The **OFFICIAL** DENON AVR-4520CI thread - Page 399 - AVS | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #11941 of 11948 Old Today, 02:43 PM
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Originally Posted by Michael Sargent View Post
So find out.
Well the effect of Audyssey is going to vary for every person's setup depending on what corrections it is applying. In my particular case it reduced the amplitude of the 40Hz signal by about .75dB.
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post #11942 of 11948 Old Today, 02:44 PM
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That is what I was wondering gsr. Is it just a power supply issue, because it would suck if someone with a $2 or $3k Marantz preamp (1.2v rated output on analogs) is experiencing the same thing...

What is the basic end result of clipping on the sub channel. Or the "con", because I am a laymen when it comes to the analog outs.

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Klipsch RF82 II and RC62 II / Hsu VTF-15H (2)
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post #11943 of 11948 Old Today, 02:52 PM
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^ I guess the obvious question here is how does this clipping compare to other AVR's and with dedicated pre-pros? Is it on a par with other similarly priced AVR's? And as someone else asked, what was used to take the measurements?
As I mentioned in one of my earlier posts the two Pioneer Elite units (SC-05 / 84TXSi) I measured and the one Onkyo (NR809) I measured were all able to output ~22Vpp at the onset of clipping. Neither clipped with the LFE only tone played at 0dB with the subwoofer trim at 0. They all had at least several extra dB of output headroom. So, based on that, I would say yes, the 4520CI is deficient compared to similarly priced units in this regard. Compared to a pre-pro I don't know. I will see about measuring my Sherbourn pre-pro later.

I used a Rigol DS1054Z oscilloscope to examine the waveform and take the measurements of the Denon. I used a Lecroy (don't know the model number) scope on the two Pioneer units. The Onkyo was measured with a trueRMS multimeter and some spreadsheet calculations to determine the onset of clipping.

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post #11944 of 11948 Old Today, 02:54 PM
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This is pretty ridiculous...

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post #11945 of 11948 Old Today, 03:00 PM
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That is what I was wondering gsr. Is it just a power supply issue, because it would suck if someone with a $2 or $3k Marantz preamp (1.2v rated output on analogs) is experiencing the same thing...
Well, in a manner of speaking it likely is a power supply issue (design related). The voltage rail(s) on the circuitry that drives the subwoofer output are not high enough to allow the full amplitude signal to pass so it gets chopped off. Denon could improve the situation by reducing the output level by a few dB in software, so you'd have to turn up the master volume higher before encountering the same issue.

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What is the basic end result of clipping on the sub channel. Or the "con", because I am a laymen when it comes to the analog outs.
Distortion, and a loss of output. As you turn up the volume further and futher you're not getting more clean SPL like you're supposed to, just some extra SPL from distortion.
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post #11946 of 11948 Old Today, 03:02 PM
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This is pretty ridiculous...
I agree, but yet the 4520CI has been out what 2.5 years now and no one noticed...
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post #11947 of 11948 Old Today, 03:03 PM
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Ouch. I wonder if the same problem is present on the analog outs running to my amp..

Maybe an actually preamp like the Marantz 7702 wouldnt have these voltage issues, or it could be a 4520 only issue. I always wondered why Denon and Marantz were always 1.2v rated on the analogs where Onkyo and Emotiva stuff was much higher.

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Klipsch RF82 II and RC62 II / Hsu VTF-15H (2)
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post #11948 of 11948 Old Today, 03:06 PM
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Originally Posted by Stereodude View Post
I agree, but yet the 4520CI has been out what 2.5 years now and no one noticed...
Ive just recently started running the subs hot like that, audyssey usually dials them way back. Wonder how much distortion I am introducing...

I guess the better alternative is to leave audyssey at the -8.5 it set them at and then just adjust sub gain with a meter...

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