Marantz AV8801 Preamp/Processor Official Owner's thread - Page 46 - AVS Forum
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post #1351 of 12271 Old 12-31-2012, 09:18 PM
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Isn't there a McIntosh equivalent to the Marantz and Denon? The MX121 maybe?

McIntosh MX151 Owner's Thread

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post #1352 of 12271 Old 12-31-2012, 09:51 PM
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guys, I was seriously considering a Theta with 2 Extreme Dacs. I just got rid of a Datasat RS20i. Prior to that, I had the Marantz 7005 paired with the exact same setup as the RS20. Honestly, not too much difference in sound quality - yes, the DSat was a bit more liquid or "black," but for the kind of money, it wasn't worth the overall cost. I decided against the Theta today as there's just so much diminishing returns in the high-end audio products. I swear it's a placebo effect. I've got a funky room, so only other consideration is the D2V as ARC may correct my room, but not sure how much better it "could" be than 32XT. I wasn't going to write about my impressions of the RS20, it's nice, but you get 90% of the sound quality (for HT) out of the Marantz. I decided to order the 8801 today. Will be interesting if it gives me that same sense of "liquidity" and incredibly low noise floor the Dsat provided.

Are you guys using Roomie Remote with iOS to control this thing? If you guys are, what else do I need to run this through my iphone?

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post #1353 of 12271 Old 12-31-2012, 10:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sherr127 View Post

i do hope this new pre will have more punch and dynamic bcos from what i experienced with 7701 it lacks the dynamic for movies,only good for concert and music..

I found the 7005 to lack in dynamics and its reproduction in music, so it would be interesting to hear this piece in my system.
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post #1354 of 12271 Old 12-31-2012, 11:06 PM
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Originally Posted by joerod View Post

Thrang, well worded summary! Comments are right on the money and I am hearing the same excellent details. cool.gif

Yes, I think we have a winner with the 8801...until next year!

Thanks
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post #1355 of 12271 Old 12-31-2012, 11:59 PM
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Originally Posted by thrang View Post

Yes, I think we have a winner with the 8801...until next year!
Thanks

This doesn't happen to often! they got it right! Both the music lover and Audiophile me are mighty impressed, and by that I mean the analog section via balanced inputs from my 105 are bliss, Audyssey is teaching and old dog some new tricks via digital dsp rc. Now unexpectedly is Hi rez files usb playback on this beast refinement resolution and pure enjoyment currently listening to Crosby,Stills & Nash "Daylight Again" 192/24. Better get ready to spend a whole lot more to better this thing alot!
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post #1356 of 12271 Old 01-01-2013, 12:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by audiofan1 View Post

This doesn't happen to often! they got it right! Both the music lover and Audiophile me are mighty impressed, and by that I mean the analog section via balanced inputs from my 105 are bliss, Audyssey is teaching and old dog some new tricks via digital dsp rc. Now unexpectedly is Hi rez files usb playback on this beast refinement resolution and pure enjoyment currently listening to Crosby,Stills & Nash "Daylight Again" 192/24. Better get ready to spend a whole lot more to better this thing alot!

I've yet to listen to any two channel; normally I use my M2Tech Young DAC, but I will try connecting my macmini/aiff library directly to the 8801.
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post #1357 of 12271 Old 01-01-2013, 06:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stieger View Post

guys, I was seriously considering a Theta with 2 Extreme Dacs. I just got rid of a Datasat RS20i. Prior to that, I had the Marantz 7005 paired with the exact same setup as the RS20. Honestly, not too much difference in sound quality - yes, the DSat was a bit more liquid or "black," but for the kind of money, it wasn't worth the overall cost. I decided against the Theta today as there's just so much diminishing returns in the high-end audio products. I swear it's a placebo effect. I've got a funky room, so only other consideration is the D2V as ARC may correct my room, but not sure how much better it "could" be than 32XT. I wasn't going to write about my impressions of the RS20, it's nice, but you get 90% of the sound quality (for HT) out of the Marantz. I decided to order the 8801 today. Will be interesting if it gives me that same sense of "liquidity" and incredibly low noise floor the Dsat provided.
Are you guys using Roomie Remote with iOS to control this thing? If you guys are, what else do I need to run this through my iphone?
Stieger

It's interesting that you weren't too impressed with the RS20i. Could you give more details? If money were no object I'd probably be looking at the Datasat and the Dirac room correction. Once your 8801 arrives, if you could post your impressions it'd be greatly appreciated. I'm wondering how much room (pun intended) there is for improvement in room correction in the future and how much is going to be down to physical treatments and so called 'funky rooms' smile.gif
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post #1358 of 12271 Old 01-01-2013, 06:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stieger View Post

guys, I was seriously considering a Theta with 2 Extreme Dacs. I just got rid of a Datasat RS20i. Prior to that, I had the Marantz 7005 paired with the exact same setup as the RS20. Honestly, not too much difference in sound quality - yes, the DSat was a bit more liquid or "black," but for the kind of money, it wasn't worth the overall cost. I decided against the Theta today as there's just so much diminishing returns in the high-end audio products. I swear it's a placebo effect. I've got a funky room, so only other consideration is the D2V as ARC may correct my room, but not sure how much better it "could" be than 32XT. I wasn't going to write about my impressions of the RS20, it's nice, but you get 90% of the sound quality (for HT) out of the Marantz. I decided to order the 8801 today. Will be interesting if it gives me that same sense of "liquidity" and incredibly low noise floor the Dsat provided.
Are you guys using Roomie Remote with iOS to control this thing? If you guys are, what else do I need to run this through my iphone?
Stieger

Greg is using Roomie. Checked it out.. works like a champ, I have it at home as well but no Marantz (yet) smile.gif

Interesting about your comments on the Datasat. I was seriously considering it myself at one point but then decided it was not worth the added investment over the Classe. Same with Theta. I really would love to hear your thoughts on the Marantz compared to the Dsat,

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post #1359 of 12271 Old 01-01-2013, 06:41 AM
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Network Reset

When having network connection issues, first try resetting the router and unplugging the 8801 for a few minutes. If still no joy, then try doing a "Network Reset" ... similar to a Microprocessor reset (p. 186) except press/hold the [Pure Direct] and [UP arrow] buttons instead while powering the unit ON. This procedure will reset the network card as well as perform a microprocessor update in the process so ensure to SAVE the config.dat file to a PC using the Web Control function (pp. 106-107) so as to more easily restore your old settings (to include Audyssey).

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1334369/the-official-denon-avr-xx12-model-owners-thread/0_100#user_E10

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post #1360 of 12271 Old 01-01-2013, 07:47 AM
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Guys whats the concensus....if you had to pick only one option what seems to give the most effect....wide channels or height channels. I realize its dependant on material but what have you guys found. I have 7.1 now and I feel that I would get more benefit with height channels....but thats just thinking out loud.

Thanks
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post #1361 of 12271 Old 01-01-2013, 08:16 AM
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I'm having a problem understanding how Audyssey is affected or not affected.

If you change the crossovers in the manual speakers module, does that affect the crossover with Audyssey on or only if it's off?

I'd guess that making changes in the equalizer only affects Audyssey off....is that correct?

Is there any way to make adjustments to Audyssey off (manual) without them showing up in Audyssey on so I can compare them? (without adding Audyssey Pro)

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post #1362 of 12271 Old 01-01-2013, 08:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JimP View Post

I'm having a problem understanding how Audyssey is affected or not affected.
If you change the crossovers in the manual speakers module, does that affect the crossover with Audyssey on or only if it's off?
I'd guess that making changes in the equalizer only affects Audyssey off....is that correct?
Is there any way to make adjustments to Audyssey off (manual) without them showing up in Audyssey on so I can compare them? (without adding Audyssey Pro)

Hi Jim

1) My understanding is you can RAISE crossovers after an Audyssey cal without detrimental effect, but not lower them

2) I beleive this is correct, though it was pointed out yesterday that tone controls, for example, can be used with Audyssey On if Dynamic EQ is disabled; not sure if this it true with the graphic EQ, but highly doubt it.

3) Not sure what your last query is...
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post #1363 of 12271 Old 01-01-2013, 08:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JimP View Post

I'm having a problem understanding how Audyssey is affected or not affected.
If you change the crossovers in the manual speakers module, does that affect the crossover with Audyssey on or only if it's off?
I'd guess that making changes in the equalizer only affects Audyssey off....is that correct?
Is there any way to make adjustments to Audyssey off (manual) without them showing up in Audyssey on so I can compare them? (without adding Audyssey Pro)

1. Audyssey uses filter control points to EQ a full range 75db test signal passed to each speaker and sub. It then passes the -3db point of each speaker to the 8801 which uses this information to set the following settings: LARGE/SMALL, crossover, distance, volume. So although changing any of these settings under Manual Setup after running Audyssey makes them the current "active" settings (Audyssey ON or OFF), doing so does not affect the Audyssey EQ process as the 8801 has made these changes.

2. In order to use the Graphic EQ, Audyssey is disabled, and therefore any changes made via the Graphic EQ settings do not apply when Audyssey is enabled again.

3. See #2.

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post #1364 of 12271 Old 01-01-2013, 09:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rosano View Post

Guys whats the concensus....if you had to pick only one option what seems to give the most effect....wide channels or height channels. I realize its dependant on material but what have you guys found. I have 7.1 now and I feel that I would get more benefit with height channels....but thats just thinking out loud.
Thanks

Depends on what you meant by "most effect"?

If it means being able to try different processing modes, heights gives more: you can run Dolby IIz as well as NeoX and DSX.

But if you are referring to biggest impact, I will say that I notice wides far more easily in the pans than the heights. I think I only noticed the heights when I was watching Episode IV when the Blockade Runner and the Destroyer was moving across overhead.

The wides provide extremely seamless panning when the action goes off screen but the sound effect is still audible. I place mine on the side walls, mirroring the side surround (using the listening position as the centre). I think the angle is important so it need not be on the front wall (wider than front LR).

Something like this:


The heights do improve the sense of the dialogue coming from the screen rather than the centre speaker under it.
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post #1365 of 12271 Old 01-01-2013, 10:15 AM
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I don't have room for wides but added heights. I find the effect very subtle but I have B&W ceiling speakers as surrounds and the heights help blend the surround sound so ceilings are not as localized for movies. Sort of a disappointment in front soundstage (Dolby PLIIz) but unexpected gain for my room. I did note some minor expansion of front soundstage going back and forth with Battle: LA.

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post #1366 of 12271 Old 01-01-2013, 01:41 PM
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Woof Woof...what are the dimensions of your room.....and by effect i meant ...impact. My room is 24 deep....14 width and about 8ft high
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post #1367 of 12271 Old 01-01-2013, 02:01 PM
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Question about configurable inputs, or lack thereof...

I sometimes like to watch sport events but listen to music via the balanced XLRs; it seems the closest I can get to doing this is assigning the XLR analog inputs for audio to my DirecTV input, and then going into setup a few menus deep and changing the input select to analog from audio - a tad tedious and not something I can program

It seems you also cannot have an hdmi source assigned to more than one virtual input which would also solve this - if I assign the hdmi input for my directv to CD, which is where I originally had the XLRs configured for analog audio, it removes the hdmi selection from the virtual input originally assigned to watching directv. Bummer

There's also no direct access digital/analog button on the remote that I can see to make the switching quick and programmable

Am I missing something obvious? Thanks...
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post #1368 of 12271 Old 01-01-2013, 02:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post

Of course you're welcome to use whatever setting you prefer, however, note that Audyssey didn't set your speakers to LARGE, rather the 8801 did that based on the -3db point passed to it from Audyssey. In fact if Audyssey (the company) had it's way, after running Audyssey, with a capable sub in the setup, the Audyssey software would set all speakers SMALL (as the Audyssey co-founder has mentioned many times in the Audyssey thread). However, sadly that is not the case and the AVR/pre mfrs generally set any speaker to LARGE if it's -3db point is < 50Hz. Setting the front mains to LARGE with the sub set to LFE+Main results in "double bass" (most likely preferred if you are used to bloated bass from an older model receiver) which most generally do not prefer once given a few weeks to adjust to the SMALL/80Hz or 60Hz setting.

So Audyssey would have me set the crossover to 80HZ on my Revel Salons. smile.gif

I think not.

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post #1369 of 12271 Old 01-01-2013, 02:50 PM
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So Audyssey would have me set the crossover to 80HZ on my Revel Salons. smile.gif
 

Not necessarily.  If you want to see the recommendations from Audyssey, try using MultEQ Pro where the preferences are listed in order.


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post #1370 of 12271 Old 01-01-2013, 02:52 PM
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Originally Posted by RichB View Post

So Audyssey would have me set the crossover to 80HZ on my Revel Salons. smile.gif
I think not.
- Rich

+1 I run my mains full range as its always negated the need for a second sub ( blends better in the room) center and surrounds however are a different story due to placement. I do have a question regarding Audyssey not doing anything for surrounds below 120hz, true or not?
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post #1371 of 12271 Old 01-01-2013, 02:59 PM
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Originally Posted by audiofan1 View Post


I do have a question regarding Audyssey not doing anything for surrounds below 120hz, true or not?

True only if your surrounds roll off at 120Hz.  wink.gif


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Originally Posted by Kal Rubinson View Post

True only if your surrounds roll off at 120Hz.  wink.gif

Hi Kal, my surrounds roll off at around 55hz, after running Audyssey the 8801 set them to 60hz , can you recommend a good point for them?
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post #1373 of 12271 Old 01-01-2013, 03:42 PM
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Well I'll be! it sounds better at 60hz , I tried 120,90,80 and the 60 had better tactile sensation from the mids via the surrounds and curious I find that using the Dynamic eq with Audyssey set to bypass the FL/FR to sound incredible for multich sacd, other wise using Audyssey or flat it sounds to thin, I must admit I never new the bypass for the main channels existed on Audyssey I would have tried it long ago. and kal thanks to you and Fitzcaraldo on here and the Asylum for championing the use of DSP room correction, Its a game changer indeed! the spatial field it creates is to die for, coupled with the seamless integration as a whole with no negitive effects I can disern on the sound I love from 2ch sacd! One couldn't ask for more at this point. I'm sure there is more I have to learn on this but the door to my multich sacd is wide open now and may finally give my 2ch a run for its money!cool.gif
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post #1374 of 12271 Old 01-01-2013, 05:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by audiofan1 View Post


Hi Kal, my surrounds roll off at around 55hz, after running Audyssey the 8801 set them to 60hz , can you recommend a good point for them?

60Hz, of course.  After all, your Audyssey calibration has much more knowledge of your system/room than I do.

Quote:
Originally Posted by audiofan1 View Post

Well I'll be! it sounds better at 60hz , I tried 120,90,80 and the 60 had better tactile sensation from the mids via the surrounds and curious I find that using the Dynamic eq with Audyssey set to bypass the FL/FR to sound incredible for multich sacd, other wise using Audyssey or flat it sounds to thin, I must admit I never new the bypass for the main channels existed on Audyssey I would have tried it long ago. and kal thanks to you and Fitzcaraldo on here and the Asylum for championing the use of DSP room correction, Its a game changer indeed! the spatial field it creates is to die for, coupled with the seamless integration as a whole with no negitive effects I can disern on the sound I love from 2ch sacd! One couldn't ask for more at this point. I'm sure there is more I have to learn on this but the door to my multich sacd is wide open now and may finally give my 2ch a run for its money!cool.gif

I have never liked using DynamicEQ (except for sports events and late night movies) nor have I ever appreciated the L/R Bypass setting.  Too much bass modes.

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post #1375 of 12271 Old 01-01-2013, 05:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rosano View Post

Woof Woof...what are the dimensions of your room.....and by effect i meant ...impact. My room is 24 deep....14 width and about 8ft high

About 4.5 x 7 x 2.5m
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post #1376 of 12271 Old 01-01-2013, 05:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RichB View Post

So Audyssey would have me set the crossover to 80HZ on my Revel Salons. smile.gif
I think not.
- Rich

Agreed. General guidance only as the vast majority don't have speakers with the low extension capability of your Salons. wink.gif

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post #1377 of 12271 Old 01-01-2013, 11:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post

Agreed. General guidance only as the vast majority don't have speakers with the low extension capability of your Salons. wink.gif

Makes sense.

I only began reading/skimming this thread today.

Perhaps I missed it, but I am interested in the two channel performance of the 8801 for folks with the analog inputs and HDMI.
Currently, I am using the Onkyo PR-SC5507 with the analog inputs from an Oppo BDP-105.

To get the very best performance, I run the 5507 in Pure mode and the Oppo with all speakers set to large.
The sound is really fantastic.

The 5507 is not XT32 capable. But when folks were raving about its performance, I tried it about 6 times and hated it every time.
So, I have developed sever case of skepticism. That leads me to absolutely require a clean analog path in any new processor I purchase.

I also have a Radiance Mini that has done quire well with its new 3D AutoCalibration from Calman 5.
So where I am coming from, I think this beauty has many features that I do not need.

Does anyone have a BDP-105 paired with 8801 and, if so, how would you compare the analog versus the digital performance?

- Rich

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post #1378 of 12271 Old 01-02-2013, 12:31 AM
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Originally Posted by thrang View Post

Question about configurable inputs, or lack thereof...
I sometimes like to watch sport events but listen to music via the balanced XLRs; it seems the closest I can get to doing this is assigning the XLR analog inputs for audio to my DirecTV input, and then going into setup a few menus deep and changing the input select to analog from audio - a tad tedious and not something I can program
It seems you also cannot have an hdmi source assigned to more than one virtual input which would also solve this - if I assign the hdmi input for my directv to CD, which is where I originally had the XLRs configured for analog audio, it removes the hdmi selection from the virtual input originally assigned to watching directv. Bummer
There's also no direct access digital/analog button on the remote that I can see to make the switching quick and programmable
Am I missing something obvious? Thanks...
Hey, there is an ir command called InputMode.

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post #1379 of 12271 Old 01-02-2013, 01:19 AM
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Originally Posted by Kal Rubinson View Post

60Hz, of course.  After all, your Audyssey calibration has much more knowledge of your system/room than I do.
I have never liked using DynamicEQ (except for sports events and late night movies) nor have I ever appreciated the L/R Bypass setting.  Too much bass modes.

I can understand the on Dynamic EQ, perhaps program dependent. As for the L/R Bypass, after great lengths of positioning my mains, bass trapping, first and second refection points, front and rear wall treatments as well I finally got the mix to my liking or shall we say my neutral and thus far for multi sacd this option sounds the smoothest with great bass thats not heavy handed, as the modes have been dealt ( as best they could) with by the acoustic panels, but more listening must be done!
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post #1380 of 12271 Old 01-02-2013, 01:36 AM
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Originally Posted by RichB View Post

Makes sense.
I only began reading/skimming this thread today.
Perhaps I missed it, but I am interested in the two channel performance of the 8801 for folks with the analog inputs and HDMI.
Currently, I am using the Onkyo PR-SC5507 with the analog inputs from an Oppo BDP-105.
To get the very best performance, I run the 5507 in Pure mode and the Oppo with all speakers set to large.
The sound is really fantastic.
The 5507 is not XT32 capable. But when folks were raving about its performance, I tried it about 6 times and hated it every time.
So, I have developed sever case of skepticism. That leads me to absolutely require a clean analog path in any new processor I purchase.
I also have a Radiance Mini that has done quire well with its new 3D AutoCalibration from Calman 5.
So where I am coming from, I think this beauty has many features that I do not need.
Does anyone have a BDP-105 paired with 8801 and, if so, how would you compare the analog versus the digital performance?
- Rich

I'm in the process of such an evaluation as I love the sound of the 105 via the 8801's balanced inputs (coming from an 95 / Anthem avm 20 )Now here is were it starts to get tricky, So far the 8801 is not what I expected no matter what format I've thrown at it thus far its excelling at said format, but I would like till next weekend to sum it up ( sorry I let my components burn in) I will say this however I'm very fortunate to have the chance to own both and glad in the end I wont have to decide between the two that would at this point be very difficult!
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