Urgent: Denon 3312 VS Pioneer SC55 - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 10 Old 09-19-2012, 08:56 PM - Thread Starter
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The SC55 is actually a Futureshop rebrand Pioneer SC1526K

Sorry for posting this as urgent especially sinse I am a newbie to this forum. I bought a Denon 3312 from Futureshop, I upgraded from a Pioneer VSX919ah-k, quite a huge upgrade.

I will get straight to the point, I have another 20 days or so to decide if I want to keep the denon or swap it for another receiver. The futureshop I deal with has one Pioneer SC1526 left and they are switching to this years models so they want to get rid of it. I paid 899 for the Denon and they are asking 1099 for the Pioneer receiver. They did/do not have either receiver set up to demo. In your guys/gals humble opinion would the pioneer be an upgrade? Would it be worth the extra $200.00? I am lookign for a little more power to my mains and the extra 2 channels would be nice for a second zone. By the way, I did find my old pioneer a little bright with my polk speakers, I am sure that the SC would be better though??

Okay so the long story if you care to read:

I really do like the denon, but the pioneer has a few features I would like that the denon does not have. The Pioneer has 9 channels running at 140 watts a piece instead of the Denon 7 running at 125 a piece (I picked up the pioneer and it has a good few pounds on the denon even though they are class D amps). The pioneer is also quite a bit nicer looking (Wife factor, must keep her happy).

The Denon has Audyssey and the pioneer has MCACC. Even though I used MCACC for a long time I think that the Audyssey does a much better job. This could just possibly be because the Denon is a much better receiver then my old pioneer so it sounds way better. The one thing I liked about MCACC is I could program 6 different memories in it and switch depending on what I was listening to / where i was sitting, is this even possible with the denon?

The Denon also sounds nice and warm with my main polk speakers. If I listen to 2 channel music with the crossover set at 60hz the amp actually produces quite a bit of bass through my polk speakers (my old pioneer did not even move the woofers), I do however run my little polk 10" sub when listening to 2 channel music to handle the bass between 35 and 60hz.

I would like to run a 7 channel system in my home theater room and run a stereo pair of cables up to my living room for music there. I also would like to be able to control the music (song list / volume) from my Ipod / ipad which works flawlessly on the Denon. I am afraid of switching to the pioneer and not being happy and having to switch back to the Denon, I also don't want to sit here wondering what if the pioneer was better everytime I listen to my stereo? I am hoping that I will have this receiver for 5 years (bought the 5 year FS replacement warrenty) before upgrading it again so I want to be happy with it. (I am happy with it BTW... Not sure if I would be happIER with the pioneer)

If I do decide to stay with the Denon I would eventually end up getting 2 Stereo amps, one for the zone 2 pre amps to run upstairs and one for my mains to give a bit more head room and a little bit more snap to the bass (The RTI 10's can handle 300 watts each). I would have to get these after I upgrade my surrounds though.

If I do end up getting the 2 additional amps of course I would have to get a pair of RTI-A9's for the home theater and move the RTI-10's upstairs. Alternatively a pair of Lsi 9's on fancy speaker stands would also look good in the living room. AHHHH Upgradeitis! IT IS A DISEASE!

P.S. Do not laugh at my Surround speakers (lol) they used to be my mains and have been rotated to surround duty until I get a pair of FXI-A4's or RTI-A3's... that is a question for another day though. I know the FXI's would be better for movies but I also listen to a lot of concert Blu rays, and I want to get an SACD player.

Thanks,
Schmick

TV - Samsung 50" plasma
Receiver - Denon 3312
Mains - Polk RTI 10
Center - Polk CSI A4
Surrounds - Sony SS-F7000
Subs 1 - Velodyne EQMax 12
Sub 2 - Polk Audio PSW 10
BD - Sony BDP S350
Play station 2
Nintendo Wii

Edit: Added some more hardware to my sig.
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post #2 of 10 Old 09-20-2012, 01:31 AM
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The Pioneer is defiantly more powerful yes smile.gif I do assume that the MCACC in the newer Pioneer will be better than the old MCACC version in your older Pioneer.

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post #3 of 10 Old 09-20-2012, 06:06 AM
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Regardless of marketing, AVRs are generally only rated into 2 channels, and as the Pioneer is rated at only 1khz (which is generally about 10% higher than the full 20hz-20khz rating on the Denon) in actually both AVRs have roughly the same power. Audyssey can only save one EQ at a time and is not tweakable like MCACC. As there seem to be plusses to both models, to set aside any doubts, why not just get the SC-55 and demo them both at the same time, returning the one you don't select?

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post #4 of 10 Old 09-20-2012, 06:23 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Prietz0r View Post

The Pioneer is defiantly more powerful yes smile.gif I do assume that the MCACC in the newer Pioneer will be better than the old MCACC version in your older Pioneer.

Thanks, is this fro personal experience? Or are you just going by the specs?

How does the iphone app work for the pioneer and does airplay work well?

How is the gui on the pioneer, the gui on the Denon is sooo much nicer than my old pioneer?

Sorry for so many questions, but I really want to make the right choice this time so i do not have to go get another receiver in 2 years.
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post #5 of 10 Old 09-20-2012, 02:18 PM - Thread Starter
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Going to give this a little bump and hope for some more insight.
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post #6 of 10 Old 09-20-2012, 02:25 PM
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The 55 has class D amps and is a no brainer here IMO

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post #7 of 10 Old 09-20-2012, 05:08 PM - Thread Starter
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Okay if it is a no brainer what are you saying????? Seriously man? I understand a lot about electronics but the store is 2 hours away and I will have to go atleast twice if I am going to do a side by side comparison... Is it a no brainer that the pioneer is worth the extra coin? why be so vague?
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post #8 of 10 Old 09-20-2012, 10:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smithers138 View Post

Thanks, is this fro personal experience? Or are you just going by the specs?
How does the iphone app work for the pioneer and does airplay work well?
How is the gui on the pioneer, the gui on the Denon is sooo much nicer than my old pioneer?
Sorry for so many questions, but I really want to make the right choice this time so i do not have to go get another receiver in 2 years.

Hi please read this quote smile.gif
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prietz0r View Post

Let's compare the "HT Labs Measures" from the same site smile.gif
For the new Marantz SR7007:
Two channels driven continuously into 4-ohm loads:
0.1% distortion at 205.1 watts
1% distortion at 225.4 watts
Two channels driven continuously into 8-ohm loads:
0.1% distortion at 124.3 watts
1% distortion at 143.2 watts
Five channels driven continuously into 8-ohm loads:
0.1% distortion at 89.5 watts
1% distortion at 111.4 watts
Seven channels driven continuously into 8-ohm loads:
0.1% distortion at 70.5 watts
1% distortion at 83.8 watts
For the 'old' Marantz SR7005:
Two channels driven continuously into 4-ohm loads:
0.1% distortion at 200.1 watts
1% distortion at 222.6 watts
Two channels driven continuously into 8-ohm loads:
0.1% distortion at 121.5 watts
1% distortion at 139.5 watts
Five channels driven continuously into 8-ohm loads:
0.1% distortion at 91.2 watts
1% distortion at 112.1 watts
Seven channels driven continuously into 8-ohm loads:
0.1% distortion at 74.6 watts
1% distortion at 89.6 watts
For the Denon AVR-3312CI which is reported as be in the same 'class' as the Marantz 700x series with similar components smile.gif :
Two channels driven continuously into 4-ohm loads:
0.1% distortion at 202.0 watts
1% distortion at 225.5 watts
Two channels driven continuously into 8-ohm loads:
0.1% distortion at 122.9 watts
1% distortion at 143.3 watts
Five channels driven continuously into 8-ohm loads:
0.1% distortion at 82.9 watts
1% distortion at 103.0 watts
Seven channels driven continuously into 8-ohm loads:
0.1% distortion at 79.5 watts
1% distortion at 96.8 watts
And one of the competitors from a other company the Pioneer Elite SC-57 (Pioneer SC-LX85 is other countries):
Two channels driven continuously into 4-ohm loads:
0.1% distortion at 215.7 watts
1% distortion at 254.2 watts
Two channels driven continuously into 8-ohm loads:
0.1% distortion at 138.1 watts
1% distortion at 178.0 watts
Five channels driven continuously into 8-ohm loads:
0.1% distortion at 115.1 watts
1% distortion at 132.0 watts
Seven channels driven continuously into 8-ohm loads:
0.1% distortion at 109.6 watts
1% distortion at 123.7 watts
Interesting is that the 'older' Marantz is apparently testing just a bit better, but not really a big change, no new amp section for the newer one ?
The Denon AVR-3312CI is benchmarking quite the same as both Marantz models smile.gif
Looks like the amp section in both brands are outputting the same power amount of power.
And the Pioneer has the highest output, but that was expected the rated output is 140 watt 2 channels to 125 for the Marantz and Denon models smile.gif

TV: Panasonic TX-P50VT30E
Audio | Receiver: Pioneer VSX-AX2AS-S (Pioneer Elite VSX-82TXS) | Speakers: 2x KEF Q900 for Fronts | 2x KEF Q700 for Rears
Audio/Video Sources | Panasonic DMP-BDT 310 | Pioneer PL-510 | HTPC using Intel i3-3220 16GB XBMC on Ubuntu 13.10
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post #9 of 10 Old 09-21-2012, 08:40 AM - Thread Starter
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Silly me, I thought if I looked at $1000 + amps they would be straight up with thier ouputs. Isn't thier some kind of false advertising rules. . I knew when I bought my VSX919ah-k that it would not output the advertised 130 Watts perchannel, I did however expect higher end amps to output close to thier advertised power, atleast the Denon 3312 sounds sweet in steroe mode. It is much warmer than the previous pioneer I had, I can set the Cut off at 60hz and listen to it at volume level 0 without the amp struggeling at all.

I think I am going to stick with the denon because I like the sound quality so much, I will put the extra $200 toward a power amp. I want a power amp that can put out about 500 watts RMS per channel stereo, something that is very transparent and will not colour the sound coming out of the receiver. I have searched quite a bit for something that fits these specs and I can only find really expensive amps or really cheap amps that have horrable reviews.

What sort of a budget should a guy set for a decent quality 2 or 3 channel amp? I would not mind amping the center channel for movies either. Does anyone have any suggestions of amps that I should be looking at? Evena five channel amp would be okay, I would use 3 channels for the Front Left/Right/Center and then use 2 channels for zone 2 and put 2 speakers in my sitting room for music.

Edit:

So looking at those specs a guy who is bi amping(with the receiver) will actually get less power to the mains than if he just single wired and only used 5 channels at a time?
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post #10 of 10 Old 10-12-2012, 12:34 PM
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@ smithers138 Did you made already a choice btw ? smile.gif

TV: Panasonic TX-P50VT30E
Audio | Receiver: Pioneer VSX-AX2AS-S (Pioneer Elite VSX-82TXS) | Speakers: 2x KEF Q900 for Fronts | 2x KEF Q700 for Rears
Audio/Video Sources | Panasonic DMP-BDT 310 | Pioneer PL-510 | HTPC using Intel i3-3220 16GB XBMC on Ubuntu 13.10
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