Can YOU hear the difference between amplifiers?? - AVS Forum
View Poll Results: Can you hear the difference between amplifiers?
1 - Absolutely 35 22.73%
2 - Generally Yes 47 30.52%
3 - Undecided... 15 9.74%
4 - Doubtful but perhaps 30 19.48%
5 - Absolutely Not 27 17.53%
Voters: 154. You may not vote on this poll

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post #1 of 433 Old 11-08-2012, 03:39 AM - Thread Starter
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Given they are competently designed, functioning and properly matched to a speaker's requirements.
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post #2 of 433 Old 11-09-2012, 07:48 AM
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I definitely heard an improvement going from Crown 402d to Parasound Halo A23. The difference was not subtle to say the least.
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post #3 of 433 Old 11-09-2012, 10:41 AM
 
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I recently have been commenting in a thread about this topic which has basically formed two camps in the audio world. This one I will sit out, but am offerring popcorn sales! I've got butter, Becel, or plain, with or without salt. All done the old school way over a hot stove with real oil, those with discerning palates can taste the difference!rolleyes.gif
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post #4 of 433 Old 11-10-2012, 06:31 AM - Thread Starter
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From my recent experience I purchased an Exposure amp to compare to a Bryston and a Behringer. The Exposure 2010S2 seems to have a warmth/haze. It makes my Harbeths sound very comfortable. Through the Bryston, the Harbeths sound a little hard.
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post #5 of 433 Old 11-10-2012, 11:25 AM
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Placebo is a very powerful effect, I honestly won't believe there's a true difference between 2 amps with the same measured power ratings unless someone was able to pass a blind test like this:

- The same sound clip is played 20 times randomly on both amps, 10 times on amp A and 10 times on amp B
- Volume played would be the same for both amps

If the person was able to tell accurately which amp is which during the 20 times the track was played, I'll believe there's a true difference between the sound produced, paying it a couple of times only isn't enough for accurate results.

I wish someone who has access to lots of power amps and pre-amps would be able to do something like that, it would be extremely helpful.
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post #6 of 433 Old 11-10-2012, 01:30 PM
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I can hear a difference.

To presume that YOU can, or cannot would be self-centered and arrogant.
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post #7 of 433 Old 11-10-2012, 01:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NorCalJason View Post

I can hear a difference.
To presume that YOU can, or cannot would be self-centered and arrogant.

...and lacking knowledge on what an amplifier is supposed to do...I'll help you out,... an amplifier is made for amplifying the incoming signal to a power level it was designed to. It does it in a linear manner. Not more, not less. An amplifier is only one part of the signal chain somewhere between the source input and the speakers, ...and the room,...and our ears + brain. In case one can hear a difference in the signal chain the least will it be the amplifier that changes the SQ (Sound Quality). If it does, ...it's broken. cool.giftongue.gifwink.gifbiggrin.gif
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post #8 of 433 Old 11-10-2012, 02:55 PM
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Then I guess what your saying is that I should sell my BAT VK-6200 and get the cheapest amp that puts out the same wattage since they're all the same?

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post #9 of 433 Old 11-10-2012, 03:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mankite View Post

Then I guess what your saying is that I should sell my BAT VK-6200 and get the cheapest amp that puts out the same wattage since they're all the same?

Nope, I would suggest you to buy a more expensive one that puts out the same wattage and then compare..cool.giftongue.gif

Fair enough, eh? smile.gif
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post #10 of 433 Old 11-10-2012, 03:17 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mogorf View Post

...and lacking knowledge on what an amplifier is supposed to do...I'll help you out,... an amplifier is made for amplifying the incoming signal to a power level it was designed to. It does it in a linear manner. Not more, not less. An amplifier is only one part of the signal chain somewhere between the source input and the speakers, ...and the room,...and our ears + brain. In case one can hear a difference in the signal chain the least will it be the amplifier that changes the SQ (Sound Quality). If it does, ...it's broken. cool.giftongue.gifwink.gifbiggrin.gif

Now you're presuming that he lacks knowledge on what an amp is supposed to do. Just because he comes to a different conclusion than you. Nice.
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post #11 of 433 Old 11-10-2012, 03:19 PM
 
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Originally Posted by mogorf View Post

Nope, I would suggest you to buy a more expensive one that puts out the same wattage and then compare..cool.giftongue.gif
Fair enough, eh? smile.gif

From your perspective, wouldn't a cheaper amp bring him to the same conclusion yet save him thousands? Why would you send a guy on a fool's errand?
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post #12 of 433 Old 11-10-2012, 03:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by runnin' View Post

From your perspective, wouldn't a cheaper amp bring him to the same conclusion yet save him thousands? Why would you send a guy on a fool's errand?

He asked for it! smile.gif
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post #13 of 433 Old 11-10-2012, 03:28 PM
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So by that logic two speakers that measure the same sound the same?

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post #14 of 433 Old 11-10-2012, 03:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mankite View Post

So by that logic two speakers that measure the same sound the same?

This thread is about amplifiers, so let's limit the dissussions to amps, no need to convey logic or divert the subject to matters out of the scope of this discussion. Agree? smile.gif

BTW, did you get the more expensive amps yet?
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post #15 of 433 Old 11-10-2012, 03:35 PM
 
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Originally Posted by mogorf View Post

He asked for it! smile.gif

I'd suggest not buying an expensive amp as you may become upset about it.
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post #16 of 433 Old 11-10-2012, 03:39 PM
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I just want to see how far you'll go with "your all the same opinion". I don't believe just because you can't pick something out in a blind test that there's no difference. You could blind fold me and take me for a ride in a Corvette and then a Mustang and I couldn't tell you which is which but they are certainly not the same. Human hearing is anything but a science.

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post #17 of 433 Old 11-10-2012, 03:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by runnin' View Post

I'd suggest not buying an expensive amp as you may become upset about it.

+1. tongue.giftongue.giftongue.gif
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post #18 of 433 Old 11-10-2012, 03:46 PM
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If you can't hear a difference in a blind test while an amp is $2000 more expensive than the other, why the hell would you buy it over the less expensive option when it comes to pure SQ?

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post #19 of 433 Old 11-10-2012, 03:53 PM
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I believe every amp I've owned sounded slightly different. When you have a dedicated listening room and know your system inside and out the slightest change is noticable. Does that suggest that amps make a bigger difference then the room, speakers, or processor for that matter. I do think you get less differences from switching amps but to suggest there is no difference is crazy. The guy I bought my BAT VK-6200 off of switched to a Sim Audio Titan. I heard both at his house and we both agree the Titan sounded more neutral. I guess we were both sipping the Koolaid. smile.gif

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post #20 of 433 Old 11-10-2012, 03:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mankite View Post

I just want to see how far you'll go with "your all the same opinion". I don't believe just because you can't pick something out in a blind test that there's no difference. You could blind fold me and take me for a ride in a Corvette and then a Mustang and I couldn't tell you which is which but they are certainly not the same. Human hearing is anything but a science.

The difference is in marketing, be it cars or amps, makes no difference. Being an engineer or a somewhat technically savvy man makes a big difference compared to biased opinions experienced here, there and everywhere spread by simple minds (aka enthusiasts). Sorry, no intention to hurt honest souls.

As reagrds human hearing, it is continuously under research,...and research,...and research. smile.gif
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post #21 of 433 Old 11-10-2012, 03:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mankite View Post

I just want to see how far you'll go with "your all the same opinion". I don't believe just because you can't pick something out in a blind test that there's no difference. You could blind fold me and take me for a ride in a Corvette and then a Mustang and I couldn't tell you which is which but they are certainly not the same. Human hearing is anything but a science.

a completely non-working analogy...

if you can't "pick it out" in a blind test, that should be telling you something...

you might be surprised at how much science there is...

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post #22 of 433 Old 11-10-2012, 04:01 PM
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Your far from hurting my feelings. Like I asked before and you didn't want to answer. If two speakers measure the same do they sound the same if both are in the same room with the same electronics? Enlighten me with your vast wisdom I beg of you. smile.gif

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post #23 of 433 Old 11-10-2012, 04:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mankite View Post

I believe every amp I've owned sounded slightly different. When you have a dedicated listening room and know your system inside and out the slightest change is noticable. Does that suggest that amps make a bigger difference then the room, speakers, or processor for that matter. I do think you get less differences from switching amps but to suggest there is no difference is crazy. The guy I bought my BAT VK-6200 off of switched to a Sim Audio Titan. I heard both at his house and we both agree the Titan sounded more neutral. I guess we were both sipping the Koolaid. smile.gif

Please, ...don't say it needs Koolaid to hear the difference. Yet, when you say switching amps resulted in a sound more neutral I get lost in the discussion, coz I have no idea what that means. Can only think of placebo maybe?
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post #24 of 433 Old 11-10-2012, 04:05 PM - Thread Starter
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Guys, could we keep this on amplifiers please? Speakers obviously sound different! My left one and right one are always playing different sounds! Ha ha ha! No, really, if we could keep it to amplifiers it would be appreciated.
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post #25 of 433 Old 11-10-2012, 04:07 PM
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Next you'll be telling me that sex with a woman is the same no matter which woman it is because the end result is always identical. I've found the experience differs with the woman. HaHa, I win!smile.gif
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post #26 of 433 Old 11-10-2012, 04:16 PM
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http://www.matrixhifi.com/contenedor_ppec_eng.htm


The results showed:

38 persons participated on this test
14 chose the "A" system as the best sounding one
10 chose the "B" system as the best sounding one
14 were not able to hear differences or didn't choose any as the best.


http://www.tom-morrow-land.com/tests/ampchall/index.htm
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post #27 of 433 Old 11-10-2012, 05:01 PM
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Just because something is more expensive doesn't mean it's better. I've demoed a lot of speakers and have hated systems that cost over $200,000.

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post #28 of 433 Old 11-10-2012, 05:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Knucklehead90 View Post

http://www.matrixhifi.com/contenedor_ppec_eng.htm
The results showed:

38 persons participated on this test
14 chose the "A" system as the best sounding one
10 chose the "B" system as the best sounding one
14 were not able to hear differences or didn't choose any as the best.

http://www.tom-morrow-land.com/tests/ampchall/index.htm

Thank you, this proves my point.

24 of 38 people were able to hear a difference.

The title of this thread is "can you hear the difference between amplifiers"

My response was: "I can. Maybe you can, or maybe you can't."

wink.gif
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post #29 of 433 Old 11-10-2012, 05:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mankite View Post

Just because something is more expensive doesn't mean it's better. I've demoed a lot of speakers and have hated systems that cost over $200,000.

Same thing goes for wine. I've tasted some very 'special' wine I don't care for, at $350+ a bottle.
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post #30 of 433 Old 11-10-2012, 05:23 PM
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My biggest question is if you feel this hobby is a religion with no scientific evidence to prove what we feel or hear by changing gear then why he a member here and go out of your way to sway us? Why do you need us to believe what you believe so bad?

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