Outlaw Audio vs. Emotova vs. Marantz 5 channel amps - Page 2 - AVS Forum
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post #31 of 50 Old 02-11-2013, 01:48 PM
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Originally Posted by runnin' View Post

Read carefully. I am not suggesting that you are using the AVS forum follow function to follow me. But you repeatedly pick out my posts among many to "offer different opinion". In this case, the thread starter asked the same question in a thread you frequent, the Emotiva XPA-5 thread. You chose to ignore it there, and instead make your first post here, and quote my post to oppose in doing so. And yes you are opposing my opinion as you typically do. Look, follow me around if you want, but it looks rather silly.

 

 

If I am not using the AVS 'follow user' (and I am not in your case) how do you think I am 'following' you?  You are, if I may be frank, the last person I'd follow. I think you are being paranoid. I am in this thread because I DO follow someone who posts here and when I spotted the reference to Emotiva, owning 4 of their amps, I decided to contribute. If you don't like it, put me on ignore or shut up about it.

 

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Again, the thread poster has said clearly that he has limited space. The XPR amp has already been suggested and he responded to that suggestion by mentioning he has limited space, and not with interest in the amp. So you obviously didn't read the thread although you read my post oddly enough. Think whatever you want about Outlaw, Emotiva and 120 volts, but at least read the thread you are posting in.

 

I admit that I did not see the OP saying he did not want to consider the XPR-5. Nonetheless I do feel my post had merit, as it broadened out the discussion and also countered one or two of your points (balanced connectors, power supply rating etc). If the OP complains, I will be happy to delete my post if he so wishes. In the meantime, I can't quite understand why you are getting so uptight about it.

 

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PS This is an American forum. It has many new American posters joining all the time. They do not know you. They may therefore read your incomplete post about your 13 amp circuit and assume that they can plug their whole system into a circuit that can only supply 1800 watts, trip the breaker and ruin their projector which then can't do a cool down cycle and damages the LCD panels. Not everyone knows you like Theresa.
 
Right alongside my user name it says where I am located. The UK. Easy enough?
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post #32 of 50 Old 02-11-2013, 01:52 PM
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Originally Posted by runnin' View Post

Could you point out where the question was answered? I don't see it. I mean, I've pointed out that the post included amps made both in the US and elsewhere, so the poster wasn't excluding other countries. But I don't see how you responded to that. At any rate, one or two posts expressing patriotism is hardly grounds to claim racism.

BTW, you may both follow Emotiva threads, but you both don't quote me then repeatedly disagree with what I've said. Paranoia? Why are you afraid of patriotism?

Those 2 disagree with a lot of folks(That's AVS in general-makes its fun you know), don't think of yourself as special biggrin.gif:D

 

wink.gif

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post #33 of 50 Old 02-11-2013, 01:53 PM
 
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I won't be shutting up about anything. Try to avoid me if you don't like being challenged on your posts/behaviour. And maybe you could stop following Theresa around and find your own path.
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post #34 of 50 Old 02-11-2013, 01:56 PM
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Question answered eek.gif Patriotism is sometimes thinly veiled racism.

By the way, both Keith and I follow threads about Emotiva amps because we are both fans. Paranoia isn't necessary.

I know that you and Keith do not like my posts. However, I have not received any moderator warnings due to our disagreements. However, I did recently get one when responding to a certain member who does not own Emotiva. That same person is criticizing you and Keith for trolling when he constantly jabs at any Emotiva post.

Do I sense hypocrisy?

 

Mudcat - it is not that I do not like your posts - just that sometimes I do not agree with them that's all. I have found our disagreements have always been conducted in a civil, grown-up way and we can (and do) disagree strongly on many occasions, but there are never any personal attacks that I can recall. I do try to give good, valid reasons when I disagree with someone's post, aimed at trying to illuminate the discussion, not just argue. Disagreement is a fact of life on AVS and, when conducted with civility, is what makes it such a great forum.
 
I take your point about the pot and kettle wrt to Emotiva posts ;)  At least you don't think I am stalking you LOL!
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post #35 of 50 Old 02-11-2013, 01:58 PM
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Originally Posted by runnin' View Post

I won't be shutting up about anything. Try to avoid me if you don't like being challenged on your posts/behaviour. And maybe you could stop following Theresa around and find your own path.

Thanks for your advice. I am sure I will find somewhere appropriate to put it.

 

BTW, if 'behaviour' is an issue, the forum rules say to report offending posts to the Mods, rather than replying to them or quoting them.

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post #36 of 50 Old 02-11-2013, 03:21 PM
 
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Okay, in taking another look at things, it seems you post here an awful lot(10 in the last hour alone) I typically post several per day, maybe 6 or 7. We do have a common interest in Emotiva threads. Aside from that, we share opposing views on amp SQ, Emotiva quality and so when I post on these topics, since you post on the same topics and post so much more than I, it's common for you to take a different side than me and quote me while doing so. That's probably why you end up opposing what I've said in the handful of posts I make per day.

So if you continue to do so, then I guess I'll continue to respond in kind.
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post #37 of 50 Old 02-11-2013, 06:15 PM
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I thought I would be reading a thread about the comparisons between Outlaw, Emotiva and Marantz amps. But I thought wrong wink.gif.

Bill

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post #38 of 50 Old 02-12-2013, 03:04 AM
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Originally Posted by runnin' View Post

Okay, in taking another look at things, it seems you post here an awful lot(10 in the last hour alone) I typically post several per day, maybe 6 or 7. We do have a common interest in Emotiva threads. Aside from that, we share opposing views on amp SQ, Emotiva quality and so when I post on these topics, since you post on the same topics and post so much more than I, it's common for you to take a different side than me and quote me while doing so. That's probably why you end up opposing what I've said in the handful of posts I make per day.

So if you continue to do so, then I guess I'll continue to respond in kind.

I accept your apology :)

 

I also offer my own apology to you if I gave the impression I was stalking you or was on some sort of crusade to challenge you. I assure you I am doing neither!

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post #39 of 50 Old 02-12-2013, 03:14 AM
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Originally Posted by Bill Mac View Post

I thought I would be reading a thread about the comparisons between Outlaw, Emotiva and Marantz amps. But I thought wrong wink.gif.

Bill

 

:)  Threads of this nature always seem to end up as a bickering forum IMO. Anything that asks for, or offers, an opinion always seems to end the same way. The only threads that don't automatically suffer from this are the 'technical' ones where people are seeking, and being offered, tech solutions to various issues. The Audyssey thread is mostly like that for example, although even that descends into bickering from time to time, but they quickly get back on track.

 

If this thread stayed on the tech comparisons between Outlaw and Emo - eg one has x wpc, the other has y wpc etc - the thread would stay on course. But inevitably it soon happens that someone pops up and makes some sort of outrageous claim ("I have heard both and x totally blows away y for SQ") and then someone else jumps in to offer a counterview to that, and then, well... we know what happens. Some users are also very emotional and get upset if their opinions are challenged, even if they are challenged in a non-confrontational way, and then they overreact. Occasionally they will calm down and see that they weren't being attacked personally, but sometimes not. It's human nature I guess :)

 

If you really want to see bickering (and I am guessing you don't - LOL) you should read some of the acoustics threads! 

 

Anyway, I will bow out of this thread and leave you guys to the discussion - I only dropped in because I saw in an alert email thing that there was something about the XPA-5 and my curiosity was piqued. There are some AVS members who I 'follow' so when they post to a thread I get the email alert for that thread. I have found this useful - if you choose carefully the people you follow, picking those with similar interests to yourself, it can lead to all sorts of interesting threads you'd never see otherwise. 

 

Cheers, Bill. See you in another thread soon :)

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post #40 of 50 Old 02-12-2013, 03:21 AM
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Originally Posted by kbarnes701 View Post

smile.gif  Threads of this nature always seem to end up as a bickering forum IMO. Anything that asks for, or offers, an opinion always seems to end the same way. The only threads that don't automatically suffer from this are the 'technical' ones where people are seeking, and being offered, tech solutions to various issues. The Audyssey thread is mostly like that for example, although even that descends into bickering from time to time, but they quickly get back on track.

If this thread stayed on the tech comparisons between Outlaw and Emo - eg one has x wpc, the other has y wpc etc - the thread would stay on course. But inevitably it soon happens that someone pops up and makes some sort of outrageous claim ("I have heard both and x totally blows away y for SQ") and then someone else jumps in to offer a counterview to that, and then, well... we know what happens. Some users are also very emotional and get upset if their opinions are challenged, even if they are challenged in a non-confrontational way, and then they overreact. Occasionally they will calm down and see that they weren't being attacked personally, but sometimes not. It's human nature I guess smile.gif

If you really want to see bickering (and I am guessing you don't - LOL) you should read some of the acoustics threads! 

Anyway, I will bow out of this thread and leave you guys to the discussion - I only dropped in because I saw in an alert email thing that there was something about the XPA-5 and my curiosity was piqued. There are some AVS members who I 'follow' so when they post to a thread I get the email alert for that thread. I have found this useful - if you choose carefully the people you follow, picking those with similar interests to yourself, it can lead to all sorts of interesting threads you'd never see otherwise. 

Cheers, Bill. See you in another thread soon smile.gif

Your input was most welcome.
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post #41 of 50 Old 02-12-2013, 03:22 AM
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Originally Posted by Bill Mac View Post

I thought I would be reading a thread about the comparisons between Outlaw, Emotiva and Marantz amps. But I thought wrong wink.gif.

Bill

I too would never have dreamed the direction this thread would take. It should have been a straight forward comparison.
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post #42 of 50 Old 02-12-2013, 04:37 AM
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Originally Posted by kbarnes701 View Post

smile.gif  Threads of this nature always seem to end up as a bickering forum IMO. Anything that asks for, or offers, an opinion always seems to end the same way. The only threads that don't automatically suffer from this are the 'technical' ones where people are seeking, and being offered, tech solutions to various issues. The Audyssey thread is mostly like that for example, although even that descends into bickering from time to time, but they quickly get back on track.

If this thread stayed on the tech comparisons between Outlaw and Emo - eg one has x wpc, the other has y wpc etc - the thread would stay on course. But inevitably it soon happens that someone pops up and makes some sort of outrageous claim ("I have heard both and x totally blows away y for SQ") and then someone else jumps in to offer a counterview to that, and then, well... we know what happens. Some users are also very emotional and get upset if their opinions are challenged, even if they are challenged in a non-confrontational way, and then they overreact. Occasionally they will calm down and see that they weren't being attacked personally, but sometimes not. It's human nature I guess smile.gif

If you really want to see bickering (and I am guessing you don't - LOL) you should read some of the acoustics threads! 

Anyway, I will bow out of this thread and leave you guys to the discussion - I only dropped in because I saw in an alert email thing that there was something about the XPA-5 and my curiosity was piqued. There are some AVS members who I 'follow' so when they post to a thread I get the email alert for that thread. I have found this useful - if you choose carefully the people you follow, picking those with similar interests to yourself, it can lead to all sorts of interesting threads you'd never see otherwise. 

Cheers, Bill. See you in another thread soon smile.gif

Your input was most welcome.

 

Thanks Theresa. I thought I was just offering a POV but it seemed to cause a derailment of the thread for a little while, and that is the last thing I want to do. A good thread comparing Outlaw and Emotiva (or even Emotova LOL) would be very useful I think, given the similarities they share in many ways, despite having large differences in price. It would be useful to potential buyers to discover what they get for their extra cash if they buy Outlaw over Emo. Maybe that is a new thread?

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post #43 of 50 Old 02-12-2013, 05:15 AM
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True, it would be useful. I think my comparison of the Outlaw to the Emotiva was a fair one, even saying that if I had limitless resources I would get the Outlaw. This is despite having Emotiva amps that I'm very satisfied with.
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post #44 of 50 Old 02-12-2013, 05:39 AM
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To be honest I wasn't placing blame on anyone for this thread going off topic. What I see is two different schools of thought and it seems that one is trying to convince the other that they are wrong and vice versa. I see this in a lot of threads here when this type of comparison discussion takes place. I certainly have been guilty of it myself wink.gif. But it gets to a point where there is no way either side is going to change the others opinion. This is where I find these types of back and forth discussions really serve no purpose. Then it becomes personal in nature and threads get closed. Sometimes it is good the threads are closed especially when it becomes personal as it just doesn't stop.

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post #45 of 50 Old 02-12-2013, 05:40 AM
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To be honest I wasn't placing blame on anyone for this thread going off topic. What I see is two different schools of thought and it seems that one is trying to convince the other that they are wrong and vice versa. I see this in a lot of threads here when this type of comparison discussion takes place. I certainly have been guilty of it myself wink.gif. But it gets to a point where there is no way either side is going to change the others opinion. This is where I find these types of back and forth discussions really serve no purpose. Then it becomes personal in nature and threads get closed. Sometimes it is good the threads are closed especially when it becomes personal as it just doesn't stop.

Bill

Very true.
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To be honest I wasn't placing blame on anyone for this thread going off topic. What I see is two different schools of thought and it seems that one is trying to convince the other that they are wrong and vice versa. I see this in a lot of threads here when this type of comparison discussion takes place. I certainly have been guilty of it myself wink.gif. But it gets to a point where there is no way either side is going to change the others opinion. This is where I find these types of back and forth discussions really serve no purpose. Then it becomes personal in nature and threads get closed. Sometimes it is good the threads are closed especially when it becomes personal as it just doesn't stop.

Bill

Very true, and this is something that is getting much worse in my experience on this forum. The 2 schools of thought, I mean. There are some forums where difference of opinion is respected, or at least allowed. This is not one of those. In fact there are a few posters who seem to enjoy attacking the other school of thought as if it's a competition or game of some kind.

Anyway, what are your thoughts on the design differences between the Emotiva XPA-5 and the Outlaw 7500? The Outlaw has a power supply of 3.2 KVA, 12 output devices/channel and 150,000 total micro farads in 5 caps with a gain of 28. It's also a true balanced design instead of single ended. The XPA-5 is single ended, has a 1.2KVA power supply, has 6 output devices/channel, and 60,000 micro farads. Also a gain of 32db. In your experience, would these differences count for anything?
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post #47 of 50 Old 02-12-2013, 10:10 AM
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I have had a Marantz MM 9000 THX certified five channel amplifer in my system for going on five years now. It delivers 150 watts per channel and is THX certified. I bought it used in immaculate condition off of Audiogon in 2008. The amp was manufactured in 2000 . I paid $450 from a private owner, plus the shipping was on me. I have Sierra 1 bookshelf speakers as the front end in my system. I had previously purchased an LPA-1 amp from Emotiva, which I returned within the 30 day return window. My Sierra One's are a very neutral speaker, and the LPA-1 was not a good match for them, IN MY OPINION !!!. Also, i do like to listen at very loud levels, and while the LAP-1 was hooked up to my system, I blew a woofer in one of my front Sierra's speakers. I am not blaming the amp, as I was definitely pushing my system past it's limits. Dave at Ascend Acoustics was kind enough to replace the woofer at no charge. The cost of the LPA-1 brand new, was only a little more than the used Marantz MM9000 amp I bought off a fellow audiogon member. I am not knocking Emotive amps, but for my system the LPA-1 did not work. The Marantz amp on the other hand, has a very warm sound to it, and mates very well with the neutral sound of the Sierra Ones. As for Outlaw, I have never heard one of their amps, but all the reviews I have read on them seem to indicate they are a little on the warm side of neutral sounding, if that makes any sense. Also, I don't see that many multi channel Marantz or Outlaw amps on the used market. On the other hand, I see alot of Emotive amps up for sale. So either the people are upgrading to a different Emotive amp, or they are not happy with the performance. I would definitely encourage you to consider the current Marantz offering, the MM 7055. It delivers 140 watts per channel, and from the reviews I have read, it delivers the warm sound that Marantz has always been known for. Do not let wattage numbers deceive you ! The difference between a 140 watt external amp and a 200 watt one is not very discernable. However, the amp that you use will definitely add it's own flavor to the sound. That part will definitely be audible. Very much more so than the power numbers. GOOD Luck to You !
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post #48 of 50 Old 02-12-2013, 10:19 AM
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Quote:
Very true, and this is something that is getting much worse in my experience on this forum. The 2 schools of thought, I mean. There are some forums where difference of opinion is respected, or at least allowed. This is not one of those. In fact there are a few posters who seem to enjoy attacking the other school of thought as if it's a competition or game of some kind.

I think the difference in opinions should be respected on both fronts. But it takes two to tango and sometimes one just has to not respond to others differing opinions smile.gif.
Quote:
Anyway, what are your thoughts on the design differences between the Emotiva XPA-5 and the Outlaw 7500? The Outlaw has a power supply of 3.2 KVA, 12 output devices/channel and 150,000 total micro farads in 5 caps with a gain of 28. It's also a true balanced design instead of single ended. The XPA-5 is single ended, has a 1.2KVA power supply, has 6 output devices/channel, and 60,000 micro farads. Also a gain of 32db. In your experience, would these differences count for anything?

I'm not sure if you are asking me personally on the comparisons between these two amps. But if money was not an issue I would go with the Outlaw all day long. On specs alone the Outlaw has the advantage but whether that would equate to obvious SQ differences that I'm not sure. I guess alot would depend on the other gear in the system and how well ones hearing is.

Bill

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post #49 of 50 Old 02-12-2013, 10:58 AM
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I'm not sure if you are asking me personally on the comparisons between these two amps. But if money was not an issue I would go with the Outlaw all day long. On specs alone the Outlaw has the advantage but whether that would equate to obvious SQ differences that I'm not sure. I guess alot would depend on the other gear in the system and how well ones hearing is.

Bill

I too would go with Outlaw if money wasn't an issue. But right now I'm using three Emo amps and they seem perfectly neutral to me.
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post #50 of 50 Old 02-12-2013, 12:33 PM
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As for Outlaw, I have never heard one of their amps, but all the reviews I have read on them seem to indicate they are a little on the warm side of neutral sounding, if that makes any sense.

I have owned an Outlaw 7500 (5X200W) for about 7 years....it doesn't seem at all "warm", i.e., utterly neutral, with a quite a little on the "kick##s side" ....
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