The **OFFICIAL** DENON AVR-4520CI thread - Page 49 - AVS Forum
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post #1441 of 9054 Old 12-08-2012, 06:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ccotenj View Post

^^^
edit: this is actually the "user jnterface 101" part, and it's right... wink.gif when looking at the unit from the back, the user will intuitively hook the speaker up to the posts that are "closest" to it... when in doubt (and there's always doubt tongue.gif ), assume the user will not read, and will do the "most obvious" thing... smile.gif

+1

Yes, it does make sense as is. smile.gif

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post #1442 of 9054 Old 12-08-2012, 06:38 AM
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@mike...

it's early on a saturday, and realistically, there's not a lot of owners yet (and all of those owners "know" how to use the avr, so there's not a lot of questions), so a little enjoyable off topic discussion never hurts... smile.gif

when looking at it from the back side of your avr... which "side" do you connect the "left" speaker to? wink.gif

as far as the car analogy goes, that doesn't work... it's a different perspective... you are "in" the car when you are using it... you are "in front of" the avr when you are using it... i don't disagree that when the equipment is in a different room, the intuitiveness of this breaks down... realistically though, most don't have this scenario, and even fewer did when the "traditional" layout was designed (long before anything but 2 channel existed)...

as noted, i doubt a lot of thought went into this... i'd wager a large sum that the person who designed the first "back panel" many years ago simply thought it would make sense for the speaker to be connected to the "closest" post... smile.gif

- chris

 

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post #1443 of 9054 Old 12-08-2012, 06:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ss9001 View Post

Since many of the ex-Pioneer old pros are here now wink.gif, I thought I'd ask here how some of you perceive NeoX (now that you have it cool.gif) vs PLIIz vs audy's dsx?
I've been comparing NeoX heights vs PLIIz and everytime, I think I like PLIIz better. To me, it seems more expansive without negatively impacting the front soundstage, I guess more subtle applies. I can't quite explain it but NeoX seems to me to alter the entire front soundstage. but I'm looking for others' perceptions.
I'm not sure how many Pioneer posters are this far along in their use since many Pio posters lately seem stuck on connectivity & functionality issues tongue.gifwink.gif
old pros & new - thoughts? I'd like to see a listening guide between the 3 modes. Roger Dressler put some of his opinions in a post awhile back, based on how he perceived them. he thought that on much content, NeoX seemed to derive its heights from both surrounds and front L/R while IIz gets them only from surrounds. but that's the way he hears it & maybe that explains what I hear....I dunno confused.gif

Nice to see you here, Steve!

I posted my impressions of the various listening modes back several pages. I have yet to encounter a source where I preferred Neo:x over DSX. I have Audyssey DSX (heights and wides) engaged for video content all the time, I.e. satellite and DVD/Blu-ray, and turn it off only for the occasional poorly-recorded show. I rarely use DSX for music sources.

As a side note, I found that the effects of heights and wides became much more pleasing when I upgraded the effect speakers to be timbre-matched with the front speakers. All of my speakers are now from the same manufacturer (except the subs), and share common high frequency drivers.
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post #1444 of 9054 Old 12-08-2012, 06:43 AM
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So while eating breakfast, as I was giggling while posting, my wife wanted to know the "inside joke".
After I explained to her, she agreed with you guys, saying its the "exit stage left" viewpoint....who am I to argue now smile.gif

So, my OCD decided to see if that carried over to other labeling on the back.
I guess not, as HDMI / others are labeled from the installer viewpoint when hooking up stuff
5e3atyhy.jpg

When the USA goes metric maybe this can change also ....

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post #1445 of 9054 Old 12-08-2012, 06:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by ccotenj View Post

^^^
edit: this is actually the "user jnterface 101" part, and it's right... wink.gif when looking at the unit from the back, the user will intuitively hook the speaker up to the posts that are "closest" to it... when in doubt (and there's always doubt tongue.gif ), assume the user will not read, and will do the "most obvious" thing... smile.gif

+1

Yes, it does make sense as is. smile.gif

yea... smile.gif

the distinction here (i think) is that mike is looking at it from an engineers perspective (which isn't bad, just different), and i (and you) are looking at it from answering 1000's of questions where the user did the "obvious, but wrong" thing... smile.gif

there's a reason why denon came up with that godawful new setup routine for their avrs (i'm assuming they put that mess on the lower line ones as well)... the great majority of users in today's incredibly "user friendly" world just expect to do "the most obvious thing" and have it work... they've been trained to do so by all the other electronics they use... you could hand a modern smartphone to rip van winkle, and he'd be able to use it in 2 minutes, simply by doing the "obvious" things... "user interfaces" are magnitudes of order more "intuitively obvious" than they were even 5 years ago, let alone 10 or 20...

sorry for the even more ot digression... redface.gif

- chris

 

my build thread - updated 8-20-12 - new seating installed and projector isolation solution

 

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1332917/ccotenj-finally-gets-a-projector

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post #1446 of 9054 Old 12-08-2012, 06:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mtbdudex View Post

So while eating breakfast, as I was giggling while posting, my wife wanted to know the "inside joke".
After I explained to her, she agreed with you guys, saying its the "exit stage left" viewpoint....who am I to argue now smile.gif

So, my OCD decided to see if that carried over to other labeling on the back.
I guess not, as HDMI / others are labeled from the installer viewpoint when hooking up stuff
5e3atyhy.jpg

When the USA goes metric maybe this can change also ....

Sent from my 32GB iPhone4 using Tapatalk

you have married a wise woman... smile.gif

hey, we've only been switching over for 40 years... these things take time... tongue.gif

- chris

 

my build thread - updated 8-20-12 - new seating installed and projector isolation solution

 

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1332917/ccotenj-finally-gets-a-projector

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post #1447 of 9054 Old 12-08-2012, 07:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ccotenj View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by mtbdudex View Post

So while eating breakfast, as I was giggling while posting, my wife wanted to know the "inside joke".
After I explained to her, she agreed with you guys, saying its the "exit stage left" viewpoint....who am I to argue now smile.gif

So, my OCD decided to see if that carried over to other labeling on the back.
I guess not, as HDMI / others are labeled from the installer viewpoint when hooking up stuff
5e3atyhy.jpg

When the USA goes metric maybe this can change also ....

Sent from my 32GB iPhone4 using Tapatalk

you have married a wise woman... smile.gif

hey, we've only been switching over for 40 years... these things take time... tongue.gif

I now know why I read here before reading the funnies out of the paper every Saturday.
I also, immediately ran downstairs and double checked that my left front wasn't in the right binding and so on. Whew! tongue.gif

In search of video bliss...
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post #1448 of 9054 Old 12-08-2012, 07:24 AM
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I am not sure it is connected, but about the time of the recent firmware update, I have no longer been able to play my flac and mp3 files located on my hard drive that is connected to my network router.

Prior, it worked seemlessly, by clicking on the media server icon.

When I click on the folder labeled "music" now, it seems to do a network reset now. When I click on the songs I had saved in the "Favorites" menu icon, I get an error message that says the "Track not found, skip track". I checked the hard drive on my PC and the files seem fine and play.

Not sure there is any connection to the update, but temporally it started about the same time.

Any thoughts?
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post #1449 of 9054 Old 12-08-2012, 08:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mariob33 View Post


I now know why I read here before reading the funnies out of the paper every Saturday.
I also, immediately ran downstairs and double checked that my left front wasn't in the right binding and so on. Whew! tongue.gif

Glad to offer some Saturday humor.

Back to 4520 discussion, hey airplay is kinda cool!
Absolutely nothing to set-up, just selected music app, and there was magically this small box with up arrow next to the volume control to select the source output.
What a no-brainer.

And controlling the volume also, how sweet.
Makes me wonder how soon before Internet Protocol totally replaces IR/RS-232 for all our HT devices.....
I vote sooner than later, much more flexibility it seems.


Now, if all 5 of the Apple devices in our home tried to control it wonder what would happen?
And of course if someone by accident starts airplay, then AVR switches to that...that could be an issue...or a method for practical joke.

I'll have to check the set-up preferences to see if the AVR can somehow block airplay or onscreen "ask" to switch over to it instead of auto.
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post #1450 of 9054 Old 12-08-2012, 09:06 AM
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AirPlay 501;
So I was upstairs, basement ht totally off, and AirPlay turned it on and started to play. Then, it leaves the AVR on...

Hmmm, seems to easy for it.
I don't see any pref in my iPhone to control that easy access.
Guess if you have access to the network it grants you unrestricted access.
(These are times I wish for paper user manual)

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post #1451 of 9054 Old 12-08-2012, 10:01 AM
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Given my difficuly playing files from my network hard drive using the 4520's media server icon (mentioned above), I tired to troubleshoot a little.

Reset, restarted my router that the hard drive is plugged in to-did not help.

Backed up my 4520, checked to make sure backup was not all 0's, and it was not, had lots of text and other numbers. Backup said it completed successfully.

Figured I would try and reset on the 4520.

Did a full reset on the 4520 (MP and network).

I did not think it would reset all my settings to default, but it did. Did not think, even if it did, would be a big deal, since I just did a "successful backup".

Unfortunately, I have tried a "Load" restore twice and each time it goes for 5 minutes, then I get a message on my laptop "Load not completed. Please try again."

The 4520 seems stuck in "Loading", with the only way to break it, to pull the plug of the unit,. (any other way to do this?)

I am going to try one more time, then guess I will start from scratch and do the Audyssey setup and all the settings from scratch.

Any ideas how to avoid this in the future?

Addendum:

Third try to restore/load seems to have worked. This time I plugged my laptop directly into the router for a wired connection rather than wireless. Seems to have been successful.

(although did not fix the initial problem which was accessing the hard drive media files, mp3 and flac)
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post #1452 of 9054 Old 12-08-2012, 10:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mtbdudex View Post

As I'm installing my wide and height speakers this rainy Saturday morning, I find it ironic that on the backplate RH is on the LH side and LH is on the RH side.
(For all the speaker connections)
User interface 101 mistake!
Even with the screen print there, wanna bet someone wired it wrong...
8ady8u5u.jpg
I'm sure this has been posted before.
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well this makes sense when you think about which direction from the back of the unit you are running wires to the speakers, this way they don't cross over each other.

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post #1453 of 9054 Old 12-08-2012, 10:24 AM
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Folks,

Just getting delivery of the 4520 tomorrow.
I have B&W speakers but have yet not invested in a sub. Have a failrly lasrge living room with concrete walls.
Would like to drawn on the collective wisdom of the foroum for a reco on the sub.
Thanks
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post #1454 of 9054 Old 12-08-2012, 10:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smad View Post

Folks,
Just getting delivery of the 4520 tomorrow.
I have B&W speakers but have yet not invested in a sub. Have a failrly lasrge living room with concrete walls.
Would like to drawn on the collective wisdom of the foroum for a reco on the sub.
Thanks

Can you add a little more information?

What's your budget?
Do you have room for dual subs?
Size limitations / WAF issues?
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post #1455 of 9054 Old 12-08-2012, 12:10 PM
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Have now experienced my first "weird receiver moment". For the last couple of days, I noticed that PLIIx showed up on the display and the sound out of my speakers had changed.

This should not be possible since I had set up my system as a 5.1 system plus zone2/3 in the speaker configuration. So, I took a look at the speaker configuration in the manual speaker setup. Sure enough, it was set to a 9.1 configuration. That explains the odd PLIIx indicator on the display and the sound changes.

This appears to be to only change in the system. No other settings were impacted. Has anyone else experienced any spontaneous settings changes ? Is there a button or combination of buttons on the remote that my non-techy spousal unit might have accidentally triggered ?

- Steven
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post #1456 of 9054 Old 12-08-2012, 12:17 PM
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Originally Posted by scbartling View Post

Have now experienced my first "weird receiver moment". For the last couple of days, I noticed that PLIIx showed up on the display and the sound out of my speakers had changed.
This should not be possible since I had set up my system as a 5.1 system plus zone2/3 in the speaker configuration. So, I took a look at the speaker configuration in the manual speaker setup. Sure enough, it was set to a 9.1 configuration. That explains the odd PLIIx indicator on the display and the sound changes.
This appears to be to only change in the system. No other settings were impacted. Has anyone else experienced any spontaneous settings changes ? Is there a button or combination of buttons on the remote that my non-techy spousal unit might have accidentally triggered ?
- Steven

Several if us have reported that the AVR reverts to "prior settings" following a firmware upgrade. Is it possible that this is the cause?
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post #1457 of 9054 Old 12-08-2012, 01:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post

that's the way it works for essentially every receiver on the market -- only analog audio can go to another zone (although for newer network models this does include internally tuned network streams like AirPlay, Internet Radio, etc).

I have question about the zone 4 HDMI.

I have a 5308ci serving my theater. I want it to also serve a TV in another room. It would be nice to have all of my sources connected to the receiver with only HDMI and have both the projector in the theater and the TV in the next room connected via HDMI--and be able to watch different sources on each. My understanding is that I can't do this on the 5308ci.

My question is could I accomplish this using a 4520ci on the Zone 4 Matrix HDMI output?

This seems like a common question but if it's in this thread I've missed it.

Thanks
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post #1458 of 9054 Old 12-08-2012, 01:34 PM
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For my issue of AirPlay turning my 4520 on, I'll have to check if the network always on is enabled, if so that could explain it.
AirPlay pings the AVR, it turns on and plays.
(page 82 and 147 of manual)


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post #1459 of 9054 Old 12-08-2012, 01:39 PM - Thread Starter
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@Cinti - Yes, that's exactly the way Zone 4 HDMI works.

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post #1460 of 9054 Old 12-08-2012, 01:40 PM
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Correct. The Network setting factory defaults to "Always On" which would indeed cause this behavior. smile.gif

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post #1461 of 9054 Old 12-08-2012, 01:42 PM
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Is anyone finding good deals on this unit online yet? I want to know about deals. Thanks.smile.gif

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post #1462 of 9054 Old 12-08-2012, 01:45 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mtbdudex View Post

For my issue of AirPlay turning my 4520 on, I'll have to check if the network always on is enabled, if so that could explain it.
AirPlay pings the AVR, it turns on and plays.
(page 82 and 147 of manual)


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I don't understand what the "issue" is? AirPlay is supposed to turn the unit on, that's a BENEFIT, not an issue. You can start music playing without having to mess with the receiver or remote. If you want it to then off on its own there is an "auto standby" feature.

Also, on your left/right thing... That's the way it works on all receivers and it's really the only way that makes sense. The connections are oriented to the physical location of the speakers - otherwise you'd have to cross the wires between left and right sides to get to the connections.

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post #1463 of 9054 Old 12-08-2012, 01:47 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by sourbeef View Post

Is anyone finding good deals on this unit online yet? I want to know about deals. Thanks.smile.gif

You have to CALL to get deals. Denon aggressively polices their msrp so you will almost never see the best deals posted online.

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post #1464 of 9054 Old 12-08-2012, 01:48 PM
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@sourbeef...


see post 1430, i already responded to you... wink.gif

- chris

 

my build thread - updated 8-20-12 - new seating installed and projector isolation solution

 

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1332917/ccotenj-finally-gets-a-projector

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post #1465 of 9054 Old 12-08-2012, 01:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CintiAudio View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post

that's the way it works for essentially every receiver on the market -- only analog audio can go to another zone (although for newer network models this does include internally tuned network streams like AirPlay, Internet Radio, etc).

I have question about the zone 4 HDMI.

I have a 5308ci serving my theater. I want it to also serve a TV in another room. It would be nice to have all of my sources connected to the receiver with only HDMI and have both the projector in the theater and the TV in the next room connected via HDMI--and be able to watch different sources on each. My understanding is that I can't do this on the 5308ci.

My question is could I accomplish this using a 4520ci on the Zone 4 Matrix HDMI output?

This seems like a common question but if it's in this thread I've missed it.

Thanks

yes, that is how it works... i have it set up that way... ps3, oppo, atv, mac mini and 2 fios boxes connected to the avr... main zone out to theater room... zone 4 out to a tv in another room... works very well... smile.gif

- chris

 

my build thread - updated 8-20-12 - new seating installed and projector isolation solution

 

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1332917/ccotenj-finally-gets-a-projector

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post #1466 of 9054 Old 12-08-2012, 01:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AustinJerry View Post

Several if us have reported that the AVR reverts to "prior settings" following a firmware upgrade. Is it possible that this is the cause?

I wish that was the case, then I could explain it.

I have only upgraded firmware once (the marathon 55 minute initial upgrade) and I verified every single setting after the upgrade.

Somewhere between the 1st firmware upgrade and this morning (about 2 weeks), the speaker configuration spontaneously changed.

This morning, I corrected the speaker configuration, upgraded the firmware (the latest 3 minute upgrade), and again checked the speaker configuration afterwards (it was still ok).

Guess I'll have to wait and see if this happens again.

- Steven
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post #1467 of 9054 Old 12-08-2012, 01:57 PM
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^^^

always a possibility that someone "pushed a button"...

another good reason to have a universal remote... coded properly, no "oopsies" can happen*... smile.gif

* assuming you hide the original remotes well enough so they can't be found... tongue.gif

- chris

 

my build thread - updated 8-20-12 - new seating installed and projector isolation solution

 

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1332917/ccotenj-finally-gets-a-projector

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post #1468 of 9054 Old 12-08-2012, 04:55 PM
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Can anyone confirm that after latest firmware upgrade, that their 4520 can still access and play mp3 and flac files on a network/router hard drive?
About that time I stopped being able to access and play my files. I can still play them on my PC and on my Ipad, so they seem ok.
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post #1469 of 9054 Old 12-08-2012, 05:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tachy View Post

Can anyone confirm that after latest firmware upgrade, that their 4520 can still access and play mp3 and flac files on a network/router hard drive?
About that time I stopped being able to access and play my files. I can still play them on my PC and on my Ipad, so they seem ok.

I would be glad to try for you, but I don't usually use my 4520 to play MP3 files stored on my PC. When I try and access the PC, it is showing as "Not authorized" in the list. If you can help me overcome this obstacle, perhaps I can help.
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post #1470 of 9054 Old 12-08-2012, 06:59 PM
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I am not certain, but I think in your case, the PC "Share" and/or firewall settings need to be set to allow the 4520 to access the files. My setup is somewhat different, in that I have a hard drive, plugged directly in to my router by USB, that is directly seen by my Denon. Up until this week, these files played seemlessly, but for some reason this week, when I try to access them, the darned receiver disconnects it's network entirely and has to restart its network connection from scratch, and no songs are seen.
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