Marantz AV8801 Preamp/Processor Official Owner's thread - Page 97 - AVS Forum
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post #2881 of 12271 Old 02-16-2013, 09:41 AM
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Right after Rich posted his disappointment in the second AV8801 he acquired I went and rigorously recabled my setup to verify his conclusions.

Even though it was 02:30AM, or thereabout, I compared HDMI and 7.1 to the Oppo, again. I couldn't play loud and the volume levels were only vaguely similar, as it isn't easy to quicly switch between feeds to active speakers (able to do 130dB each) without waking neighbours in the whole block. Two hours later I went to bed thinking I heard clear differences between the Marantz and the Oppo on at least one song, the relentless first track from Lynni Treekrem's album Haugtussa.

After resting for a bit I made several separate attempts today to try and repeat my findings of the night, in vain. Because I focussed mostly on troublesome trebble I relaxed and did other stuff in between to avoid ear fatigue. There is sibilance present in several songs I used, but it is there through whatever route I tried (even using my Sennheiser HD565 from the Oppo). It has led me to believe relative volume levels were to blame during the night.

There could be some extra trebble or thinness of sound, but not to the extend it got noticed on my system. Coming from a Pioneer AX10, a TAG McLaren AV32R DP and an Onkyo TX-NR5008 I am used to trebble and a somewhat thin sounding amp, so I could be a bad judge here. Also my room accoustics, Blue Jeans interconnects or Cordial Pro Line XLR's could mask stuff. I don't know.
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post #2882 of 12271 Old 02-16-2013, 11:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RichB View Post

OK, it is getting late.
I did some quick experiments with the Center Channel since watching TV is DD 5.1 is fairly bright and I notice increased sibilance with the AV8801.

With my system, I believe the XLR connection is producing a thinner/brighter sound from the center channel.
I believe the sounds is better balanced when I repeated the Speaker Setup and set only the center channel to RCA and used an RCA connection.

So that begs two questions:

1) Are those of use experience brighter sounds using XLRs (I am)
2) Can you try some channels RCA after repeating the guided setup and selecting that mode?

Good night.

- Rich

Rich,

From the EE point of view I should not have expected the difference in sound between interconnect and speak cables... My ears tell me otherwise. Bi-amping my speakers produces different presentation altogether... Much tighter and fuller mid bass.

To my surprise, the Canary quad S11 speaker cables gave me more balanced response compare to a bit brightness with Monster 12 gauge cables. I agree with you, you may want to swap XLR cables with Coax RCA's and observe the results.

- Alex
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post #2883 of 12271 Old 02-16-2013, 01:58 PM
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Let it burn in!
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post #2884 of 12271 Old 02-16-2013, 02:16 PM
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Originally Posted by audiofan1 View Post

Let it burn in!

I talked to you via PM, and i felt the same way as others with the Marantz as far as sounding thin and bright compared to My Anthem d2, but after some time it has settled in very nicely and with the Audessey engaged has done wonders for my system compared to the arc with the Anthem.My bass is really kicking now and the sound stage and imaging is very good, while listening to 2 channel i get up to check if my center speaker is on...lol
I never thought burn in on a solid state piece would matter but it seems to have some merit to it,and i don't think my ear's got used to it otherwise I'm very sensitive to the harshness and i would know it.
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post #2885 of 12271 Old 02-16-2013, 02:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GerryWaz View Post

Just curious if anyone has done any testing of M-DAX on the AV8801 . . .

Finally tried DLNA (using MonkeyMedia as my server) and AirPlay from my PC and both worked great. So just wondering what folks think of using M-DAX with compressed music files.

Most of my ripped files are MP3's @ 320kps (we use Flash drives in our cars for playing music and they just support WMA's and MP3's). Am I right in assuming the less you compress your music files the less that M-DAX will have an effect on them?

Since you have them at 320 kps i'm guessing you rip your own from CDs?

Do as I do, I rip mine to FLAC, then use dB Poweramp Batch Converter to convert them to MP3s. If you have a multicore CPU it doesn't take long.

I have my whole library of CDs in Flac and MP3s. Flac for use at home, and MP3s for my iPods. I only use 128 kbs too get as much as I can on the iPods, have over 20.000 songs, and I like to get all of the with me. Never know what I want to listen to in advance.
And I get the better quality that my setup deserves.
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post #2886 of 12271 Old 02-16-2013, 02:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by buckley44 View Post

I talked to you via PM, and i felt the same way as others with the Marantz as far as sounding thin and bright compared to My Anthem d2, but after some time it has settled in very nicely and with the Audessey engaged has done wonders for my system compared to the arc with the Anthem.My bass is really kicking now and the sound stage and imaging is very good, while listening to 2 channel i get up to check if my center speaker is on...lol
I never thought burn in on a solid state piece would matter but it seems to have some merit to it,and i don't think my ear's got used to it otherwise I'm very sensitive to the harshness and i would know it.[/quote

The 8801 is capable of some serious resolution and at first it was to its determent, the harshness could make one cringe, but now works in its favor and brings toe tapping pace and rhythm to music and has a midrange I'm beginning to love very much,its fast detailed and still musical and its bass is taunt tight and well defined, its got a hold on fast transients and doesn't smear the sound.The movie experience on the 8801, lets just say I'm still finding hard to believe at times there was something I was missing that it found and presented in a way Iv'e not heard before. Coming from the an Anthem as well with its smooth sound and finding that the 8801 after settling has bested its processing abilities even via analog is icing on the cake. Now who would've ever thought music over an hdmi cable could sound so good , I'm eating my crow on this one !
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post #2887 of 12271 Old 02-16-2013, 03:35 PM
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Audiofan1, thank you for posting your experiences even with the burn in. As an EE this phenomenon has surprised me too. I'm not sure how much of that is solid state electronics vs things like slight changes in the impedance vs frequency of capacitors. I experienced it firsthand with an Oppo BDP-83 and a 95. Hard to call it "getting used to it" when you're comparing it directly to another piece as reference that's level matched going back in forth with two copies of the same title. Thanks to all you guys posting sound quality comparisons and noting bugs with the 8801. I'm about ready to order one. Please, someone PM me with a could place to buy and what a competitive street price would be.
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post #2888 of 12271 Old 02-17-2013, 12:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RichB View Post

I hooked up the new AV8801 and I am not sure it is much different.

Laura shay's bittersweet CD benefited by the birghtness.
Little Voice not so much. Here are my CD 2.0 listening results in pure direct mode:
HDMI is more balanced but less detailed.
COAX is BRIGHT with not enough weight in the lower end.
XLR is bright a bit more detail and low end.
7.1 retains all the detail, but is it ever bright !

exm, are you ready to add a possible issue?

excessive brightness on 7.1 inputs in Pure Direct.
Longer term users feel this goes away after burn-in.
However, a few have become concerned enough to return the unit.

- Rich

If you take a look at the pictures Marantz provides in their commercial presentation of the AV8801, you'll find one with 13 stacked circuit boards. I showed it to an electronics colleague of mine last week who identified it as an (the) input selector. He said this solution made it easy to switch out parts if people inadvertently blow up a port.

No matter what its purpose, Marantz is clearly showing it off as a selling aid: a nice (looking) array of electronic circuits. What caught my eye is that all these neatly stacked circuits are populated with Electrolytic capacitors, which are generally considered a big no-no anywhere in the signal path of a high-end audio device.

The presence of such cheap components, possibly aided by a long internal wiring path to get there, could easily be the main culprit of what you are experiencing: degradation of all pre-amplified signals no matter which input is used.

Most gear nowadays is packed with such capacitors, so few people will notice their effect because they have gotten used to it. Also other components in the chain and room acoustics are seldom good enough to identify a single device to have such traits. I'm sure these are important reasons I cannot clearly identify the signal degradation myself.
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post #2889 of 12271 Old 02-17-2013, 01:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ettepet View Post

If you take a look at the pictures Marantz provides in their commercial presentation of the AV8801, you'll find one with 13 stacked circuit boards. I showed it to an electronics colleague of mine last week who identified it as an (the) input selector. He said this solution made it easy to switch out parts if people inadvertently blow up a port.

No matter what its purpose, Marantz is clearly showing it off as a selling aid: a nice (looking) array of electronic circuits. What caught my eye is that all these neatly stacked circuits are populated with Electrolytic capacitors, which are generally considered a big no-no anywhere in the signal path of a high-end audio device.

The presence of such cheap components, possibly aided by a long internal wiring path to get there, could easily be the main culprit of what you are experiencing: degradation of all pre-amplified signals no matter which input is used.

Most gear nowadays is packed with such capacitors, so few people will notice their effect because they have gotten used to it. Also other components in the chain and room acoustics are seldom good enough to identify a single device to have such traits. I'm sure these are important reasons I cannot clearly identify the signal degradation myself.

What signal degradation?
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post #2890 of 12271 Old 02-17-2013, 02:18 AM
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Originally Posted by audiofan1 View Post

What signal degradation?

The one you're not noticing. (that was an easy one, lol.. biggrin.gif)

But seriously, if you are not part of the religious sect of Audioholics origin and DO know a bit about signal integrity, electronics and physics you quickly come to realize that a poor choice of electronics, speaker placement and room acoustics can (and will) easily degrade a signal. Audibly so. Although as I said you might not notice when switching out one component, or even move your stuff to a more ideal listening environment. If causes of signal degredation are still present after you switch components you will still hear them.

In my comparisons between "Oppo + Marantz" and just the Oppo I never could quickly and comfortably switch between input paths, truly level matched etc. My (signal level carrying) XLR speaker cables are 10 meters long, running along power cords and other signal cables, with unbalanced circuitry on both ends. Well I call it unbalanced circuitry but there is an op-amp there to convert it back and forth. My room acoustics are not (anywhere close to) ideal either. In short, even though it took a lot of effort on my side I know my observations carry only limited weight.
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post #2891 of 12271 Old 02-17-2013, 02:48 AM
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Config questions -

I have my Oppo BDP-105 hooked up the Marantz via 3 paths: HDMI, the 7.1 multi-channel RCA inputs, and the XLR stereo inputs. And I can switch the audio selection between each of those paths via the Marantz remote (although not as easily as I would like). I know that if I select the HDMI input for audio, then the Marantz can use all the bells and whistles to process the signal.

What about when using the 7.1 analog multi-channel inputs (for either movie-watching or multi-channel SACD listening)?

Will any Audyssey correction apply to the 7.1 inputs? What about if I use the graphic equalizer settings? Or even just the simple channel-level adjustments manually set with the test-tone and an old analog Radio Shack meter? Or the speaker-distance config values? Which of these adjustments - if any - are applied by the Marantz in 7.1 input mode?

Related question - what about sound modes? Specifically - for a 5.1 sound-track movie - when using the 7.1 multi-channel Oppo outputs - is there any way to tell the Marantz to use PL-IIx sound-mode to give some signal to the rear-surrounds? (Or is there some setting on the Oppo that I never noticed to tell it to "double" the surround signals so they also get sent to the rear-surround 7.1 outputs when watching a 5.1 movie?)

Similarly to the 7.1 questions - what about when using the XLR-stereo inputs? Which settings/adjustments available on the Marantz, if any, apply when listening to the XLR inputs? And if I'm listening in "Stereo" or "Direct" mode - will the XLR inputs only drive my front L/R speakers? Or is there some bass mgmt available - in one of these modes - to engage the sub-woofer as well? For XLR-stereo listening I'm looking for the "best" mode to listen to the music in its "pure" form - whatever the artist/recording engineers intended it to sound like...

Thanks,
Bill
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post #2892 of 12271 Old 02-17-2013, 03:19 AM
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Originally Posted by hifiaudio2 View Post

I don't know if Marantz can add NTFS capability to the 8801 in a firmware update, but I sure wish they would. Very annoying to have to reformat external hard drives to be able to use them with this unit. That is a step back from the Integra 80.x series.

The FAT16 or FAT32 requirement for USB inputs has been a requirement on all networking D&M models since the networking feature was first introduced.

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post #2893 of 12271 Old 02-17-2013, 03:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ettepet View Post

Do people here use "Dynamic EQ"? And if so, at what setting? (meaning 'Reference Level Offset')

I finally managed to do a full 8-point Audyssey calibration today, without outside noise etc. You cannot store more than 1 calibration it seems, the Onkyo had 2 storage locations for all its settings iirc. Well, I'm happy with my 1 calibration. smile.gif

The general recommendation to start out is Dyn EQ on for all sources with the RLO set to 10 for TV and music sources and 0 for movie sources adjusting accordingly to suit your preference keeping in mind the goal of Dyn EQ is to boost the bass and surround audio at volume levels below reference (0db/80).

One of the many benefits of using the Audyssey Pro Kit is the ability to more quickly load multiple saved calibrations. Those interested in learning more about the kit might want to review the Audyssey Pro Installer Kit thread.

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1346723/the-audyssey-pro-installer-kit-thread-faq-in-post-1/0_100

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post #2894 of 12271 Old 02-17-2013, 03:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stoneycreek View Post

On a side note; I wish that the 8801 would have a way to access surround sound field selections via the web based GUI instead of hitting the button and not being able to individually select the specific sound field that you want. My Denon 4311CI had this capability but then the denon also had the option to adjust the channel levels without going to the test tones and adjusting the levels in that manner. Anyone know why these differences or changes were made?

Brian

Cannot provide the reasoning as far as the "why", but do note this change applies to all of the 2012 D&M models to include the 4520CI.

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post #2895 of 12271 Old 02-17-2013, 03:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GerryWaz View Post

Just curious if anyone has done any testing of M-DAX on the AV8801 . . .

Finally tried DLNA (using MonkeyMedia as my server) and AirPlay from my PC and both worked great. So just wondering what folks think of using M-DAX with compressed music files.

Most of my ripped files are MP3's @ 320kps (we use Flash drives in our cars for playing music and they just support WMA's and MP3's). Am I right in assuming the less you compress your music files the less that M-DAX will have an effect on them?

At that rate you're unlikely to notice any change based on the note in the manual ....


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post #2896 of 12271 Old 02-17-2013, 03:42 AM
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Have a little "problem" with my controlling of the AV8801.

I use the Logitech Harmony Touch remote, and to get around the zones powering on, I used the advice in this thread to use cbl/sat button to power on in stead of the power on signal.
But when I'm starting my TV activity which uses the cbl/sat input, the AV8801 don't go to that input. So I manually have to switch the input to the correct one.

Tried to switch the power on to the ipod input. But the same result. The Logitech has the TV activety set to use the cbl/sat signal for signal input.

Any ideas?

When starting in other activetys it works great.
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post #2897 of 12271 Old 02-17-2013, 03:47 AM
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@Bill222, you can not apply Audyssey to the 7.1 inputs, you can through the other inputs (XLR, HDMI, analog).

Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post

The general recommendation to start out is Dyn EQ on for all sources with the RLO set to 10 for TV and music sources and 0 for movie sources adjusting accordingly to suit your preference keeping in mind the goal of Dyn EQ is to boost the bass and surround audio at volume levels below reference (0db/80).

Thanks! smile.gif
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post #2898 of 12271 Old 02-17-2013, 03:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill222 View Post

Config questions -

I have my Oppo BDP-105 hooked up the Marantz via 3 paths: HDMI, the 7.1 multi-channel RCA inputs, and the XLR stereo inputs. And I can switch the audio selection between each of those paths via the Marantz remote (although not as easily as I would like). I know that if I select the HDMI input for audio, then the Marantz can use all the bells and whistles to process the signal.

What about when using the 7.1 analog multi-channel inputs (for either movie-watching or multi-channel SACD listening)?

Will any Audyssey correction apply to the 7.1 inputs? What about if I use the graphic equalizer settings? Or even just the simple channel-level adjustments manually set with the test-tone and an old analog Radio Shack meter? Or the speaker-distance config values? Which of these adjustments - if any - are applied by the Marantz in 7.1 input mode?

Related question - what about sound modes? Specifically - for a 5.1 sound-track movie - when using the 7.1 multi-channel Oppo outputs - is there any way to tell the Marantz to use PL-IIx sound-mode to give some signal to the rear-surrounds? (Or is there some setting on the Oppo that I never noticed to tell it to "double" the surround signals so they also get sent to the rear-surround 7.1 outputs when watching a 5.1 movie?)

Similarly to the 7.1 questions - what about when using the XLR-stereo inputs? Which settings/adjustments available on the Marantz, if any, apply when listening to the XLR inputs? And if I'm listening in "Stereo" or "Direct" mode - will the XLR inputs only drive my front L/R speakers? Or is there some bass mgmt available - in one of these modes - to engage the sub-woofer as well? For XLR-stereo listening I'm looking for the "best" mode to listen to the music in its "pure" form - whatever the artist/recording engineers intended it to sound like...

Thanks,
Bill





7.1 analog inputs ==> Audyssey, DSP and bass management is disabled

Graphic equalizer ===> Audyssey disabled

Channel level settings still apply as these are set by the 8801 (not Audyssey) and done in the analog domain

XLR inputs are treated as are the RCA inputs (all modes that apply to RCA stereo inputs are active) with following conditions for stereo 2.0 input:
  • STEREO = bass management (with FL/FR set to SMALL/XHz, lower bass frequencies below XHz will pass to the sub)
  • DIRECT/PURE DIRECT = no bass management so yes, FL/FR only (must set sub to LFE+MAIN if sub use desired with 2.0 content)

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post #2899 of 12271 Old 02-17-2013, 05:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AndersT2 View Post

Have a little "problem" with my controlling of the AV8801.

I use the Logitech Harmony Touch remote, and to get around the zones powering on, I used the advice in this thread to use cbl/sat button to power on in stead of the power on signal.
But when I'm starting my TV activity which uses the cbl/sat input, the AV8801 don't go to that input. So I manually have to switch the input to the correct one.

Tried to switch the power on to the ipod input. But the same result. The Logitech has the TV activety set to use the cbl/sat signal for signal input.

Any ideas?

When starting in other activetys it works great.


If you're certain that the watch TV activity program shows powering on the Marantz by using the cbl/sat button, then you need to reteach the cbl/sat button from the Marantz remote to the Harmony. Apparantly, the program code for that button is wrong.

Aren't Harmony remotes fun. smile.gif

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post #2900 of 12271 Old 02-17-2013, 07:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ettepet View Post

If you take a look at the pictures Marantz provides in their commercial presentation of the AV8801, you'll find one with 13 stacked circuit boards. I showed it to an electronics colleague of mine last week who identified it as an (the) input selector. He said this solution made it easy to switch out parts if people inadvertently blow up a port.

No matter what its purpose, Marantz is clearly showing it off as a selling aid: a nice (looking) array of electronic circuits. What caught my eye is that all these neatly stacked circuits are populated with Electrolytic capacitors, which are generally considered a big no-no anywhere in the signal path of a high-end audio device.

The presence of such cheap components, possibly aided by a long internal wiring path to get there, could easily be the main culprit of what you are experiencing: degradation of all pre-amplified signals no matter which input is used.

Most gear nowadays is packed with such capacitors, so few people will notice their effect because they have gotten used to it. Also other components in the chain and room acoustics are seldom good enough to identify a single device to have such traits. I'm sure these are important reasons I cannot clearly identify the signal degradation myself.

I could not have said it better myself. Speaking to a friend who is in biomedical, a capacitor is mainly used to stabilize voltage. I agree that this would not be useful in the signal path. I opened up my DHC 9.9 because I will have to replace some caps on the HDMI board that are failing and looked at the XLR paths. From what I could tell, I did not see that many on the board. Who knows, just my observation. In my opinion the Marantz is overpriced and the marketing material tries to justify this. Also the Integra has three transformers placed in the front of the chassis. Two of them iron plate core and the other toroidal. I am not a EE, so for what its worth.
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post #2901 of 12271 Old 02-17-2013, 07:22 AM
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^^^ sorry to burst your apparent Marantz bashing posts, but the proof is in how it sounds. And there are many on this thread including well known reviewers, EE's and a bunch of guys that IMO have some great technical knowledge, (not to meantion having an ear for detail) and have owned everything from A to Z in search of "the perfect sound" who will reject your jaded opinion of the 8801. Yes it has some bugs and yes there are and will be updates, but with the right remote I anticipate I can control a satellite in space while listening to IMO some very clean sound. What I really wanted say was piss off, but I won't.
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post #2902 of 12271 Old 02-17-2013, 07:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jr_spyder View Post

New guy here considering buying an 8801. Have skimmed a lot of this thread but not all 2800+ entries! I'm looking for input on the user experience of selecting and playing music files from a NAS. ...
Thanks,
JR

I'm using Synology iOS remote app, called DS Audio with the iTune-ish I/F which allows you to choose any net streamers
just click one of those hundreds of collection albums or songs within that album in my NAS


To my surprise, AV8801 stream & play DTS-ES music as well
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post #2903 of 12271 Old 02-17-2013, 07:35 AM
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I don't understand how anyone can look at a picture of the inside of a processor and conclude the use of capacitors is the cause of brightness in the sound that some report....

my opinion only...

please take the high road in every post
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post #2904 of 12271 Old 02-17-2013, 07:43 AM
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there is another IOS app that works well with the Marantz:

Sitecom Media Controller

http://www.sitecom.com/mobile/apple/imediacontrol/

I can bring up a music server (Olive 06HD) and select it to play on the 8801: it turns the 8801 on and switches to the network input and it plays

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if you see a problematic post, please do not quote it or respond to it: report it to the mods to handle
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post #2905 of 12271 Old 02-17-2013, 08:18 AM
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Originally Posted by comfynumb View Post

^^^ sorry to burst your apparent Marantz bashing posts, but the proof is in how it sounds. And there are many on this thread including well known reviewers, EE's and a bunch of guys that IMO have some great technical knowledge, (not to meantion having an ear for detail) and have owned everything from A to Z in search of "the perfect sound" who will reject your jaded opinion of the 8801. Yes it has some bugs and yes there are and will be updates, but with the right remote I anticipate I can control a satellite in space while listening to IMO some very clean sound. What I really wanted say was piss off, but I won't.

If you paid attention to the reviewers who frequented this topic their agreed opinion was that it performs well/best within its price range. I haven't managed to get my hands on a copy of Stereophile yet, but besides the praise of a properly setup Audyssey calibration using the Marantz I won't expect the reviewer to claim analogue (stereo/7.1) audio bliss with the Marantz in the audio chain. And that is not because of commercial reasons to artificially distinguish the upper market from such much cheaper devices. Compromises were made, stuff you can hear with good hearing using very good equipment under good circumstances.

The problem on forums as these is that many people lack the reference to excellence and become like mediocre salesmen who base most of their knowledge on comments and feedback from customers (in this case: fellow forum posters) instead of facts and their own experience. Add stubbornness or religious zeal and effectively you can feel censorship being forced upon you.

There is a huge gap between insanely overpriced audio components sold as high-end and the "all is alike (above a certain, not too expensive pricepoint)" attitude that many forum members seem to hold as guideline. I have listened to many audio setups, small scale shootouts under various conditions to know that all observation is relative to circumstances.

Few here can claim they got everything "perfect", or even close to that, so that leaves modesty in their claims and observations. Not a "piss off" atitude towards critique.
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post #2906 of 12271 Old 02-17-2013, 08:39 AM
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I don't understand how anyone can look at a picture of the inside of a processor and conclude the use of capacitors is the cause of brightness in the sound that some report....

my opinion only...

Are you an electronics engineer? Why, as a well respected forum member posts such remarks? Is there anything you base this upon, since it is posted as opinion and not a question.

By the way it was never "concluded", merely suggested, together with the remark that there should generally not be any Electrolytic capacitors in the signal path of a high-end audio device. I don't know if these capacitors are inside the signal chain (to avoid "popping"?). My 4 years education in electronics was not followed by decades of experience in the field, so I won't claim to know all as facts. I was just trying to help out, seemingly against the grain of some people who do know all.
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post #2907 of 12271 Old 02-17-2013, 08:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ettepet View Post

If you paid attention to the reviewers who frequented this topic their agreed opinion was that it performs well/best within its price range. I haven't managed to get my hands on a copy of Stereophile yet, but besides the praise of a properly setup Audyssey calibration using the Marantz I won't expect the reviewer to claim analogue (stereo/7.1) audio bliss with the Marantz in the audio chain. And that is not because of commercial reasons to artificially distinguish the upper market from such much cheaper devices. Compromises were made, stuff you can hear with good hearing using very good equipment under good circumstances.

The problem on forums as these is that many people lack the reference to excellence and become like mediocre salesmen who base most of their knowledge on comments and feedback from customers (in this case: fellow forum posters) instead of facts and their own experience. Add stubbornness or religious zeal and effectively you can feel censorship being forced upon you.

There is a huge gap between insanely overpriced audio components sold as high-end and the "all is alike (above a certain, not too expensive pricepoint)" attitude that many forum members seem to hold as guideline. I have listened to many audio setups, small scale shootouts under various conditions to know that all observation is relative to circumstances.

Few here can claim they got everything "perfect", or even close to that, so that leaves modesty in their claims and observations. Not a "piss off" atitude towards critique.



I heard the same "critique" about the 7005, that performed way over it's head. And having a biomed person claim that the 8801 is full of inferior parts IMO is absurd on his part. Who's claiming mediocracy? I own a 8801, that said I don't claim or portray to be a tech wizard, but the 8801 is anything but mediocre. IMO some can't stand the fact that the 7005 performed as good as "many" of their overpriced pre/pro's and they really despise that the mid priced 8801 took that performance to a whole new level.

By the way until a moderator or someone who I respect asks me to stop my posts, I'll post whatever I want.

Thanks,
John.
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Originally Posted by JimP View Post

If you're certain that the watch TV activity program shows powering on the Marantz by using the cbl/sat button, then you need to reteach the cbl/sat button from the Marantz remote to the Harmony. Apparantly, the program code for that button is wrong.

Aren't Harmony remotes fun. smile.gif

Yes, you have to teach the remote the input button...

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post #2909 of 12271 Old 02-17-2013, 08:44 AM
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We are all here to LEARN! Being overly sensitive to observations and criticism does not advance the discussion. Just because the sound of the 8801 was not for me does not make it a bad choice. As I mentioned in my observations, it sounds very detailed and I could hear things I never noticed before with my current Pre/Pro. I am very sensitive to "grain", and that might have gone away in time but did not want to gamble on that with a narrow return policy. There are many in this forum that enjoy their unit and that is what it is all about. This is a hobby after all, and with so many choices and possible combinations, there is no telling what is possible. The Integra line has its reliability issues as I would not be looking to replace my DHC 9.9 if the HDMI board was not failing. Again I am not an expert on gear and electronics but try to remain open and take the good with bad.

IMHO!!
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post #2910 of 12271 Old 02-17-2013, 08:53 AM
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Originally Posted by comfynumb View Post

I heard the same "critique" about the 7005, that performed way over it's head. And having a biomed person claim that the 8801 is full of inferior parts IMO is absurd on his part. Who's claiming mediocracy? I own a 8801, that said I don't claim or portray to be a tech wizard, but the 8801 is anything but mediocre. IMO some can't stand the fact that the 7005 performed as good as "many" of their overpriced pre/pro's and they really despise that the mid priced 8801 took that performance to a whole new level.

By the way until a moderator or someone who I respect asks me to stop my posts, I'll post whatever I want.

Thanks,
John.

Read the post again. Not inferior parts, Capacitors are used to regulate and stabilize voltage. No one is claiming inferior parts.
You need to put the coffee down and take a breath.
IMHO.
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