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-   -   How to accomplish: Speakers to mute, on Headphone relay input - Denon AVR (http://www.avsforum.com/forum/90-receivers-amps-processors/1424891-how-accomplish-speakers-mute-headphone-relay-input-denon-avr.html)

bencn 08-16-2012 09:09 AM

Hi guys,

Setting up a system for my friends parents..

They have an in-wall 5.1 system which is fed from a Denon 1612 in the rack. They want to have the speakers mute when they plug in a headphone set which is wired to a faceplate in the room (2x 22gauge shielded).

I'm pretty sure this could be accomplished with this product:
http://nilesaudio.com/product.php?prodID=SAS-1&recordID=Automated%20Switching%20Systems&categoryID=Switching%20Systems&catcdID=&prdcdID=FG00230

but thinking there's probably an easier way..


Would love to hear suggestions, also I'll keep you guys in the loop and letchya know how it goes!

jdsmoothie 08-16-2012 09:14 AM

The speakers are automatically muted when a headphone plug is inserted into the headphone jack on the front panel of the 1612.

bencn 08-16-2012 09:28 AM

Since the Denon will automatically mute speakers when headphone plugged in would need to use the Pre out i'm thinking...


Actually they have an RTI system, so a contact relay could Mute the Denon and then PreOut will go to the headphones (I think)!

DonoMan 08-16-2012 09:43 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post

The speakers are automatically muted when a headphone plug is inserted into the headphone jack on the front panel of the 1612.

They don't want to use that jack directly, so they can't use it at all. That kind of jack has an internal switch that closes when a plug is inserted, even if said plug is not connected to anything on the other end. They'll need to use their own headphone driver and switching, unless they want to pay someone to open that receiver up and run the jack switch to the other equipment.

bencn 08-16-2012 10:55 AM

Quote:
They don't want to use that jack directly, so they can't use it at all

True Say.. When muting the System will the Pre Outs continue as normal (or a way to program as such)? Hmm gonna check the manual.


The next part of the equation is finding a faceplate such as the RDL D-SH1M and rigging it to provide relay control

DonoMan 08-16-2012 11:08 AM

It turns the pre-outs off as well, so you'll need to use the pre-outs for a headphone amp too. If you're already using them for speakers, you can use Y-cables, but you'll need something else that will detect the headphones in the wallplate or whatever that you use and turn off the other stuff. I would recommend doing so via an amp with 12v trigger rather than by muting the signal to the input of the amp, but that would more or less work too. You either need an integrated system or you need a wallplate that exposes the same sort of switch inside the headphone jack like receivers have inside. You can use that to control a relay (preferably buffered with a transistor - I do not like driving relays directly from 12v triggers) which could control the amp for the main speakers.

bencn 08-16-2012 11:38 AM

Dang..
Quote:
It turns the pre-outs off as well, so you'll need to use the pre-outs for a headphone amp too

So no output on the Denon that's independent of mute. So the only way to hear headphones whilst speakers are muted is to Y Off from the actual sources correct? The headphone amp (if need be) would have to be connected to the sources or otherwise would be muted if connected to the Preouts. Headphone plate would therefore need to be equipped with selectable source outputs. Damn.

DonoMan 08-16-2012 11:43 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by bencn View Post

Dang..
So no output on the Denon that's independent of mute. So the only way to hear headphones whilst speakers are muted is to Y Off from the actual sources correct? The headphone amp (if need be) would have to be connected to the sources or otherwise would be muted if connected to the Preouts. Headphone plate would therefore need to be equipped with selectable source outputs. Damn.

No, not from the sources.. Y off from the preamp outs into a headphone amp (Note: I don't believe in expensive headphone amps whatsoever - only recommending one because you actually need one to hook stuff up this way) and either use manual switching or build the same sort of muting circuit the Denon has, based around a headphone jack with a continuity switch (like receivers use).

bencn 08-16-2012 12:19 PM

Quote:
No, not from the sources.. Y off from the preamp outs into a headphone amp


But the 1612 just has Pre Outs (Surr Back / Front Height) and they will Mute as well when the rest of the speakers are muted (Mute command is pressed). So how do you listen to headphones while Denon is muted?

DonoMan 08-16-2012 12:20 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by bencn View Post

But the 1612 just has Pre Outs (Surr Back / Front Height) and they will Mute as well when the rest of the speakers are muted (Mute command is pressed). So how do you listen to headphones while Denon is muted?

By not using the headphone jack of the receiver itself at all, and instead using a separate headphone amp with an external muting circuit (unless you can find a product that actually serves this purpose out of the box).

You either use the receiver's headphone jack directly or not at all, again, because the mute works by detecting if there is something physically plugged in, NOT by checking if there's an actual circuit connected to it.

Not having the preouts (1612 obviously doesn't) means you'll need to use the receiver's headphone jack directly or do something custom. Else you need to buy a receiver with preouts to do what you want to do, or an external product that has all of this stuff built in and can be driven by the speaker-level out of the 1612. Or, technically, you could use a line out converter on the speaker level outputs to get line level... Technically there are several possibilities here, but all of them involve a bunch of complexity and/or spending a decent amount of money.

bencn 08-16-2012 12:20 PM

Or are you suggesting a seperate Pre amp unit in line btw sources and Denon?

bencn 08-16-2012 12:22 PM

what feeds the headphone amp? from which unit/output?

DonoMan 08-16-2012 12:24 PM

the headphone amp should get the same signal as the front speakers, except at line level. Or I guess maybe there are also headphone amps that can take speaker level inputs... You'd have to look.

bencn 08-16-2012 04:35 PM

Doesn't matter though.. Everything will be Muted including the headphones!

Me solution:
Y off from the sources, config RTI programming so when one source is selected that the others are muted at the source (not Denon)
Y offs feed mini audio mixer RDL TX-MX2R which feeds Headphone plate RDL DS-SH1 (accepts line level, output to headphone),

Then after plugging in headphones just have to manually hit mute on the remote, headphone automatically plays same source as on TV


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