Marantz AV8801 Preamp/Processor Official Owner's thread - Page 172 - AVS Forum
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post #5131 of 11874 Old 04-19-2013, 08:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smitty8451 View Post

Thank you Ralph, does it also pass through any selection on the fly while the unit is off. The reason I ask is in the morning I browse the net with my HTPC, when the wife wakes up she will watch Directv. Can you just switch the inputs to passthrough without turning on the unit to make the selection. The yamaha lets you just use the remote to select the input while the unit is off and out to the TV the signal goes. BTW are you the same Ralph that used to post on another website (the name escapes me at the moment) on the B&K REF 50 series of Pre-Pros back in 05-06 timeframe? If so I want to thank you as your insight into that unit when I had it allways was a great help.

Greetings,

I haven't tried what you're suggesting however I can't see any way to make changes like that without powering the unit on so I would say no.

Yes, I am the same Ralph (the site was the HT Spot) and you're very welcome... smile.gif

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post #5132 of 11874 Old 04-19-2013, 09:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by danielo View Post


I now have a 8801 to replace my AVP since its in for repair frown.gif so i feel ok in posting in this thread. The 8801 is not a bad unit but in many area's not up to the level of the mightly avp esp. in options like outlined above. The bad news i did manage to blow up the 8801 within 3 hours of use (probably a lemon) so can't play with it any longer to compare it to the denon.

You might want to check your power or transformer if you are using one since you now have two dead preamps.

- Rich

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post #5133 of 11874 Old 04-19-2013, 09:34 AM
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Main Zone On/Off issue has been solved. smile.gif


Folks with Harmony One, I've learned that AV8801 Device commands provided by Harmony uses wrong Main Zone Power ON/OFF command...

The proper Main Zone POWER ON/OFF Pronto Hex Command can be found on row#6 on the AV Commands Excel Sheet of the Marantz_AV_SR_NR_IR_CODE_V03.xls

Go to SR7007 software downloads section to download this Excel file.

I've followed this link to import Pronto HEX command and named it "MainPowerOnOff"

http://www.avforums.com/forums/remote-controls/1510519-guide-getting-pronto-hex-codes-into-your-harmony-remote.html
OzzieP and msilverz like this.

- Alex
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post #5134 of 11874 Old 04-19-2013, 09:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by danielo View Post

I posted a little more on the avp thread and the other 'dual' owner ohyeah32 seems to agree. Indeed 3 hours is very little time to compare them for sure and the 8801 seems a fine unit. Maybe the most impressive things are because the AVP is a 2007 design it can still be so impressive in the area of build, options and settings.

My AVP has the update so the compare to the 8801 is fair, i tested both with and without xt32. Now XT32 and/or pro takes time and a little fiddling so i am sure more was to be gained from the 8801 if i had more time.

Build : The 8801 is nice but its not a AVP, at 1/3 of the price (in europe with the 3d update) this is maybe not expected

Sounds: Always the hardest to say in such a limited time. One thing i know for a fact is that the AVP/POA combo has a lower noise level. At 0dB without content the AVP doesn't produce any noise on my speakers ears at say 30cm from speakers. On the 8801 i can pick up noise up about 1 meter away. The sound quality to me seems that the AVP was more focussed and imaging was sharper i prefer that but some might prefer the more diffuse sound of the 8801.

Audyssey: Both sounded better with than without it in my room. setup are very similar and probably same people worked on it. Missed the fact that as far as i could see i can't use audyssey in pure-direct mode.

OSD: unless i am mistaken the 8801 most of the time doesn't overlay its menu's over the video (for example when going into the menu's). For the rest i found the 'tunning' they did with the 'gold' look not really a step forward almost trying to put lipstick on a pig.

Remote: hard to believe but its even worse than the 2 remotes we got with the AVP now i am sure most won't use them anywhere but pffff.

Connections : Well just look at the back of the 2 units. Now i agree you don't need all these svideo's anymore but i would run out of simple digital in's quickly since i prefer them for audio over hdmi.

Settings: flipping through the menu's its very similar maybe the new X000 line will change that but its still the old structure. I did notice that where the AVP has 3 levels of settings the 8801 mostly stops at 2. As a result i missed many small tweaks that are possible on the avp that could not quickly see on the 8801. Small example i could not quickly see how to use a hdmi input for video but take the audio from spdif.

After about 3 hours of use i heard a pop in my right channel, again 15 seconds later and my amp shut down. Looks like something blew in the analog part of the right channel both over rca and xlr. With the AVP you can reroute channels after the digital stage to any (or multiple) of the output boards i could have rerouted the signal to say SW2 or SW3 and continued using it again more flexible.

I am sure there are area's where the 8801 is more modern than a updated AVP, but what the designers of the AVP aimed for as a starting point in what you can do was so much higher and it still shows in 2013 even after 5 years.

Not trying to bash the 8801 in fact i am glad to see a nice pre/pro at this price level was always sad denon dropped their idea to release a smaller AVP-CIX a few years ago and the 8801 seems to be close to that and will make many people happy.

The AVP was a exception even among other units in its price class the focus of putting so much into a single box and more switches and options (combined with D&M known bad manuals) is not for everybody.

Maybe ohyeah32 can add more flavour to this discussion but my short visit with the 8801 vs my AVP-3D made me appreciate even more what their engineers created way back and i hope its back soon to take its place in my rack for a few more years.

Daniel.

To each his own I guess. I replaced the Integra Research RDC 7.1 with the Marantz AV8801 and very happy with the results. This pre/pro is very transparent and dynamic; it reminds me a lot about the Krell HT 7.1 that I had 8 years ago.
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post #5135 of 11874 Old 04-19-2013, 10:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by krellcoda View Post

To each his own I guess. I replaced the Integra Research RDC 7.1 with the Marantz AV8801 and very happy with the results. This pre/pro is very transparent and dynamic; it reminds me a lot about the Krell HT 7.1 that I had 8 years ago.

Sure not sure how your comparison relates, i tried to compare parts that are not really about taste but more based on real differences. The one thing that is hard to nail down is SQ so i am more reluctant to talk about that but other things are more clear since they depends on facts that can be checked or tested.

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post #5136 of 11874 Old 04-19-2013, 10:34 AM
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Originally Posted by RichB View Post

You might want to check your power or transformer if you are using one since you now have two dead preamps.

- Rich

I was indeed worried but the AVP has a broken digital board so seems unrelated. I did check everything and asked about if the poweramp could
have resulted in something like this they feel its not possible. To make sure i have now a simple (3th) pro-ject pre-amp hooked up and using that
without any problems.

But if anyone can give me a logical way my poweramp or normally stable 240volt power (in this country) could result in this i would listen for sure smile.gif

Daniel.

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post #5137 of 11874 Old 04-19-2013, 11:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Selden Ball View Post

If Audyssey produces a response curve which is not as flat as when Audyssey is disabled, then something is wrong with your calibration. Problems like this often are caused by putting the microphone on a surface which vibrates due to the test tones or other noises. (e.g. a using a tripod sitting on a sofa cushion) That's why professional microphone boom stands are strongly recommended. They only cost about $20.

For more details please read the Audyssey FAQ. http://www.avsforum.com/t/795421/official-audyssey-thread-faq-in-post-1/51750#post_21782993

Doh! Looks like I am recalibrating...
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post #5138 of 11874 Old 04-19-2013, 12:03 PM
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Ran audyssey for the first time in all 8 positions and got some unexpected results.

1. It tells my my Side Left speaker might be wired backwards, I double checked it and it was fine so I hit ignore.
2. It set my front three mains to Large despite me having 2 subs.
3. It sucked the bass out of my system and I like my bass. I noticed both subs were set to -15dbs?
4. Crossovers for the main was set 120Hz?

I went ahead and set the mains back to small with a crossover at 80Hz and pumped up my bass again. Is audyssey doing anything else to the system?
I do like the sound from the system and it is way more open in the surrounds than my old system.
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post #5139 of 11874 Old 04-19-2013, 12:41 PM
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If you haven't already, please read through the Audyssey FAQ. See http://www.avsforum.com/t/795421/official-audyssey-thread-faq-in-post-1/51750#post_21782993

1. One possible cause of a false miswiring warning is reflections. Your room might need some audio treatments (absorbers or diffusers).

2. You do need to manually set speakers to Small to enable bass management. The Large setting is "helpfully" configured for you by code provided by Marantz, not by the code provided by Audyssey.

3. A setting of -15 dB indicates that you need to turn down the subwoofer volume controls. Audyssey turned the level down as far as it could, but the subwoofers were still too loud. As a result, they're uncalibrated.

4. What kind of speakers do you have?
Remember that the values published by manufacturers are for anechoic chambers, not for home listening rooms, so their low frequency limits have to be taken with a grain of salt. Also, unusually high crossover frequencies sometimes are caused by reflections. Remove any objects from the room that don't need to be there permanently. One person recently reported that removing a child's chair substantially reduced the crossover settings for his speakers.

5. Crossover frequencies shouldn't be reduced, only increased, because Audyssey normally does not do any equalization below the speaker's f3 frequency, which Marantz uses to determine the crossover frequency.

Selden
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post #5140 of 11874 Old 04-19-2013, 01:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Selden Ball View Post

My personal guess is that D&M don't plan to release a pre/pro with Denon branding any time soon. The Marantz AV8801 is the Denon AVR 4520 with the appropriate tweaks to make it into a pre/pro. The model numbers of the two units don't correspond to the annual model number changes they've used up until this year, which implies to me that they don't want them to appear to be obsolete despite annual changes in the numbering used for their other systems.



You keep referring to the two being pretty much the same. IMO you can compare an AVR to a pre/pro only so far. If they were the same either the Denon should/would sell for more or the Marantz less. Many circuits are different. Just saying smile.gif
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post #5141 of 11874 Old 04-19-2013, 01:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by danielo View Post

I posted a little more on the avp thread and the other 'dual' owner ohyeah32 seems to agree. Indeed 3 hours is very little time to compare them for sure and the 8801 seems a fine unit. Maybe the most impressive things are because the AVP is a 2007 design it can still be so impressive in the area of build, options and settings.

My AVP has the update so the compare to the 8801 is fair, i tested both with and without xt32. Now XT32 and/or pro takes time and a little fiddling so i am sure more was to be gained from the 8801 if i had more time.

Build : The 8801 is nice but its not a AVP, at 1/3 of the price (in europe with the 3d update) this is maybe not expected

Sounds: Always the hardest to say in such a limited time. One thing i know for a fact is that the AVP/POA combo has a lower noise level. At 0dB without content the AVP doesn't produce any noise on my speakers ears at say 30cm from speakers. On the 8801 i can pick up noise up about 1 meter away. The sound quality to me seems that the AVP was more focussed and imaging was sharper i prefer that but some might prefer the more diffuse sound of the 8801.

Audyssey: Both sounded better with than without it in my room. setup are very similar and probably same people worked on it. Missed the fact that as far as i could see i can't use audyssey in pure-direct mode.

OSD: unless i am mistaken the 8801 most of the time doesn't overlay its menu's over the video (for example when going into the menu's). For the rest i found the 'tunning' they did with the 'gold' look not really a step forward almost trying to put lipstick on a pig.

Remote: hard to believe but its even worse than the 2 remotes we got with the AVP now i am sure most won't use them anywhere but pffff.

Connections : Well just look at the back of the 2 units. Now i agree you don't need all these svideo's anymore but i would run out of simple digital in's quickly since i prefer them for audio over hdmi.

Settings: flipping through the menu's its very similar maybe the new X000 line will change that but its still the old structure. I did notice that where the AVP has 3 levels of settings the 8801 mostly stops at 2. As a result i missed many small tweaks that are possible on the avp that could not quickly see on the 8801. Small example i could not quickly see how to use a hdmi input for video but take the audio from spdif.

After about 3 hours of use i heard a pop in my right channel, again 15 seconds later and my amp shut down. Looks like something blew in the analog part of the right channel both over rca and xlr. With the AVP you can reroute channels after the digital stage to any (or multiple) of the output boards i could have rerouted the signal to say SW2 or SW3 and continued using it again more flexible.

I am sure there are area's where the 8801 is more modern than a updated AVP, but what the designers of the AVP aimed for as a starting point in what you can do was so much higher and it still shows in 2013 even after 5 years.

Not trying to bash the 8801 in fact i am glad to see a nice pre/pro at this price level was always sad denon dropped their idea to release a smaller AVP-CIX a few years ago and the 8801 seems to be close to that and will make many people happy.

The AVP was a exception even among other units in its price class the focus of putting so much into a single box and more switches and options (combined with D&M known bad manuals) is not for everybody.

Maybe ohyeah32 can add more flavour to this discussion but my short visit with the 8801 vs my AVP-3D made me appreciate even more what their engineers created way back and i hope its back soon to take its place in my rack for a few more years.

Daniel.

Do you really think 3 hours is a valid comparison confused.gif
Its taken me no less than a 3 months of tweaking and repositioning my speakers to form a solid opinion on the 8801 vs the Anthem it replaced as the feature set and sound from the two processors were not the same! The 8801 not having precision is an understatement , not only does it have it, but has the ability to give spaciousness as well in addition to that precision, Now don't get me started on its precision in Multi /ch what this thing does between all channels is nothing short of breathless and this was my opinion before Audyssey. As far as all else is concerned I'm still at the tip of the iceberg on its features but haven't found it lacking compared to the Anthem's legendary flexibility and has a few it doesn't and for me that says a lot ! I'm sure you'll get a few more years out of the Denon and I probably would change as well at this point. But if you had to have the latest and greatest! I wouldn't hesitate to get the 8801 wink.gif
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post #5142 of 11874 Old 04-19-2013, 01:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by comfynumb View Post

You keep referring to the two being pretty much the same. IMO you can compare an AVR to a pre/pro only so far. If they were the same either the Denon should/would sell for more or the Marantz less. Many circuits are different. Just saying smile.gif

+1 , similar parts yes !

same ? No!
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post #5143 of 11874 Old 04-19-2013, 01:21 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlxG View Post

Main Zone On/Off issue has been solved. smile.gif


Folks with Harmony One, I've learned that AV8801 Device commands provided by Harmony uses wrong Main Zone Power ON/OFF command...

The proper Main Zone POWER ON/OFF Pronto Hex Command can be found on row#6 on the AV Commands Excel Sheet of the Marantz_AV_SR_NR_IR_CODE_V03.xls

Go to SR7007 software downloads section to download this Excel file.

I've followed this link to import Pronto HEX command and named it "MainPowerOnOff"

http://www.avforums.com/forums/remote-controls/1510519-guide-getting-pronto-hex-codes-into-your-harmony-remote.html

Thanks. I wonder if we can somehow have Logitech fix this. I know they have updated 'devices' in the past.
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post #5144 of 11874 Old 04-19-2013, 01:45 PM
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Originally Posted by exm View Post

Thanks. I wonder if we can somehow have Logitech fix this. I know they have updated 'devices' in the past.

Not sure, I might have already fixed it myself. Since I've uploaded my newly created "MainPowerOnOff" command through their server... In theory you should be able to see it on your end... Not sure how to test it since I see it in the AV8801 device command list now.

- Alex
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post #5145 of 11874 Old 04-19-2013, 03:07 PM
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Thanks, that seem to do the trick!
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post #5146 of 11874 Old 04-19-2013, 03:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ambesolman View Post

Seems strange to me that this newer unit wouldn't be able to do that too. I'm assuming airplay can be sent to the 2/3/4 zones even if not playing in the main zone?

It was dropped as of the 2012 models although independent Airplay was only added as of the 2012 models as the 2011 models have to play Airplay to the Main Zone in order to get it to the other zones as well.

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post #5147 of 11874 Old 04-19-2013, 03:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Selden Ball View Post

If you haven't already, please read through the Audyssey FAQ. See http://www.avsforum.com/t/795421/official-audyssey-thread-faq-in-post-1/51750#post_21782993

1. One possible cause of a false miswiring warning is reflections. Your room might need some audio treatments (absorbers or diffusers).

2. You do need to manually set speakers to Small to enable bass management. The Large setting is "helpfully" configured for you by code provided by Marantz, not by the code provided by Audyssey.

3. A setting of -15 dB indicates that you need to turn down the subwoofer volume controls. Audyssey turned the level down as far as it could, but the subwoofers were still too loud. As a result, they're uncalibrated.

4. What kind of speakers do you have?
Remember that the values published by manufacturers are for anechoic chambers, not for home listening rooms, so their low frequency limits have to be taken with a grain of salt. Also, unusually high crossover frequencies sometimes are caused by reflections. Remove any objects from the room that don't need to be there permanently. One person recently reported that removing a child's chair substantially reduced the crossover settings for his speakers.

5. Crossover frequencies shouldn't be reduced, only increased, because Audyssey normally does not do any equalization below the speaker's f3 frequency, which Marantz uses to determine the crossover frequency.

Thanks for the reply,.
1. I have both absorbers and diffusers already in the room reflection should not be an issue.

2. Got them in small.

3. My subs do not have volume control.

4. B&W FCM-8 for the front three and rear 2, SCM-8 for the sides.

5. reset the crossovers back.
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post #5148 of 11874 Old 04-19-2013, 05:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OzzieP View Post

Thanks, that seem to do the trick!

For some reason, I wan't able to select various source inputs, so I've also added new inputs such as SelectDVDInput. And now I'm able to scroll through various Activities.

I have just observed a bug... Normally I watch TV via CBL/SAT source select input command. So, if I scroll through all activation and return back to watch TV activity, my Zone 2 would turn ON again. mad.gif

For now, I'll just use Zone2Power On/Off command to deactivate it.

- Alex
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post #5149 of 11874 Old 04-19-2013, 07:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by danielo View Post

...
OSD: unless i am mistaken the 8801 most of the time doesn't overlay its menu's over the video (for example when going into the menu's). For the rest i found the 'tunning' they did with the 'gold' look not really a step forward almost trying to put lipstick on a pig.
...
Connections : Well just look at the back of the 2 units. Now i agree you don't need all these svideo's anymore but i would run out of simple digital in's quickly since i prefer them for audio over hdmi.
...
Daniel.

Yes - concerning the OSD, you are mistaken. As long as you have "Video Conversion" turned on, the 8801 is always using overlay menus. (At least, it is for me. I'm using the primary HDMI output, connected to my TV.)

About connections - I agree with you, up to a point. I agree that the 8801 should have a few more audio digital inputs. And a few more HDMI inputs for that matter. I have a collection of devices that only support fiber-optic for digital sound. For some of those devices, I now have to put their fiber outputs through converter boxes so I can plug them in as co-ax digital audio into the 8801 (since I quickly ran out of fiber-optic inputs on the 8801). However, your comment about preferring digital-in compared to HDMI makes no sense to me. If my older sources supported HDMI, I would gladly use the HDMI instead of the digital inputs for sound.

As for looking at the back of the units - I'm not sure which AVP you have without a model number. The picture I looked at on Denon's site was strange. A 9.3 unit? I'm only running a 7.1 system currently, but the 8801 supports up to 11.2. If I was going to expand, I would find 11.2 more useful than 9.3 - but that's based on my speaker choices. The fact that the 8801 supports 11.2 is a big selling point to some users, and of no interest to others. I'm thinking of adding height speakers (I actually already have suitable speakers and left-over amp-channel capacity), but I'm not sure it would be worth the trouble.
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post #5150 of 11874 Old 04-19-2013, 08:58 PM
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I was hoping someone could explain to me how to use the Dialog Enhancer setting. When I go to the Audio Menu and select one of the options - Low, Medium or High - the processor and OSD states that Dialog Enhancer is on at the selected setting. However, when I go back to the Setup menu, it states that Dialog Enhancer is Off, not the setting I just selected.

How is this setting supposed to work? When I change the setting to Low and see it register on the processor as Low, but go back to settings and see it says Off - is it actually still on Low or is it Off? After you turn the unit to standby does the unit hold the setting - assuming it is even working - or does it revert to Off?

Thanks
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post #5151 of 11874 Old 04-20-2013, 12:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by audiofan1 View Post

Do you really think 3 hours is a valid comparison confused.gif
Its taken me no less than a 3 months of tweaking and repositioning my speakers to form a solid opinion on the 8801 vs the Anthem it replaced as the feature set and sound from the two processors were not the same! The 8801 not having precision is an understatement , not only does it have it, but has the ability to give spaciousness as well in addition to that precision, Now don't get me started on its precision in Multi /ch what this thing does between all channels is nothing short of breathless and this was my opinion before Audyssey. As far as all else is concerned I'm still at the tip of the iceberg on its features but haven't found it lacking compared to the Anthem's legendary flexibility and has a few it doesn't and for me that says a lot ! I'm sure you'll get a few more years out of the Denon and I probably would change as well at this point. But if you had to have the latest and greatest! I wouldn't hesitate to get the 8801 wink.gif

My goal was not to start a discussion about SQ since as you pointed out it was limited on the other hand i have probably been one of the few people who had the 2 units in the same room with the same setup so thats why i gave my feelings on pure and xt32 setup anyway. It seemed better than people who have heard them in different rooms or not at all.

The rest of my comments (most) are about possibilities and basic engineering where with the exception of full 11 channel support the AVP is a step above the 8801 that is clearly (from both the analog and digital side) limited by its AVR start. I have now heard the first rumours of a new A1 level design within D&M that will be the base for either a marantz or denon machine at the 8k price level. Personally i have my doubts about if this will happen but if it happens i hope they again go for the more flexible level of the AVP.

This was my main message you can see how the AVP was designed with a different idea and to a different price point, However fine the 8801 is it won't be in the same position the AVP is in after 5 years.

If most people didn't find my compare useful ill stop again, this all happened a few weeks ago and i only commented because i was asked to provide more info.

Daniel.

for men to evolve we have to upgrade
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post #5152 of 11874 Old 04-20-2013, 01:10 AM
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Originally Posted by Bill222 View Post

Yes - concerning the OSD, you are mistaken. As long as you have "Video Conversion" turned on, the 8801 is always using overlay menus. (At least, it is for me. I'm using the primary HDMI output, connected to my TV.)

About connections - I agree with you, up to a point. I agree that the 8801 should have a few more audio digital inputs. And a few more HDMI inputs for that matter. I have a collection of devices that only support fiber-optic for digital sound. For some of those devices, I now have to put their fiber outputs through converter boxes so I can plug them in as co-ax digital audio into the 8801 (since I quickly ran out of fiber-optic inputs on the 8801). However, your comment about preferring digital-in compared to HDMI makes no sense to me. If my older sources supported HDMI, I would gladly use the HDMI instead of the digital inputs for sound.

As for looking at the back of the units - I'm not sure which AVP you have without a model number. The picture I looked at on Denon's site was strange. A 9.3 unit? I'm only running a 7.1 system currently, but the 8801 supports up to 11.2. If I was going to expand, I would find 11.2 more useful than 9.3 - but that's based on my speaker choices. The fact that the 8801 supports 11.2 is a big selling point to some users, and of no interest to others. I'm thinking of adding height speakers (I actually already have suitable speakers and left-over amp-channel capacity), but I'm not sure it would be worth the trouble.

I had OSD in overlay just seemed not todo it for all settings/types of screens. This might be a setting i missed again my time was limited so there are probably ways todo it i have missed. Why i sometimes prefer spdif over hdmi for audio is not important the fact is i can set it up more flexible if there is one word i would say they differ is the avp is more flexible in almost all areas.

There is only one (well 2 europe has a few changes) AVP-A1HD-3D. Its a 12 channel design that you can assign channels how you want. with the 3d update it allows for the 4 new speakers but not at the same time.

And i agree there would only be 2 reasons for me to pick the 8801 over the AVP, if you want the 4 new speaker layouts and/or if you missed the 3D/XT32 upgrade and feel (like i do) the XT32 is something you want.

Also this compare has its limits, you can't (easy) get the AVP's anymore and if you find one you are taking a gamble compared to a newer and in the coming years probably better supported unit like the 8801.

Daniel.

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post #5153 of 11874 Old 04-20-2013, 01:37 AM
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Originally Posted by danielo View Post

My goal was not to start a discussion about SQ since as you pointed out it was limited on the other hand i have probably been one of the few people who had the 2 units in the same room with the same setup so thats why i gave my feelings on pure and xt32 setup anyway. It seemed better than people who have heard them in different rooms or not at all.

The rest of my comments (most) are about possibilities and basic engineering where with the exception of full 11 channel support the AVP is a step above the 8801 that is clearly (from both the analog and digital side) limited by its AVR start. I have now heard the first rumours of a new A1 level design within D&M that will be the base for either a marantz or denon machine at the 8k price level. Personally i have my doubts about if this will happen but if it happens i hope they again go for the more flexible level of the AVP.

I think the Marantz design team set out with a predecessor to the 8003 in mind and not an AVR. they have been around for awhile you know and never have the two been accused of sounding alike!
Higher level prepro's already exists in the 8K and up market, but good luck to Denon or Marantz as it will be nice to see statement pieces from them!

This was my main message you can see how the AVP was design with a different idea and to a different price point, However fine the 8801 is it won't be in the same position the AVP is in after 5 years.

Same is true for any prepro these days, and speak for yourself, I just switched from an Anthem avm 20 thanks to an Oppo 95 so I'm looking at 6-10yrs biggrin.gif

If most people didn't fine my compare useful ill stop again, this all happened a few weeks ago and i only commented because i was asked to provide more info.

Daniel.

And at 30lbs its not fluff in there! and its pretty too!
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post #5154 of 11874 Old 04-20-2013, 01:57 AM
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Originally Posted by audiofan1 View Post

And at 30lbs its not fluff in there! and its pretty too!

Be careful how you quote the above bold comments are from you i assume. I am kind of done with this discussion unless people have questions. Introducing new things like weight doesn't add anything unless you want to say that there is a 30lbs weight difference between them and why that might be.

Daniel.

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post #5155 of 11874 Old 04-20-2013, 02:01 AM
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Originally Posted by danielo View Post

Be careful how you quote the above bold comments are from you i assume. I am kind of done with this discussion unless people have questions. Introducing new things like weight doesn't add anything unless you want to say that there is a 30lbs weight difference between them and why that might be.

Daniel.

I'm done as well , hope all goes well with the AVP smile.gif
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post #5156 of 11874 Old 04-20-2013, 04:54 AM
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Who uses Audyssey pro and do you feel the sound is better compared to XT32?
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Do the analog inputs go through an A to D, D to A conversion while in Direct and/or Pure Direct Mode?
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post #5158 of 11874 Old 04-20-2013, 05:41 AM
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Do the analog inputs go through an A to D, D to A conversion while in Direct and/or Pure Direct Mode?

that is a simple question with a very complicated answer. I don't own Denon/Marantz gear but I have read that getting a true direct analog signal is not as simple as Pure Direct mode, that there is still some digital processing going on so there would be an A>D>A conversion. there are several very experienced people here & in the Denon AVP/5308 threads who have figured out how to get to pure analog direct & hopefully one of them can give those steps to you. apparently, there's a way to turn-off ALL digital processing for analog inputs but one of them will have to explain how smile.gif

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post #5159 of 11874 Old 04-20-2013, 06:43 AM
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Originally Posted by ss9001 View Post

that is a simple question with a very complicated answer. I don't own Denon/Marantz gear but I have read that getting a true direct analog signal is not as simple as Pure Direct mode, that there is still some digital processing going on so there would be an A>D>A conversion. there are several very experienced people here & in the Denon AVP/5308 threads who have figured out how to get to pure analog direct & hopefully one of them can give those steps to you. apparently, there's a way to turn-off ALL digital processing for analog inputs but one of them will have to explain how smile.gif

Not sure if we can help, For the avp/5308 it had todo with turning both DSP modes off (a option in a menu) and mostly making sure AL32 was not turned on. Default this upsampling/smoothing is always done after a signal comes in. I think its still unclear if the 8801 took AL32 (under a different name) from the 4520 and if so if its used in the same same (default on) way. On the avp/5308 its easy to check since it has a AL32 led on this display they removed it for the 8801.

Sorry if we can't help more,

Daniel.

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post #5160 of 11874 Old 04-20-2013, 07:17 AM
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Originally Posted by danielo View Post

Not sure if we can help, For the avp/5308 it had todo with turning both DSP modes off (a option in a menu) and mostly making sure AL32 was not turned on. Default this upsampling/smoothing is always done after a signal comes in. I think its still unclear if the 8801 took AL32 (under a different name) from the 4520 and if so if its used in the same same (default on) way. On the avp/5308 its easy to check since it has a AL32 led on this display they removed it for the 8801.

Sorry if we can't help more,

Daniel.

I have the 5308, and while the Advanced or AL24 led do not appear in the Direct or Pure Direct modes, the manual states that "Advanced AL24 Processing is conducted for all channels and modes other than DSD Direct". So if the manual is correct it would seem that some processing is still occurring even though the led is off.
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