The **OFFICIAL** DENON AVR-4520CI thread - Page 226 - AVS Forum
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post #6751 of 10586 Old 01-18-2014, 07:49 PM
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I was merely giving you examples of how the Harmony is infinitely better than the 4520's remote.

And who said anything about using the consoles for games? smile.gif
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post #6752 of 10586 Old 01-18-2014, 07:59 PM
 
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Originally Posted by ke4pym View Post

I was merely giving you examples of how the Harmony is infinitely better than the 4520's remote.

We have stuck with using four different remotes; cable box, AVR, blu-ray and flat screen. Most of the time it's between the cable box and the AVR. The blu-ray and flat screen remotes come into play when playing with the AVR or the blu-ray player. I use to have a programmable all-in-one remote and it was such a pain programming it and teaching my wife what buttons to push for what. Then there's the problem of her accidentally pushing the wrong button, while I wasn't home and the cellphone calls to get her right again.

I kinda like that clunky 4520 remote. And when the matching DBT-3313UDCI blu-ray player is connected, we should be able to do it in three remotes. tongue.gif
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post #6753 of 10586 Old 01-18-2014, 08:18 PM
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Originally Posted by ke4pym View Post

This 4520 user switched to a Harmony Ultimate remote. I've never used the remote that came with my 4520.

Well I know this isn't the right thread for remotes but since it has been mentioned here, I to recently bought the 4520 (still in the box) along with the matching DBT-3313UDCI blu-ray player (also the box), just haven't had the time to hook it all up yet. As far as the Harmony Ultimate and these 2 Denon pieces I planned on getting this remote because of the RF capability with all my equipment residing in a closet down the hall from my living room, does this remote lack any major access points that would be needed in either Denon unit that any of you folks may have notice ? Or is this the remote to go with for a set up like mine utilizing the RF and with the simple set-up that most rant about ?
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post #6754 of 10586 Old 01-18-2014, 08:19 PM
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Originally Posted by BeeMan458 View Post

We have stuck with using four different remotes; cable box, AVR, blu-ray and flat screen. Most of the time it's between the cable box and the AVR. The blu-ray and flat screen remotes come into play when playing with the AVR or the blu-ray player. I use to have a programmable all-in-one remote and it was such a pain programming it and teaching my wife what buttons to push for what. Then there's the problem of her accidentally pushing the wrong button, while I wasn't home and the cellphone calls to get her right again.

I kinda like that clunky 4520 remote. And when the matching DBT-3313UDCI blu-ray player is connected, we should be able to do it in three remotes. tongue.gif

I don't want to take over this thread about the Ultimate. So if you have questions about it, feel free to PM me. There are also a ton of resources out there that will go into detail about what it can do, and threads here on AVS better suited to it.

My parents, who are both in their late 60's, and technophobic were able to pick up the remote and use it within a matter of minutes.

Setup is easy.

Find a place for the hub so it can see your gear. For gear it can't see, there are two IR eyes included with super long cords.
Plug the hub in and setup the eyes if necessary. Find a cosey home for the cradle and plug it in.

Plug the remote into your laptop. Goto myharmony.com. Log in.
Give details about your WiFi network (you can skip this if you want) so you can use the phone app if you so choose.
The web site connects to your remote and walks you through inventorying your system. It asks the make and model of all of your gear.
Then it finds out what device controls the volume when you watch certain sources.
Then it asks you to set up activities (Watch a BluRay, Listen to a Record, Watch Tv, etc, etc. Then it asks you what gear is associated with that activity and what input it is on.
Finally, it pushes the changes to your remote and hub.

Done. Including first time firmware updates and setup - 45 minutes, tops. And you're not eating up 8 batteries for 4 remotes.

I also have a 900 I use in the bedroom. That remote requires a rocket science degree to setup compared to what they've done with the Ultimate.
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post #6755 of 10586 Old 01-18-2014, 08:21 PM
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So I've just removed the Auzentech X-Fi completely and connected the GTX780 to the 4520 with a HDMI cable and the problems started, the 2560x1080 display is connected to the DVI port of the GTX780...

I only get audio when I put the Windows display settings on Extend or Duplicate these displays.
*When it's set to Duplicate, it sets the display resolution to 1920x1080 and the 2560x1080 display shows stuff incorrectly.
*When it's set to Extend, the 2560x1080 works normally, but I have a whole empty 1920x1080 desktop on the "right" which I don't see if the plasma isn't on, and it never is, when the monitor is on.

Is there a way to set the HDMI port of the GTX780 to transport audio only at all times, and video when I decide to turn the 2nd display on?

*When the 2560x1080 display is connected with a HDMI cable to the 4520, it works fine just until it enters Windows and then says "No input signal" and turns off. Nothing in the receiver setup options makes it turn back on.

I knew there would be problems because of the displays different resolutions and the stupid HDCP crap, which doesn't let you stream audio only through a HDMI cable.

Edit: I'm thinking - what if I put the Auzentech back and connect it with the S/PDIF cable, and use that when using the monitor, and switching (every time) manually to the GTX HDMI when I'm using the plasma. This seems like a working workaround, however it's a bit stupid. Or maybe I should try writing to Denon's support to add some functionality so the 4520 be made compatible with 21:9 display resolution? It seems unlikely they'll do something about that.
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post #6756 of 10586 Old 01-18-2014, 08:26 PM
 
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Originally Posted by ke4pym View Post

I don't want to take over this thread about the Ultimate. So if you have questions about it, feel free to PM me.

Thanks for the thoughtful post with basic primer included.
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post #6757 of 10586 Old 01-19-2014, 02:14 AM
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Started a new thread, but thought I would post this here as well with hopes of someone knowing the answer:

 

I was wondering if anyone out there may have an answer to my problem. I just updated my receiver to a Denon AVR-4520ci. I was previously using the Pioneer VSX-70. I have a Samsung 3D Blu-ray Player and an Epson Home Cinema 5030UB Home Theater Projector. Been watching 3D movies just fine until I installed the new Denon. Now when I try to play a 3D movie, my Blu-ray player keeps saying that my TV(projector) does not support 3D. I updated the firmware on the Denon, but still gives the same message. I can reconnect the Pioneer and everything works fine. Any ideas? Thanks.

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post #6758 of 10586 Old 01-19-2014, 02:40 AM
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^^
If the BDP is able to pass regular 720p 2D video without any issues, then adding an HDMI extender should resolve the issue. Forum sponsor Monoprice has several available.

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post #6759 of 10586 Old 01-19-2014, 07:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wysiwygbg View Post

So I've just removed the Auzentech X-Fi completely and connected the GTX780 to the 4520 with a HDMI cable and the problems started, the 2560x1080 display is connected to the DVI port of the GTX780...
Sorry: I didn't realize that you have a higher-resolution primary display frown.gif (I have intentionally limited my home system to only 1080p displays in order to avoid some of these kinds of problems, but I understand the need for greater screen real estate.)

The connections you mention (HDMI to AVR, DVI to display) would be the ones I think I'd use.
Quote:
I only get audio when I put the Windows display settings on Extend or Duplicate these displays.
*When it's set to Duplicate, it sets the display resolution to 1920x1080 and the 2560x1080 display shows stuff incorrectly.
*When it's set to Extend, the 2560x1080 works normally, but I have a whole empty 1920x1080 desktop on the "right" which I don't see if the plasma isn't on, and it never is, when the monitor is on.
Sorry: I don't understand what you find wrong with "Extend". Could you elaborate?

(Since my displays have identical resolution, I use Duplicate. I have a laptop and normally use the larger TV as my primary display.)

However, you might want to try the free NirSoft utility MultiMonitorTool. http://www.nirsoft.net/utils/multi_monitor_tool.html

It looks like it might help to speed up configuration changes. (I've never tried it.) Presumably there are other similar utilities.
Quote:
Is there a way to set the HDMI port of the GTX780 to transport audio only at all times, and video when I decide to turn the 2nd display on?
In principle it should already do that, but Nvidia's audio drivers don't seem to cope well when a TV connected to an AVR turns off and on. Transporting audio over HDMI requires a video signal (audio is sent during the "vertical retrace interval"), so AVRs simulate an invisible 720p TV when the real TV is not on. There's something about the change between the real and simulated TVs (which differs depending on the TV and the AVR) that Nvidia's drivers don't like.

There are two potential workarounds that I'm aware of. I'm not sure if they'll work for you.
1) Run AVR Audio Guard. See http://www.avsforum.com/t/1317491/silent-stream-bug
2) With the TV off, the HDMI output device might be quite different, so it needs to be configured separately in the audio Playback devices menu.
Quote:
*When the 2560x1080 display is connected with a HDMI cable to the 4520, it works fine just until it enters Windows and then says "No input signal" and turns off. Nothing in the receiver setup options makes it turn back on.
In general, receivers can handle only the standard entertainment TV resolutions: 1920x1080 (1080i/p) & 1280x720 (720p) plus the older NTSC and PAL "Standard Definition" resolutions. BIOS video (what you get before Windows starts) usually is 480p, equivalent to NTSC. The AVR can handle 480p, but it can't handle the higher Windows desktop resolution.
Quote:
I knew there would be problems because of the displays different resolutions and the stupid HDCP crap, which doesn't let you stream audio only through a HDMI cable.

Edit: I'm thinking - what if I put the Auzentech back and connect it with the S/PDIF cable, and use that when using the monitor, and switching (every time) manually to the GTX HDMI when I'm using the plasma. This seems like a working workaround, however it's a bit stupid.
That should work. You might associate it with the AVR's CD input. As you say, it'll be awkward to switch back and forth, though.
Quote:
Or maybe I should try writing to Denon's support to add some functionality so the 4520 be made compatible with 21:9 display resolution? It seems unlikely they'll do something about that.
Unfortunately, I don't think D&M can do anything about it. My understanding is that the resolution limitations are designed into the HDMI chipsets that AVR manufacturers use. The next step up in resolution would be to UHD (often called 4K) resolution at 30Hz. UHD at 60Hz will require HDMI v2.0 and lots of money to upgrade everything. frown.gif

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post #6760 of 10586 Old 01-19-2014, 07:51 AM
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Originally Posted by Selden Ball View Post

Sorry: I don't understand what you find wrong with "Extend". Could you elaborate?
When set to Extend, Windows shows primary desktop on primary monitor, and secondary desktop (the extention) on the secondary display (in this case the AVR/TV). Since I use only one of these displays at a given time, I don't see the "extention", because it's in standby. However Windows need it to be "active" so the GTX can pass audio (and video, stupid HDCP) to the AVR so I could hear stuff. This means that whenever I move my mouse to the right of the primary display it does not stop at the end of the display, but gets to the "extended desktop", which I don't see, because it's in stand-by, and that's frustrating.

I'll try the "MultiMonitorTool" to see if it helps, but I doubt it will.
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post #6761 of 10586 Old 01-19-2014, 07:56 AM
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Yes, I can understand that frustration frown.gif Best of luck!

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post #6762 of 10586 Old 01-19-2014, 10:16 AM
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Have any owners of this DENON AVR-45CI experienced this? PLEASE HELP!

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post #6763 of 10586 Old 01-19-2014, 10:16 AM
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Originally Posted by audiomirage View Post
 

Started a new thread, but thought I would post this here as well with hopes of someone knowing the answer:

 

I was wondering if anyone out there may have an answer to my problem. I just updated my receiver to a Denon AVR-4520ci. I was previously using the Pioneer VSX-70. I have a Samsung 3D Blu-ray Player and an Epson Home Cinema 5030UB Home Theater Projector. Been watching 3D movies just fine until I installed the new Denon. Now when I try to play a 3D movie, my Blu-ray player keeps saying that my TV(projector) does not support 3D. I updated the firmware on the Denon, but still gives the same message. I can reconnect the Pioneer and everything works fine. Any ideas? Thanks.

 

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Have any owners of this DENON AVR-45CI experienced this? PLEASE HELP!

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post #6764 of 10586 Old 01-19-2014, 10:34 AM
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audiomirage,

A "quick" test would be to connect the 4520 directly to the projector using a short HDMI cable that's certified to be "High Speed" to see if that works. I suspect it will.

What kind of cable are you currently using between the AVR and the projector?
Is it an active cable with builtin amp and equalizer? (e.g. Monoprice Redmere)
Or is it a passive cable with thick wires to compensate for its long length?

My suspicion is that the cable running to your projector is passive and is too long for use with Denon AVRs. If that's the case, and assuming you'd rather not run new cables (with thicker wires or active), you might want to consider getting an HDMI amp/equaliser.

Different brands of AVRs output different HDMI signal levels. My guess is that the EDID signal getting back to the Denon is too weak to provide a reliable result with the circuitry that Denon is using.

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post #6765 of 10586 Old 01-19-2014, 10:40 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Selden Ball View Post

audiomirage,

A "quick" test would be to connect the 4520 directly to the projector using a short HDMI cable that's certified to be "High Speed" to see if that works. I suspect it will.

Good call on the High Speed HDMI cable.

Upgrades are a good thing that can come with hidden hassles.
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post #6766 of 10586 Old 01-19-2014, 12:40 PM
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I must assume it is a passive cable due to the size of the cable.  I will unmounts projector (what a hassle :-)..) and reconnect with a short high speed hdmi cable to test this theory.  If this solve the problem, what cable do you recommend?  It has to be 50ft in length to reach my projector.  Thank you.

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post #6767 of 10586 Old 01-19-2014, 01:11 PM
 
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Originally Posted by audiomirage View Post

I must assume it is a passive cable due to the size of the cable.  I will unmounts projector (what a hassle :-)..) and reconnect with a short high speed hdmi cable to test this theory.  If this solve the problem, what cable do you recommend?  It has to be 50ft in length to reach my projector.  Thank you.

Order up a "HIGH SPEED" cable. I think it's HDMI 1.4a compatible but that's not suppose to be on the cable due to some licensing BS. Now the manufactures are to only say, "HIGH SPEED."

(and yes, a passive cable.....well, until it gets plugged in)

...tongue.gif

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post #6768 of 10586 Old 01-19-2014, 01:17 PM
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Okay, going to order a monoprice cable.  Ordering the ~~Ultra Slim Series High Performance HDMI® Cable w/ RedMere® Technology.  I note that this has "one way" technology.  Is this the correct cable for my projector? Or do I need a 2-way cable?  Thank you.

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post #6769 of 10586 Old 01-19-2014, 01:32 PM
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I can't say anything about the Monoprice cables, maybe they're good. I'd advise to buy a Bandridge Profigold cable, correct model of the cable you're looking for is "PROV1015", it may cost a bit more than the Monoprice cable, but I've never had any problems with Bandridge cables to this moment - they work as advertised.
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post #6770 of 10586 Old 01-19-2014, 01:39 PM
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Originally Posted by audiomirage View Post

Okay, going to order a monoprice cable.  Ordering the ~~Ultra Slim Series High Performance HDMI® Cable w/ RedMere® Technology.  I note that this has "one way" technology.  Is this the correct cable for my projector? Or do I need a 2-way cable?  Thank you.

"One way" simply means it needs to be connected properly. The two cable ends are clearly labeled "source" and "TV". This would be a good cable choice. I have 30' Redmere cables in my system. Being active cables, they are somewhat smaller in diameter than a passive 50' cable would be, which makes cable routing simpler.
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post #6771 of 10586 Old 01-19-2014, 01:48 PM
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Awesome! Thanks for all the help. Cable on it's way.

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post #6772 of 10586 Old 01-19-2014, 02:04 PM
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Originally Posted by audiomirage View Post

Have any owners of this DENON AVR-45CI experienced this? PLEASE HELP!

Guess you missed my post immediately after you posted your question early this morning. Much easier way suggested than having to remove the projector. smile.gif

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post #6773 of 10586 Old 01-19-2014, 02:22 PM
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Finished the bulk of the install for my new 4520CI and 3313UDCI combo. Quite easy having read this thread, asking a couple of questions and also reviewing user manual in advance of opening the cartons. After using it to watch a movie last night I have two comments about the system.

First comment is that it does not seem nearly as loud as my 5803A as I have to turn volume up to 75-80 before it gets to the level I was that it took 1/3rd of a turn to reach. I read posts about the specs and in my opinion it comes no where near to "knocking the dust off the rafters" like the 5803A although it is certainly more pleasant sounding maybe because of the addition of 2 channels (for Front High speakers) and also the more sophisticated version of Audyssey. Not trying to associate loudness with better but sometimes depending upon the movie rocking the house is called for.

Second comment is also a question. I miss the lack of switched AC outlets that the prior generations of Denon had as standard equipment. I read earlier in the thread others were not pleased that Denon removed them and there seems to be plenty of area available on the back panel. I always plugged in my subwoofer into one of the switched outlets. Now I have to remember to turn on and then off later. It's not like an external amp where on/off button it is also similar height. My subwoofer is a B&W and the off switch is below the heat sink fins and not easily reachable (and not visible) without some additional effort. Wondering how others are coping with manual on/off subwoofer or maybe I am just lazier than others.
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post #6774 of 10586 Old 01-19-2014, 02:25 PM
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One way or the other, just seemed simpler to move projector than move receiver,bd player, and all the connected source/speaker wires. Also projetor is ceiling mounted. Thanks!
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post #6775 of 10586 Old 01-19-2014, 02:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John-Burgess View Post

Finished the bulk of the install for my new 4520CI and 3313UDCI combo. Quite easy having read this thread, asking a couple of questions and also reviewing user manual in advance of opening the cartons. After using it to watch a movie last night I have two comments about the system.

First comment is that it does not seem nearly as loud as my 5803A as I have to turn volume up to 75-80 before it gets to the level I was that it took 1/3rd of a turn to reach. I read posts about the specs and in my opinion it comes no where near to "knocking the dust off the rafters" like the 5803A although it is certainly more pleasant sounding maybe because of the addition of 2 channels (for Front High speakers) and also the more sophisticated version of Audyssey. Not trying to associate loudness with better but sometimes depending upon the movie rocking the house is called for.

Second comment is also a question. I miss the lack of switched AC outlets that the prior generations of Denon had as standard equipment. I read earlier in the thread others were not pleased that Denon removed them and there seems to be plenty of area available on the back panel. I always plugged in my subwoofer into one of the switched outlets. Now I have to remember to turn on and then off later. It's not like an external amp where on/off button it is also similar height. My subwoofer is a B&W and the off switch is below the heat sink fins and not easily reachable (and not visible) without some additional effort. Wondering how others are coping with manual on/off subwoofer or maybe I am just lazier than others.

 

Regarding the 4520 not being as loud, have you run the Audyssey calibration yet?  Assuming both AVR's were properly calibrated, a measurement mic at the MLP should record 75dB when the speaker level test tones are generated.  If both AVR's produce 75dB, then neither AVR should sound louder than the other.

 

Regarding the switched outlets, many of us who owned older Denon's immediately missed the convenience.  However, if you inspected the user manual closely, these switched power outlets were usually rated at 100W or less.  The typical subwoofer easily exceeds 100W, so those of us who were using the connection for subs (myself included) were exceeding the rating of the outlet and could have caused damage to the AVR.

 

The Denon has two triggers.  Get a power strip that can be controlled by the voltage trigger, and plug the sub into the power strip.  that should solve your problem.

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post #6776 of 10586 Old 01-19-2014, 03:18 PM
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So what is the difference between a high speed HDMI cable and a non high speed?

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post #6777 of 10586 Old 01-19-2014, 04:07 PM
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So what is the difference between a high speed HDMI cable and a non high speed?

Google's 2nd result: http://www.sony-asia.com/support/faq/347075
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post #6778 of 10586 Old 01-19-2014, 04:09 PM
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Does Denon require them?

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post #6779 of 10586 Old 01-19-2014, 04:10 PM
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Does Denon require them?

The content you want to transfer through them, require them. If you want to watch 720p/1080i - a standard speed HDMI cable will be enough, if you want 1080p or more - you'll need a High speed HDMI cable. I think that's explained clearly enough in the link I've just given you...
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post #6780 of 10586 Old 01-19-2014, 04:17 PM
 
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Get a power strip that can be controlled by the voltage trigger, and plug the sub into the power strip.

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