Toroidal Transformer, is it really needed... - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 13 Old 03-22-2013, 10:33 AM - Thread Starter
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Toroidal Transformer, is it really needed more than once?

I see some of these "High End" processors advertised that they have "Large Toroidal Transformers" which I assume is cleaning up the power, but if your processor is already connected to a line conditioner that also has a large toroidal transformers is it really needed?

If the electricity goes thru your line conditioner transformer for cleaning and then again does the same thing thru your processor does this help or hinder it?
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post #2 of 13 Old 03-22-2013, 12:56 PM
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The advantages of a torroidal power transformer are:
  • Less interference due to EMI from the transformer magnetics
  • More compact, increased voltage/current output capability for its size

But these come @ a higher transformer component cost, a nice touch in a higher end component..

Just my $0.02... ๐Ÿ‘๐Ÿ˜‰
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post #3 of 13 Old 03-22-2013, 01:17 PM - Thread Starter
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Yes it is a nice touch, but how many times does power need to go thru these toroidal transformers?

Does that mean if your processor has a toroidal transformer it can go plugged in directly to the wall instead of a line conditioner?
Is there any harm or good hooking it up to a line conditioner that already has a toroidal transformer?
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post #4 of 13 Old 03-22-2013, 06:51 PM
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Toroidal transformer's have pluses and minuses.

PLUS
Less external magnetic field.
Smaller size.
Less weight.

MINUS
Wider band-width so line noise can pass through.
Poorly designed or mis-specified are sensitive to high line voltage and DC offset.
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post #5 of 13 Old 03-23-2013, 06:35 AM - Thread Starter
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"Is there any harm or good hooking it up to a line conditioner that already has a toroidal transformer?"

Seems to me like overkill.
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post #6 of 13 Old 03-23-2013, 06:28 PM
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Line conditioner is the overkill, not the toroidal transformer inside per se. Your assumption that the TT inside AVR is for 'cleaning up power' is incorrect.
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post #7 of 13 Old 03-23-2013, 06:42 PM
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Most transformers are just fine if designed properly. Toroids are just lighter and cheaper to make. And as for anything between the wall power and your equipment , forget it, nothing really works good. Just be sure and unplug during lightning storms.

Wishing I could post in the Ultra Hi-End HT Gear ($20,000+)

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post #8 of 13 Old 03-24-2013, 11:58 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kilian.caย View Post

Line conditioner is the overkill, not the toroidal transformer inside per se. Your assumption that the TT inside AVR is for 'cleaning up power' is incorrect.

Thanks, I did have a misunderstanding on the function of the TT, but are you saying that the power coming into the home can not be cleaned up with a line conditioner?
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post #9 of 13 Old 03-24-2013, 12:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gferrellย View Post

Most transformers are just fine if designed properly. Toroids are just lighter and cheaper to make. And as for anything between the wall power and your equipment , forget it, nothing really works good. Just be sure and unplug during lightning storms.

Lets clear up some inaccuracies...
  • The power transformer is the single most expensive component in an AVR
  • The traditional EL type power transformer is cheaper to build than a torroidal
  • Due to the high cost of the power transformer whether EL or torroidal this is where many brands cut cost using small guage wires for its internal windings which can saturate under load
  • A torroidal has certain advantages for minimal EMI radiation interference, ie. less hum
  • A torroidal can be made more compact than an EL type if used in a smaller footprint component
  • A power transformer be it torroidal or EL does not kleen up the power


Just my $0.02.... ๐Ÿ‘๐Ÿ˜‰
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post #10 of 13 Old 03-24-2013, 03:22 PM
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A power transformer be it torroidal or EL does not kleen up the power

Unless it is used as an isolation transformer.

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post #11 of 13 Old 03-24-2013, 05:59 PM
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'kleen up'? Is it US spelling of 'clean', or something related to Kleenex? biggrin.gif
Quote:
Originally Posted by OzziePย View Post

Thanks, I did have a misunderstanding on the function of the TT, but are you saying that the power coming into the home can not be cleaned up with a line conditioner?

No I wasn't saying that, just in most homes cleaning up power isn't necessary.

Audiosceptics accept audio trials using 25 people. A recent Oxford study with over 353,000 patient records from 639 separate clinical trials shows for every 1,000 people taking diclofenac or ibuprofen there would be 3 additional heart attacks, 4 more cases of heart failure and 1 death every year.

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post #12 of 13 Old 03-27-2013, 03:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gferrellย View Post

A power transformer be it torroidal or EL does not kleen up the power

Unless it is used as an isolation transformer.

Isolation transformers don't clean up noise....they just isolate. The fact that noise is AC..will get through the transformer pretty much by their very nature.

I must be guilty because people say I am guilty because they chose to call me guilty because they refuse to see the truth. Much easier to be part of the mob..
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post #13 of 13 Old 03-27-2013, 04:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M Codeย View Post

[*] Due to the high cost of the power transformer whether EL or torroidal this is where many brands cut cost using small guage wires for its internal windings which can saturate under load[/quote.]

Not quite correct; saturation happens in the iron core; less copper increases power loss because of its higher resistance.

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