Pioneer SC-1222-K Anyone? - Page 4 - AVS Forum
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post #91 of 386 Old 01-18-2013, 10:15 AM
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Hey 1222 owners.

Have any of you had a 1021 or something similar? I am thinking of upgrading to the 1222 since it looks amazing with the Class D. However I got the 1021 not even a year ago.. Worth it?
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post #92 of 386 Old 01-18-2013, 10:19 AM
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It's important to note that there is an exhaust fan on the left side of the 1222 if you're looking at its (quality plastic) face plate. The top of my unit is VERY cool compared to many other receivers I've owned, but the low RPM extremely quiet exhaust fan does pull some heat out. Not a ton, but its worth mentioning if you're going to put this receiver in any kind of a tight fitting case.

In general I am very happy I purchased this receiver! I admit, I was a little leery of the low price. I demand quality from my electronics and would rather have nothing while I wait to find a good receiver, rather than settle on an inferior product. I was prepared to spend more on a unit that I wouldn't outgrow anytime soon such as the Onkyo 3009/3010. I'm glad I let the spec sheet comparison weigh as heavily as I did on my decision. After owning the 1222 for about 4 months now, I'm very happy! No disclaimers necessary, such as "for the price".

-Mike
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post #93 of 386 Old 01-18-2013, 10:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mingus Ah Um View Post

So far I really like the receiver, however it is not nearly as easy to set up as the onkyo in my opinion. The menu's aren't nearly as intuitive and I really dislike the remote. I think these are minor things that I will get used to with time. Two problems I'm having though is programing the remote to control my bd player and satellite receiver.

Even if you can programme it, you're still gonna need the other remotes for various other settings. I've decided to just get a universal remote e.g. Logitech Harmony has good reviews. Also, it'll make everything a lot easier to use at night as well.
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post #94 of 386 Old 01-18-2013, 01:00 PM
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Originally Posted by Russianblue View Post

Mingus, i concur with your assessment of the CD player switch. in general, the Pioneer's 'transitional performance' could have been a bit better thought out. when i auditioned the onkyo 818, i noticed the user interface definitely being more polished, not only aesthetically, but also in terms of one's ability to adjust video and sound parameters while not interrupting current programming etc.

the sound though. the sound the sound the sound. i keep coming back to it. i don't care HOW smooth that onkyo interface was......i was not gonna trade the audio performance. it was a STARK difference in my opinion.

Absolutely agree. The sound is what is making me look past a few of these 'quirks' I wasn't expecting. I can live without watching baseball while I listen to my music. I'm sure I will end up getting one of the logitech remotes. I don't think the pioneer remote is worth the hassle. Overall I'm very happy with the purchase. I was quite distraught when my onkyo crapped out last week but this puts a whole new smile on my face. So in the end, maybe my onkyo was a good thing!
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post #95 of 386 Old 01-18-2013, 01:45 PM
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Originally Posted by okibcn View Post

Do not worry about heat, this amplifier has the best value. Interface is ugly and the setup is not nice, but very easy. The nice interface is in the app for iPad. It is a pleasure to deal with it. Anyway the Pandora setup can not be done with this app.

I'm still having problems with Pandora, even after upgrading to the latest firmware using USB I'm still unable to connect it to my account. Are you having the same issue?

Regards

Oki
No issues with Pandora after firmware upgrade. Keep in mind that you have to log on Pandora using the Remote control under the Receiver's GUI (Do not use the ipad application); and second is CASE SENSITIVE!... My password is all lower case; and by default on the Pioneer the letters when you scroll starts uppercase!. My login failed 3 times; when I decided to use lowercase then problem solved!!.. its a pain getting each letter because you have to scroll a lot!!!; but after that; piece of cake!.... After setting up your account on the receiver then you can use Pandora on the Ipad App; really AWESOME!.....
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post #96 of 386 Old 01-18-2013, 04:21 PM
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Newegg lowered the price to $550, so I couldn't resist ordering one. Amazon had the SC-61 for $750, and I was very tempted to order it just for the build quality, but Pioneer apparently doesn't warranty elite products sold online, which sucks.

I'll post back with my thoughts when I get it. I live one state over from Newegg's warehouse, so I should get it Monday. Can't wait smile.gif

-Jeff
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post #97 of 386 Old 01-18-2013, 04:55 PM
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Both are at excllent price. The 1222 is exactly the same as the sc61; except it does not have the elite logo, amber disply, blue rounded lit on power button and 12v trigger and I believe the front chassis is brushed black metal while 1222 is brushed black plastic. Internally use the same components, same wattage, same everything. Honestly I prefer the grey/white display than amber/orange, but the blue lit on power button is sweet.
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post #98 of 386 Old 01-19-2013, 04:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by javygonx View Post

No issues with Pandora after firmware upgrade. Keep in mind that you have to log on Pandora using the Remote control under the Receiver's GUI (Do not use the ipad application); and second is CASE SENSITIVE!... My password is all lower case; and by default on the Pioneer the letters when you scroll starts to uppercase!. My login failed 3 times; when I decided to use lowercase then problem solved!!.. its a pain getting each letter because you have to scroll a lot!!!; but after that; piece of cake!.... After setting up your account on the receiver then you can use Pandora on the Ipad App; really AWESOME!.....
Thanks! Finally I could listen to Pandora! The audio quality is awesome for a free service. Much better than any average online radio. Pioneer should work a little bit on the user interface.

I love this receiver, superior tecnology, superior sound.

Thanks

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post #99 of 386 Old 01-19-2013, 10:33 PM
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Originally Posted by okibcn View Post

I love this receiver, superior tecnology, superior sound.

Thanks
Totally agreed. Bye bye Audessey and AB Amps biggrin.gif
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post #100 of 386 Old 01-21-2013, 06:20 AM
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Currently have an Onkyo 809, its not that old and so far its working fine, but the history of HDMI issues and Onkyos lack of customer service are a little scary.

Has anyone replaced a newer Onkyo with this 1222-K? The Newegg price is really tempting, but I think Ill miss the nice OSD the Onkyo has, and I might actually have to change furniture (the Onkyo is tight side to side right now, and I know the Pio has a fan on the left side). Wondering if its worth the extra 100 or so to return the Onkyo and get the 1222.

Sound-wise Im satisfied with the Onkyo (granted, havent used it a ton since I got it), it would strictly be an "upgrade" for reliability (its nice that the Pio puts out more power when fully driven, but my speakers are efficient enough its not a HUGE selling point)

EDIT: one more thing - I noticed the Pioneer only has a single global xover value. My rear surround speakers are tiny little cubes (NOT Bose, FWIW smile.gif ), so they probably cant handle an 80Hz xover value. Would I really have to set every single speaker to a high value? (Right now Audyssey picks up 150Hz for those little cubes) I cant see setting everything for 150 and it actually sounding nice.

Thanks in advance.

-Chris
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post #101 of 386 Old 01-21-2013, 08:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisexv6 View Post

EDIT: one more thing - I noticed the Pioneer only has a single global xover value. My rear surround speakers are tiny little cubes (NOT Bose, FWIW smile.gif ), so they probably cant handle an 80Hz xover value. Would I really have to set every single speaker to a high value? (Right now Audyssey picks up 150Hz for those little cubes) I cant see setting everything for 150 and it actually sounding nice.

Thanks in advance.

-Chris

Unfortunately, that's true. Keep n mind that on;y speakers set to "small" will send the bass below the xover to the sub. If you have speakers capable to handle good bass you can always set them to "large" and the small speakers to "small". . . The quality of the sound will depend much more on the quality of the sub. With a very good sub, setting everything to small and xover to 150 could be the best option but we are now talking about high-end stuff.

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post #102 of 386 Old 01-21-2013, 08:14 AM
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Hi Chris. That is true. You will lose the OSD; pretty sadly yes the xover is a global value (50hz, 80hz, 100hz, 150hz, 200hz). Its weird this xover jumps from 100 to 150 but that is Pioneers philosphy. Pioneer engineer claims that having xover for each speakers can cause sync issues and other things that I cant remembered right now.

My recommendation is if you want this receiver try to replace your surrounds. I use Polk Rti4 as surrounds and can handle 60hz, but I setup my crossover at 100hz and is amazing. I consider my equipment sound better with 100hz than 80hz crossover setting.

Onkyo 809 is a very nice and good receiver. I own Onkyos in the past and for their price they aare powerful, cool features and nice audio (bit harsh though). But I honestly can say this Pioneer 1222 is at other level in SQ. Much better than my previous Onkyos and better than my Denon 3311.

At first I was skeptical with mcacc vs audessey and my ears was in like "audessey mode" lol. But after a week I can honestly say that advanced mcacc is better than audessey xt or lesser. Cant say about audessey xt32. Of course probably you will need to perform so tweaks after calibration like for example if you want a deeper bass, or more highs. But it is possible. Is not like audessey that you cant do nothing after cal.

Also thsvPioneer has lots of audio feautures and the video upscalong is awesome. My onkyo 515 has the same video upscaling chipset as the Pioneer 1222 but for some unknown reason the pioneer scales better and have more video options. I test it on Netflix both receivers and Pioneer wins by miles.
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post #103 of 386 Old 01-21-2013, 09:25 AM
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Originally Posted by slimoli View Post

Unfortunately, that's true. Keep n mind that on;y speakers set to "small" will send the bass below the xover to the sub. If you have speakers capable to handle good bass you can always set them to "large" and the small speakers to "small". . . The quality of the sound will depend much more on the quality of the sub. With a very good sub, setting everything to small and xover to 150 could be the best option but we are now talking about high-end stuff.

Thanks, didnt think of that but not sure how easy it will be to find a good quality sub that can do 150Hz. 120, maybe, 150 I dont know. Which leads me to another question - does the global xover control the LFE signal too? From what I read in the manual I *think* it does. An 80Hz LFE xover seems too low, no?
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Originally Posted by javygonx View Post

Hi Chris. That is true. You will lose the OSD; pretty sadly yes the xover is a global value (50hz, 80hz, 100hz, 150hz, 200hz). Its weird this xover jumps from 100 to 150 but that is Pioneers philosphy. Pioneer engineer claims that having xover for each speakers can cause sync issues and other things that I cant remembered right now.

My recommendation is if you want this receiver try to replace your surrounds. I use Polk Rti4 as surrounds and can handle 60hz, but I setup my crossover at 100hz and is amazing. I consider my equipment sound better with 100hz than 80hz crossover setting.

Onkyo 809 is a very nice and good receiver. I own Onkyos in the past and for their price they aare powerful, cool features and nice audio (bit harsh though). But I honestly can say this Pioneer 1222 is at other level in SQ. Much better than my previous Onkyos and better than my Denon 3311.

At first I was skeptical with mcacc vs audessey and my ears was in like "audessey mode" lol. But after a week I can honestly say that advanced mcacc is better than audessey xt or lesser. Cant say about audessey xt32. Of course probably you will need to perform so tweaks after calibration like for example if you want a deeper bass, or more highs. But it is possible. Is not like audessey that you cant do nothing after cal.

Also thsvPioneer has lots of audio feautures and the video upscalong is awesome. My onkyo 515 has the same video upscaling chipset as the Pioneer 1222 but for some unknown reason the pioneer scales better and have more video options. I test it on Netflix both receivers and Pioneer wins by miles.

Thanks for the info. Unfortunately replacing the surrounds is out of the question - WAF of the current surrounds is high, anything else would be low. Since they are just rear surrounds its not a huge deal to me. I just wanted to make sure a global xover setting wont blow them up. Audyssey crosses them over at 150Hz right now, my fronts will be capable of 80Hz easily but not much lower (they will be DIY bookshelves, not floorstanders). Id hate to set my fronts to 150 just because of the rear surrounds. On the flipside Id hate to set everything to 80 and blow the rear surrounds.

Tough decision....I think the Pioneer will ultimately end up more reliable (just a WAG at this point though), and I dont it might have better sound quality, but the whole global xover thing is throwing me for a loop right now.
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post #104 of 386 Old 01-21-2013, 09:31 AM
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I believe Epik Legend subs can handle up to 250hz. And is a great sub.
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post #105 of 386 Old 01-21-2013, 09:38 AM
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Another question - not sure if anyone knows but figured Id ask: why is this model being sold for such a low price?

From what I can see it was introduced in June of '12 so its still a mostly current model (not like the Onkyo 809 which is over a year old at this point I think)

Newegg seems to have it at this price VERY often....just Google slickdeals newegg sc-1222. Looks like every month since sept its been at this low price, or something close to it. If it was introduced in June and priced so low starting in September, is there something up with it?

Seems very odd to me that it would be cleared out that low so quickly.
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post #106 of 386 Old 01-21-2013, 09:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisexv6 View Post

Another question - not sure if anyone knows but figured Id ask: why is this model being sold for such a low price?

From what I can see it was introduced in June of '12 so its still a mostly current model (not like the Onkyo 809 which is over a year old at this point I think)

Newegg seems to have it at this price VERY often....just Google slickdeals newegg sc-1222. Looks like every month since sept its been at this low price, or something close to it. If it was introduced in June and priced so low starting in September, is there something up with it?

Seems very odd to me that it would be cleared out that low so quickly.

The SC-1222 original price is $1,100 dollars. At this price there are many other AVR's that offer more options. I was thinking of buying it, but I also want to add an external amp. I decided not to buy it due to not having 12V triggers. I'm probably going to go with Denon or Manratz waiting on tax returns biggrin.gif

However, it is a nice AVR for the $549.99 price.

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post #107 of 386 Old 01-21-2013, 10:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GusGus748s View Post

The SC-1222 original price is $1,100 dollars. At this price there are many other AVR's that offer more options. I was thinking of buying it, but I also want to add an external amp. I decided not to buy it due to not having 12V triggers. I'm probably going to go with Denon or Manratz waiting on tax returns biggrin.gif

However, it is a nice AVR for the $549.99 price.

Agreed. I wouldnt pay $1100 for it (granted, I wouldnt pay 1100 for ANY avr, its just not in the budget). I would think there is a way to workaround the lack of trigger, but Im not sure. While Im not planning on adding external amp(s) right now, it would be a nice feature to have in the future (I dont replace my gear every 2 or 3 years....the Onkyo and/or this Pio are a replacement for a 10 yr old Kenwood!)

The Onkyo cost 450, the Pio is 550. The 100.00 is not overly important if Im gaining something more reliable. Hard to find that out for sure since the Pio is still fairly new and hard to find reviews on.
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post #108 of 386 Old 01-21-2013, 10:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisexv6 View Post

. Which leads me to another question - does the global xover control the LFE signal too? From what I read in the manual I *think* it does. An 80Hz LFE xover seems too low, no?
.

The LFE is a separate channel and will be output "as is" through the sub pre-out to the sub. Won't be affected by the xover. As you probably know, there are many media without the presence of the LFE channel and most bass you hear is normally derived from the regular channels.

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post #109 of 386 Old 01-21-2013, 12:29 PM
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Originally Posted by chrisexv6 View Post

Agreed. I wouldnt pay $1100 for it (granted, I wouldnt pay 1100 for ANY avr, its just not in the budget). I would think there is a way to workaround the lack of trigger, but Im not sure. While Im not planning on adding external amp(s) right now, it would be a nice feature to have in the future (I dont replace my gear every 2 or 3 years....the Onkyo and/or this Pio are a replacement for a 10 yr old Kenwood!)

The Onkyo cost 450, the Pio is 550. The 100.00 is not overly important if Im gaining something more reliable. Hard to find that out for sure since the Pio is still fairly new and hard to find reviews on.
Maybe I am still too excited with the toy since I installed it 2 weeks ago, but the sound quality is way better than any other AB amplifier, and a lot better than the previous ICE series. If you are able to compare Yamaha, Denon and Onkyo against the new Pioneer D3 class amplifiers, you will notice the huuuge difference between the entry level D3 unit against any mid level AB amp.

Regarding the price, it is the entry model of the top D3 class, and the first months are always at the MSRP in authorized dealers and soon the price go down ONLY in surplus and auction markets like those internet stores. The authorized dealers are then forced to slightly reduce the price. Same happens with TV, even the Top 8000 Series TV from Samsung dropped the price from the MSRP of $3700 to $1846, and it is one of the best TVs out there. Do not be fooled about suspecting problems with a product just because you can find it at a very low price in just a couple of internet stores.

Regards

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post #110 of 386 Old 01-21-2013, 12:41 PM
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I wish I could somehow compare them. I can get an SC-61 from the local best buy, but its pretty darn expensive and will come with a restock fee. Same goes for the 1222-K since its only available from Newegg for the decent price. Newegg returns kinda stink, so it would be a "point of no return" purchase pretty much.
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post #111 of 386 Old 01-22-2013, 04:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisexv6 View Post

I wish I could somehow compare them. I can get an SC-61 from the local best buy, but its pretty darn expensive and will come with a restock fee. Same goes for the 1222-K since its only available from Newegg for the decent price. Newegg returns kinda stink, so it would be a "point of no return" purchase pretty much.



They are almost the sreceiverever minus nameplate, cosmetics, 4k video. Go and listen to sc-61 and see if you like the sound. If you think it is worth the extra $ for 4k and the other small differences, take it home with you. You will get warranty if purchased at Best Buy. I did just this, and bought the 1222 from Newegg. biggrin.gif
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post #112 of 386 Old 01-22-2013, 05:55 AM
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I am afraid that Sc-61 does not have 4k passthrough. The only single difference from the sc-1222 is the IP control.

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post #113 of 386 Old 01-22-2013, 08:09 AM
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Originally Posted by okibcn View Post

I am afraid that Sc-61 does not have 4k passthrough. The only single difference from the sc-1222 is the IP control.

Regards

Sc-1222 has IP control; so I believe that SC-61 should have it too. About 4k it depends. My onkyo 515 has 4k but it does not works if your display do not support 4k. And second; I prefer to lose the 4k from 1222 with the excellent audio quality from Pioneer.
Its really an awesome receiver; I consider better than my Denon 3311CI....
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post #114 of 386 Old 01-22-2013, 08:40 AM
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Price jumped back up to full MSRP last night, now back down to 599 (but was even lower at 549 before)

Holding off for now. The Onkyo works fine currently and I would hate to lose the nice OSD. I guess worst case is if the Onkyo dies a year or two from now, Ive learned my lesson.
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post #115 of 386 Old 01-22-2013, 08:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisexv6 View Post

Price jumped back up to full MSRP last night, now back down to 599 (but was even lower at 549 before)

Holding off for now. The Onkyo works fine currently and I would hate to lose the nice OSD. I guess worst case is if the Onkyo dies a year or two from now, Ive learned my lesson.

Lol.. The Onkyo should last bit longer than that! smile.gif Thats the bad thing from Newegg; keeps changing prices. But I believe if you check price regularly they will put it back to $550. I payed $599 + $78 shipping! OUCH!!!
The OSD is another thing that Pioneer should fix, Many people complain about the remote; but you have to understand it. Its not that bad; also the iphone app helps is awesome too so you probably dont need a remote or OSD.
Also you can create your own app to manage the receiver.... Im working on that now for iphone.. Lets see how it goes...
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post #116 of 386 Old 01-22-2013, 09:58 AM
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Yeah the Onkyo SHOULD last longer than that. It just seems there is a lot more doom and gloom about possible HDMI issues, etc.

The funny thing is its hard to tell exactly if the 809 is actually prone to the same issues as previous models. Its clear the x08 and earlier had problems, but not quite as clear about the x09 and x17/18 models.

The 809 is "old" at this point, but really need to see what happens after they are 3 or 4 years old. Some of the earlier models lasted that long too before they died so it remains to be seen if the x09 lasts the same, longer, or shorter.

Im very surprised Pioneer doesn't improve the OSD, but it seems like the higher end Elite models might have a slightly better one than the lower Elite/1222-K. I guess they want to reserve it to spend extra $$$, but having two different OSDs doesnt make sense to me, seems like it would cost them more to have it that way than to just give every model the same one.

As far as apps go, Im not sure if I can develop one for the Onkyo. They have their own Android and iOS apps, so they did it somehow, just not sure how "open" the API is. From what I hear about the Pioneer app, Im not sure you would even need to write another one....every review Ive seen about it said its that good.

And as much as I like Audyssey I think I would actually like MCACC more. Might take a bit to get used to and "tweaked" just right, but it seems more powerful.
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post #117 of 386 Old 01-22-2013, 10:02 AM
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Pioneer SC-1222-K = $549. Grab while you can!
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post #118 of 386 Old 01-22-2013, 10:21 AM
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Hehe that didnt take long for it to come back down again.

The dilemma returns!
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post #119 of 386 Old 01-22-2013, 11:06 AM
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Actually an issue I found: the shelf Im putting it on is only about 1" wider than the whole unit, that leaves not much space for the fan to vent.

Might have to give up on the idea....the only other thing I could think of is "ducting" the fan from the side to the rear. Seems like too much work to replace a unit that seems to be working fine so far.
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post #120 of 386 Old 01-22-2013, 11:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seriousjack85 View Post

Pioneer SC-1222-K = $549. Grab while you can!

How does this reciever compare to something like the Marantz SR5007. That is the other one I was giving a hard look at? Or possibly the Denon 3313/3312? I need something with pre-outs. Can someone help me understand if getting this for 549 is worth it or would my money be better spent on a 5007 or something a little better. Thoughts?
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