Official Pioneer SC-68/67 Thread - Page 22 - AVS Forum
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post #631 of 1849 Old 12-21-2012, 01:25 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FilmMixer View Post

It's been mentioned in a review I read on high def digest... not a Pioneer issue I suppose.

yeah, sometime this afternoon I came across a post or 2 about it in one of the Denon threads I think.

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post #632 of 1849 Old 12-21-2012, 01:34 PM - Thread Starter
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I have a question.

I've just discovered Internet Radio & figured out how it works in the receiver but I'm confused about the vtuner registration redface.gif is it needed to get something?

because I get hundreds of channels from the US country list, without doing anything to register it online or on the radio-pioneer web page. the manual mentions it but I have no idea what it's supposed to do for you - get more channels or something else? confused.gif

I'm a newbie on internet radio anyway...

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post #633 of 1849 Old 12-21-2012, 01:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bbear View Post

Help - unable to install the USB-DAC driver..quote]

I can't recall the details but I followed instructions and got it installed on my Windows 7 without any problem. Other people on the forum has intalled fine on XP as well. I didn't copy anything manually to my PC. I think this is how I did it - insert Navigator CD into PC and select install usb-dac which downloads the driver to your PC, then connect the usb cable, select usb-dac as the input, your PC should automatically install the driver at that time.
Hope this help.
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post #634 of 1849 Old 12-21-2012, 01:46 PM - Thread Starter
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^^
+1 no problem for me either but that was when I first got it so don't remember exactly what I did but it wasn't anything special. WinXP Tablet PC edition. I don't remember if I got any kind of confirmation dialog box after installation.

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post #635 of 1849 Old 12-21-2012, 01:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by soniky View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by bbear View Post

Help - unable to install the USB-DAC driver..quote]
I can't recall the details but I followed instructions and got it installed on my Windows 7 without any problem. Other people on the forum has intalled fine on XP as well. I didn't copy anything manually to my PC. I think this is how I did it - insert Navigator CD into PC and select install usb-dac which downloads the driver to your PC, then connect the usb cable, select usb-dac as the input, your PC should automatically install the driver at that time.
Hope this help.

Thanks, at least I know others using XP have had success.

I am going to install AVNavigator on my XP computer, maybe it needs that to somehow enable the driver installation to complete. Failing that, I will try installing on my work laptop (also XP Pro) and see if that works. My laptop is not a solution however, but at least it will give me another data point.
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post #636 of 1849 Old 12-21-2012, 01:55 PM
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Originally Posted by ss9001 View Post

^^
+1 no problem for me either but that was when I first got it so don't remember exactly what I did but it wasn't anything special. WinXP Tablet PC edition. I don't remember if I got any kind of confirmation dialog box after installation.

I wonder if the SC-68 is being shipped with different versions of the CD? I could not find the files for the CD anywhere on the Pioneer website so presumably the CDs being shipped are the only one which is available at the moment.

I did hit the problem the other day when I had to copy the files off the CD in order to install AVNavigator (read that tip in this thread I think). The way the CD has been built seems a little 'flakey', or at least that is my experience trying to run it on XP
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post #637 of 1849 Old 12-21-2012, 01:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ss9001 View Post

I have a question.
I've just discovered Internet Radio & figured out how it works in the receiver but I'm confused about the vtuner registration redface.gif is it needed to get something?

because I get hundreds of channels from the US country list, without doing anything to register it online or on the radio-pioneer web page. the manual mentions it but I have no idea what it's supposed to do for you - get more channels or something else? confused.gif
I'm a newbie on internet radio anyway...

Steve,
From what I remember from my SC-57 ownership, the VTuner registration is more about customization: being able to add URLs for streams that might not be in the Vtuner catalog, or to develop station lists outside of the regional/genre ones that are defined within the software.
That might be useful if you want to create a specialized list of favorite stations or a different sub-menu breakdown (e.g. 'Sport Talk Radio' or the like).

If you mostly listen to stations in a specific area, or a small number, it's just a bell and whistle. The adding URL thing might be handy if you have stations that only play in embedded players (assuming you can ID the actual stream URL), or for ones that have changed their URL but haven't had their entry updated.

BTW, between vTuner, dedicated station websites, and iPhone apps, I've been listening to Internet radio for almost a decade. These days about the only thing we use a terrestrial radio for is traffic and sports, when AT&T reception is acting up, or we're lazy...

Stuart

 

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post #638 of 1849 Old 12-21-2012, 02:06 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bbear View Post

Thanks, at least I know others using XP have had success.
I am going to install AVNavigator on my XP computer, maybe it needs that to somehow enable the driver installation to complete. Failing that, I will try installing on my work laptop (also XP Pro) and see if that works. My laptop is not a solution however, but at least it will give me another data point.

I checked files to see what was installed. In windows-system32-drivers, at least these 3 will be there after installation:

usb20asiop.dll
usb20asiop.ini
PioneerNap.sys

By all means, try it on another PC. My laptop is a Tosh with XP Tablet PC edition. And last year, I discovered much to my surprise that the software for the SVS EQ1 audyssey sub EQ'r couldn't recognize the EQ1 over USB on that laptop but it worked with std XP Pro on a desktop and another laptop. In talking to SVS, neither they or Audyssey tested it or verified it with XP Tablet PC version. I tried each USB port on the Tosh & even tho the software installed OK it never recognized the device. never had that problem with any USB device before or since.

the disc structure has 3 directories with all the files, one each for XP, Vista & W7 so the installation seems to be OS specific probably determined by the installer.

also, try a shorter USB cable. when I installed it I used a cable <=6 ft to the receiver & obviously had the receiver turned on to complete installation...no problems.

you don't need AV Nav installed, just click on the box for USB-DAC driver on the 1st splash screen after the disc spins up. then accept the license, and it will pop up with the usual file run-save box, click run, Installshield starts up and goes to normal windows program installation screen. I just tried mine again and the only radio button option available for me was to remove the driver so I couldn't test the installation any further.

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post #639 of 1849 Old 12-21-2012, 02:24 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sdrucker View Post


stu, thanks for the help. I'll take help even from ex-Pioneer owners wink.gifbiggrin.gif

you explained things perfectly, I understand now. Pioneer could have explained it a whole lot better (sigh)...Denon is probably no different. the companies probably assume that everyone by now is familiar with how vtuner works. none of my Pioneer's ever had internet radio capability, even the susano didn't have it so I am really new to this redface.gif

even luddites like me eventually get modernized wink.giftongue.gif

have a great holiday!

Steve
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post #640 of 1849 Old 12-21-2012, 02:29 PM
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Originally Posted by ss9001 View Post

stu, thanks for the help.
you explained things perfectly, understand now. Pioneer could have explained it a whole lot better (sigh)...Denon is probably no different.

Well, since you asked tongue.gif ... I found their interface more responsive, and less likely to crash than Pioneer's when I had the SC-27 or 57. Otherwise it's the same principle for signup (although I often use the "recently played" station list as my version of favorites).

Regardless, either manual leaves a lot to be desired. Pity there's not a Pioneer version of Batpig's guide....

Stuart

 

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post #641 of 1849 Old 12-21-2012, 07:23 PM
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Originally Posted by ss9001 View Post

I checked files to see what was installed. In windows-system32-drivers, at least these 3 will be there after installation:
usb20asiop.dll
usb20asiop.ini
PioneerNap.sys
.

Thanks for the list of files, I have not had a chance to check for them yet but I will definitely do so the next time I can get access to the equipment (I just got booted off as someone wanted to watch TV)

I used a shorter USB cable (about 2ft and with gold contacts) but it didn't help. Also out of desperation I tried installing AVNav on the computer which I am trying to install the USB driver. Again, I hit the problem with not being able to install that from the CD so I copied the CD contents to hard drive and was able to install the AVNav that way. Unfortunately having AVNav on the computer didn't help with being able to install the USB driver frown.gif

I also tried running the setup from the XP folder from the copy of the CD, but that didn't help either.

The sequence you describe is exactly the same as I see except that I never get past the part where it asks me to connect the USB cable.

I have been in touch with the person who sold me the SC-68 and they have asked the Pioneer rep to call me. Hopefully this will happen over the next day or so but being the holiday season I accept that I may have to wait a while.

I knew I might have a few issues setting up my SC-68 but I never dreamt it would be an issue with something as basic as installing a USB driver. Make me seriously question how well Pioneer tested the CD before they released it.
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post #642 of 1849 Old 12-21-2012, 07:52 PM
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Originally Posted by bbear View Post

I knew I might have a few issues setting up my SC-68 but I never dreamt it would be an issue with something as basic as installing a USB driver. Make me seriously question how well Pioneer tested the CD before they released it.

Just in case there is more than one version of the CD out there, my disk has a number on it (in very small leters): ARU7029-A
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post #643 of 1849 Old 12-21-2012, 08:22 PM
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has anyone had the chance to compare the SC-68/67 vs. NAD T757.....? As far as sound quality goes which is better...? i'm confused between these two. no chance to demo together.

Thanks,

Rana

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post #644 of 1849 Old 12-21-2012, 08:30 PM
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Hi Soniky,Thanks for your input

I do have HDMI connected and Pandora is working - kinda. Please tell me how to give a thumbs up or down and advance to the next song. The only control I can get to work for Pandora is resume play. I am still missing something obvious.Sounds good though on my 2.1 speakers though. I have hi bit enabled, Slow filter, 1080i, phase on.
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post #645 of 1849 Old 12-21-2012, 09:24 PM
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RE: problems installing USB-DAC driver on XP machine ..

Tonight I tried installing the USB DAC driver on my work laptop which is also running XP Pro SP3. The driver also failed to install, with exactly the same symptoms as reported earlier.

After the failed install I had a look for those three files under system32, but none of them were there.

Then I decided to look under the Event Properties, under Computer Administration. For the two times I attempted the installation I see the same error reported..

"The cmiainfo service failed to start due to the following error:
The system cannot find the file specified"

I am convinced now that either the CD is damaged, or has been built badly and is missing some critical file!

I am hoping that the Pioneer rep (assuming he calls me) will be able to shed some light on this.
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post #646 of 1849 Old 12-21-2012, 09:57 PM
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Originally Posted by bbear View Post

I am convinced now that either the CD is damaged, or has been built badly and is missing some critical file!

I just remembered that when put the CD in my computer one of the options it offers is to install the manual. For the manual there are two options, English and French

I am wondering if this is a CD specifically for the Canadian market? Maybe this version of the CD is faulty

For anyone outside of Canada, would you mind slipping your CD into your computer and seeing if it offers the two languages?

If not, then maybe there is a US specific version, and perhaps that one doesn't have the issue with the missing file??
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post #647 of 1849 Old 12-22-2012, 03:21 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rana_kirti View Post

has anyone had the chance to compare the SC-68/67 vs. NAD T757.....? As far as sound quality goes which is better...? i'm confused between these two. no chance to demo together.

no but a key factor will be Pioneer MCACC vs Audyssey. NAD does not use the most advanced version of Audyssey, they have used MultiEQXT instead of paying the cost to go to Multi32XT. NAD is a good name & known for excellent gear & conservatively rated amps. I can't help you with a direct ears 1:1 comparison sorry...I can give you my own thoughts on the 2, not including actual listening auditions.

to be honest, I have considered NAD as an alternative to Pioneer but the fact that Denon has used the best form of Audyssey while NAD stays with older & less advanced versions keeps NAD off my own list. but that is only my own opinion.

and even if you can't directly compare them, you could
1. audition each one at respective dealers, hopefully in similar room layouts, and ideally with same speakers
2. download each one's manual and familiarize yourself with each one's features

I admit to personal bias in what I'm about to tell you but for my tastes & what the 2 companies offer, I'd take the SC-68 any day of the week over the NAD due to several unique features the 68 has, and NAD not having the best form of Audyssey room correction. for me the only reason to consider an alternative to Pioneer is to get Audyssey and if I was going to do that, I might as well get the best flavor of Audyssey wink.gif

If I were looking at options to the SC-68, I'd consider a Denon 4520 or Marantz 8801 prepro long before a NAD, just because of the Audyssey version. you may have totally different needs & desired features than me smile.gif

if you haven't done so yet, downloading product sheets & manuals will help on what each offers in features & functionality. that is something owners can help you with if you have questions.

good luck, let us know how your shopping goes
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post #648 of 1849 Old 12-22-2012, 03:45 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rana_kirti View Post

has anyone had the chance to compare the SC-68/67 vs. NAD T757.....? As far as sound quality goes which is better...? i'm confused between these two. no chance to demo together.

actually, I'm going to amend my suggestions smile.gif I've downloaded the T757 manual and looked over its setup and Audyssey features.

this is a no-brainer - the 757 is not even in the same ballpark as what the SC-68 has & does. if you're seriously interested in NAD, the only receiver worth comparing with the SC-68 is their flagship T787, the T757 is way behind the Pioneer SC-68 technologically.

While NAD doesn't say, the version of Audyssey in the 757 looks to be one of the basic versions not even as advanced as the MultiEQXT version in the T787. and certainly not as advanced as Pioneer's room EQ. I say this because NAD specifically states Audyssey MultiEQXT in their lit on the 787 but doesn't even mention Audyssey or display the name anywhere in their specs except in the manual. And the setup menu is far less advanced than what's in the Pioneer.

and on top of that, even though NAD rates its amps conservatively, the 757 is only a 7 X 60 wpc amp! while the SC-68 is 9 X 140 wpc and is capable of maintaining high power 5 & 7 channels driven at same time. amplifier comparsion is not even close. The NAD also only has Dolby ProLogic IIx and DTS Neo6, so is using 10 yr old matrix processing, doesn't do height or width channels if you have any interest in expanding past 7.1. The SC-68 has all the latest, PLIIz & dts NeoX. the list goes on but I hope I made my point wink.gif

the 757 is possibly less costly but also far less advanced receiver than the SC-68, not even in the same league. if you want to compare the 757 with a Pioneer, you should be looking at the SC-61 for a better comparison or the T787 with the SC-68.

to repeat, the only NAD I would compare the SC-68 with is the T787 or don't bother....there are much better alternatives.

my 2c...
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post #649 of 1849 Old 12-22-2012, 03:58 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bbear View Post

Just in case there is more than one version of the CD out there, my disk has a number on it (in very small leters): ARU7029-A

same CD# as what came in my US SC-68.

weird, for XP you wouldn't have to do a "install as admin" that Vista/W7 users sometimes have to do to install software, so I'm at a loss. you did say XP Pro and not a Media Center edition? just XP Professional?

and you tried on more than 1 PC? I wonder if your error meant if couldn't find a file on your hard drive to start this service not missing a file on your CD? is it possible you have some hard drive/windows corruption? I think you said it was a clean OS install but you didn't mention if you had done service pack update.

I'll root around my XP files & services shortly & see if I can find something useful.

Steve
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post #650 of 1849 Old 12-22-2012, 04:24 AM - Thread Starter
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OK bbear, I googled cmiainfo and don't know if this will help but...

cmiainfo is associated with a C-Media audio driver. apparently there's something not present in your XP OS, missing driver, or not running correctly. My Toshiba uses Realtek sound & has CMedia installed, according to the registry. I also found from googling "Realtek Cmedia" a site with reference to service pack 2, that some have needed to reinstall CMedia drivers. My OS is SP3, with the all the latest updates incl the latest .Net Frameworks. You didn't mention but if you aren't updated with SP3, that may be part of the problem.

if you know how to check your registry...regedit...look for a CMedia key under HKEY_CurrentUser_Software. if it's not there, I suspect that may be the issue...what I don't know is it's from the Pioneer disc (IMO, I doubt it comes from the disc since IIRC, CMedia had long been present on my laptop) or from Windows XP installation or Service Packs. mine is an imaged drive so the install was pre-done. and it's possible it's from your PC vendor, since I found reference to Asus motherboard on one of the search returns.

maybe you can 1) verify with Pioneer if it's supposed to get installed by their disc 2) do an add hardware, sound card drivers, and see if the driver is anywhere in cab files or your XP disc or 3) last resort & riskiest, install from a driver site off web but I don't have a clue which specific C-Media driver(s) to install 4) get advice from Pioneer or Microsoft what to do.

mine is a work laptop so I can't fool around experimenting installing drivers...I used to do that kind of stuff all the time with my own PC's just to learn things when I was building them. if I made a big boo boo, I just wiped out the partition and started over eek.gif it was fun for a lot of years but I don't have too much patience for it now - now I hate it when I have to "maintain" my wife's PC tongue.gif

hopefully, u won't have to do PC/OS stuff and you just have a had CD wink.gifsmile.gif

keep us posted...

Steve
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post #651 of 1849 Old 12-22-2012, 09:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by davehale View Post

Hi Soniky,Thanks for your input
I do have HDMI connected and Pandora is working - kinda. Please tell me how to give a thumbs up or down and advance to the next song. The only control I can get to work for Pandora is resume play. I am still missing something obvious.Sounds good though on my 2.1 speakers though. I have hi bit enabled, Slow filter, 1080i, phase on.
Dave

I uploaded the Pandora display on my monitor. The first one is before playing. The second one is when playing. You don't get too many choices like you get on a PC though. I can't find a way to give a thumb up/down, but to advance to the next song you press the double right arrow key under - preset + on the remote. I've not changed any HDMI settings at all, just whatever is the default. If your TV is not showing anything, try power it down and on to re-initiate HDMI handshake with sc-68. (Has it ever showing anything from sc-68? If not, make sure you select HDMI as input on the TV or check the cable)


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post #652 of 1849 Old 12-22-2012, 10:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ss9001 View Post

OK bbear, I googled cmiainfo and don't know if this will help but...
cmiainfo is associated with a C-Media audio driver. apparently there's something not present in your XP OS, missing driver, or not running correctly. My Toshiba uses Realtek sound & has CMedia installed, according to the registry. I also found from googling "Realtek Cmedia" a site with reference to service pack 2, that some have needed to reinstall CMedia drivers. My OS is SP3, with the all the latest updates incl the latest .Net Frameworks. You didn't mention but if you aren't updated with SP3, that may be part of the problem.

Both computers are running XP Pro SP3
Both computers have SoundMax Integrated HD Audio
I checked the registry on both computers and there is no Cmedia entry under HKEY_CURRENT_USER/Software

So, I think you have hit the nail on the head!

Pioneer look to have built a CD requiring third part software (i.e. Cmedia) to already be installed on the users computer.

Question is, even if I could obtain the Cmedia drivers, how could I install them when I don't have Cmedia hardware, and what negative effect might that have on my computer?

I hope Pioneer will contact me soon because I am really not happy that I can't use one of the main features for which I purchased this receiver mad.gif
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post #653 of 1849 Old 12-22-2012, 11:39 AM
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Pandora,
Thanks again Sinoky for those pictures. I was sweating it there for awhile. I have exactly what you have. Unfortunately I received my answer from Pandora

Thanks for writing. It looks like you've been answered on the AV forum.

We don't design the apps in house. In this case, Pioneer has used our API to design and create the app and it is possible that they have left out certain features on the web app. This is unfortunate and I would encourage you to share your feedback with Pioneer.

Let me know if I can help you with anything else!
Thanks,
Ben
Listener Advocate
PANDORA® internet radio


So now I know OPPO excellent API design, Denon good API design, Pioneer a work in progress.

Dave
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post #654 of 1849 Old 12-22-2012, 01:40 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by bbear View Post

I hope Pioneer will contact me soon because I am really not happy that I can't use one of the main features for which I purchased this receiver mad.gif

I wouldn't give up hope yet. I'm only going by the error message you mentioned which may or may not be related smile.gif

From what I've found by searches, Cmedia makes USB audio chips & drivers/codecs for sound cards so you may still be OK depending on what Pioneer says. it's possible it's what's in the SC-68 and that it's the driver itself that the disc is supposed to install for the PC to communicate. again, it may still be a defective disc smile.gif

all I can do is throw out possibilities based on the info you got back from Windows services. see what Pioneer has to say. I hope they can help sort it out for you.

Steve
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post #655 of 1849 Old 12-22-2012, 03:08 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by davehale View Post

Hi Soniky,Thanks for your input
I do have HDMI connected and Pandora is working - kinda. Please tell me how to give a thumbs up or down and advance to the next song. The only control I can get to work for Pandora is resume play. I am still missing something obvious.Sounds good though on my 2.1 speakers though. I have hi bit enabled, Slow filter, 1080i, phase on.
Dave

I can't directly speak to Pandora but I was stumped how to navigate the Internet Radio settings with the Pio remote, none of the up/down, < > buttons did anything. The iphone app worked just fine, so I got out the manual and you have to hit the "Net" button first on the remote, then its nav buttons work on the menu. The menu for Pandora may work the same way. Try it...smile.gif

also, I haven't gotten my URC programmable remote's nav buttons to work on the Internet Radio yet. Either the discrete codes aren't in the list or I didn't program them. But at least the Pioneer remote & iphone work very well.

Steve
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post #656 of 1849 Old 12-22-2012, 04:01 PM
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Pandora,

OK ss9001 that helped. It is a 3 button push -1) Try to find in the dark w/o your glasses and hit the Net button then 2) By finger feel locate and hit the Video Parameter/Menu Tools Button to 3) Hit your thumbs up/down. Much too complicated in my opinion. There shoulb be an additional icon or 2 on screen to eliminate #2 by navigating using the arrows and Enter butoon while looking on screen. Just my opinion. Thanks for all your help
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post #657 of 1849 Old 12-22-2012, 04:10 PM
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Pandora

Just one more thing if I may. My Denon lights up the TV for 15 seconds when a new song begins to play in Pandora so as to check out the title and goes dark each time until a new song plays. Is this possible with the Pioneer? as that feature is worthwhile.
Dave
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post #658 of 1849 Old 12-22-2012, 07:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ss9001 View Post

I wouldn't give up hope yet. I'm only going by the error message you mentioned which may or may not be related smile.gif

While reading about Cmedia, I stumbled across this article about a Pioneer Elite N-50 which uses a Cmedia chip, could it be that the SC-68 also uses a Cmedia device and that is why the USB-DAC installer is looking for a Cmedia driver file?

http://www.head-fi.org/products/pioneer-elite-n-50-network-audio-player/reviews
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post #659 of 1849 Old 12-23-2012, 03:58 AM
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Originally Posted by rana_kirti View Post

has anyone had the chance to compare the SC-68/67 vs. NAD T757.....? As far as sound quality goes which is better...? i'm confused between these two. no chance to demo together.

The SC-68 is a remarkable achievement from Pioneer. Both Sound quality and features offered. The NAD line of receivers are also pretty fantastic. They have a very warm and clean sound,punchy and very dynamic. They do however lack on features but thats not what NAD is all about , they are all about sound quality.
Depending on the speakers you own or want to use would decide which one to get. Also what features you want. If you are into computer music , they SC-68 is a very strong choice as it has a built in USB DAC that I have listened to many times and love it.

I have not side by side these receivers but have heard them many times. The NAD is hard to beat and I'm kinda sure it's slightly better in sound quality alone but without a side by side it's very difficult to judge this. Whats remarkable about the Pioneer is that is competes with high end receivers in sound quality . I don't think others like Denon , Marantz , Integra do. I think they all have a very good sound in their own right but don't compare to NAD. The Pioneer does and I would love to do a shootout with these 2.
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post #660 of 1849 Old 12-23-2012, 09:59 AM
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I am thinking very seriously of getting an SC-68 to replace my old B&K AVR (that doesn't have HDMI) and it will be running my big Martin-Logan's and M-L center (I only have a 5.1 system with in wall rears), and getting an Oppo 105 (to replace my first generation Denon BluRay). I was wondering:

1. Would the SC-68 do well with my Mrtin-Logan's?
2. I have an older REL subwoofer...what became of the issue regarding possible incompatibility with the D class amps? I couldn't find any further discussion after the issue was raised but maybe I missed it.
3. I will probably be getting an Apple TV and a Roku 2 so I can get Netflix, Amazon Prime, AND YouTube. AirPlay will be nice as well, but since AirPlay is on the SC-68 I guess that is redundant but fine...any difference at all between having Airplay on your AVR and on your Apple TV?
4. If my iTunes music library would be in lossless, how would the sound quality differ, if at all, between streaming it from iTunes through AirPlay to my system versus playing a CD in the Oppo 105? Is there degradation or loss by WiFi streaming compared to playing a CD what is supposed to be an excellent player?

Sorry if the questions are naive, and thanks in advance!
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