The **OFFICIAL** DENON AVR-4520CI thread - Page 265 - AVS Forum
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post #7921 of 8912 Old 04-27-2014, 08:48 AM
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Originally Posted by AV_mike View Post

Short answer, NO.

Stereo bass is not supported via the subwoofer outputs - but you may be able to use the pre-amp outputs for Left & Right (running them full range) to extract the L & R bass, if that's what you're after.
Not what people usually do - but it's your system.

Better to place the two subs for the smoothest bass response within the listening area, then allow normal bass management to steer the low range from all other speakers to the sub array. With a reasonable low crossover (80Hz or lower) you should not be able to locate the sources of the very low frequencies - higher crossovers can allow the localization of the subs in some instances.

Is there a particular reason for wanting L & R output for the subs?

Regards, Mike.

You could use a MiniDSP 2x4 I believe and split the signal to your subs, and left and right channels.

Denon 4520ci, 3 JBL 2360As/EV DHA-1s, 3 1/4 Pie bass bins, MiniDSP 2x4s, 4 Klipsch HIPs, 2 Klipsch KP3002s, PS3, XBox 360, 3 Intel NUCs, Monoprice Redmere, Monster HTPS7000, 2 SUPER SPUD subs, Panasonic AE8000u, and a Yamaha P7000s.
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post #7922 of 8912 Old 04-27-2014, 09:25 AM
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Or get some wall to wall carpet and have an edge banded to it.

I love the creativity and cost effective as well!
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post #7923 of 8912 Old 04-27-2014, 09:52 AM
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Originally Posted by luvmusic View Post

True, I believe my trouble is the floor / ceiling reflections mainly.

I don't see that you have posted any room response measurements anywhere. Without doing some analysis, all these suggestions about how to treat floor reflections may be completely off the mark. You say your room is untreatable. Why not measure and see how things really look?
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post #7924 of 8912 Old 04-27-2014, 11:35 AM
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Originally Posted by AV_mike View Post

Short answer, NO.

Stereo bass is not supported via the subwoofer outputs - but you may be able to use the pre-amp outputs for Left & Right (running them full range) to extract the L & R bass, if that's what you're after.
Not what people usually do - but it's your system.

Better to place the two subs for the smoothest bass response within the listening area, then allow normal bass management to steer the low range from all other speakers to the sub array. With a reasonable low crossover (80Hz or lower) you should not be able to locate the sources of the very low frequencies - higher crossovers can allow the localization of the subs in some instances.

Is there a particular reason for wanting L & R output for the subs?

Regards, Mike.

I was reading on SVS website about dual subs and they mention the benefit of stereo subs.

Indecision may or may not be my problem.
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post #7925 of 8912 Old 04-27-2014, 12:07 PM
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I was reading on SVS website about dual subs and they mention the benefit of stereo subs.

Wait. You mean a place that primarily sells subwoofers is recommending that everyone have two of them?
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post #7926 of 8912 Old 04-27-2014, 12:28 PM
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Originally Posted by Sam S View Post


Wait. You mean a place that primarily sells subwoofers is recommending that everyone have two of them?

 

Maybe Sonnie is making is influence felt already.

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post #7927 of 8912 Old 04-27-2014, 01:51 PM
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Originally Posted by jlpowell84 View Post

I spent two weeks measuring with so many sweeps in REW I was begging for no more! eek.gif The front wall 1/4 and 3/4 points have provided the best response raw I can get (shout out to Sanjay for his recommendations). Each room is different so your room may not be good on the front wall due to your dimension specific modes. My front wall is about 15ft wide. The length of the room is about 28ft and has a huge null in the middle. But I sit 9ft from my screen and 10ft from the front wall which propels me farther forward past the big middle null. I have never heard B&W speakers and I am sure they are nice. But JTR Triple 8's are not your entry level speaker wink.gif They absolutely destroy my entry speakers my buddy now owns (Definitive Technology BP8060 towers).

here is what I have ended up with after EQ...look at my profile pic smile.gif

I am gonna shoot for a PJ as my next big move. But it's a rental as my wife and I live low in prepping for house buy. It is a small guest house in the country and we love it. Very quiet and secluded. But obviously no major mods.

Well, I won't argue with using Rew 1. As you noted, each room is different and yours is rectangular. You did note a big null field (Which I also had). I found that not having both subs in a stereo pair, but rather on opposite corners gave me the best overall Low Frequency response in the entire room, for all listeners/viewers. So, just a suggestion. For a long room like yours, you might get better results with a front and rear sub configuration but you would know.

I am not very familiar with JTR speakers of any kind. All I know is they play really, really loud and are very efficient and use a compression driver. The few specs that JTR shows on its site seem focused on maximum DB output and not much else. I find this unusually emphasized for what are suppose to be their home line. I imagine they sound much like Klipsch stuff but who knows? I did notice you have yours toed in quite lot. There seems to be absolutely no reviews or analysis of any of the JTR stuff. Reviews on the manufacturers web site (under construction) is limited to 300 words of talk of the line "Boy they are loud". Obviously what is posted on line is quite small company and cult like. Handmade crossovers, quality control that employs simple one guy in a garage manufacturing and not responding to e-mails.

The B&W 800 series is much better reviewed (by many authorities) and is without a doubt in a different price range and quality control/manufacturing range as well; which therefore targets a different market. You might want to compare your speakers to something like the B&W Custom Series CT 700 7.3s for a fairer comparison. Like yours, black, boxy, and efficient. I could not find anyone who has compared on line those JTR's to much of anything. The only posts are from people going from low to mid priced speakers to the JTR's. All wax poetic about how awesome the JTR's are but most posts note "loudness" as the primary reason for moving to the JTR's..... Clearly not my goal.

You could get an on wall 120" 1.9 gain screen for around $600. A projector from AVS (As an idea would come in at $1,000 to $2,500 for even a 3D Sony (See AVS B Sale they just had). Then, with that much improved wall, you could add Wides. The 4520 and all the DSX, Neo:X Receivers really do amazing things with Wides. A Projector and a decent screen. My friend is a renter and needed to set up a movie room in his house. We did the screen, projector, and AVR for less than $3,000 and his system rocks. Best of all, he just needs to take the screen with him and equipment and he can set up at the next rental in days. This guy can't buy because he works for a major sports franchise and has always got to be ready to move to a different organization.

It is a worthy exercise in saving for a home. (Even if it is too close to Duck country for me) however, aesthetically, you can do a lot for very, very little. Placing gear somewhere other than right below your viewing area, cleaning up wiring, etc.. And Batpig is right, your wall wants a screen; solving two issues, wood paneling ick and a bigger viewing area.
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post #7928 of 8912 Old 04-27-2014, 02:59 PM
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Originally Posted by AustinJerry View Post

I don't see that you have posted any room response measurements anywhere. Without doing some analysis, all these suggestions about how to treat floor reflections may be completely off the mark. You say your room is untreatable. Why not measure and see how things really look?

I don't have access to that info. Secondly, I don't have the ability to capture that to post it either. I much prefer to use my ears in the final analysis.
The room is physically untreatable save a rug.I can't use free standing panels as they would be right in the traffic area, otherwise I would. It's just a poor room and that's it. I get fairly good sound for 2.0, but that's about it. It could be that I don't play loud enough, but I hate loud volume anyways and I don't want to get evicted. The sound travels right out through the front door even at normal listening level.
I just have to live with what it is and stop beating my head against the wall trying to change physics.
I am looking into the second rug idea as I see that working and that will help a little for the floor reflections which will cut a little of the ceiling reflections since not as much sound waves will be bouncing off the floor.
That said,I do want to learn and do measurements myself just out of curiosity.
Plus, remember I need to see what if any magic XT32 will do.
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post #7929 of 8912 Old 04-27-2014, 03:02 PM
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Originally Posted by Sam S View Post

Wait. You mean a place that primarily sells subwoofers is recommending that everyone have two of them?

It seems almost everyone recommends two subs, not just sellers.

Indecision may or may not be my problem.
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post #7930 of 8912 Old 04-27-2014, 04:08 PM
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Well, I won't argue with using Rew 1. As you noted, each room is different and yours is rectangular. You did note a big null field (Which I also had). I found that not having both subs in a stereo pair, but rather on opposite corners gave me the best overall Low Frequency response in the entire room, for all listeners/viewers. So, just a suggestion. For a long room like yours, you might get better results with a front and rear sub configuration but you would know.

I am not very familiar with JTR speakers of any kind. All I know is they play really, really loud and are very efficient and use a compression driver. The few specs that JTR shows on its site seem focused on maximum DB output and not much else. I find this unusually emphasized for what are suppose to be their home line. I imagine they sound much like Klipsch stuff but who knows? I did notice you have yours toed in quite lot. There seems to be absolutely no reviews or analysis of any of the JTR stuff. Reviews on the manufacturers web site (under construction) is limited to 300 words of talk of the line "Boy they are loud". Obviously what is posted on line is quite small company and cult like. Handmade crossovers, quality control that employs simple one guy in a garage manufacturing and not responding to e-mails.

The B&W 800 series is much better reviewed (by many authorities) and is without a doubt in a different price range and quality control/manufacturing range as well; which therefore targets a different market. You might want to compare your speakers to something like the B&W Custom Series CT 700 7.3s for a fairer comparison. Like yours, black, boxy, and efficient. I could not find anyone who has compared on line those JTR's to much of anything. The only posts are from people going from low to mid priced speakers to the JTR's. All wax poetic about how awesome the JTR's are but most posts note "loudness" as the primary reason for moving to the JTR's..... Clearly not my goal.

You could get an on wall 120" 1.9 gain screen for around $600. A projector from AVS (As an idea would come in at $1,000 to $2,500 for even a 3D Sony (See AVS B Sale they just had). Then, with that much improved wall, you could add Wides. The 4520 and all the DSX, Neo:X Receivers really do amazing things with Wides. A Projector and a decent screen. My friend is a renter and needed to set up a movie room in his house. We did the screen, projector, and AVR for less than $3,000 and his system rocks. Best of all, he just needs to take the screen with him and equipment and he can set up at the next rental in days. This guy can't buy because he works for a major sports franchise and has always got to be ready to move to a different organization.

It is a worthy exercise in saving for a home. (Even if it is too close to Duck country for me) however, aesthetically, you can do a lot for very, very little. Placing gear somewhere other than right below your viewing area, cleaning up wiring, etc.. And Batpig is right, your wall wants a screen; solving two issues, wood paneling ick and a bigger viewing area.

JTR is badas stuff. I put them in the semi-pro home theater category. Heard them a few times in a great HT space.


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post #7931 of 8912 Old 04-27-2014, 05:09 PM
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Originally Posted by SeattleHTGuy View Post

Well, I won't argue with using Rew 1. As you noted, each room is different and yours is rectangular. You did note a big null field (Which I also had). I found that not having both subs in a stereo pair, but rather on opposite corners gave me the best overall Low Frequency response in the entire room, for all listeners/viewers. So, just a suggestion. For a long room like yours, you might get better results with a front and rear sub configuration but you would know.

I am not very familiar with JTR speakers of any kind. All I know is they play really, really loud and are very efficient and use a compression driver. The few specs that JTR shows on its site seem focused on maximum DB output and not much else. I find this unusually emphasized for what are suppose to be their home line. I imagine they sound much like Klipsch stuff but who knows? I did notice you have yours toed in quite lot. There seems to be absolutely no reviews or analysis of any of the JTR stuff. Reviews on the manufacturers web site (under construction) is limited to 300 words of talk of the line "Boy they are loud". Obviously what is posted on line is quite small company and cult like. Handmade crossovers, quality control that employs simple one guy in a garage manufacturing and not responding to e-mails.

The B&W 800 series is much better reviewed (by many authorities) and is without a doubt in a different price range and quality control/manufacturing range as well; which therefore targets a different market. You might want to compare your speakers to something like the B&W Custom Series CT 700 7.3s for a fairer comparison. Like yours, black, boxy, and efficient. I could not find anyone who has compared on line those JTR's to much of anything. The only posts are from people going from low to mid priced speakers to the JTR's. All wax poetic about how awesome the JTR's are but most posts note "loudness" as the primary reason for moving to the JTR's..... Clearly not my goal.

You could get an on wall 120" 1.9 gain screen for around $600. A projector from AVS (As an idea would come in at $1,000 to $2,500 for even a 3D Sony (See AVS B Sale they just had). Then, with that much improved wall, you could add Wides. The 4520 and all the DSX, Neo:X Receivers really do amazing things with Wides. A Projector and a decent screen. My friend is a renter and needed to set up a movie room in his house. We did the screen, projector, and AVR for less than $3,000 and his system rocks. Best of all, he just needs to take the screen with him and equipment and he can set up at the next rental in days. This guy can't buy because he works for a major sports franchise and has always got to be ready to move to a different organization.

It is a worthy exercise in saving for a home. (Even if it is too close to Duck country for me) however, aesthetically, you can do a lot for very, very little. Placing gear somewhere other than right below your viewing area, cleaning up wiring, etc.. And Batpig is right, your wall wants a screen; solving two issues, wood paneling ick and a bigger viewing area.

You obviously have no idea about JTR Speakers. Go to the JTR thread and you will learn a lot. Very surprised that you haven't done that already considering you have search a little bit already. Don't assume they sound like Klipsch. wink.gif

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post #7932 of 8912 Old 04-27-2014, 05:13 PM
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JTR is badas stuff. I put them in the semi-pro home theater category. Heard them a few times in a great HT space.

The event that is going on right now in Chicago has high end speakers and JTR and Seaton. Some of the guys that are writing about their experiences are saying that the JTR 215's are blowing a lot of the competition out of the water. Same thing with Seaton Sound. They are saying that there are 300k and 500k speakers there that lack the full range capabilities which is crazy for that amount of money!

I would say that JTR speakers are high end sound, just not a high end appearance.

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post #7933 of 8912 Old 04-27-2014, 05:44 PM
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Pain Infliction, true I don't know much of anything about JTR. I did go to the forum but the 50 or so pages I read just state they are great and then just about everyone says they play loud; thus the klipsch comment. So, perhaps someday maybe someone will review them that I follow and respect and do a deep analysis. Until then, they look a lot like Parts Express Kits. I know, looks don't make for sound but they do affect the spousal happiness factor and frankly they don't make a room look good. Perhaps the auto paint they are putting on them might help. I also think Wilson gear is terribly ugly but others differ. To each his own.

Keep in mind I bought SVS Ultras over a lot of less expensive but equally good quality simply based on the exterior build quality of the SVS's I own, they are amazing and just are put together like a precisiont Swiss Watch. They also sound and perform amazingly. I pay up for better looking speakers. Others might not.
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post #7934 of 8912 Old 04-27-2014, 06:18 PM
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Pain Infliction, true I don't know much of anything about JTR. I did go to the forum but the 50 or so pages I read just state they are great and then just about everyone says they play loud; thus the klipsch comment. So, perhaps someday maybe someone will review them that I follow and respect and do a deep analysis. Until then, they look a lot like Parts Express Kits. I know, looks don't make for sound but they do affect the spousal happiness factor and frankly they don't make a room look good. Perhaps the auto paint they are putting on them might help. I also think Wilson gear is terribly ugly but others differ. To each his own.

Keep in mind I bought SVS Ultras over a lot of less expensive but equally good quality simply based on the exterior build quality of the SVS's I own, they are amazing and just are put together like a precisiont Swiss Watch. They also sound and perform amazingly. I pay up for better looking speakers. Others might not.

I've personally auditioned the Klipsch Ultra2 series speakers, my buddy had a full theater setup and the RF7's and RC64 center channel. I can assure you JTR's don't sound the same. I'm hosting a GTG this summer in July, you're free to head up North of the border and come hear them for yourself if you'd like. smile.gif

What are you running for mains? Feel free to come up and bring them to run head to head with some JTR's to see how yours compare. It's always nice to directly compare speakers to what you have.

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JTR Noesis 228HT (LCR)
Axiom Audio QS8 surrounds
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Falcon Screens FVHD105
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I thought this thread was about the AVR-4520CI...?
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post #7936 of 8912 Old 04-27-2014, 06:27 PM
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I've personally auditioned the Klipsch Ultra2 series speakers, my buddy had a full theater setup and the RF7's and RC64 center channel. I can assure you JTR's don't sound the same. I'm hosting a GTG this summer in July, you're free to head up North of the border and come hear them for yourself if you'd like. smile.gif

What are you running for mains? Feel free to come up and bring them to run head to head with some JTR's to see how yours compare. It's always nice to directly compare speakers to what you have.

JTR speakers can also be had in a nice veneer if you are willing to pay the premium. I personally like my speakers to disappear in my room and not reflect any light from my projector so the JTR standard finish is ideal for me.

3 - JTR 228's LCR (game room)
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post #7937 of 8912 Old 04-27-2014, 06:29 PM
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I thought this thread was about the AVR-4520CI...?

It is, show me one long time thread on AVS that doesn't always have a little side conversations going on? rolleyes.gif
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post #7938 of 8912 Old 04-27-2014, 06:34 PM
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Sure, understand, but now would be an appropriate time to get back on topic.
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post #7939 of 8912 Old 04-27-2014, 06:56 PM
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It is, show me one long time thread on AVS that doesn't always have a little side conversations going on? rolleyes.gif

+1.

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post #7940 of 8912 Old 04-27-2014, 07:06 PM
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Originally Posted by SeattleHTGuy View Post

Well, I won't argue with using Rew 1. As you noted, each room is different and yours is rectangular. You did note a big null field (Which I also had). I found that not having both subs in a stereo pair, but rather on opposite corners gave me the best overall Low Frequency response in the entire room, for all listeners/viewers. So, just a suggestion. For a long room like yours, you might get better results with a front and rear sub configuration but you would know.

I am not very familiar with JTR speakers of any kind. All I know is they play really, really loud and are very efficient and use a compression driver. The few specs that JTR shows on its site seem focused on maximum DB output and not much else. I find this unusually emphasized for what are suppose to be their home line. I imagine they sound much like Klipsch stuff but who knows? I did notice you have yours toed in quite lot. There seems to be absolutely no reviews or analysis of any of the JTR stuff. Reviews on the manufacturers web site (under construction) is limited to 300 words of talk of the line "Boy they are loud". Obviously what is posted on line is quite small company and cult like. Handmade crossovers, quality control that employs simple one guy in a garage manufacturing and not responding to e-mails.

The B&W 800 series is much better reviewed (by many authorities) and is without a doubt in a different price range and quality control/manufacturing range as well; which therefore targets a different market. You might want to compare your speakers to something like the B&W Custom Series CT 700 7.3s for a fairer comparison. Like yours, black, boxy, and efficient. I could not find anyone who has compared on line those JTR's to much of anything. The only posts are from people going from low to mid priced speakers to the JTR's. All wax poetic about how awesome the JTR's are but most posts note "loudness" as the primary reason for moving to the JTR's..... Clearly not my goal.

You could get an on wall 120" 1.9 gain screen for around $600. A projector from AVS (As an idea would come in at $1,000 to $2,500 for even a 3D Sony (See AVS B Sale they just had). Then, with that much improved wall, you could add Wides. The 4520 and all the DSX, Neo:X Receivers really do amazing things with Wides. A Projector and a decent screen. My friend is a renter and needed to set up a movie room in his house. We did the screen, projector, and AVR for less than $3,000 and his system rocks. Best of all, he just needs to take the screen with him and equipment and he can set up at the next rental in days. This guy can't buy because he works for a major sports franchise and has always got to be ready to move to a different organization.

It is a worthy exercise in saving for a home. (Even if it is too close to Duck country for me) however, aesthetically, you can do a lot for very, very little. Placing gear somewhere other than right below your viewing area, cleaning up wiring, etc.. And Batpig is right, your wall wants a screen; solving two issues, wood paneling ick and a bigger viewing area.

Good stuff on the projector recommendations. I hate the wood paneling look too but the primary focus has shifted to our future and saving in numerous ways for buying a home and building a financial base. This little rental home on a horse ranch in the country (just outside of town and 10 miles from my work) provides a cost effective solution and just my wife and I (and cat) actually love it out here. So I will make do the best with what I have for now.

Now it seems you have ruffled a couple feathers by putting JTR on line with Klipsch and just being loud speakers. Yes they do play loud (I have had well over reference briefly with music) but they also have superb command of the dynamic range and I would label them as total opposite end of the spectrum in relation to piercing. In fact I went to Kris Deering's GTG last year in Seattle when he had the Legacy 5 channel Focus SE's on display with a couple Seaton Submersives and the entire system was tuned the day before by the kind and very personable Mark Seaton. I stayed the night before at a fellow AVS member's home who had a 7 channel JTR setup and Quad submersives (running flat). Both systems where systematically treated by Bryan at GIK acoustics. I came away that weekend having decided I would own JTR speakers. The main point for me was the fact that as we watched the movie Oblivion the sound was SO pleasing to the ears and absolutely no harshness was present at all. It was the most realistic rendering of Center channel dialogue I had ever heard. I literally thought Tom Cruise was in the room. And it was a 80 inch TV with the CC risen to just below the panel tilted upward! Lecagies were superb as well but the treble and the highs had a slight piercing effect over the much cheaper JTR's. The articulate detail I hear now that I have felt with first reflection points with room treatments is unreal. I don't have the flagship models as you know and I live with the feeling knowing there is 'more' out there in respect to SQ if I am being honest and not a fanboy gloating defense to Jeff P. Yes his major chink is his lack of communication but having a consistent quarter Mil in orders prob on hand for some time now as he ships out continually and receives orders prob gives him a secure feeling in knowing he can wait to improve that department. I myself had to deal with it. Anyway I suppose we should get back on track and I am excited for the arrival of my 4520 this week!

lol! I just found this quote from a guy at Axpona listening to Legacy, Seaton, JTR and every major audio company
"You know, when RMK declared his JTR Triple 8's to be a performance match of his original Revels I though he was full of crap. I've come a long way. Big fan of controlled directivity now, love the impact of EQ and DSP. Man, what I was missing..."
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post #7941 of 8912 Old 04-27-2014, 07:25 PM
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Actually I feel one of the best things about my JTR speakers is how detailed and crystal clear they are at extremely quite volumes. When the kids go to bed sometimes I'll head down our theater and watch a movie with the master volume knob at -35 to -40, and at those volumes I can hear things perfectly clear, no straining trying to hear what people are saying during movies. The beauty of the JTR's are that once you want to get crazy with the volume they still remain calm and composed and don't start to break up and compress and screaming distortion. Where as a large portion of big name speakers start to scream mercy when things get really loud.

I'm really considering buying a new AVR to use and the AVR-4520 is number one on my list. But I'm trying to decide if at this point I should hold off till Denon has HDMI 2.0 out in their top tier AVR.

My Gear:

JTR Noesis 228HT (LCR)
Axiom Audio QS8 surrounds
Sherbourn PA 7-350
Pioneer VSX-21TXH
JVC RS45
Falcon Screens FVHD105
Dual PSA XS30's (gone but not forgotten)
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post #7942 of 8912 Old 04-27-2014, 07:35 PM
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Originally Posted by jbrown15 View Post

It is, show me one long time thread on AVS that doesn't always have a little side conversations going on? rolleyes.gif
Why is it that the JTR owners are the ones to alway bring up that their speakers are the best? Why can't they just say it in their own thread instead of other threads? I agree it is time to get back on topic and talk about the Denon 4520.
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Denon 4520ci, 3 JBL 2360As/EV DHA-1s, 3 1/4 Pie bass bins, MiniDSP 2x4s, 4 Klipsch HIPs, 2 Klipsch KP3002s, PS3, XBox 360, 3 Intel NUCs, Monoprice Redmere, Monster HTPS7000, 2 SUPER SPUD subs, Panasonic AE8000u, and a Yamaha P7000s.
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post #7943 of 8912 Old 04-27-2014, 07:44 PM
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Sorry, I sent it off track, however the 4520 and the 8801 I own (based on the same tech platform) are pretty boring these days. They work, next week.... still working, next week...... oh, still working. I use B&W 803S's as fronts an HTM3S as center and every other speaker in the room is B&W with Nautilus Tweeters; most in the 800 Seires. Subs SVS Sealed Ultra's. The whole enchilada...... Heights, Wides, Surrounds and Rear Surrounds. I never (OK, only to freak out friends) play beyond -5 reference and sound quality in my room is more important than sound volume. I will go learn about JTR's but in my experience (limited as it may be) speaker efficiency can easily be confused with speaker quality. I remember the red rimmed Cerwin Vega's many of my friends thought were cool and I thought were crap in my youth. I am old.....

The Denon AVR, people beat the heck out of on this forum if the internal DAC parts are "perceived" inferior. I do not think they are but we can look at 600 pages of speaker comment where no one has done a true full review; blind speaker testing is simply unheard of.. Going into one horribly laid out Hotel room to another horribly laid out hotel room and saying one speaker sounds "wayyyyy" better is kind of weird, not at all scientific and not really all that insightful. I would also add the totally esoteric and crazy expensive stuff out there is more vapor than reality. Equipment lines like Denon, Marantz, Onkyo, etc... have great manufacturing and economies of scale. These do not exist in garage based companies but just might if your speaker costs a half million US $. I just don't need a half million dollar speaker. I also love Vancouver, B.C. but don't want to haul my mains up there. Customs might give me some hell as well!!!

OK, I will go troll the JTR thread. Not so much troll as look for real reviews and real listening tests. My mom would perceive a speaker that is 10db more efficienct as better, she's in her mid 70s and might hear the JTR's....smile.gif
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post #7944 of 8912 Old 04-27-2014, 07:53 PM
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Originally Posted by ellisr63 View Post

Why is it that the JTR owners are the ones to alway bring up that their speakers are the best? Why can't they just say it in their own thread instead of other threads? I agree it is time to get back on topic and talk about the Denon 4520.
What's wrong with you? The post you quoted said none of that and nobody said jtr was the best.

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post #7945 of 8912 Old 04-27-2014, 08:06 PM
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Stay on topic while in here guys. If you need to discuss something else find/start a new topic.

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post #7946 of 8912 Old 04-27-2014, 08:30 PM
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Originally Posted by ellisr63 View Post

Why is it that the JTR owners are the ones to alway bring up that their speakers are the best? Why can't they just say it in their own thread instead of other threads? I agree it is time to get back on topic and talk about the Denon 4520.

Why is it Klipsch owners get their feathers ruffled when someone says something sounds better then their speakers? rolleyes.gif

I never said JTR's sound the best, but to me they have sounded better then anything else that I've auditioned. And now I'd like to possible buy a Denon AVR-4520 to use with them. Why is this such a crime?

Can any owners of high sensitivity speakers tell me what they think of using Audyssey XT32 with there speakers? I'd like to hear back from guys with speakers that are above 96dB sensitivity please.

My Gear:

JTR Noesis 228HT (LCR)
Axiom Audio QS8 surrounds
Sherbourn PA 7-350
Pioneer VSX-21TXH
JVC RS45
Falcon Screens FVHD105
Dual PSA XS30's (gone but not forgotten)
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post #7947 of 8912 Old 04-27-2014, 08:33 PM
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Looks like someone went to the principals office rolleyes.gif

We could discuss again the specs of the 4520 yea?

For real though I am very excited about the arrival of my 4520 on Thursday!
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post #7948 of 8912 Old 04-27-2014, 08:34 PM
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Originally Posted by SeattleHTGuy View Post

Sorry, I sent it off track, however the 4520 and the 8801 I own (based on the same tech platform) are pretty boring these days. They work, next week.... still working, next week...... oh, still working. I use B&W 803S's as fronts an HTM3S as center and every other speaker in the room is B&W with Nautilus Tweeters; most in the 800 Seires. Subs SVS Sealed Ultra's. The whole enchilada...... Heights, Wides, Surrounds and Rear Surrounds. I never (OK, only to freak out friends) play beyond -5 reference and sound quality in my room is more important than sound volume. I will go learn about JTR's but in my experience (limited as it may be) speaker efficiency can easily be confused with speaker quality. I remember the red rimmed Cerwin Vega's many of my friends thought were cool and I thought were crap in my youth. I am old.....

The Denon AVR, people beat the heck out of on this forum if the internal DAC parts are "perceived" inferior. I do not think they are but we can look at 600 pages of speaker comment where no one has done a true full review; blind speaker testing is simply unheard of.. Going into one horribly laid out Hotel room to another horribly laid out hotel room and saying one speaker sounds "wayyyyy" better is kind of weird, not at all scientific and not really all that insightful. I would also add the totally esoteric and crazy expensive stuff out there is more vapor than reality. Equipment lines like Denon, Marantz, Onkyo, etc... have great manufacturing and economies of scale. These do not exist in garage based companies but just might if your speaker costs a half million US $. I just don't need a half million dollar speaker. I also love Vancouver, B.C. but don't want to haul my mains up there. Customs might give me some hell as well!!!

OK, I will go troll the JTR thread. Not so much troll as look for real reviews and real listening tests. My mom would perceive a speaker that is 10db more efficienct as better, she's in her mid 70s and might hear the JTR's....smile.gif

Why not just come up for the day for my GTG to hear them for yourself? Leave your speakers at home and just come out to meet some fellow Pacific Northwest members. smile.gif There'll also be some other great speakers for you to hear. It's looking like we'll have some of the new speaker line from Funk Audio too. really nice stuff that would probably peek your interest. It should be a fun event.

My Gear:

JTR Noesis 228HT (LCR)
Axiom Audio QS8 surrounds
Sherbourn PA 7-350
Pioneer VSX-21TXH
JVC RS45
Falcon Screens FVHD105
Dual PSA XS30's (gone but not forgotten)
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post #7949 of 8912 Old 04-27-2014, 08:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jlpowell84 View Post

Looks like someone went to the principals office rolleyes.gif

We could discuss again the specs of the 4520 yea?

For real though I am very excited about the arrival of my 4520 on Thursday!

I really don't see why the hand slapping has to start now and why the mods need to get involved, nothings gotten out of hand and suddenly I'm not allowed to talk about my speakers that I'm considering using with the AVR-4520? rolleyes.gif

Almost 8000 posts in this thread, I find it hard to believe its 7900 posts only about the AVR. wink.gif
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My Gear:

JTR Noesis 228HT (LCR)
Axiom Audio QS8 surrounds
Sherbourn PA 7-350
Pioneer VSX-21TXH
JVC RS45
Falcon Screens FVHD105
Dual PSA XS30's (gone but not forgotten)
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post #7950 of 8912 Old 04-28-2014, 03:06 AM
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It seems almost everyone recommends two subs, not just sellers.

Don't confuse two properly positioned (for smoothest response) subwoofers, with 'stereo' subs positioned under/next to the Left & Right speakers. I would be surprised if SVS supported the idea of stereo bass - but do understand them recommending dual subs for most people.

Regards, Mike.
Dual subs work very well with the 4520 do to its inclusion of SubHT EQ (just trying to stay on topic........................)
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