Owners Thread Cambridge Audio 651r/751r - Page 13 - AVS Forum
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post #361 of 640 Old 10-13-2013, 02:27 PM
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Originally Posted by MSHAVS View Post

Hello "751r/651r" owners,

it took a lot of reading through the whole Owners-Thread to decide whether or not go for a CA AVR. But the more I read the more I got excited !! I was owner of a Onkyo TX-NR5008 which could not be repaired. Luckily for me it was still covered by the warranty and I got my money back (well, not the money, but I can select a new AVR through the shop for the same amount). At first I had no real clue which direction to go since I liked the 5008 quite a lot (it had a very good power-supply and a high grade audio section) . Most of the time I use the AVR for Stereo (via Pure Direct mode - I am still a vinyl-player), but I would like to have a decent sound for movies too. A direct replacement from Onkyo (5009 or 5010) are too expensive TMHO, so I was looking for other brands as well. I was almost ready to decide on the Marantz SR7008, but I was hesitant for some reason. I think the SR7008 is a good AVR for the money, but since I did not use the Onkyo that much for all surround features (audyssey is not my taste; I tried it several times, but every time I switched it off again) I was not convinced it is the right AVR for me. I was looking around on the Internet for other possibilities and ran into this Thread. Although I was already aware for the Cambridge brand as a good audio company it not on my list of AVRs.

I have decided to go for the 651r since the prize for the 751r is way off for me. The USB-port is quite nice, but I am not using this -yet- and the number of digital coax and optical ports is enough for me. I expect to receive the AVR somewhere this week. I hope the Firmware is up-to-date, because I want to use the bi-amp possibility i.c.w. the analogue direct mode. If not perhaps it can be updated by the shop or else I hope to be able to do so myself (and hopefully I can receive the FW-files from one for the forum-readers?). Although I have read all of the posts I can't remember if somebody has used a USB-to-RS232 converter i.c.w. a null-modem cable for this? My PCs don't have a RS232 port anymore.

Thank to you guys for all descriptions and true opinions about the CA AVRs. I hope it'll become reality for me too (I expect it will). After I have received and setup my 651r I will let you know my experiences.

Welcome to the club. You may not make alot of friends outside of our circle, but you will soon know our little secret. Do not get discouraged at first. The 651 is a beast, but comes with a bit of quirkeyness. It takes an honest month for it to really start to sing. Hang in there and take BH123's advise on the setup and enjoy. If you have a problem or question, we will help you through it. I used my laptop's USB adapted to a null modem cable for the FW upgrade. Also works with WINDOWS 8. The original FW download instructions have errors so when you get ready, let us know. Also bi-amping is a waste of speaker wire, dont bother.
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post #362 of 640 Old 10-13-2013, 03:48 PM
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Originally Posted by MSHAVS View Post

Hello "751r/651r" owners,
I have decided to go for the 651r since the prize for the 751r is way off for me. The USB-port is quite nice, but I am not using this -yet- and the number of digital coax and optical ports is enough for me.
That's not all. Imho the nicest feature that distinguished the 751R from the 651R is upsampling all material to 24 Bit / 192 kHz . Beside the 651R I have the 752BD Player which also scales up to 24/192 (maybe with a worse processor than the 751) and it makes a difference to normal 16bit / 44,1 kHz CDs.
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post #363 of 640 Old 10-13-2013, 04:21 PM
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Just find out, that CA is on the AVS Forum. Maybe it's interesting for writing them PMs...
http://www.avsforum.com/u/8413611/cambridge-audio
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post #364 of 640 Old 10-13-2013, 04:22 PM
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That's not all. Imho the nicest feature that distinguished the 751R from the 651R is upsampling all material to 24 Bit / 192 kHz . Beside the 651R I have the 752BD Player which also scales up to 24/192 (maybe with a worse processor than the 751) and it makes a difference to normal 16bit / 44,1 kHz CDs.

I too am impressed with the 752's SQ. For CD playback I decode in the 752 and send analog to my 751. This way I dont have to deal with that digital blip at the begining of every song. As far as a differance, the upsampling in the 752 sounds the same as the 751's upsampling. My opinion is that the 651/751s are better suited for analog inputs for music. The 752BD and the 651/751 are perfect mates. I'm even considering sending my minidisc players digital signal to the 752 to get the upsampling.
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post #365 of 640 Old 10-14-2013, 03:28 PM
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Just find out, that CA is on the AVS Forum. Maybe it's interesting for writing them PMs...
http://www.avsforum.com/u/8413611/cambridge-audio


Maybe CA secretly lurks this site for insider info. Lets create a list of wishful upgrades we would like to see happen to the 651/751. Who knows, maybe they will see it. Ill start.

1. Fix that nasty blip at the begining of songs during digital playback.
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post #366 of 640 Old 10-14-2013, 11:00 PM
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Originally Posted by mike47 View Post

1. Fix that nasty blip at the begining of songs during digital playback.

Amen. If anyone cares how my situation came out - i was prepared to run the music through analog but then noticed the same problem on a game via ps3, and there's no way I'm running analog sound for that.

It seems as soon as there's a bit of silence my 751r forgets the codec and refreshes itself. Blast, because the SQ was stellar. Oh well!
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post #367 of 640 Old 10-15-2013, 01:03 AM
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Originally Posted by gcby30 View Post

Amen. If anyone cares how my situation came out - i was prepared to run the music through analog but then noticed the same problem on a game via ps3, and there's no way I'm running analog sound for that.

It seems as soon as there's a bit of silence my 751r forgets the codec and refreshes itself. Blast, because the SQ was stellar. Oh well!

Do your children NEED the game console connected to the AVR?

Most parents just use the TV speakers to avoid more complications. Kids usually don't care that much.

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post #368 of 640 Old 10-15-2013, 04:36 AM
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Originally Posted by gcby30 View Post

Amen. If anyone cares how my situation came out - i was prepared to run the music through analog but then noticed the same problem on a game via ps3, and there's no way I'm running analog sound for that.
It seems as soon as there's a bit of silence my 751r forgets the codec and refreshes itself. Blast, because the SQ was stellar. Oh well!

Do you own the 752BD also? Then you can connect the PS3 to it and use the 752BD to upsample and convert to analog. Or you buy an old DAC at ebay... http://www.ebay.com/itm/Cambridge-Audio-Azur-DacMagic-D-A-converter-/300989561775?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4614603baf
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post #369 of 640 Old 10-15-2013, 10:48 AM
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What children?

To nojindij - thanks, the Cambridge folks also recommended that, but buying more Cambridge gear to fix the existing Cambridge gear...haven't got the stomach for it! smile.gif
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post #370 of 640 Old 10-15-2013, 04:13 PM
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Originally Posted by mike47 View Post


1. Fix that nasty blip at the begining of songs during digital playback.
2. Display volume scale on TV when playing CDs
3. IOS and Android remote control for the 752BD and if possible for the 651R/751R too
4. Firmware updates for everyone via USB stick
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post #371 of 640 Old 10-15-2013, 06:45 PM
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I was wondering what the trim settings in the speaker config. do. Ive been running my settings on my front speakers at "10". If I turn the trim down to "0", then I have to turn the volume up almost to 0db to listen loud. My speakers have a 89db rating, and require lots of power. Everythings fine with the trim set at "10" but I wonder what the trim actually changes.

Holy Bajesus! My 651r is loud as a mofo at -40db! Those speaks you have must be the least sensitive speakers ever :O!

And yes, I do like my music loud & clear - check out my car install wink.gif

http://youtu.be/fERBCnXNWl4
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post #372 of 640 Old 10-16-2013, 02:08 AM
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Originally Posted by nojindij View Post

That's not all. Imho the nicest feature that distinguished the 751R from the 651R is upsampling all material to 24 Bit / 192 kHz . Beside the 651R I have the 752BD Player which also scales up to 24/192 (maybe with a worse processor than the 751) and it makes a difference to normal 16bit / 44,1 kHz CDs.

up scaling on 751/752BD players is amazing! great feature, I didnt hear that quallity on other vendors. CA rocks in this part!
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post #373 of 640 Old 10-16-2013, 09:16 AM
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Originally Posted by KLoNe View Post

Holy Bajesus! My 651r is loud as a mofo at -40db! Those speaks you have must be the least sensitive speakers ever :O!

And yes, I do like my music loud & clear - check out my car install wink.gif

http://youtu.be/fERBCnXNWl4


89db with a 300w rating. At -40db, they are only whispering. I learned that lesson the hard way. from now on I wont buy a speaker with less that 93db sens.
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post #374 of 640 Old 10-16-2013, 10:22 AM
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89db with a 300w rating. At -40db, they are only whispering. I learned that lesson the hard way. from now on I wont buy a speaker with less that 93db sens.

What are your trim levels in the avr now?

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The best EQ is no EQ ...

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post #375 of 640 Old 10-16-2013, 10:53 AM
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What are your trim levels in the avr now?

+5 on the fronts and +3 on the rest.
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post #376 of 640 Old 10-16-2013, 12:13 PM
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+5 on the fronts and +3 on the rest.

Where do you end up on master volume with those trim levels?

History is written by those who have hanged heroes ...

The best EQ is no EQ ...

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Main System: Klipsch RF-82 II, Klipsch RC-62 II, RS-52 II, Onkyo 5010, Rythmik FV15HP, PSB S300
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post #377 of 640 Old 10-16-2013, 03:46 PM
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Originally Posted by mike47 View Post

89db with a 300w rating. At -40db, they are only whispering. I learned that lesson the hard way. from now on I wont buy a speaker with less that 93db sens.

There must be something wrong with your settings... or the receiver. My speakers have 88 db / 300W. Moderate room volume is at -50 db with (direct,analog) stereo. At -10db I have to leave the room because it's to loud....
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post #378 of 640 Old 10-16-2013, 04:08 PM
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There must be something wrong with your settings... or the receiver. My speakers have 88 db / 300W. Moderate room volume is at -50 db with (direct,analog) stereo. At -10db I have to leave the room because it's to loud....

I dont know of any more settings. When I want to really listen loud, The master volume is in the -10 to 0 range. When I say "loud", I mean concert level loud. If I turn off the dynamic eq, and dynamic vol. off, it will play louder just dont sound too good. I have to admit, the as the speakers are breaking in, they are getting louder and more powerful. BTW the 651 that I had before the 751 was the same way. My old Infinity speakers have 93db sens and they top out at around -20db on the master vol. I think these speakers need more time, Polk says 80-100hrs.
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post #379 of 640 Old 10-17-2013, 02:29 PM
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Polk says 80-100hrs.
Polk Audio RTI A7? Why do you buy speakers for about 1/5 the price of the 651R? It is much more fun if the speakers are better then the receiver instead of the other way around.
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post #380 of 640 Old 10-17-2013, 04:05 PM
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Polk Audio RTI A7? Why do you buy speakers for about 1/5 the price of the 651R? It is much more fun if the speakers are better then the receiver instead of the other way around.

When I started this new home theater upgrade I wanted to spend the same amount on the speakers as I did the receiver. The 651 that I bought was $1799.00 and the Polks were $1800 for the 5 speaker setup, 2 RTi A7s - 2 RTi A3s - and 1 CSi A6. At 1/5 the price, that would put the 651 at $9000! Did you give $9000 for your 651?
These speakers sound absolutly wonderful to me and I am very satisfied with the SQ and there is no distortion. They just require lots of power to drive hard. My receiver can handle them, just at high volume settings. But no distorion, even at 0db.
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post #381 of 640 Old 10-18-2013, 01:51 PM
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When I started this new home theater upgrade I wanted to spend the same amount on the speakers as I did the receiver. The 651 that I bought was $1799.00 and the Polks were $1800 for the 5 speaker setup, 2 RTi A7s - 2 RTi A3s - and 1 CSi A6. At 1/5 the price, that would put the 651 at $9000! Did you give $9000 for your 651?.

I'm only speaking about the fronts. At amazon the front Polks are sold for less then 500$

I buy the 651R for ~1500 € (~2020$) and the two front speakes for 5500 € (~7525$ + LS cables for ~500$). Primely I'm hearing stereo and CDs. Thats another emphasis.
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These speakers sound absolutly wonderful to me and I am very satisfied with the SQ and there is no distortion. They just require lots of power to drive hard. My receiver can handle them, just at high volume settings. But no distortion, even at 0db.

If you are lucky with this setting then all seems to be OK
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post #382 of 640 Old 10-21-2013, 12:13 PM
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Dear fellow 7/651R owners,

At last, saturday my 651R arrived !!! After collecting, unpackaging and connecting all the wires the configuration started. I never understood why you need to get a driver's licence for driving your car, but not some sort of exam for configuring an AVR !! Too many setup screens and too many mistakes to make, TMHO. But anyway, I started with the speaker setup which is not too difficult to do. After that it was necessary to decide how to connect all the different sources: I have several analog and digital sources.

First quirkyness found (compared to my previous Onkyo AVR): why only possible to perform the setup on TV and not on the display? Although it's only 2 lines it would be great not to switch to the TV-screen everytime. And also the screen needs to go from 1080p to 576p resolution, so the switch takes some time on my Sharp-TV. Ok, I'll survive this one.
Next, I use the bi-amp setup. No problem for digital sources. Yet a problem for my turntable in case I want to use Stereo Direct (and I want to). And possibly my CD-player (as I want to try to play it via analog also). The FW version is 1.44/1.45/1.09. The update to 1.51 will help here.

2nd quirkyness (compared to Onkyo AVR): My pre-amp for my turntable is less loud compared to the digital sources. I did not find a way to increase the amplification of the analog entry. May be a bit of a problem when I switch to another source after playing records and I forget to lower the volume. Perhaps I can buy a new pre-amp with a higher gain (my current one is quite low).

3rd quirkyness: the remote. Nice touch, heavy, but almost unreadable !! why such small buttons with such small letters on it? Well, after a while I think I'll learn which buttons to push (most of them are quite useless anyway). As long as the volume buttons are easy to find I'll survive.

4th quirkyness: the naming of the source buttons. This is an overall issue with many AVRs TMHO. After setting up all the sources I ended up with CD for CD, BD for BluRay, Video 1 for my HTPC, Video 2 for my Squeezebox Touch and Wii, Rec 1 for IPTV (only audio) and Rec 2 for my turntable. It was quite difficult to set it the way I wanted it due to the type of digital connections (Optical or Coaxial). After setting some explanatory names the entries are sensible, but I never understood why the generic names of the buttons are not just named S1, S2, etc. for instance.

After the setup I ended up with watching the first movies (I wanted to wait with audio after some warm-up of the AVR). First Bluray: Bladerunner. Good picture (as supposed with BD). Sound: not too bad !! Better sounding Center-audio with clearer voices, but not harsh. A bit of tweaking of the Sub necessary since it was a bit too heavy (regular problem with BD TMHO). Now some music DVDs. Also not too bad !! I need to figure out what's the best to use: Dolby or DTS. Picture quality: not sure. Not bad, but I think it could be better. I need to play with the scaler settings lateron.

Now using audyssey, first only the autosetup. After using this it seems that the measurement of the distances and gain is almost the same as I did manually, way to go !! Just some minor differences. Second setup, now with 2EQ. Now 3 times bleeping for the measurements. OK, again listening to some music DVDs. Is it better? Not sure. A bit more high and perhaps somewhat broader staging. Need to do some more listening to it in the future.

This was all on saturday. Time to sleep.

Sunday: the AVR is on the whole morning playing random music. The afternoon is for serious listening (I know the AVR needs to run in a long time, but I can't wait to hear how it sounds now!). First some HD-audio via Squeezebox. First tracks passed. What did I hear? Good sound ... a bit "stiff", but needs more time to run in. What else? Detail !! Depth !! Highs are a bit harsh. Base could be a bit more subtle. Now some CDs. Same thing. Details, depth and a bit harsh. No bad so far !! Need some patience in the next weeks of so.

Monday: I use the bi-amp to use 2 separate cables: one copper-silver cable for highs and one copper cable for base. This was the best setup with my Onkyo AVR. I change the cables around and listen again. WOW !!!!! Less harsh and a very nice center stage and more depth !!! This is good !! The top high notes are a bit less forward, but the sound is almost perfect. Now I remove the copper-silver cable and connect the copper cable to both entries. No bi-amping now. Listening again: yes this is the way I want it !! No more bi-amping necessary? I think so.

After listening for a while I realize that this is comparable with a setup I had some years ago when I used a Meridian Amplifier. Is this then what people call "British sound"? I think so.

Two days of listening: I am sold !! It only can get better over time. When I was reading all reviews and remarks I felt that this AVR had to be mine and it's all true. No overblown reviews of people who say that their AVR is the best. the 651R is a good AVR for Movies, but there are definitely better ones. the Onkyo was better for that, I think. But the audio quality is without any doubt. Can it become any better? Yes, but then I need to change my speakers and sources. The 651R is good "center" to start to change things in the future. Perhaps a better streaming device. Don't know yet what or when, but things will change :-)

OK. that's it for now. to be continued ...
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post #383 of 640 Old 10-28-2013, 11:18 AM
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Hello 7/651R Owners,

I managed to update the Firmware to 1.51 (thanks to Braveheart123 smile.gif). Now I have this RS232-crosscable and USB-to-RS232 converter cable which I can connect to my little Raspberry-Pi system running debian-linux. I managed to send the serial controls to my AVR manually. In this way you can control -part of- the AVR over a network (telnet connection). Did anyone already try this? And if anyone did this is there some program or app that can be used to control the AVR via a tablet or smartphone? Or another program or tool running on a windows-based system?

Regards,

MSHAVS
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post #384 of 640 Old 11-06-2013, 07:07 AM
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Brave heart can I request for the 651r firmware? Myers mail is villafuerte.zeus@yahoo.com

Thanks
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post #385 of 640 Old 11-06-2013, 07:18 AM
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Btw I am getting my 651r tom. My setup is aero 2 for front and aero center.i am using yamaha ns333 for my sorround and velodyne vx 11 for my sub. Appreciate if u csn share some tips on the setup for audio as well as for the HDTV. I'm using sharp lc60.
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post #386 of 640 Old 11-06-2013, 08:22 AM
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Hello StZeus,

I don't know your type of speakers, but best advise is to use your own ears as your guide :-) I have set everything straight, so no EQ. I tried Audyssey, but for me it's not what I like. Use Analog Direct as much as possible. I don't know if your sub can be configured as part of the front-speakers (I use a REL-sub which can be connected parallel to the fronts-speakers.)?

Just play with it, but allow enough time to let the AVR break in. It takes a long while to get the actual sound. I am using the 651R for a couple of weeks now and I think it's now reaching the point of being used long enough for this.

For your TV: I use a Sharp LC70. Just set the Scaler to Bypass. I have tried to see what happens when you use Process, but I don't see any difference, so I assume that my TV (and BluRay Player) are already processing the image. Play with it and perhaps you experience different results.

Regards,

MSHAVS
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post #387 of 640 Old 11-07-2013, 03:36 AM
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Thanks! Just audition 551r,651r and 751r and bought 751r in the end..it's coming tom and excited for it.
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post #388 of 640 Old 11-08-2013, 07:34 PM
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My 751r is playing good except I can't figure out how to make the USB 2.0 work with my jriver media center installed in my Mac.

No sound even after I selected cambridge USB 2.0 in my sound preference outputs and configure the midi settings.

Appreciate any sharing of ur experience.
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post #389 of 640 Old 11-09-2013, 01:19 PM
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Originally Posted by StZeus View Post

My 751r is playing good except I can't figure out how to make the USB 2.0 work with my jriver media center installed in my Mac.

No sound even after I selected cambridge USB 2.0 in my sound preference outputs and configure the midi settings.

Appreciate any sharing of ur experience.

Did you select "2.0" in the USB setup menu?
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post #390 of 640 Old 11-09-2013, 08:33 PM
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Somehow I manage to figure out how to make it work by tweaking some of the output in the jriver and Mac setting. The only issue I have now is that the sound is distorted when jriver up sample flac files to 192 and it seems that the maximum up sample with decent sound is 96/32 bit. Not sure if the issue is my Mac or the usb cable I am using.
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Cambridge Audio Azur 651r Home Cinema Receiver , Cambridge Audio Ltd , Cambridge Audio , Cambridge Audio Azur 751r Black
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