Marantz AV8801 Preamp/Processor Official Owner's thread - Page 298 - AVS Forum
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post #8911 of 12214 Old 11-02-2013, 05:14 AM
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Originally Posted by spentmuch View Post

So let's say that hypothetically I am now expecting to receive an 8801 next Tuesday...Perhaps some of the already wise and familiar owners can direct me to where I can pre-read about some set-up tips to get the best sound it's capable of ?  (I already feel a  little apologetic asking this question because I'm sure that somewhere on this forum there must be a thread on the topic...I just couldn't find it so far). Give a 'newbee' a hand, please.

Thanks



I use Audyssey for both music and movies and once you get the right settings I think you'll be happy. Are you familiar with or have to ever used Audyssey before? I adjusted my 8801 manually for close to 2 months but when I ran Audyssey it took it to another level. If you want to use it and are not familiar with I suggest reading the F&Q on the first page of the Audyssey thread, it is very informative.

Unfortunately, the initial post hasn't been kept up to date. The more detailed FAQ/101 which people currently use is quite a bit later in the thread, at http://www.avsforum.com/t/795421/official-audyssey-thread-faq-in-post-1/51750#post_21782993

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post #8912 of 12214 Old 11-02-2013, 05:28 AM
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Originally Posted by comfynumb View Post
 
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Originally Posted by spentmuch View Post

So let's say that hypothetically I am now expecting to receive an 8801 next Tuesday...Perhaps some of the already wise and familiar owners can direct me to where I can pre-read about some set-up tips to get the best sound it's capable of ?  (I already feel a  little apologetic asking this question because I'm sure that somewhere on this forum there must be a thread on the topic...I just couldn't find it so far). Give a 'newbee' a hand, please.

Thanks



I use Audyssey for both music and movies and once you get the right settings I think you'll be happy. Are you familiar with or have to ever used Audyssey before? I adjusted my 8801 manually for close to 2 months but when I ran Audyssey it took it to another level. If you want to use it and are not familiar with I suggest reading the F&Q on the first page of the Audyssey thread, it is very informative.

Unfortunately, the initial post hasn't been kept up to date. The more detailed FAQ/101 which people currently use is quite a bit later in the thread, at http://www.avsforum.com/t/795421/official-audyssey-thread-faq-in-post-1/51750#post_21782993

 

Selden, if the poster is referring to the FAQ link in post #1 of the Official Audyssey Thread, that does link to the FAQ/101.

 

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post #8913 of 12214 Old 11-02-2013, 05:33 AM
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Anybody knows how to shut off fan connected to the rear USB port once 8801 is turned off?

My USB fan keeps running even after I've turned off the 8801 with remote.

The Network setting (p. 142 OM) defaults to "Always ON". If you set it to "Off in standby" the USB jacks will power off.

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post #8914 of 12214 Old 11-02-2013, 05:34 AM
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Yes, I forgot to add that the you go to page 1 and there's a link to the F&Q.
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post #8915 of 12214 Old 11-02-2013, 10:30 AM
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I had the anthem d2 than went to the d2v. Sound on them are hard to beat however having had the marantz for over 4 months I do not miss the anthem at all. This pre has so much flexibility and future proofing in place you cant beat it for the price. Also the sound in my opinion is very natural and is comparable to the anthem I previously owned.

Don,

Thanks very much for the comments - the comparison is much appreciated. I'm glad that in comparison to the Anthem your view of the sound is very natural.

Before you got the Marantz were there other brands that you strongly considered?

Thanks,
Dan
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post #8916 of 12214 Old 11-02-2013, 10:35 AM
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Originally Posted by whoaru99 View Post

I'm a little bit older Anthem customer coming from an AVM 20 to the Marantz AV7005. I think the Anthem was/is a higher quality piece than the 7005 is and still has features I miss, but I am generally satisfied with my 7005. Went with the Marantz primarily for the HDMI connectivity stuff, room correction, and favorable reviews. Would have loved to stay with Anthem but I just didn't want to part with that kind of money this time around to get the newer bells and whistles.

Thanks for your comments as well as a prior Anthem owner. What are the features that you miss from the Anthem that the Marantz does not have? What was it about the quality of the piece on the Anthem that seemed higher quality than the Marantz? I just went to see the Marantz and the build quality seems very solid/heavy/substantial - in fact it seems to be a more substantial piece than my Anthem AVM 30. Is it the audio or certain features that you found higher quality in the Anthem?

Thanks!

Any other Anthem to Marantz owners out there - would love to hear more points of comparison. I'll give it an audition but my concern is still that the Marantz "signature" is warmer than Anthem and I could loose some soundstage and transparency as a result.... I really hope not as the more I look around I'm not sure there is much else to consider under $4,000 or $5000 with the features and quality.
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post #8917 of 12214 Old 11-02-2013, 11:03 AM
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Of course, I have only the 7005, not the 8801 so I can't speak in that regard. However, I think the internal layout and overall build of the Anthem is better, and I think they used better parts, generally speaking...although how much some of that directly contributes to the sound, well. I don't know. The features I miss most are being able to send digital sources to other zones and the two speaker configuration (movie / music) setup. I also miss the ability to have the multichannel analog inputs remain analog or be able to digitize them for bass management/DSP, etc.

In addition, the support through Anthem was top notch. Not that I needed it but my brother had some issues with some configuration he was using and Anthem worked with him on some firmware stuff to try to get it resolved. Don't think Marantz is going to be working one on one with some firmware...but could be wrong.

Like I said, I'm satisfied with the 7005 but probably would have gone with another Anthem processor had I wanted to part with that much $$.

Just because there is a knob doesn't mean you should turn it.
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post #8918 of 12214 Old 11-02-2013, 11:05 AM
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I've never owned an Anthem, but ... The front panel's curved sides look like metal but actually are plastic. Some people dislike that. If you tap on one with a fingernail it goes "thunk" instead of "ting".

If you have a local brick-and-mortar A/V store, you might investigate getting a loaner or rental unit so you can listen to one in your home. Listening to one in your own room is the only way to be sure it meets your requirements. Alternatively, most resellers (in the U.S.) accept returns within the first 30 days with no questions asked. Be sure to buy from an authorized dealer, though. They'll usually quote a very good price if you call them directly, but are only allowed to advertise MSRP.

Also, don't forget that if you use Audyssey's automated room EQ for most of your listening, much of whatever individual sonic signature it might have will have been effectively wiped out by its attempt to produce an accurate (flat) frequency response in your listening environment. Please be sure to peruse the Audyssey FAQ/101 at http://www.avsforum.com/t/795421/official-audyssey-thread-faq-in-post-1/51750#post_21782993 The overly simplistic instructions in the 8801's manual do not produce optimal results.

edited to add:
The 8801 has the same limitations that whoaru99 noted about the 7005. Current expectations are that the 8801's successor will have eliminated some of the Zone 2 limitations since that has already happened in D&M's 2013 receivers.

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post #8919 of 12214 Old 11-02-2013, 02:17 PM
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Originally Posted by whoaru99 View Post

Of course, I have only the 7005, not the 8801 so I can't speak in that regard. However, I think the internal layout and overall build of the Anthem is better, and I think they used better parts, generally speaking...although how much some of that directly contributes to the sound, well. I don't know. The features I miss most are being able to send digital sources to other zones and the two speaker configuration (movie / music) setup. I also miss the ability to have the multichannel analog inputs remain analog or be able to digitize them for bass management/DSP, etc.

In addition, the support through Anthem was top notch. Not that I needed it but my brother had some issues with some configuration he was using and Anthem worked with him on some firmware stuff to try to get it resolved. Don't think Marantz is going to be working one on one with some firmware...but could be wrong.

Like I said, I'm satisfied with the 7005 but probably would have gone with another Anthem processor had I wanted to part with that much $$.

Thanks for the follow-up post!

I have liked the two speaker config - have one for two-channel music and one for movies. However, I thought that the Marantz was functional enough to have specific setups for specific sources - could be very wrong about it. Does the absence mean that if you want to have a setting that is different for music, you have to manually switch things around for music vs video/HT? I was also under the impression that you could have multiple Audyssey settings retained so maybe that is one way to do it in order to have one set up for music or movies/tv.....

Also, I was under the impression, again perhaps wrongly, that any source could be sent to the other zones. I only have one other zone that isn't stereo and I have the Anthem running into a separate A/V Receiver which takes the raw input and then does surround and provides the power - is it because on the Anthem zone 2/3 can "copy" from main zone and on the Marantz the other zones cannot just distribute what the main is playing? I would hope that I could still do that with an additional zone. I also thought that HDMI could be sent out to one of the other zones. I think I may be mistaken then.....

So, on the Marantz, how does everyone use the other zones?

As for internal parts, I suspect that maybe head to head the Anthem was better in 2004 when I bought it and the current Anthem at 2x the price is better, but I suspect that the audio and video processing components in the Marantz have to be as good or very close to what I have in the old Anthem at least....right?
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post #8920 of 12214 Old 11-02-2013, 02:19 PM
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The marantz remembers my cd settings versus my blu ray.
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post #8921 of 12214 Old 11-02-2013, 02:35 PM
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A design oversight in all of D&M's 2012 equipment (including the 4520 receiver and 8801 pre/pro) is that they cannot forward external digital audio sources (HDMI or S/PDIF) to Zone 2's analog outputs. They can only forward analog audio input connections. Of course, this is a serious problem in 2013, since many current BD players no longer include analog audio outputs. This oversight was fixed in their 2013 models: stereo PCM audio can be forwarded as analog to Zone 2, including HDMI signals which have been down-mixed to stereo PCM. This limitation does not apply to the internal tuner or networked audio. Apparently it is a limitation in the hardware which cannot be fixed by a firmware update.

D&M audio processing settings are remembered for each different type of audio input.

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post #8922 of 12214 Old 11-02-2013, 03:16 PM
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Originally Posted by Selden Ball View Post

A design oversight in all of D&M's 2012 equipment (including the 4520 receiver and 8801 pre/pro) is that they cannot forward external digital audio sources (HDMI or S/PDIF) to Zone 2's analog outputs. They can only forward analog audio input connections. Of course, this is a serious problem in 2013, since many current BD players no longer include analog audio outputs. This oversight was fixed in their 2013 models: stereo PCM audio can be forwarded as analog to Zone 2, including HDMI signals which have been down-mixed to stereo PCM. This limitation does not apply to the internal tuner or networked audio. Apparently it is a limitation in the hardware which cannot be fixed by a firmware update.

D&M audio processing settings are remembered for each different type of audio input.

Seldon,

Thanks for the additional details - very helpful. For music audio, networked audio (I assume that means streaming something off of iTunes, etc.) is fine for my other zone audio purposes but I do want to be able to send cable tv as well to other zones (I need to for a couple of zones as they aren't fed otherwise). Is there anything that can be done to send video to other zones? What is the HDMI out Zone 4 used for? Does that mean that the music/video from the main zone cannot be sent out to the other zones for whole house listening/viewing from the same source? I assume users have overcome this limitation as many people must use the other zones - just not sure what it means for my setup.

If not, seems to be a strange and very big oversight in a product like this.....not like it is new technology to do it. Does Marantz have a hardware upgrade program like Anthem does so it can be fixed?

Thanks!
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post #8923 of 12214 Old 11-02-2013, 03:23 PM
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Originally Posted by Selden Ball View Post

D&M audio processing settings are remembered for each different type of audio input.

One follow-up on this - is both CD and DVD are coming in from the same player can there be a different setting for the "CD" and a different setting for the "DVD" or because it is one input and one HDMI cable, then the 8801 sees it as the same?
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post #8924 of 12214 Old 11-02-2013, 04:32 PM
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One follow-up on this - is both CD and DVD are coming in from the same player can there be a different setting for the "CD" and a different setting for the "DVD" or because it is one input and one HDMI cable, then the 8801 sees it as the same?

Hi! the 8801 is very flexible in this regard I have my Oppo 105 going to the cd,dvd and bluray iputs of the 8801 via xlr,hdmi and rca and they each retain different playback settings .

Now to your inquiry on the 8801 vs. Anthem which in my case was an AVM 20v2 which was essentially an AVM 30 after the upgrade . One thing right of the bat is a concern I had as well and was unfounded ,and that's the Marantz house sound being described as warm! The 8801's sound is flat out neutral dynamic and capable of producing very high resolution refined sound. When compared to the Anthem the Anthem comes out sounding warm while the 8801 reveals hidden details with pristine clarity. As a surround processor ites multich performance delivers pans in a 360 fashion from my 5.1 setup that amazed me when I first installed it a year ago and this was without Audyssey. After running a calibration the next level of performance was more than a few notches above what I ever expected. Combine this sound and things the Anthem, as flexible as I thought is was, the 8801 does so much more and has me still smiling after a year of ownership.

Get one wink.gif
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post #8925 of 12214 Old 11-02-2013, 11:15 PM
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I have had this AV for almost a year, but don't get to enjoy it anywhere near as much as I would like to.

I have an Oppo BDP-93 Blu Ray player and want to use HDMI for video to get to the 8801, but I want to use the analogue outputs to use the 7.1 input on the 8801.

I have tried a few times to accomplish this, but I cant get the menu settings correct.

Can someone please tell me what parts of the menu to access to get the audio on 8801 inputs to be via the 7.1 inputs? I have the HDMI cable connected to the Bu Ray player input.
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post #8926 of 12214 Old 11-03-2013, 12:21 AM
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Run the HDMI directly to your TV/Projector.
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post #8927 of 12214 Old 11-03-2013, 01:33 AM
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Originally Posted by cp1966 View Post

I have had this AV for almost a year, but don't get to enjoy it anywhere near as much as I would like to.

I have an Oppo BDP-93 Blu Ray player and want to use HDMI for video to get to the 8801, but I want to use the analogue outputs to use the 7.1 input on the 8801.

I have tried a few times to accomplish this, but I cant get the menu settings correct.

Can someone please tell me what parts of the menu to access to get the audio on 8801 inputs to be via the 7.1 inputs? I have the HDMI cable connected to the Bu Ray player input.

Inputs - Input Select - Input Mode - 7.1 CH IN, p. 136 OM


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post #8928 of 12214 Old 11-03-2013, 06:12 AM
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Originally Posted by Selden Ball View Post


D&M audio processing settings are remembered for each different type of audio input.

Guess I'm not clear what you mean here; processing settings as in the surround mode, or do you mean speaker/bass management configuration?

Not trying to belabor the point, but trying to understand if I'm possibly missing something in the setup/features of my Marantz.

The Anthem would remember the DSP/surround mode preference per input, bass, treble, any of that type of stuff, but you could also assign each input one of two speaker configurations dubbed "movie" or "music". The two configurations could have completely different bass management/speaker setup/config settings.

Just because there is a knob doesn't mean you should turn it.
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post #8929 of 12214 Old 11-03-2013, 06:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DanielG View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Selden Ball View Post

A design oversight in all of D&M's 2012 equipment (including the 4520 receiver and 8801 pre/pro) is that they cannot forward external digital audio sources (HDMI or S/PDIF) to Zone 2's analog outputs. They can only forward analog audio input connections. Of course, this is a serious problem in 2013, since many current BD players no longer include analog audio outputs. This oversight was fixed in their 2013 models: stereo PCM audio can be forwarded as analog to Zone 2, including HDMI signals which have been down-mixed to stereo PCM. This limitation does not apply to the internal tuner or networked audio. Apparently it is a limitation in the hardware which cannot be fixed by a firmware update.

D&M audio processing settings are remembered for each different type of audio input.

Seldon,

Thanks for the additional details - very helpful. For music audio, networked audio (I assume that means streaming something off of iTunes, etc.) is fine for my other zone audio purposes but I do want to be able to send cable tv as well to other zones (I need to for a couple of zones as they aren't fed otherwise). Is there anything that can be done to send video to other zones?

Caveat: I have no personal experience with multi-zone systems, since my (relatively simple) needs are handled primarily by having a completely separate A/V system in my bedroom.

Questions about whole-house A/V distribution would get better answers in the Forum http://www.avsforum.com/f/36/home-a-v-distribution

If you want to send the same HDMI signals to all of the zones, you might want to consider an HDMI "splitter". An example is http://www.amazon.com/Bytecc-HMSP104-1x4-HDMI-Splitter/dp/B004N1SIB0

Alternatively, you might consider an external HDMI matrix switch. Unfortunately, they tend to be rather expensive.

Don't forget that the HDMI standard requires the source device to downgrade its signal to match the least-capable display device. In some cases this can be worked around by providing a fake EDID signal from something like the HDMI Detective http://www.amazon.com/Gefen-EXT-HDMI-EDIDP-HDmi-Detective-Plus/dp/B001RIMZUW
Quote:
What is the HDMI out Zone 4 used for? Does that mean that the music/video from the main zone cannot be sent out to the other zones for whole house listening/viewing from the same source? I assume users have overcome this limitation as many people must use the other zones - just not sure what it means for my setup.

As I understand it, the Zone 4 HDMI output only provides access to the HDMI inputs. It's part of the same HDMI switch. i.e. it doesn't provide access to the tuner or to networked audio sources.

To send the same video to the other zones, you'd need to put a splitter on one of the HDMI monitor outputs.

A limitation of all receivers and pre/pros is that they do not provide access to networked video or to video files stored on USB drives. For that you need a modern Blu-ray player, a dedicated "media player" or an HTPC.
Quote:
If not, seems to be a strange and very big oversight in a product like this.....not like it is new technology to do it. Does Marantz have a hardware upgrade program like Anthem does so it can be fixed?
No, they don't. Denon used to sell a relatively high-end pre/pro which was upgradable, but apparently it was just too small a market and thus too expensive for them to continue supporting it. There are rumors of higher-end equipment with the Denon label being released next year, so presumably there will be equivalent Marantz units, too. Nobody knows what their features will be, though, other than support for HDMI V2.0.

I hope these comments help a little.

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post #8930 of 12214 Old 11-03-2013, 07:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by whoaru99 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Selden Ball View Post


D&M audio processing settings are remembered for each different type of audio input.

Guess I'm not clear what you mean here; processing settings as in the surround mode, or do you mean speaker/bass management configuration?
My understanding is that both are remembered. Caveat: I do not (yet) own an 8801.

Note that it cannot distinguish between a stereo CD and a stereo BD being played on the same BD player connected to the BD input. People usually run separate S/PDIF and/or analog connections from the BD player to the CD input so that it's easier to apply set-and-forgotten settings for the two different listening environments. E.g. set the CD input to stereo for 2.1 or Pure Direct so only the fronts are used, but set the BD input to Neo-X so all speakers are always used.
Quote:
Not trying to belabor the point, but trying to understand if I'm possibly missing something in the setup/features of my Marantz.

The Anthem would remember the DSP/surround mode preference per input, bass, treble, any of that type of stuff, but you could also assign each input one of two speaker configurations dubbed "movie" or "music". The two configurations could have completely different bass management/speaker setup/config settings.
D&M doesn't provide aggregated settings like that. I.e you can't trivially switch between two different groups of settings for the same input, and if you have separate BD and DVD players, you can't apply the same group of settings to both. You have to modify each setting for each input individually.

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post #8931 of 12214 Old 11-03-2013, 07:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DanielG View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Selden Ball View Post

D&M audio processing settings are remembered for each different type of audio input.

One follow-up on this - is both CD and DVD are coming in from the same player can there be a different setting for the "CD" and a different setting for the "DVD" or because it is one input and one HDMI cable, then the 8801 sees it as the same?

As I mentioned in my response to whoaru99, the pre/pro doesn't distinguish among the different types of discs being played. If you want a different configuration of settings to be applied without laboriously changing each of them, you need to connect the player to several different inputs.
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post #8932 of 12214 Old 11-03-2013, 07:19 AM
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Quote:
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As I mentioned in my response to whoaru99, the pre/pro doesn't distinguish among the different types of discs being played. If you want a different configuration of settings to be applied without laboriously changing each of them, you need to connect the player to several different inputs.

Exactly, it's not like there are not enough inputs on this thing.

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post #8933 of 12214 Old 11-03-2013, 08:53 AM
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Yeah, no doubt there are a ton of inputs....but is it confirmed ALL configurations including speaker bass managment settings are actually remembered per input, or is the speaker config/bass management a global setting?

I understand the 7005 isn't the 8801, but at least on the 7005 it looks to me like bass management and speaker config is a global setting.

Just because there is a knob doesn't mean you should turn it.
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post #8934 of 12214 Old 11-03-2013, 09:19 AM
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For me cd stereo input leads to two speakers out if i want using direct . This is remembered. If I want audyseey and 2.1 for stereo listening this is remembered instead. If I want to change I can. It will remember my last choice.

For my fios input two channel inputs leads to pliix as I have chosen this is remembered for the source if the two channel input. When fios has 5.1 pliix is also chosen.

Hope this helps.
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post #8935 of 12214 Old 11-03-2013, 09:33 AM
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Selden,

Thanks! Your comments once again are extremely helpful - as you can tell, I am quite far down on the learning curve at this point. My guess is that I will need either a switcher or matrix. Maybe the benefit of the matrix is that I think the good ones also distribute the audio over the HDMI as well as the video and a switcher wouldn't???

Is it possible to use the first HDMI out directly to my primary tv and the second HDMI out for the main zone for the switcher to get the main video feed to whichever other area of the house that I may want it? Seems like that could work and then it is just a question of getting the audio there. I also will have a separate AV receiver for my bedroom zone and so would just need to run a feed from the processor to that receiver somehow in full (perhaps from the second HDMI output and let that receiver do all the work for that zone. For the other zones with small tvs and stereo in-wall speakers perhaps the switcher and analog two channel for zones 2/3 would be fine... Luckily I don't care much about the quality of the video/audio to two of my four zones and so maybe a switcher attached to the second output would work Not sure if any of this makes sense.

Can the matrix input be attached to one of the main 8801 HDMI outputs and so I only need a matrix with 1 or probably 2 inputs and then 4 outputs though not sure they make less than a 4x4. How much would a solid high quality HDMI matrix run? $300? $600? Seems like some online are $150-250 and others are well over $1k.
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post #8936 of 12214 Old 11-03-2013, 09:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by audiofan1 View Post

Hi! the 8801 is very flexible in this regard I have my Oppo 105 going to the cd,dvd and bluray iputs of the 8801 via xlr,hdmi and rca and they each retain different playback settings .

Now to your inquiry on the 8801 vs. Anthem which in my case was an AVM 20v2 which was essentially an AVM 30 after the upgrade . One thing right of the bat is a concern I had as well and was unfounded ,and that's the Marantz house sound being described as warm! The 8801's sound is flat out neutral dynamic and capable of producing very high resolution refined sound. When compared to the Anthem the Anthem comes out sounding warm while the 8801 reveals hidden details with pristine clarity. As a surround processor ites multich performance delivers pans in a 360 fashion from my 5.1 setup that amazed me when I first installed it a year ago and this was without Audyssey. After running a calibration the next level of performance was more than a few notches above what I ever expected. Combine this sound and things the Anthem, as flexible as I thought is was, the 8801 does so much more and has me still smiling after a year of ownership.

Get one wink.gif

Very glad to hear you take on the sound and how happy you are with the sound of the 8801 compared to the Anthem.

I was able to borrow an 8801 and this afternoon hope to give it an initial try for audio. While there is no way I am swapping everything out and replacing the Anthem with the 8801 in my full HT system (would take me all day), I hope that I can get a solid sense for the sound by just attaching my Lexicon player using HDMI to the 8801 and then the balanced outputs right to my Bryston amp. While I will not have the Audyssey setup and other special setup or configuration at this point, I really hope that I will be able to get a "feel" for the character of the sound. If I come to the same conclusion on the sound, I think I am getting close to wanting to pull the trigger on this one.
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post #8937 of 12214 Old 11-03-2013, 09:41 AM
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By the way, when deciding on the 8801 did anyone look at and compare the Yamaha cx-a5000? Seems like it may be a slight step down but hard to tell as I could not find many full audio publication reviews on it.
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post #8938 of 12214 Old 11-03-2013, 09:55 AM
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Thanks, I will give this a shot!
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post #8939 of 12214 Old 11-03-2013, 10:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DanielG View Post

By the way, when deciding on the 8801 did anyone look at and compare the Yamaha cx-a5000? Seems like it may be a slight step down but hard to tell as I could not find many full audio publication reviews on it.



Many of us bought the 8801 before the Yamaha was ever announced. By all accounts the CX-A5000 is a very good pre, the real reviews by Dave V. and Kal R. will be coming soon. I doubt you could go wrong but I found the one I want in the 8801 as it has surpassed every expectation I had. Yeah there's always a nit pick or a wish it did/had this or that but this thing is pretty special wink.gif
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post #8940 of 12214 Old 11-03-2013, 10:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by comfynumb View Post

Many of us bought the 8801 before the Yamaha was ever announced. By all accounts the CX-A5000 is a very good pre, the real reviews by Dave V. and Kal R. will be coming soon. I doubt you could go wrong but I found the one I want in the 8801 as it has surpassed every expectation I had. Yeah there's always a nit pick or a wish it did/had this or that but this thing is pretty special wink.gif

What is the ETA on these reviews?
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