It's time to upgrade. - AVS Forum
Forum Jump: 
 
Thread Tools
post #1 of 10 Old 01-02-2013, 12:32 AM - Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
bassage's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Phoenix, Arizona
Posts: 283
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
I've been using the same old receiver I got 12 years ago for my surround sound. It's about time I upgrade to get the most out of Blu Ray movies. I'm not looking for the ultimate audiophile receiver, I just simply want to FINALLY hear the lossless audio from my Blu Rays. What features do I need to look for in a receiver to make sure I get the most out my movies? Any suggestions for a decent receiver that isn't insanely expensive? What price should I expect to pay?
bassage is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 10 Old 01-02-2013, 02:16 AM
585-645-1006
 
jdsmoothie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 42,793
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 267 Post(s)
Liked: 1300
The comparison between using optical passing the higher bitrate DD/DTS lossy audio vs. the DD/DTS HD audio over HDMI will likely not be noticeable, rather the biggest improvement gained by upgrading to a more current model will be the use of the Auto EQ program on the speakers/sub.

---------------------------------
"JD" – jd@avscience.com ; shop.avscience.com ; 585-645-1006, AVScience - AVSForum sponsor for 15 years  
Mon - Fri: 8am – 8pm EST (Sat/Sun, leave message)
Call for pricing on Denon, Marantz, Yamaha, Onkyo, Klipsch, Def Tech, Oppo, Parasound 
** Think the AVR is defective?  Reset the microprocessor 4-5 times. 
jdsmoothie is online now  
post #3 of 10 Old 01-02-2013, 05:49 AM
Member
 
kdp99's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Southampton,Hants,UK
Posts: 78
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Another (and cheaper) option is to get a blue ray player that re-encodes the Blue ray sound tracks to maximum bit rate DTS (such as a samsung), which can pass to your older AVR via the optical connection.

While not quite as good as an HDMI connection the consensus seems to be that its damned close.

I use this with my Denon 5800.
kdp99 is online now  
post #4 of 10 Old 01-02-2013, 01:19 PM - Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
bassage's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Phoenix, Arizona
Posts: 283
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post

The comparison between using optical passing the higher bitrate DD/DTS lossy audio vs. the DD/DTS HD audio over HDMI will likely not be noticeable, rather the biggest improvement gained by upgrading to a more current model will be the use of the Auto EQ program on the speakers/sub.

So, are you saying it's not worth it to upgrade? I don't know a lot about audio, but I assumed that it would be a big difference to switch to a newer model since my receiver was released right around the time that DVDs became popular.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kdp99 View Post

Another (and cheaper) option is to get a blue ray player that re-encodes the Blue ray sound tracks to maximum bit rate DTS (such as a samsung), which can pass to your older AVR via the optical connection.
While not quite as good as an HDMI connection the consensus seems to be that its damned close.
I use this with my Denon 5800.

Do you know if the PS3 can do this? That's what I use.
bassage is offline  
post #5 of 10 Old 01-02-2013, 04:28 PM
585-645-1006
 
jdsmoothie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 42,793
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 267 Post(s)
Liked: 1300
Quote:
Originally Posted by bassage View Post

So, are you saying it's not worth it to upgrade? I don't know a lot about audio, but I assumed that it would be a big difference to switch to a newer model since my receiver was released right around the time that DVDs became popular.
Do you know if the PS3 can do this? That's what I use.

If that is the only reason you want to upgrade, yes. Also the BDP doesn't rencode the audio, rather AFAIK the higher bitrate DD/DTS audio is already encoded on the BD by default, so yes, the PS3 can play this via the optical audio output.

---------------------------------
"JD" – jd@avscience.com ; shop.avscience.com ; 585-645-1006, AVScience - AVSForum sponsor for 15 years  
Mon - Fri: 8am – 8pm EST (Sat/Sun, leave message)
Call for pricing on Denon, Marantz, Yamaha, Onkyo, Klipsch, Def Tech, Oppo, Parasound 
** Think the AVR is defective?  Reset the microprocessor 4-5 times. 
jdsmoothie is online now  
post #6 of 10 Old 01-02-2013, 06:10 PM
Senior Member
 
elmorage's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 225
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 49
go for the upgrade. i recently switched a 6 year old onkyo 503 for a new denon 1713 and it is like hearing surround sound again for the first time. it was worth it for audyssey alone, but pandora and airplay support plus less cables make it a slam dunk.
elmorage is offline  
post #7 of 10 Old 01-02-2013, 07:55 PM
Member
 
Deucedriver's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Rocklin, CA
Posts: 93
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Thanks for posting this, and if you don't mind me piggybacking I'm in the same spot and looking at a possible upgrade.

I have an Outlaw 950 pre and I've been looking at the Marantz AV7005, now heavily discounted. I really like the sound of my 950, but would like to move up to TrueHD (if it matters) and have a more streamlined cable setup with HDMI support. My primary music listening is SACD/CD using analog out and the Outlaw bypass from a Sony DVP-9000ES. I would still keep that unit. As my family has grown the Outlaw has had to accept the audio from an X-box, PS3, and DirecTV HD.

Any thoughts or suggestions?
Deucedriver is offline  
post #8 of 10 Old 01-02-2013, 09:26 PM - Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
bassage's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Phoenix, Arizona
Posts: 283
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
I'm not really interested in any special features like streaming music and other media to my receiver, I really only use it for movies and games. Any recommendations for a decent one that will just simply sound great for movies without a ton of advanced features? Not looking to spend more than $400-$500. Also, is it worth it to go for 7.1? Seems like there aren't that many Blu Rays that even use 7.1.
bassage is offline  
post #9 of 10 Old 01-02-2013, 11:32 PM
Member
 
kdp99's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Southampton,Hants,UK
Posts: 78
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post

Also the BDP doesn't rencode the audio, rather AFAIK the higher bitrate DD/DTS audio is already encoded on the BD by default, so yes, the PS3 can play this via the optical audio output.

Not correct about the re-encode, I have tested it. I have 2 Blue ray players, Samsung 5500 and Oppo 93 both connected to my Denon via optical/coaxial. With SOME dolby true HD discs (e.g. LA Confidential) the Oppo gives standard rate Dolby Digial but the Samsung gives re-encoded max bit rate DTS. I raised it with Oppo support and its something to do with the disc having Java. The Samsungs do re-encode the audio to DTS.
kdp99 is online now  
post #10 of 10 Old 01-02-2013, 11:48 PM
AVS Special Member
 
BIslander's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 8,433
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 8 Post(s)
Liked: 122
^^ Samsungs offer two types of bitstream.

Bitstream Audiophile sends whatever codec is on the disc. When using an S/PDIF connection, the player will send the lossy version of the lossless original - the DTS core from dts-MA tracks and DD 5.1 from TrueHD tracks.

With Bitstream Re-encode, the player will decode whatever track you select and re-encode it as DTS. The Re-encode setting allows you to mix in Secondary Audio when using optical or coax connections. Audiophile only sends the movie soundtrack, which does not include menu sound effects or PIP commentary tracks.

There is no sonic advantage to re-encoding to DTS instead of DD 5.1. Both are done at the maximum DVD bitrates and are indistinguishable.

jdsmoothie was quite correct in his description of how legacy connections are usually handled with lossless originals on Blu-ray. There is no re-encoding done unless the user calls for it on players like Samsungs that offer it as an option. Instead of re-encoding, the player simply sends the lossy core that is part of the dts-MA encode or the hidden DD 5.1 track that is embedded in the TrueHD package.
BIslander is offline  
Reply Receivers, Amps, and Processors

User Tag List

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off