on to the other stuff.... as I mentioned before, I am fortunate to have a my router nearby so a simple hardwire ethernet connection was used and I have had zero network hiccups. DHCP works smoothly, I was up and running with internet radio stations within minutes of turning it on for the first time. Pandora also works perfectly. I do not have a SiriusXM account nor do I have any media server network content, so I cannot comment on those aspects.

What makes these features so neat again is the smartphone app control. I have heard others complain about the house Denon app -- and to be honest I have yet to experiment with 3rd party apps -- but I find the Denon app to run quickly and smoothly and allows all the functionality I've desired at this point. Now, I'm not using the iPhone app when watching a movie or something, in those video-viewing situations I'd be using my Harmony. But for sitting on my ass on the couch and quickly dialing up some music (whether Pandora, Internet Radio, or AirPlay), turning Main Zone or Zone 2 on/off and adjusting volume, and selecting sources or surround modes, it's fully functional and easy to use, and a more pleasurable experience than the clunky button interface of a wand-style traditional remote like my Harmony.


Some screencaps of the Denon app for your viewing pleasure:

Boot-up screen...




Here is the primary interface screen:




The main power button is upper right, and eight programmable "quick call" buttons are at the bottom as well as the volume control slider. In the main graphical area on the top, touching the source (e.g. Network) on the left will allow you to switch between inputs/sources, touching the "PLII Music" (in this screen cap) will bring up the surround mode options:



I love the logical grouping by type (the DSP Simu modes like MultiCH Stereo and sillier options like Jazz Hall and Virtual are down below), this is IMO just a much easier way to access surround modes than the ambiguously named Movie, Music, etc buttons.


Back to the eight buttons on the bottom.... by holding down any button for a few seconds, a menu of commands pops up, including surround mode buttons, input buttons, quick selects, favorite radio stations, and many more, any of which can be assigned to any of those eight spots. For example, this is what it looks like after I tweaked a bit:



I set it up so I have surround control buttons on the top row, and then direct access buttons for Internet Radio and Pandora on the button, as well as the "Restorer" toggle. Also note the "Cursor" button.... what's this? Well, tap it and now you can easily access the Denon GUI and control it from your smart phone!




Back to the main screen.... tapping the "Zones" button in the upper left brings you to this screen, which allows you to quickly turn either zone on/off and adjust volume levels. Note that the app picks up on the renamed Zone 2 as "Back Yard". Also note the bottom row of "all Zones" quick hit buttons for mute on/off and power on/off. This is great for when you are leaving the house and just want to shut it all down on your way out the door.




Touching the "Player View" button for either Zone will bring you to the interface which allows you to access and control content, this is Internet Radio:




And this is what Pandora looks like:




With options like this, I have no need for the anachronism that is AM/FM radio! It's so easy to whip out the smartphone and just start playing a radio station from Internet Radio or Pandora. And to reiterate, this is all accessible through the Denon app itself, no need as of yet to jump to any external apps.

The only semi-unfortunate aspect is that you cannot initiate an AirPlay stream through the Denon app itself. You must first leave the Denon app and fire up AirPlay externally, for example through the Music app on my iPhone:




That said, once the AirPlay stream has initiated you can, from that point forward, control AirPlay completely through the Denon app. That includes activating Zone 2 for AirPlay, and then subsequently being able to switch the Main Zone source to something else if you so desire.

But in terms of controlling the AirPlay content itself, once the stream is initiated going to the "Player View" screen brings up a very recognizable iTunes music interface with album art, shuffle/repeat buttons, a track time slider and volume slider:




Hitting the "Library" button in the upper right allows you to access your Playlists, Artists, Albums, etc. just like if you were using the Apple Remote app.




iPhone App / AirPlay Conclusion:

All in all, it's a pretty slick system. This lazy man's dream of being able to grab my phone from my pocket and start music playing in my choice of the living room and/or backyard, without having to grab the Harmony remote, turn on the plasma screen, etc. has been fully realized. In a way, it's reinvigorated my system as a "music box" and not a video system because it's so easy to get the tunes going, and it really streamlines the zone delivery system.

Just to give an example -- let's say SWMBO sends me out back to sweep the patio, water the plants, etc. I get out there, start working, and then realize "this would be better with some tunes." Previously, I would have had to go back inside, grab the Harmony, press the appropriate Activity button, wait 10+ seconds for the receiver to turn on and boot up, the plasma to turn on and go to the right input, and then I would have to get the music going. If I went back outside and decided the volume was wrong, I would have to jump back inside and grab the remote, or at best use the Remote app to control iTunes volume. Not exactly back breaking labor, but just clunky enough to be annoying.

Now, with the 2113ci, I can just pull my phone from my pocket, turn the backyard speakers on, and start my choice of Internet Radio, Pandora, or Airplay and control volume without every having to break stride. In this sense it's a major evolutionary step forward from the 2310ci in the ease and efficiency of delivering music to multiple zones.

As anyone who's read my website or posts for any length of time is aware, I've often been critical of Denon's user interface design (whether GUI / OSD or remotes), but this system is a winner for me. At some point I'll get around to trying some 3rd party control apps as well, but the Denon house setup is plenty slick and useful in my early estimation.
-
Brad Duke likes this.

batpig's "Denon-to-English Dictionary"
Setup Guide and FAQ
http://batpigworld.com/

Become a fan "batpigworld.com" on Facebook!
batpig is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #1802 of 10594 Old 09-02-2012, 11:14 PM
Newbie
 
Shakeeb's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 2
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Thank you for your response. I gathered enough from my testing that zone 2 hdmi connection is not goig to work for zone 2 if Im playing pandora.

The Setup:

1) i have a living room setup with 55" samsung, definitive speakers and mirage satellites for a 7 speaker set up.
2) My master bedroom has a 52" samsung and a yamaha sound bar (ysp1000).The sound bar has no speaker level inputs, only optical and coax, along with rca jacks.
3) My office room has bose 5.1 surround speakers. I only need sound in the room. No video.


My questions would be:
1)How can I make use of all three zones that this avr is capabale of?
2)Do I need to purchase an amplifier between zone2 receiver and bedroom soundbar?
3)D0 I need the same for zone 3?
4) will this setup allow for me to play the same source in all 3 zones? e.g Pandora?

OR

Do I need to reassign the subs from the main room to these zones? Problem being soundbar doesnt have speaker connections.

Again, if you can point me to a post or the right direction, I would greatly appreciate it.
Regards
Shak
Shakeeb is offline  
post #1803 of 10594 Old 09-03-2012, 04:24 AM
585-645-1006
 
jdsmoothie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 42,828
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 276 Post(s)
Liked: 1302
Quote:
Originally Posted by bedpan4u View Post

Wonder if any of my Canadian friends (or knowledgeable Ameri friends) can answer a question.
I picked up a 1713 at futureshop a few weeks ago for $400..
Pondering returning to pickup a refurb 2112 for from accessories4less for about the same price with shipping (to a US address that I will then pickup). I am down in the states at least 4 or 5 times over the next couple of months.
Now the question. Warranty. Anyone know if the Warranty will be honored up here in Canada? Looks like the warranty from accessories4less is a Denon Warranty and not a third party. What about non-refurbs? I know Onkyo is hardcore no warranty support for devices bought outside of Canada. Anyone know with Denon?
Thanks folks. Been stalking the tread for a bit before I pulled the trigger on Denon. Love everyones comments and help here!
Mike

The same applies to Denon, .... the warranty will not be honored in Canada. You should, however, be able to purchase a SquareTrade extended warranty which should be honored in Canada on the unit purchased in the USA.

---------------------------------
"JD" – jd@avscience.com ; shop.avscience.com ; 585-645-1006, AVScience - AVSForum sponsor for 15 years  
Mon - Fri: 8am – 8pm EST (Sat/Sun, leave message)
Call for pricing on Denon, Marantz, Yamaha, Onkyo, Klipsch, Def Tech, Oppo, Parasound 
** Think the AVR is defective?  Reset the microprocessor 4-5 times. 
jdsmoothie is offline  
post #1804 of 10594 Old 09-03-2012, 04:55 AM
585-645-1006
 
jdsmoothie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 42,828
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 276 Post(s)
Liked: 1302
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shakeeb View Post

Thank you for your response. I gathered enough from my testing that zone 2 hdmi connection is not goig to work for zone 2 if Im playing pandora.
The Setup:
1) i have a living room setup with 55" samsung, definitive speakers and mirage satellites for a 7 speaker set up.
2) My master bedroom has a 52" samsung and a yamaha sound bar (ysp1000).The sound bar has no speaker level inputs, only optical and coax, along with rca jacks.
3) My office room has bose 5.1 surround speakers. I only need sound in the room. No video.
My questions would be:
1)How can I make use of all three zones that this avr is capabale of?
2)Do I need to purchase an amplifier between zone2 receiver and bedroom soundbar?
3)D0 I need the same for zone 3?
4) will this setup allow for me to play the same source in all 3 zones? e.g Pandora?
OR
Do I need to reassign the subs from the main room to these zones? Problem being soundbar doesnt have speaker connections.
Again, if you can point me to a post or the right direction, I would greatly appreciate it.
Regards
Shak

Correct, only HDMI sources will pass through the Zone 2 (HDMI) connection.

1. MBR - connect Zone 2 (HDMI) to 52" TV and connect optical audio out from TV to the sound bar.
Office - Connect Zone 3 pre-out to another 5.1 AVR (eg. 1612) and connect the Bose speakers to that AVR. Use DD PLII on 2nd AVR to simulate 5.1 from stereo input from the 3313CI.
2. See #1
3. See #1
4. No. Only HDMI sources will pass through to the Zone 2 (HDMI), and only "analog" connected sources and on board sources (ie. Pandora, internet radio, Airplay) will pass through to the Zone 2/3 pre-outs and powered Amp Assign (Zone 2/3) speaker posts. To get Pandora to the MBR, you could connect a 3rd party device to the TV (eg. used iPod Touch).

---------------------------------
"JD" – jd@avscience.com ; shop.avscience.com ; 585-645-1006, AVScience - AVSForum sponsor for 15 years  
Mon - Fri: 8am – 8pm EST (Sat/Sun, leave message)
Call for pricing on Denon, Marantz, Yamaha, Onkyo, Klipsch, Def Tech, Oppo, Parasound 
** Think the AVR is defective?  Reset the microprocessor 4-5 times. 
jdsmoothie is offline  
post #1805 of 10594 Old 09-03-2012, 10:36 AM
Member
 
STEVEIB7's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 15
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
I understand that this is an owners thread strictly for the 3313, but wanted someone's expert opinion regarding my issue. I am on the fence as to which
receiver to purchase; the 3313 or the Onkyo 818. both receivers have similar specs. the Onkyo is THX certified while the Denon is not, but the Denon
has Airplay, while the Onkyo does not. Any advice would be appreciated.
STEVEIB7 is offline  
post #1806 of 10594 Old 09-03-2012, 11:08 AM
585-645-1006
 
jdsmoothie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 42,828
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 276 Post(s)
Liked: 1302
First off, this thread is for questions on any of the Denon XX13 models (1513 thru the 3313CI) regardless of whether you're an owner or not. Regarding 818 vs. 3313CI, depends on what features you want. As the 818 uses the far more advanced version of Audyssey MultEQ XT32, the better audio fidelity nod goes to the 818. Airplay can be added with an Apple TV (providing both video and audio, whereas on board version only provides audio). The 3313CI adds a new Zone 2(HDMI) feature that can pass independent HDMI source to another room. Past year's Onkyo models have suffered with QA issues on a larger scale then should be expected, so time will tell on the 818. Check in the 818 Owner's thread for current issues with it.

---------------------------------
"JD" – jd@avscience.com ; shop.avscience.com ; 585-645-1006, AVScience - AVSForum sponsor for 15 years  
Mon - Fri: 8am – 8pm EST (Sat/Sun, leave message)
Call for pricing on Denon, Marantz, Yamaha, Onkyo, Klipsch, Def Tech, Oppo, Parasound 
** Think the AVR is defective?  Reset the microprocessor 4-5 times. 
jdsmoothie is offline  
post #1807 of 10594 Old 09-03-2012, 03:57 PM
Member
 
DavidBulluss's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Australia
Posts: 43
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
My 2113 upgraded its firmware just now.... SPOTIFY!

Cheers, David
DavidBulluss is offline  
post #1808 of 10594 Old 09-03-2012, 04:36 PM
585-645-1006
 
jdsmoothie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 42,828
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 276 Post(s)
Liked: 1302
Great! Now we just need someone that has a Premium subscription ($9.99) to check it out to determine if it's working okay. smile.gif

---------------------------------
"JD" – jd@avscience.com ; shop.avscience.com ; 585-645-1006, AVScience - AVSForum sponsor for 15 years  
Mon - Fri: 8am – 8pm EST (Sat/Sun, leave message)
Call for pricing on Denon, Marantz, Yamaha, Onkyo, Klipsch, Def Tech, Oppo, Parasound 
** Think the AVR is defective?  Reset the microprocessor 4-5 times. 
jdsmoothie is offline  
post #1809 of 10594 Old 09-03-2012, 07:04 PM
Member
 
DavidBulluss's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Australia
Posts: 43
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post

Great! Now we just need someone that has a Premium subscription ($9.99) to check it out to determine if it's working okay. smile.gif

First impressions:
Interface for searching for artists is via cursor on the remote, a little slow and annoying. I am hoping that when I try my smart phone and app that it is easier.
I can't find a menu to select things like "gapless play" etc.

Will keep playing with it when I get time.

David
DavidBulluss is offline  
post #1810 of 10594 Old 09-03-2012, 10:40 PM
Newbie
 
coravs's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 8
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post

Although channel levels were saved by surround mode on prior year models, AFAIK, when the "CH LVL" remote adjustment capability was removed from the remote, so to was this feature. Channel level volume settings are now global for all surround modes on the XX13 models.

jdsmoothie - thanks for moving this and for all the help you've provided.

Wow - I feel this is a definite step backwards for the XX13s. Perhaps this information should be in the front of this thread as to the differences between the XX13s and the XX12s? For my needs, I now prefer the XX12s as I find myself wanting to tweak the surround levels often. And it is very disruptive to change the levels via the global setting in the middle of watching / listening via the annoying white noise tone test.

If it helps other XX13 owners, I've mitigated this somewhat via the Quick Selects. Those will store the global channel settings.
coravs is offline  
post #1811 of 10594 Old 09-03-2012, 11:05 PM
Newbie
 
coravs's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 8
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post

in terms of channel levels, as best I can tell this is how it works (note that I haven't run Audyssey yet so I can't comment on the behavior of the "Restore" function yet vis a vis channel levels and different surround modes):
1. Going into the SPEAKERS menu, then Manual Setup > Levels is the only way to globally change all the speaker volumes (as noted above the Center Channel and Subwoofer volumes can be accessed and changed in the AUDIO menu for on-the-fly tweaks).
2. Changing the speaker volumes in the LEVELS menu will reset all the levels globally. That means if you made individual tweaks to a particular surround mode (e.g. multich stereo) they will be wiped out and reset back to the whatever you set in the LEVELS menu.
3. So essentially the LEVELS menu sets the "baseline" from which you can tweak. From there, it appears that channel level volumes are shared globally for all Dolby/DTS surround modes. However, you CAN set independent channel volumes for other types of surround modes, for example STEREO vs. MULTICH STEREO vs. any of the DSP modes (Jazz Hall, Mono Movie, Virtual, etc). EDIT - it also looks like MULTICH IN can have separate levels from the Dolby/DTS surround modes, and DIRECT modes are separate as well.
For example, I put on some music and tweaked the sub ch volume separately for MultiCH Stereo, regular Stereo, and PLII Music / DTS Neo Music. Then I fired up a Netflix stream with Dolby Digital Plus, and the sub volume was the same as I had it for PLII Music. I tweaked the sub volume for Dolby Digital Plus, and then went back to streaming music and the sub volume change carried over to the PLII and DTS Neo modes, but did not carry over for MultiCH Stereo or regular Stereo, Jazz Hall, Virtual, etc.
Since there isn't really a way to adjust anything but the center and the sub without resetting the ch volumes globally (via the LEVELS menu), it appears that in practical usage (unless you have a universal with discrete codes) the independence of channel levels for different surround modes extends only to the Dialogue Level (Center ch) and Subwoofer Level settings.
It also appears that ch levels are shared across inputs.
Quick and Dirty Summary of Ch Level behavior:
1. The LEVELS menu (Speakers > Manual Setup) will reset ch levels globally for ALL surround modes -- after you make tweaks with the test tones and hit "Enter" to finish, this establishes the new baseline for all surround mdoes
2. From that baseline, you can tweak Center Ch (Dialogue Level) and Sub Volume independently for any surround mode, using the AUDIO menu. Note the caveat that all Dolby & DTS modes share common surround levels, however the levels can be independent for any other mode (MultCH Stereo, Multi CH IN, Stereo, Direct, Virtual, etc).

Just want to confirm that tweaking only refers to Center Ch and Sub. In other words, FR, FL, SR, SL will always be the same (set globally) regardless of what mode you are in. Is that correct?
coravs is offline  
post #1812 of 10594 Old 09-04-2012, 02:14 AM
AVS Special Member
 
kiwi2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 1,628
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5 Post(s)
Liked: 144
Quote:
Originally Posted by coravs View Post

Wow - I feel this is a definite step backwards for the XX13s.

I agree. It is almost a dealbreaker for me. I have raised this concern with my local dealer who then suggested, like you have suggested, the Quick Selects would achieve what I need to do. He made it sound like I could configure everything the way I wanted and then save that say as my music setup. Then I could have another setup/configuration that I could select for say, watching DVD/Blu-ray movies. Will I be able to have different speaker level settings and speaker distance settings between the likes of 'Multichannel Stereo' mode and straight Blu-ray playback?

It is very confusing trying to ascertain just what I will be and won't be able to do with the 3313. Apart from buying one and living with it for a couple of weeks. But if it doesn't give me any real practical advantages over my current and perfectly acceptable Yamaha AVR's audio performance, then what's the point of the upgrade..?
kiwi2 is offline  
post #1813 of 10594 Old 09-04-2012, 02:47 AM
Member
 
g12345567's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Sydney, Australia
Posts: 52
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidBulluss View Post

I can't find a menu to select things like "gapless play" etc.
Will keep playing with it when I get time.
David

Denon makes no mention of gapless playback either in the specifications or manual. On the other hand Marantz specifically mention gapless playback via a firmware update in there product information/specifications sheet.
g12345567 is offline  
post #1814 of 10594 Old 09-04-2012, 05:04 AM
585-645-1006
 
jdsmoothie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 42,828
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 276 Post(s)
Liked: 1302
Quote:
Originally Posted by coravs View Post

jdsmoothie - thanks for moving this and for all the help you've provided.
Wow - I feel this is a definite step backwards for the XX13s. Perhaps this information should be in the front of this thread as to the differences between the XX13s and the XX12s? For my needs, I now prefer the XX12s as I find myself wanting to tweak the surround levels often. And it is very disruptive to change the levels via the global setting in the middle of watching / listening via the annoying white noise tone test.
If it helps other XX13 owners, I've mitigated this somewhat via the Quick Selects. Those will store the global channel settings.

+1

@batpig - good idea to update post #1 with new volume level and Dialogue Level information

---------------------------------
"JD" – jd@avscience.com ; shop.avscience.com ; 585-645-1006, AVScience - AVSForum sponsor for 15 years  
Mon - Fri: 8am – 8pm EST (Sat/Sun, leave message)
Call for pricing on Denon, Marantz, Yamaha, Onkyo, Klipsch, Def Tech, Oppo, Parasound 
** Think the AVR is defective?  Reset the microprocessor 4-5 times. 
jdsmoothie is offline  
post #1815 of 10594 Old 09-04-2012, 05:05 AM
585-645-1006
 
jdsmoothie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 42,828
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 276 Post(s)
Liked: 1302
Quote:
Originally Posted by g12345567 View Post

Denon makes no mention of gapless playback either in the specifications or manual. On the other hand Marantz specifically mention gapless playback via a firmware update in there product information/specifications sheet.

The same firmware update is coming to the Denon XX12 and XX13 models at some point in the future.

---------------------------------
"JD" – jd@avscience.com ; shop.avscience.com ; 585-645-1006, AVScience - AVSForum sponsor for 15 years  
Mon - Fri: 8am – 8pm EST (Sat/Sun, leave message)
Call for pricing on Denon, Marantz, Yamaha, Onkyo, Klipsch, Def Tech, Oppo, Parasound 
** Think the AVR is defective?  Reset the microprocessor 4-5 times. 
jdsmoothie is offline  
post #1816 of 10594 Old 09-04-2012, 05:08 AM
585-645-1006
 
jdsmoothie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 42,828
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 276 Post(s)
Liked: 1302
Spotify Update

Although already issued to regions outside the USA/CA, the Spotify firmware update is scheduled to be released to the USA/CA models by the end of this week. As a reminder, this update is for the XX13 networking models only.

---------------------------------
"JD" – jd@avscience.com ; shop.avscience.com ; 585-645-1006, AVScience - AVSForum sponsor for 15 years  
Mon - Fri: 8am – 8pm EST (Sat/Sun, leave message)
Call for pricing on Denon, Marantz, Yamaha, Onkyo, Klipsch, Def Tech, Oppo, Parasound 
** Think the AVR is defective?  Reset the microprocessor 4-5 times. 
jdsmoothie is offline  
post #1817 of 10594 Old 09-04-2012, 08:15 AM
Newbie
 
kryptonite5's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 8
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
My Denon 2113 in India just auto-updated to firmware ver. 1490-0119-0000-1410-5737 today!
kryptonite5 is offline  
post #1818 of 10594 Old 09-04-2012, 09:27 AM
Senior Member
 
Krutsch's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Minnetonka, MN
Posts: 403
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 36
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post

The same firmware update is coming to the Denon XX12 and XX13 models at some point in the future.

Wait, what? I can't find the start of this discussion, but are you talking about gapless playback of FLAC via DLNA to the XX13 models?

Thanks, in advance.

"Play the volume as loud as you want - but don't touch my levels now. I got them set just like I like them"
Krutsch is offline  
post #1819 of 10594 Old 09-04-2012, 09:36 AM
Senior Member
 
Iain-'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: UK
Posts: 479
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Liked: 37
Quote:
Originally Posted by Krutsch View Post

Wait, what? I can't find the start of this discussion, but are you talking about gapless playback of FLAC via DLNA to the XX13 models?
Thanks, in advance.
Starting @ post #1809, this page.
Iain- is offline  
post #1820 of 10594 Old 09-04-2012, 09:41 AM
Senior Member
 
Krutsch's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Minnetonka, MN
Posts: 403
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 36
Quote:
Originally Posted by Iain- View Post

Starting @ post #1809, this page.

Got it... thanks. I take it the gapless discussion is specific to Spotify (I didn't know Spotify supported such a thing, but I don't use it regularly).

"Play the volume as loud as you want - but don't touch my levels now. I got them set just like I like them"
Krutsch is offline  
post #1821 of 10594 Old 09-04-2012, 09:44 AM - Thread Starter
AVS Addicted Member
 
batpig's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: San Diego
Posts: 23,723
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 93 Post(s)
Liked: 894
Quote:
Originally Posted by coravs View Post

Just want to confirm that tweaking only refers to Center Ch and Sub. In other words, FR, FL, SR, SL will always be the same (set globally) regardless of what mode you are in. Is that correct?

Well here's the thing -- you don't really have a way to do on-the-fly adjustments to the other channels beyond the Center Ch and the Sub. You can access both of these in the AUDIO menu (Dialogue Level and Subwoofer Level) and the changes will "stick" for different surround modes. However, changing the channel levels for the other channels requires going to the SPEAKERS menu and running the test tones, which I found in my testing then wipes out all the channel levels and resets the baseline for all surround modes.

So on a practical level, you are basically limited to tweaking the center and sub for different surround modes. For most people this will be more than good enough, as dialogue and bass (as I noted above) are the two things most people really care about tweaking on a regular basis.

Now, if you have a programmable universal there ARE discrete commands for speaker volume for each channel. On my Harmony I only programmed the volume codes for center channel and subwoofer as that's all I ever needed (reinforcing the point I just made). But my gut is that channel level changes would "stick" for each surround mode provided you could find a way to access them. I do have the other codes so I can test this out, although I may not be able to get to it for a few days.

As I'm writing this, however, it just occurred to me that you CAN access all your speaker levels via the web browser interface. So that is something that is easy for an owner to test -- this may be a way that you can tweak any speaker level for each surround mode. The question is whether the Ch Level interface in the web browser will exhibit the same behavior as that in the SPEAKERS menu, and reset the global levels for all surround modes.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kiwi2 
Will I be able to have different speaker level settings and speaker distance settings between the likes of 'Multichannel Stereo' mode and straight Blu-ray playback?

Levels yes, not distances.... but why on earth would you want to vary speaker distance for a different surround mode? Are you moving your speakers around?

Quote:
But if it doesn't give me any real practical advantages over my current and perfectly acceptable Yamaha AVR's audio performance, then what's the point of the upgrade..?

well, for one thing you are getting the network features, which as I detailed in my review posts gives you a really slick network audio interface for Pandora, AirPlay, etc. And the web browser control from a laptop or PC is pretty sweet as well.

secondarily, I think you are discounting the potential jump in audio performance. I ran MultEQ XT yesterday and have been doing a lot of listening (will post a more detailed review later today) but the audio performance is outstanding, I actually think it's a subtle but definite step forward from my 2310ci. Some combination of the change from MultEQ to XT and probably some DSP tweaks has brought a new level of smoothness, clarity and detail to my 5.1 speaker setup.

batpig's "Denon-to-English Dictionary"
Setup Guide and FAQ
http://batpigworld.com/

Become a fan "batpigworld.com" on Facebook!
batpig is offline  
post #1822 of 10594 Old 09-04-2012, 11:14 AM
Senior Member
 
Krutsch's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Minnetonka, MN
Posts: 403
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 36
Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post

t
* Audyssey DSX, dual HDMI outputs, and DSD over HDMI available in 2313ci and above

Hi All,

Would anyone be able to confirm that DSD over HDMI is available on 2313ci? I looked at the product page for that model and it is NOT listed (i.e. the "HDMI SACD" box is not checked in the Specifications -> Connectivity section). May be a typo on Denon's part, but I would like to confirm that this is the case, one way or the other.

Thanks.

"Play the volume as loud as you want - but don't touch my levels now. I got them set just like I like them"
Krutsch is offline  
post #1823 of 10594 Old 09-04-2012, 11:49 AM - Thread Starter
AVS Addicted Member
 
batpig's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: San Diego
Posts: 23,723
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 93 Post(s)
Liked: 894
never trust the product page specs completely. The manual is your best reference, and mentions of DSD input are plenty in the 2313ci manual.

batpig's "Denon-to-English Dictionary"
Setup Guide and FAQ
http://batpigworld.com/

Become a fan "batpigworld.com" on Facebook!
batpig is offline  
post #1824 of 10594 Old 09-04-2012, 11:59 AM
Senior Member
 
Krutsch's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Minnetonka, MN
Posts: 403
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 36
Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post

never trust the product page specs completely. The manual is your best reference, and mentions of DSD input are plenty in the 2313ci manual.

FWIW, I had downloaded and looked at the manual, but didn't catch the first time through the DSD notations on the Sound Mode table.

I appreciate your help.

"Play the volume as loud as you want - but don't touch my levels now. I got them set just like I like them"
Krutsch is offline  
post #1825 of 10594 Old 09-04-2012, 12:36 PM
585-645-1006
 
jdsmoothie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 42,828
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 276 Post(s)
Liked: 1302
Quote:
Originally Posted by Krutsch View Post

Got it... thanks. I take it the gapless discussion is specific to Spotify (I didn't know Spotify supported such a thing, but I don't use it regularly).

In this discussion regarding the gapless upgrade, it refers to the ALAC and FLAC audio codecs, while Spotify is a music streaming service.

---------------------------------
"JD" – jd@avscience.com ; shop.avscience.com ; 585-645-1006, AVScience - AVSForum sponsor for 15 years  
Mon - Fri: 8am – 8pm EST (Sat/Sun, leave message)
Call for pricing on Denon, Marantz, Yamaha, Onkyo, Klipsch, Def Tech, Oppo, Parasound 
** Think the AVR is defective?  Reset the microprocessor 4-5 times. 
jdsmoothie is offline  
post #1826 of 10594 Old 09-04-2012, 02:57 PM
AVS Special Member
 
kiwi2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 1,628
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5 Post(s)
Liked: 144
Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post

Levels yes, not distances.... but why on earth would you want to vary speaker distance for a different surround mode?

My Yamaha AVR has a '7ch Stereo' mode that simply puts 2ch material into all of the other channels. Just like Denon's 'Multichannel Stereo' mode, except with the Yamaha, 7ch Stereo mode has adjustable parameters of percentage of volume to the other channels from 0 to 100% in 1% increments. Between that and a touch of delay to the surround speakers makes for a very adjustable soundfield. If all speakers are set up to the exact true distance and all volumes are at 100%, then it is just like having a peer of headphones on. Adding a touch of delay to the surround speakers by having their physical distance 10 or 20 or 50mm further back than the settings in the AVR and reducing their volume to around 60% gives a soundstage that is still basically upfront, but very wide and deep and still with very good focus and localisation.

Delay to the surround speakers is standard practice for such a setup. DSP programs will no doubt also utilise delay to the other speakers to help tailor its soundfilled. If using something like DSX, then yes, you would want speaker distance set accurately to the true physical distance, as it will have its own delays.

The trouble with my Yamaha AVR, is that speaker distances are only adjustable in 100mm steps... which is pretty crude for what I am trying to do. Denon can be adjusted in 10mm steps which will be far easier to fine tune. So if I end up using Denon's Multichannel Stereo mode, I would like to be able to adjust speaker level volume and speaker distance independent of other modes like DSX or straight blu-ray playback.
kiwi2 is offline  
post #1827 of 10594 Old 09-04-2012, 03:22 PM
Member
 
DavidBulluss's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Australia
Posts: 43
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Krutsch View Post

Got it... thanks. I take it the gapless discussion is specific to Spotify (I didn't know Spotify supported such a thing, but I don't use it regularly).

When using Spotify with my android phone there is an option for gapless play and also for cross fade. Works fine.

David
DavidBulluss is offline  
post #1828 of 10594 Old 09-04-2012, 03:26 PM
Member
 
DavidBulluss's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Australia
Posts: 43
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post

The same firmware update is coming to the Denon XX12 and XX13 models at some point in the future.

I hope there is a menu to go with the gapless play update. I can't find anyway of setting up playlists, only a very slow and laborious way of "starring" individual tracks. I can also not find a way of playing whole albums. The Spotify on the 2113 is currently as close to useless as it could be, IMHO.

David
DavidBulluss is offline  
post #1829 of 10594 Old 09-04-2012, 03:26 PM
Member
 
Strider-'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 121
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 13
Shame that spotify isn't available in Canada. frown.gif And unlike Netflix, it's harder to fake out with a VPN since it requires a US based credit card.
Strider- is offline  
post #1830 of 10594 Old 09-04-2012, 04:12 PM
585-645-1006
 
jdsmoothie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 42,828
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 276 Post(s)
Liked: 1302
Should be available soon .... smile.gif

http://www.cultofmac.com/186345/spotify-is-about-to-arrive-in-canada-possibly-expand-into-asia-and-south-america/

---------------------------------
"JD" – jd@avscience.com ; shop.avscience.com ; 585-645-1006, AVScience - AVSForum sponsor for 15 years  
Mon - Fri: 8am – 8pm EST (Sat/Sun, leave message)
Call for pricing on Denon, Marantz, Yamaha, Onkyo, Klipsch, Def Tech, Oppo, Parasound 
** Think the AVR is defective?  Reset the microprocessor 4-5 times. 
jdsmoothie is offline  
Reply Receivers, Amps, and Processors

Tags
Denon Avr 1513 Receiver , Denon Avr 1613 Receiver , Denon Avr 1713 Receiver , Denon Avr 1913 Receiver , Denon Avr 2113ci Receiver , Denon Avr 2313ci Receiver , Denon Avr 3313ci Receiver , Denon
Gear in this thread

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off