Marantz AV8801 Preamp/Processor Official Owner's thread - Page 415 - AVS | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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Old 01-12-2015, 01:43 PM
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New guy here. Yes we all were the new guy once. Really enjoying my AV8801. Quick question. I'm using a 5.1 speaker setup and did the EQ to setup the speakers. I was playing a DTS-HD MASTER movie but the only other sound mode I could select when pushing the movie button on the remote was stereo, virtual and something else I can't remember. Why no DTS -HD +NEOX Cinema or Audyssey DSX?
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Old 01-12-2015, 02:07 PM
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Originally Posted by Jack Ruff View Post
New guy here. Yes we all were the new guy once. Really enjoying my AV8801. Quick question. I'm using a 5.1 speaker setup and did the EQ to setup the speakers. I was playing a DTS-HD MASTER movie but the only other sound mode I could select when pushing the movie button on the remote was stereo, virtual and something else I can't remember. Why no DTS -HD +NEOX Cinema or Audyssey DSX?
DTS-HD is a decoder. It isn't selectable because it's not optional. Either it needs to be used to decode the audio bitstream being received by the processor, or some other decoder is required (e.g. Dolby TrueHD).

DTS Neo:X, Dolby ProLogic and Audyssey DSX are all upmixers. They expand the incoming audio stream to occupy all of your speakers if you have more speakers than there are channels in the on-disc soundtrack. Since you have a 5.1 speaker system, they're only available when you play a stereo soundtrack. They aren't available if you are playing a 5.1 or 7.1 soundtrack because all of your speakers are already occupied. If you were to add Front Height speakers, for example, then they'd be available, since no on-disc soundtrack includes support for discrete Front Height speakers.

In contrast, Stereo is a downmixer. It'll downmix any incoming multichannel audio so it uses only your two front speakers, plus maybe the subwoofer if you have bass management enabled for them.

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Old 01-12-2015, 04:31 PM
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Posted this a while ago, but never really got much of a response;

My system is in my signature (maybe). I have run Audessey. Watching movies , especially Blu Rays, my system ROCKS! Watching a concert on Blu Ray (even on plain ol DVD) the system ROCKS!

Listening to CDs, however, the system lacks any oomph. I am using RCA cables to connect my CD jukebox to the 8801. If I use my Oppo to listen to a CD (connected via HDMI), the sound is still lacking.

I was able to connect airplay to play music from my iPhone and it was really bad.

What could I possibly be doing wrong? Everyone raves about the audio quality of this for 2 channel sound, but I much prefer listening to my Denon 8303 driving my 28 year old Klipsch Kg4s for CD listening.

Any and all advice appreciated!


Here is my basic info; 8801 pre-pro, Outlaw 7700 balanced amp (200 wpc), Klipsch RF7, RC7, RS7 surrounds and CDT5800C rear surrounds, Panasonic 65" plasma HDTV, Oppo BDP93 Blu Ray player, SOny 400 DVD and CD jukeboxes, Toshiba A2 HD DVD player, PS3 and Wii game consoles.

Last edited by cp1966; 01-12-2015 at 04:40 PM. Reason: Added info
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Old 01-12-2015, 08:37 PM
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Originally Posted by cp1966 View Post
Posted this a while ago, but never really got much of a response;

My system is in my signature (maybe). I have run Audessey. Watching movies , especially Blu Rays, my system ROCKS! Watching a concert on Blu Ray (even on plain ol DVD) the system ROCKS!

Listening to CDs, however, the system lacks any oomph. I am using RCA cables to connect my CD jukebox to the 8801. If I use my Oppo to listen to a CD (connected via HDMI), the sound is still lacking.

I was able to connect airplay to play music from my iPhone and it was really bad.

What could I possibly be doing wrong? Everyone raves about the audio quality of this for 2 channel sound, but I much prefer listening to my Denon 8303 driving my 28 year old Klipsch Kg4s for CD listening.

Any and all advice appreciated!
"Lacks any oomph" is rather vague, but suggests to me that you feel the lack of low frequencies.

You don't mention if you have Dynamic EQ enabled. That boosts low frequencies relative to higher frequencies as you turn down the volume, maintaining tonal balance. Also, make sure you've set the front speakers to be Small so that bass management is enabled and the low frequencies are being sent to your subwoofer. (Although you don't mention having one ) The bass provided by even the best floorstanding speakers is quite uneven because of their placement in the room. In addition, don't select Direct or Pure Direct when listening to stereo soundtracks. They disable all processing, including Audyssey, DynEQ and bass management.

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Here is my basic info; 8801 pre-pro, Outlaw 7700 balanced amp (200 wpc), Klipsch RF7, RC7, RS7 surrounds and CDT5800C rear surrounds, Panasonic 65" plasma HDTV, Oppo BDP93 Blu Ray player, SOny 400 DVD and CD jukeboxes, Toshiba A2 HD DVD player, PS3 and Wii game consoles.

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Old 01-12-2015, 10:34 PM
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Sorry, I forgot to list my sub, I have an Outlaw LFM 1-EX subwoofer.

I do not recall if i have the Dynamic EQ enabled or not, but I think I have my main speakers set to large, so I can change that and see if it helps. I believe I have one setting for low effects set to "main and sub" or similiar.

I tried using "direct" mode and didnt really care for it as the sub was not engaged.

When I say no "oomph", I meant overall listening quality, not just impact from a subwoofer. Like I said, listening to movies is great. But music is not fantastic. The sound/imaging/clarity sounds better from my Kg4s.

It could also be my room, but why would concert Blu Rays (like John Mayer) sound so incredible if the room itself was so bad?
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Old 01-12-2015, 11:08 PM
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Originally Posted by kiwi2000 View Post
quote:
originally posted by Budley007



Yes I am sure that is what the Marantz tech was referring to.
Again though if it played on the 8003 why not the 8801?
Arent these images standardised?

I can see the image in windows media player I have idea how to measure the image however.
It has been my experience that album art sizes are not standardized. The image you embed in the metadata determines the size.

Your ripping software may allow you to specify the size when encoding, but chances are, if you have music files with embedded album art from various sources, you'll most probably have album art of various sizes.
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Old 01-13-2015, 07:54 AM
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When I watch dolby digital programming from direct tv, I find the sound "tinny" and fatiguing over time. Movies sound awesome. I know dtv audio will never match audio from a blu ray disk but are there any tweaks I can make that will make the dtv experience a little better?
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Old 01-13-2015, 07:58 AM
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Originally Posted by cp1966 View Post
Sorry, I forgot to list my sub, I have an Outlaw LFM 1-EX subwoofer.

I do not recall if i have the Dynamic EQ enabled or not, but I think I have my main speakers set to large, so I can change that and see if it helps. I believe I have one setting for low effects set to "main and sub" or similiar.

I tried using "direct" mode and didnt really care for it as the sub was not engaged.

When I say no "oomph", I meant overall listening quality, not just impact from a subwoofer. Like I said, listening to movies is great. But music is not fantastic. The sound/imaging/clarity sounds better from my Kg4s.

It could also be my room, but why would concert Blu Rays (like John Mayer) sound so incredible if the room itself was so bad?
With the FL/FR speakers set to LARGE, you can set Sub to LFE+MAIN to ensure lower frequencies are "also" passed to the sub as well. Although Audyssey is disabled when using DIRECT, some prefer DIRECT for music listening.

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Old 01-13-2015, 08:21 AM
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Originally Posted by cp1966 View Post
Sorry, I forgot to list my sub, I have an Outlaw LFM 1-EX subwoofer.

I do not recall if i have the Dynamic EQ enabled or not, but I think I have my main speakers set to large, so I can change that and see if it helps. I believe I have one setting for low effects set to "main and sub" or similiar.
The setting LFE+MAIN results in the same low frequencies being emitted by both the Front speakers and the subwoofer. The interference between them usually causes the bass to be muddy and boomy. Enabling bass management (setting the speakers to "Small") usually is more appropriate. The optimal crossover frequency depends on the speakers and the room acoustics, but 80Hz usually is a reasonable starting point.

Quote:
I tried using "direct" mode and didnt really care for it as the sub was not engaged.
Direct disables all signal processing, so it also disables Audyssey and DynamicEQ, usually causing sound accuracy to suffer.

Quote:
When I say no "oomph", I meant overall listening quality, not just impact from a subwoofer. Like I said, listening to movies is great. But music is not fantastic. The sound/imaging/clarity sounds better from my Kg4s.

It could also be my room, but why would concert Blu Rays (like John Mayer) sound so incredible if the room itself was so bad?
There are at least a couple of reasons why CDs and BDs sound different:
1. Visuals provide a substantial distraction from the audio quality.
2. Their recorded dynamics are different.

The playback settings that you use for CDs have to be quite different from the settings used for Blu-ray discs.

Blu-ray soundtracks are mixed with different goals than audio-only soundtracks intended for CDs or other media, so they often have quite different dynamics. Unfortunately, most modern CD audio is recorded at a high level with substantially reduced dynamics while Blu-rays are not. This difference can make it rather difficult to find optimal gain settings. Remember that even slight differences in sound level, as little as a small fraction of a dB, can cause one soundtrack to sound better than another, with the louder being preferred.

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Old 01-13-2015, 08:22 AM
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Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post
With the FL/FR speakers set to LARGE, you can set Sub to LFE+MAIN to ensure lower frequencies are "also" passed to the sub as well. Although Audyssey is disabled when using DIRECT, some prefer DIRECT for music listening.
Any other suggestions JD?

Honestly, listening to CDs on my Denon/Klipsch Kg4 speaker setup so SOOOOO much better for music listening than the 8801 with a 200 wpc amp driving these monster Klipsch RF7, I am very suprised, especially after hearing others rave so much about the 2 ch quality of the 8801.
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Old 01-13-2015, 08:40 AM
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Originally Posted by cp1966 View Post
Any other suggestions JD?

Honestly, listening to CDs on my Denon/Klipsch Kg4 speaker setup so SOOOOO much better for music listening than the 8801 with a 200 wpc amp driving these monster Klipsch RF7, I am very suprised, especially after hearing others rave so much about the 2 ch quality of the 8801.

I agree with Selden Ball, you cannot really compare CD's and BDs. BDs are also mixed with the sub for multi-channel.

You could also try connecting Sony COAX out and also the analog outputs to the FL/FR of the 7.1 analog inputs as a test.
There are remote codes for switching between then or use the menus. The standard analog inputs are processed so they are likely digitized but the 7.1 are analog only so have no digital processing available.

I had the BDP-105D connected via HDMI, COAX, TosLink, and 7.1 analog and could found differences.

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Old 01-13-2015, 02:20 PM
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I tried doing the 7.1 analog connections from the Oppo in lieu of the HDMI for audio a while back and I thought it sounded worse. I can try it again with just 2 channels (left and right) for CD playback, and I can try a coaxial and optical from my Sony CD jukebox.
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Old 01-13-2015, 03:23 PM
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Originally Posted by jprod View Post
When I watch dolby digital programming from direct tv, I find the sound "tinny" and fatiguing over time. Movies sound awesome. I know dtv audio will never match audio from a blu ray disk but are there any tweaks I can make that will make the dtv experience a little better?
What D* receiver do you have?

I have an HR44 Genie, DD enabled, and the audio sounds pretty good to me. No tweaking here, just set the surround setting to DD on the Marantz...
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Old 01-13-2015, 03:32 PM
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I have the hr 24I think. Have to check tonight when I get home. Is there a difference among the various models?
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Old 01-13-2015, 04:04 PM
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I have the hr 24I think. Have to check tonight when I get home. Is there a difference among the various models?
Not familiar with the HR24. You sure you have DD enabled on it?

You say it is "tinny" and fatiguing over time. Do it sound good at the start of the day??
Mine is hooked up via HDMI. On some days I will watch DirecTv literally all day and have zero problems with the audio.

You say "Movies sound awesome". Are you referring to the audio from a disc player or other service, or from premium/movie channels on DirecTv?

If the audio fades out after a while it could be a problem with the D* receiver itself.
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Old 01-13-2015, 04:30 PM
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Not familiar with the HR24. You sure you have DD enabled on it?

You say it is "tinny" and fatiguing over time. Do it sound good at the start of the day??
Mine is hooked up via HDMI. On some days I will watch DirecTv literally all day and have zero problems with the audio.

You say "Movies sound awesome". Are you referring to the audio from a disc player or other service, or from premium/movie channels on DirecTv?

If the audio fades out after a while it could be a problem with the D* receiver itself.
For example , I was watching the college football game last night and the announcers voices sounded shrilly. When I watch a blu Ray movie the dialog is much deeper and less high pitched. I realize the audio on blu Ray discs will be superior but I find myself turning down the volume over time when I watch dtv because it becomes "annoying " to my ears. Yes dd is enabled.
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Old 01-13-2015, 04:41 PM
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For example , I was watching the college football game last night and the announcers voices sounded shrilly. When I watch a blu Ray movie the dialog is much deeper and less high pitched. I realize the audio on blu Ray discs will be superior but I find myself turning down the volume over time when I watch dtv because it becomes "annoying " to my ears. Yes dd is enabled.
But you mentioned that the audio is fatiguing over time. Does it sound OK when you first listen??
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Old 01-13-2015, 05:54 PM
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Sounds the same. It's like listening to a poorly mastered cd. Listening to it gets tiring even through the audio quality does not change through the cd
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Old 01-13-2015, 07:15 PM
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Sounds the same. It's like listening to a poorly mastered cd. Listening to it gets tiring even through the audio quality does not change through the cd
If you've had your DVR hooked up to a diiferent receiver before the 8801 and you are convinced there's nothing wrong with your HR24 then I don't know what else to suggest other than the usual: Swap out your cable connections to the 8801 to make sure they are working properly etc.

I don't know what "tweaks" to suggest unless someone else can help you. My DVR has sounded fine from day 1 after running Audyssey.
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Old 01-13-2015, 07:32 PM
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I have two HR24's, and they both sound extremely good on all content. I have Audyssey and DEQ engaged, with RLO=10, DVol off. I have no idea why DirecTV content isn't sounding good on your system.
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Old 01-14-2015, 09:55 AM
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For example , I was watching the college football game last night and the announcers voices sounded shrilly. When I watch a blu Ray movie the dialog is much deeper and less high pitched. I realize the audio on blu Ray discs will be superior but I find myself turning down the volume over time when I watch dtv because it becomes "annoying " to my ears. Yes dd is enabled.
I don't get the best sound out of some programming on Dtv as well. Typically it is sporting events, but if I switch to movie channels it seems much better. I don't know, I feel like getting close to BD quality audio from sportscasting station is like asking Tiger Woods to beat Bode Miller down a Giant Slalom course, it just won't happen.
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Old 01-14-2015, 09:56 AM
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On another note, some reviews seem to be coming in that the new 7702 has superior audio quality to the 8801. I would be curious to do a head to head between the two, but not quite ready for all that at this point. Surprised I am though about what people seem to be hearing so far....

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Old 01-14-2015, 10:54 AM
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^^ BY FAR, the majority of my DirecTv viewing is sports related. Of course those channels may not match up to HBO or Showtime in terms of audio quality, but none of the sports channels that broadcast in DD 5.1 sound inferior to my ears.
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Old 01-14-2015, 11:53 AM
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I don't get the best sound out of some programming on Dtv as well. Typically it is sporting events, but if I switch to movie channels it seems much better. I don't know, I feel like getting close to BD quality audio from sportscasting station is like asking Tiger Woods to beat Bode Miller down a Giant Slalom course, it just won't happen.
I agree with you regarding bd quality from direct tv. I was just wondering if there was a way on the 8801 menus to "tweak it". With regards to Tiger, at least he's slaloming down Lindsey Vonn's mountains ( although Bode didn't do too bad for himself either)

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On another note, some reviews seem to be coming in that the new 7702 has superior audio quality to the 8801. I would be curious to do a head to head between the two, but not quite ready for all that at this point. Surprised I am though about what people seem to be hearing so far....
I never heard the 7702 but I doubt it would help.You know the old saying -- garbage in, garbage out.
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Old 01-14-2015, 12:13 PM
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I agree with you regarding bd quality from direct tv. I was just wondering if there was a way on the 8801 menus to "tweak it". With regards to Tiger, at least he's slaloming down Lindsey Vonn's mountains ( although Bode didn't do too bad for himself either)



I never heard the 7702 but I doubt it would help.You know the old saying -- garbage in, garbage out.

Dynamic EQ being engaged will possibly help somewhat, give that a shot. If it is too much at first, mess with the reference level offset to see if that helps you find a happy place.

IRT the 7702, I was stating that completely separate, not having to do with your individual issue. Just curious if others in the thread have listened to both yet, and how they 7702 could possibly be that much better as some of the posters have been claiming....

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Old 01-14-2015, 01:53 PM
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I don't get the best sound out of some programming on Dtv as well. Typically it is sporting events, but if I switch to movie channels it seems much better. I don't know, I feel like getting close to BD quality audio from sportscasting station is like asking Tiger Woods to beat Bode Miller down a Giant Slalom course, it just won't happen.
What Audio mode are you guys using if you don't like the audio you are hearing, I seem to have the same problem with Comcast, there is no info in the surrounds at all with some channels and trying some of the other audio modes do not help much either. Do any of you switch to all stereo or anything or just stick with the DD PL11X.
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Old 01-14-2015, 02:16 PM
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What Audio mode are you guys using if you don't like the audio you are hearing, I seem to have the same problem with Comcast, there is no info in the surrounds at all with some channels and trying some of the other audio modes do not help much either. Do any of you switch to all stereo or anything or just stick with the DD PL11X.
I typically just run DD or DD-EX. The problem with adding EX is I notice on a lot of commercials, there are center channel vocals, or even full signal in the rears. This is obviously way off and far from accurate. With PLIIx I am not positive I have seen the same thing, but I can check next time I am watching TV (Not too often, just major sporting events really). I don't believe period in multichannel stereo, and feel like it should be renamed "Party Mode" as all it is really good for is pumping the maximum amount of sound into ones room whilst trying to simulate a rave concert of some sort...

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Old 01-14-2015, 02:34 PM
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I typically just run DD or DD-EX. The problem with adding EX is I notice on a lot of commercials, there are center channel vocals, or even full signal in the rears. This is obviously way off and far from accurate. With PLIIx I am not positive I have seen the same thing, but I can check next time I am watching TV (Not too often, just major sporting events really). I don't believe period in multichannel stereo, and feel like it should be renamed "Party Mode" as all it is really good for is pumping the maximum amount of sound into ones room whilst trying to simulate a rave concert of some sort...
I agree with you on the muti stereo drives me crazy also, I'd rather just put up with audio on the front right and left speakers, although I don't understand if something is in 2 channel why when i engage DD or PL11x I'm not getting nothing out of my rears or sides, This does not happen on every station just certain ones. Movie channels are usually in 5.1 so in my 7.1 system I usually engage PL11x with not problems, but since I have put the Comcast X1 into the mix even with surround mode set on the box I seem to be having some issues with my other channels not coming on. My 5 channel amp usually pops on when it gets a signal.
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Old 01-14-2015, 02:43 PM
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Interesting enough, I don't have any experience with comcast so I don't know what else to tell you...

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Old 01-14-2015, 07:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by beastaudio View Post
I don't get the best sound out of some programming on Dtv as well. Typically it is sporting events, but if I switch to movie channels it seems much better. I don't know, I feel like getting close to BD quality audio from sportscasting station is like asking Tiger Woods to beat Bode Miller down a Giant Slalom course, it just won't happen.
This has been pretty much the same with me on Dish Network as well. I would classify my audio experience (best to worst) as this:

HD movie channels > HD anything else > SD channels

...and we're talking incrementally significant differences too. I can tell what type of channel I'm on with my eyes closed.
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