Watching movies at different volume from others problem - AVS Forum
Forum Jump: 
 
Thread Tools
post #1 of 23 Old 12-26-2012, 06:01 AM - Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
dazkyl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Malta , Santa Lucia
Posts: 487
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Liked: 10
What is the reason for some movies such as Harry Potter and the chamber of secrets i need to keep the volume at about 45 to hear dialogue well then i need to lower the volume again for actions parts like fighting etc because it comes too loud?

Then , as for iron man 2 i need to keep the volume at around 40 so that i hear dialogue volume well, unlike Harry Potter.

Every speaker is calibrated with spl meter and night mode is off. Center speaker is also set to "2dB higher than than the fronts for better dialogue hearing.
dazkyl is online now  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 23 Old 12-26-2012, 07:39 AM
AVS Special Member
 
JHAz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 3,810
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 13 Post(s)
Liked: 139
There are no requirements to have the dialog at a specific level in a movie, so the differences are in how they were mixed. Just like some songs have the drums louder than others . . .

That said, three possibilities:

1. Dialog normalization. Available on both Dolby and DTS but used only on DOlby for the most part, adjusts total volume based on data provided regarding overall dialog level through the movie

2. Differences in level as mixed, with those changes passed unchanged to the bluray or DVD

3. It is becoming more common to re-master movies for home release, which could invlove changes to dialog level in teh mastering process.
JHAz is offline  
post #3 of 23 Old 12-26-2012, 11:34 AM
AVS Special Member
 
Yosh70's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Sask. Canada
Posts: 2,018
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 19
Try angling your center down towards the listeners ears.....if thats not possible, maybe try and set it below the TV to see if thats any better..
Yosh70 is online now  
post #4 of 23 Old 12-26-2012, 01:00 PM
585-645-1006
 
jdsmoothie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 42,809
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 269 Post(s)
Liked: 1301
You may be better served upgrading to at least the next higher model (ie. Onkyo 5XX) as it would include Audyssey 2EQ to auto EQ your speakers as well as Dynamic EQ and Dynamic Volume for a better overall listening experience at lower volume levels as well as to boost the lower level dialogue and compress the louder explosions/commercials.

---------------------------------
"JD" – jd@avscience.com ; shop.avscience.com ; 585-645-1006, AVScience - AVSForum sponsor for 15 years  
Mon - Fri: 8am – 8pm EST (Sat/Sun, leave message)
Call for pricing on Denon, Marantz, Yamaha, Onkyo, Klipsch, Def Tech, Oppo, Parasound 
** Think the AVR is defective?  Reset the microprocessor 4-5 times. 
jdsmoothie is offline  
post #5 of 23 Old 12-26-2012, 01:46 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Yosh70's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Sask. Canada
Posts: 2,018
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 19
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post

You may be better served upgrading to at least the next higher model (ie. Onkyo 5XX) as it would include Audyssey 2EQ to auto EQ your speakers as well as Dynamic EQ and Dynamic Volume for a better overall listening experience at lower volume levels as well as to boost the lower level dialogue and compress the louder explosions/commercials.

Uhm, really? A newer, more expensive receiver is what you recommend? And then turn on Dynamic EQ and Volume to "band-aid" the problem?
Yosh70 is online now  
post #6 of 23 Old 12-26-2012, 01:55 PM
AVS Addicted Member
 
arnyk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Grosse Pointe Woods, MI
Posts: 13,654
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 288 Post(s)
Liked: 997
Quote:
Originally Posted by dazkyl View Post

What is the reason for some movies such as Harry Potter and the chamber of secrets i need to keep the volume at about 45 to hear dialogue well then i need to lower the volume again for actions parts like fighting etc because it comes too loud?

Movies aren't standardized like gallons of milk, and the way they are mixed is prone to some variations.

That all said, it is my experience that if you get your system set up right, one volume setting usually works for the entire movie.
Quote:
Every speaker is calibrated with spl meter and night mode is off.

The idea that calibrating speakers with a SPL meter represents any kind of fine tuning is a wish, not a truth. It beats random settings but not much else.

If you want the dialog to balance as well as possible you also need to work over the timbre matching of your speakers, which is not guaranteed by buying speakers from the same manufacturer, as the location of the speakers varies and is very signficiant.

This is one reason why people are so pleased with systems that are set up by professionals or have AVRs with their own built in system tuning facilities like YPAO, MCACC or Audyssey. A SPL meter is a very blunt stick compared to the tools that many people are using these days.

Quote:
Center speaker is also set to "2dB higher than than the fronts for better dialogue hearing.

Maybe you need to add more, or maybe you need to work over your system for levels, inter speaker timing, and equalization using measuring tools like a measurement mic, mic preamp/ computer interface and software like Room Eq Wizard.

You may even have room acoustics issues to deal with.
arnyk is offline  
post #7 of 23 Old 12-26-2012, 02:14 PM
585-645-1006
 
jdsmoothie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 42,809
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 269 Post(s)
Liked: 1301
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yosh70 View Post

Uhm, really? A newer, more expensive receiver is what you recommend? And then turn on Dynamic EQ and Volume to "band-aid" the problem?

You got it Toyota! I'd recommend any auto EQ (and especially Audyssey) over nothing in a heart beat. wink.gif

---------------------------------
"JD" – jd@avscience.com ; shop.avscience.com ; 585-645-1006, AVScience - AVSForum sponsor for 15 years  
Mon - Fri: 8am – 8pm EST (Sat/Sun, leave message)
Call for pricing on Denon, Marantz, Yamaha, Onkyo, Klipsch, Def Tech, Oppo, Parasound 
** Think the AVR is defective?  Reset the microprocessor 4-5 times. 
jdsmoothie is offline  
post #8 of 23 Old 12-26-2012, 10:28 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Yosh70's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Sask. Canada
Posts: 2,018
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 19
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post

You got it Toyota! I'd recommend any auto EQ (and especially Audyssey) over nothing in a heart beat. wink.gif

So any problem audio related you just recommend a newer receiver with room correction?

I have seen his room and I can tell you that his CC is above his TV pointing straight ahead.....that should be dealt with 1st.

And what are you referring to when posting "You got it Toyota"? Is that your clever way of saying I'm Asian?
Yosh70 is online now  
post #9 of 23 Old 12-27-2012, 03:38 AM
585-645-1006
 
jdsmoothie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 42,809
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 269 Post(s)
Liked: 1301
Of course any current configuration adjustments should be dealt with ... not suggesting otherwise, rather simply suggesting another option to consider once these adjustments are made if the OP still wants to make further improvements in audio clarity. And no, I wasn't referencing your ethnicity at all ... rather simply repeating a phrase from a popular Toyota TV commercial here in the states meaning "You are correct".

---------------------------------
"JD" – jd@avscience.com ; shop.avscience.com ; 585-645-1006, AVScience - AVSForum sponsor for 15 years  
Mon - Fri: 8am – 8pm EST (Sat/Sun, leave message)
Call for pricing on Denon, Marantz, Yamaha, Onkyo, Klipsch, Def Tech, Oppo, Parasound 
** Think the AVR is defective?  Reset the microprocessor 4-5 times. 
jdsmoothie is offline  
post #10 of 23 Old 12-27-2012, 03:51 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
Bond 007's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Cincinnati, OH
Posts: 11,781
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 83 Post(s)
Liked: 821
How about trying something really crazy and controversial. Increase or decrease the center channel volume depending on the needs of the movie.

No, Mr. Bond. I expect you to die!
Bond 007 is online now  
post #11 of 23 Old 12-27-2012, 07:37 AM
AVS Special Member
 
JHAz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 3,810
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 13 Post(s)
Liked: 139
That would work, of course. I just turn up when I find a movie has quieter dialog. I really don't have a set setting for movies anyway, although -20 is a typical stargting point for me. But at the levels I typically play movies at, when the SO is around, what works for most movies will not work for, say, V for Vendetta, which has dialog on average 4 to 6 dB lower than "typical." Because they mixed it that way. It's perfectly audible, of course, at reference (four times louder than my "starting point") but the movie needs a bit of a boost to get the dialog audible if I'm running at a klevel that puts typical dialog in the 65 dB range or so (like normal conversational levels).
JHAz is offline  
post #12 of 23 Old 12-27-2012, 08:06 AM
585-645-1006
 
jdsmoothie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 42,809
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 269 Post(s)
Liked: 1301
Keep in mind that Dyn Volume will also help to boost the lower movie dialog as well. smile.gif

---------------------------------
"JD" – jd@avscience.com ; shop.avscience.com ; 585-645-1006, AVScience - AVSForum sponsor for 15 years  
Mon - Fri: 8am – 8pm EST (Sat/Sun, leave message)
Call for pricing on Denon, Marantz, Yamaha, Onkyo, Klipsch, Def Tech, Oppo, Parasound 
** Think the AVR is defective?  Reset the microprocessor 4-5 times. 
jdsmoothie is offline  
post #13 of 23 Old 12-27-2012, 08:50 AM
Member
 
bargugl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 148
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 13 Post(s)
Liked: 21
You never want to buy a receiver if you feel you really don't need one. But with that said, one of the reasons I upgraded was because of this problem. It gets annoying having such radically different volumes for different movies and for some the dialog mix is impossible to hear at times without getting near reference volumes. Having to keep readjusting speaker levels is annoying and impractical if the concept is beyond that of the other people who use the system besides yourself. The fact that my wife is slightly hard of hearing only made it that much more difficult. As a result, Dolby Volume (or something similar) ended up being a big feature in deciding what receiver to buy. However, I would definitely try adjusting set-up as much as possible to try to fix an issue like this before buying a new receiver only for this reason.
bargugl is offline  
post #14 of 23 Old 12-27-2012, 09:25 AM
AVS Special Member
 
JHAz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 3,810
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 13 Post(s)
Liked: 139
Recognizing that sometimes the dialog gets mixed intentionally low making it hard to hear during loud parts of the movie (FilmMixer describes doing this on, IIRC, some of the Pacific battle scenes to make it feel more like you're really there) people who listen to music, which is all over the map, should be perfectly comfortable with the idea that you set the volume control differently for each recording, so I'm a little surprised to the extent that there's discomfort actually pushing the volume button on the remote.

OTOH, I agree that dynamic control like Dolby Volume (which I have not heard but have read good things about) or Audyssey's Dynamic Volume can be most helpful to let you get the dialog up to where you want it and keep the loud parts more under control. When watching with my SO, it'salmost always with DynVol on, at its weakest setting. Transparent, still quite dynamic but the biggest sounds remain less disturbing.

There's (actually thankfully) no way to eliminate the dynamics mixed into movies other than to use some kind of dynamic controller like DynVol or Dolby Volume, or to keep a finger on the volume control.

I say thankfully because part of what's good about movie mixes is retention of dynamics,. This occurs less in music but is not unheard of. John O'Conor's recording of the moonlight Sonata starts very very quietly, and if you can hear it at all, the loud parts will be jarring. I can lissten to it the way it was recorded when I want to pay attention, and squeeze it down a bit if I want it in the background with relatively little noticeable pumping etc. So I'm all in favor of having the dynamics available when i can use them, and am happy to be able to tame them when that's the right move . . .
JHAz is offline  
post #15 of 23 Old 12-27-2012, 11:09 AM
AVS Special Member
 
derrickdj1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 1,328
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 39 Post(s)
Liked: 135
Quote:
Originally Posted by arnyk View Post

Movies aren't standardized like gallons of milk, and the way they are mixed is prone to some variations.
That all said, it is my experience that if you get your system set up right, one volume setting usually works for the entire movie.
The idea that calibrating speakers with a SPL meter represents any kind of fine tuning is a wish, not a truth. It beats random settings but not much else.
If you want the dialog to balance as well as possible you also need to work over the timbre matching of your speakers, which is not guaranteed by buying speakers from the same manufacturer, as the location of the speakers varies and is very signficiant.
This is one reason why people are so pleased with systems that are set up by professionals or have AVRs with their own built in system tuning facilities like YPAO, MCACC or Audyssey. A SPL meter is a very blunt stick compared to the tools that many people are using these days.
Maybe you need to add more, or maybe you need to work over your system for levels, inter speaker timing, and equalization using measuring tools like a measurement mic, mic preamp/ computer interface and software like Room Eq Wizard.
You may even have room acoustics issues to deal with.

I hear so many people complain of dialogue problems, I agree with Don that system timing, equalization and room issues are the culprit in a lot of situations. Having YPAO, MCACC or some other program will help adjust the system and tell you what else may be needed.

Klipsch RF 7 based HT 7.4, Pioneer SC 35, Acurus Five 200 amp, Chase SS 18.2(2), VS 18.1(2), Samsung BDP F 7500, Asus/My Book Live HPC 4 TB

Yaquin VK 2100 amp, McIntosh XR 5 speakers, Samsung BDP F 7500
derrickdj1 is offline  
post #16 of 23 Old 12-27-2012, 11:19 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
afrogt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: SF Bay Area
Posts: 22,716
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 43 Post(s)
Liked: 348
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie

You may be better served upgrading to at least the next higher model (ie. Onkyo 5XX) as it would include Audyssey 2EQ to auto EQ your speakers as well as Dynamic EQ and Dynamic Volume for a better overall listening experience at lower volume levels as well as to boost the lower level dialogue and compress the louder explosions/commercials.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yosh70 View Post

Uhm, really? A newer, more expensive receiver is what you recommend? And then turn on Dynamic EQ and Volume to "band-aid" the problem?

In his case he bought a receiver with no room correction even though back when he made the purchase we recommended he get a step higher model. Having something like Audyssey room calibration with Dynamic Volume and EQ does make a difference. I would never buy another receiver w/o some type of room correction.

Unfortunately Dazkyl is all over the place. He's looking at replacing his Jamo towers with wall mountable THX speakers, considering a new sub and receiver. This is where our hobby gets expensive as you keep replacing components year after year.

Afro GT
afrogt is offline  
post #17 of 23 Old 12-27-2012, 11:37 AM
AVS Special Member
 
pokekevin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Huntington Beach, CA
Posts: 5,062
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
Liked: 101
After reading your post is sounds like you just dont like the dynamics of the film you are watching. (The loud part). Dialogue trying pointing the speaker down a bit. I also agree with AfroGT and JD's advice. Try a receiver with room correction. Dyna volume and Dyn EQ are great tools that help imho.

No subwoofer I've heard has been able to produce the bass I've experienced in the Corps!

Must..stop...buying...every bluray release...
pokekevin is offline  
post #18 of 23 Old 12-27-2012, 12:36 PM
Member
 
Jond0's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 119
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 14
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post

You got it Toyota!

Do you have to be racist about it?
Jond0 is offline  
post #19 of 23 Old 12-27-2012, 12:48 PM
585-645-1006
 
jdsmoothie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 42,809
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 269 Post(s)
Liked: 1301
I use the expression somewhat often and with everyone and you apparently missed the part about the expression coming from an old TV ad. wink.gif


---------------------------------
"JD" – jd@avscience.com ; shop.avscience.com ; 585-645-1006, AVScience - AVSForum sponsor for 15 years  
Mon - Fri: 8am – 8pm EST (Sat/Sun, leave message)
Call for pricing on Denon, Marantz, Yamaha, Onkyo, Klipsch, Def Tech, Oppo, Parasound 
** Think the AVR is defective?  Reset the microprocessor 4-5 times. 
jdsmoothie is offline  
post #20 of 23 Old 12-27-2012, 12:52 PM
Advanced Member
 
Louquid's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 748
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Liked: 37
If I turn off dynamic volume and EQ then I too have a have to crank it up to hear dialogue, while the action scenes come in a bit too loud. My room and speaker setup isn't perfect, or even ideal. Audyssey helps with my room's many imperfections.

Louquid is offline  
post #21 of 23 Old 12-27-2012, 12:54 PM
Advanced Member
 
Louquid's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 748
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Liked: 37
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jond0 View Post

Do you have to be racist about it?

I believe he was quoting the slogan for the 70's Toyota ads. He even said so in an earlier response.

Louquid is offline  
post #22 of 23 Old 12-27-2012, 03:20 PM
AVS Special Member
 
pokekevin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Huntington Beach, CA
Posts: 5,062
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
Liked: 101
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post

I use the expression somewhat often and with everyone and you apparently missed the part about the expression coming from an old TV ad. wink.gif

I had a mk4 supra before...that cracked me up so much lool

No subwoofer I've heard has been able to produce the bass I've experienced in the Corps!

Must..stop...buying...every bluray release...
pokekevin is offline  
post #23 of 23 Old 12-27-2012, 06:48 PM
Member
 
Jond0's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 119
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 14
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post

I use the expression somewhat often and with everyone and you apparently missed the part about the expression coming from an old TV ad. wink.gif


rolleyes.gif
Jond0 is offline  
Reply Receivers, Amps, and Processors

User Tag List

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off