Best Sound Quality: Pioneer VSX 1122 or Denon AVR 2313 - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 10 Old 01-17-2013, 12:56 PM - Thread Starter
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Being a newbie in the AVR business, it is hard to choose what you want it seems. Let alone being able to find out EXACTLY what you want.

It is easy comparing all the features of all the avrs and both of the above mentioned avrs have exactly what I need, with the Denon (which isn't that much more expensive on a website in my country) probably having the edge with the Audyssey and 4K features, while the Pioneer has 7.2, multi video and more amp power.

So i decided to base my decision on the one that actually sounds better. There's just one problem: I never owned any avrs so I don't know which receiver sounds the best.

Does anyone know? Or does anyone know wether Pioneer has better sound quality in general than Denon? Or is it the other way around?
I am talking about sound quality when listening to music. I listen to all kinds of music, but i really like a powerful bass line in electronic music.

Help! eek.gif
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post #2 of 10 Old 01-17-2013, 01:05 PM
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With modern receivers, the quality of their room equalization software makes a major difference in the quality of their sounds. The version of Audyssey provided by the Denon 2313 includes equalization for the subwoofer. Pioneer's MCACC does not.

Bear in mind that Audyssey tries to make the audio accurate. Many people have formed a preference for overly-loud bass and, as a result, sometimes are disappointed with the result.

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post #3 of 10 Old 01-17-2013, 01:12 PM - Thread Starter
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I can understand that Audyssey is much better than Pioneer's equivalent, but - as i should have mentioned in my first post - i am looking to connect these tower speakers: http://www.jamo.com/speaker-types/floorstanding/?sku=S718
and use mainly these for listening to music


Will the denon, the pioneer or both (or none?) get the best out of these floorstanding speakers?
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post #4 of 10 Old 01-17-2013, 02:06 PM
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Bear in mind that room equalization software really doesn't know what type of signal it's processing. It attempts to compensate for infelicities in both speakers and room acoustics.

Also, quality subwoofers can do a much better job of handling low fequencies below 120Hz than even the best floor standing speakers. Note that the specs for those speakers just say 40Hz-20KHz, not saying if the low frequency limit is for a 3dB decrease in signal, 6dB or even more. Most music doesn't go extremely low, but bass guitars and drums can benefit from good low frequency reproduction.

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post #5 of 10 Old 01-17-2013, 02:35 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Selden Ball View Post

Bear in mind that room equalization software really doesn't know what type of signal it's processing. It attempts to compensate for infelicities in both speakers and room acoustics.

Also, quality subwoofers can do a much better job of handling low fequencies below 120Hz than even the best floor standing speakers. Note that the specs for those speakers just say 40Hz-20KHz, not saying if the low frequency limit is for a 3dB decrease in signal, 6dB or even more. Most music doesn't go extremely low, but bass guitars and drums can benefit from good low frequency reproduction.

I've currently got them connected to a Kenwood XD-652 mini hifi that I bought at a very young age, and the bass is incredible. I'm not familiar with what those numbers mean for sound quality, but I guess you're saying both avrs will be equally good?
These Jamo speakers will have to do for now, i will buy a subwoofer along with other surround speakers in a couple of months time.
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post #6 of 10 Old 01-18-2013, 08:57 AM
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I'm just saying that the low frequency output quoted by the manufacturer for those speakers is ambiguous, and that adding a subwoofer and a receiver which has some form of room equalization will produce sound that's even better, no matter how good the speakers seem now.

In other words, you have a lot to look forward to!

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post #7 of 10 Old 01-18-2013, 09:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Qualky View Post

I can understand that Audyssey is much better than Pioneer's equivalent, but - as i should have mentioned in my first post - i am looking to connect these tower speakers: http://www.jamo.com/speaker-types/floorstanding/?sku=S718
and use mainly these for listening to music


Will the denon, the pioneer or both (or none?) get the best out of these floorstanding speakers?

I disagreed that "Audessey" is much better than Advanced MCACC.. I have a Denon 3311 which has Audessey XT and a Pioneer 1222 with Advanced MCACC.. And by sub sounds way; way better on the Pioneer. Pioneer does not EQ the sub; it does not necesarly means that the sub will sound bad.. Thats a fallacy!!.. I thought the same in the past; everybody is in favor of Audessey; but I have to test both systems myself to see... On Pioneer there is an option for SW in which you can setup 3 filters specially for the sub; tweaking that; setting the speakers to "Plus"; adjust the low freq (63Hz, 120Hz) and trust me the sub combine with your fronts will sound AMAZING.. I tested both systems on same area; same speakers; ran audessey and mcacc three times before doing tests!! and honestly I have to say the that Pioneer 1222 bea my Denon 3311... You can't edit any audessey; but you does with mcacc...
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post #8 of 10 Old 01-18-2013, 10:07 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Selden Ball View Post

I'm just saying that the low frequency output quoted by the manufacturer for those speakers is ambiguous, and that adding a subwoofer and a receiver which has some form of room equalization will produce sound that's even better, no matter how good the speakers seem now.

In other words, you have a lot to look forward to!

Thanks, i'll certainly be looking for a good subwoofer! I need to search for active subwoofers, right? Can you suggest good price-quality brands? I seem to like the wharfedale ones..

i don't know if you'll be able to view this website
http://hificorner.nl/speakers/subwoofers/asw610.html
http://hificorner.nl/speakers/subwoofers/diamond-10-mx-sub-blackwood.html
Quote:
Originally Posted by javygonx View Post

I disagreed that "Audessey" is much better than Advanced MCACC.. I have a Denon 3311 which has Audessey XT and a Pioneer 1222 with Advanced MCACC.. And by sub sounds way; way better on the Pioneer. Pioneer does not EQ the sub; it does not necesarly means that the sub will sound bad.. Thats a fallacy!!.. I thought the same in the past; everybody is in favor of Audessey; but I have to test both systems myself to see... On Pioneer there is an option for SW in which you can setup 3 filters specially for the sub; tweaking that; setting the speakers to "Plus"; adjust the low freq (63Hz, 120Hz) and trust me the sub combine with your fronts will sound AMAZING.. I tested both systems on same area; same speakers; ran audessey and mcacc three times before doing tests!! and honestly I have to say the that Pioneer 1222 bea my Denon 3311... You can't edit any audessey; but you does with mcacc...

I'm afraid i just ordered the Denon one :-). It seems like it's all a rather personal choice, and i just need some experience. Denon won't be all that bad if i see how many people think so highly of it!
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post #9 of 10 Old 01-18-2013, 10:15 AM
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For recommendations on quality subwoofers in your price range, I suggest asking in the forum http://www.avsforum.com/f/113/subwoofers-bass-and-transducers

People eager to help you get the most out of your new Denon receiver can be contacted in the thread http://www.avsforum.com/t/1409431/the-official-denon-avr-xx13-model-owners-thread-faq

The FAQ and "101" documents in the Audyssey thread will help you get the best results. Too often subtle oversights can result in less-than-adequate sound quality. The instructions in most receiver manuals are drastically simplified. See http://www.avsforum.com/t/795421/official-audyssey-thread-faq-in-post-1
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post #10 of 10 Old 01-19-2013, 01:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Qualky View Post

I'm afraid i just ordered the Denon one :-). It seems like it's all a rather personal choice, and i just need some experience. Denon won't be all that bad if i see how many people think so highly of it!
Im on this hobby since 1989; in the past I own great mid-high range receivers from Marantz, Yamaha, Denon, Sony, and Onkyos. From all the Denon 3311 was the best until I tried this Pioneer's 1222. Many people are "married with Audessey"; but I have to give it a try to Advanced MCACC. I'm not going back!...D3 amps with MCACC is really awesome!..... I tried YPAO and I consider Audessey is better than Ypao

Pioneer still can improve some little details to get an almost excellent calibration system like adding 2 more EQs to the low freq: 24hz and 40hz; also to add some sub EQ and done!.. But honestly; my sub and front speakers now comes to live with this Pioneer; never happened in the past with my Marantz 6005, Yamaha RX-A1000, Or Onkyo 806. I also had an Onkyo 515 in which I sold it last week.
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Pioneer Vsx 1122 K , Denon Avr 2313ci Receiver , Pioneer Sc 1222 7 2 Channel Network Ready Av Receiver , Denon Avr 3311ci Receiver
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