Marantz 5005 receiver - AVS Forum
Receivers, Amps, and Processors > Marantz 5005 receiver
Lxmarch's Avatar Lxmarch 05:49 PM 03-26-2013
I am experiencing intermittent HDMI dropouts with Blu ray and Fios sources. HDMI control is off and firmware on both sources is updated. Marantz has not been helpful and I hesitate shipping the receiver off when the problem is intermittent.

I do have a question about the video mode and scaler settings. Video mode is currently set to Auto and i/p scaler to off. I don't know if changing these would help as I don't really understand the manual's description for auto and movie setting in video mode (page 49 of manual). Does the auto setting mean the receiver is doing the video processing and if so, how can I get the Blu ray player to do this instead? What am I missing here?

jdsmoothie's Avatar jdsmoothie 05:56 PM 03-26-2013
It's generally best to connect cable/sat boxes (HDMI) directly to the TV to minimize the HDMI handshake issues you are experiencing which are common with all AVRs. Also connect optical from the box to the AVR for surround audio. For the Blu Ray player, set the "Deep Color Output" setting to OFF and that should resolve the issue there. You also may want to try connecting the Blu Ray player into the other HDMI inputs to see if one works better than another.
Lxmarch's Avatar Lxmarch 08:28 PM 03-26-2013
Thank you so much. I will try your suggestions. Would your answer be the same even though this problem seems to have developed recently and did not happen at all during the first year or so with this receiver even though all the equipment remains connected the same way?
Thank you, Laurie
jdsmoothie's Avatar jdsmoothie 04:17 AM 03-27-2013
Yes. HDMI connections can cause more issues then they're worth. With cable/sat boxes, a firmware update to the box can often cause HDMI handshake problems until another firmare update is passed to resolve the issue which is why many installers simply bypass the AVR from the get-go with the configuration I suggested above. Check to see if the FIOS box recently got a firmware update as that will likely be the culprit for the cable box at least.
Selden Ball's Avatar Selden Ball 11:48 AM 03-27-2013
If you haven't already, you might check to make sure all of the HDMI cables are well seated. Gradual oxidation of a poorly seated cable might have been gradually reducing the signal level so that now it has started to fall below the level needed by the TV. Just reseating the HDMI cables (with all equipment off!) might help since it'd tend to wipe off some of the surface oxidation.

If you haven't already, you also might turn off "deep color" in the Blu-ray player. That would reduce the player's HDMI bitrate, which would increase the reliability of the HDMI signal getting through to the TV.

As for what the receiver is doing to the video, you'll need to provide the receiver's model number. Sometimes different manufacturers use different meanings for similar phrases. In general, it's usually best to let the TV do the scaling, sending the original resolution of the disc being played through both the player and the receiver. Some players do have more video manipulation options which can help with poorer quality DVDs, though.
Lxmarch's Avatar Lxmarch 06:22 AM 03-28-2013
Thank you for this additional help. I have turned off "Deep Color" on the Blu Ray player as suggested in the very helpful post by JDSmoothie and will test out fully. I now seem to recall that the problem started after I hooked in this current player. If that doesn't get rid of the dropouts I will take the next step and connect the cable box directly to the TV.
(Panasonic V10; Panasonic BDT-220 Blu ray and Marantz 5005 receiver)

I did try to re-seat the HDMI cables but may have missed one end or another so will do again.

If you are familiar with the Marantz, I am confused about the description video mode settings (listed in the manual on page 49) Auto says "Process video automatically based on the HDMI content information" and Movie says "Process video normally." I don't know what the settings mean really, which to choose and what piece of equipment is doing the processing. Ditto for the i/p scaler settings. I 'm not sure how I should have that set (HDMI or off)

Thank you for the advice.
Selden Ball's Avatar Selden Ball 02:50 PM 03-28-2013

The "video mode" settings are used in conjunction with the subsequent "i/p Scaler", "Resolution", "Progressive Mode" and "Aspect" video processing options.

When "video mode" is set to "Game", most of the video processing (if any) is disabled in order to minimize the amount of delay between the video signal coming in from the game console (or PC) and the video output leaving the receiver. This minimizes the "lag" which sometimes causes problems for gamers. "Game" would be appropriate if you have a gaming console connected to the port you're configuring. "Movie" probably would be appropriate if a Blu-ray player is connected. "Auto" probably would be appropriate if you're using a PlayStation3 for both games and movies. In most cases, "Auto" should be fine, though.

The "i/p scaler" setting is used in conjunction with the subsequent "Resolution", "Progressive Mode" and "Aspect" settings. Note that scaling is not available when an HDMI input video signal has too high a bitrate, e.g. when x.v.Color (deep color) is enabled. (The text doesn't explicitly say "too high", but all of the options it lists cause increased bitrates.) The "i/p scaler" setting enables (or disables) conversion of the video signal's resolution for analog input, HDMI input or both types of input connections. "Off" usually is reasonable, so that the input signal is passed unchanged through the receiver to the TV (or projector), so that the TV itself scales the video signal to match the native resolution of its display.

Sometimes, though, it's appropriate to scale the video to a particular resolution before it gets to the TV, often because the TV's scaler doesn't do as good a job as the receiver's scaler does. In that case, you'd need to know the exact resolution of the TV's display, so that the signal doesn't wind up being scaled twice (first in the receiver and then again in the TV) and made to look even worse.

The subsequent "Resolution" setting determines the exact scaling to be used for the output signal if the scaler is not "Off". "Auto" usually is reasonable. That causes the scaling to match the capability that the display device (TV or projector) reports over HDMI to the receiver. If you have an HD TV that's capable of only 720p, for example, with "Auto" set the receiver should automatically scale whatever input signal comes in to 720p, whether up from 480i standard definition or down from 1080p HD. Alternatively, you can set the receiver to output one of the list of specific fixed resolutions.

Similarly, it mght be appropriate to set "progressive mode" and "aspect" if the TV isn't doing what you want.

In most cases, though, it's appropriate to have other devices do the scaling-- either the source device (BD player, cable box, game console, etc) or the TV -- and not the receiver, so I recommend setting "Video Mode" to "Auto" and "i/p Scaler" to Off.

Does this clarify things at all?
Lxmarch's Avatar Lxmarch 03:53 PM 03-28-2013
Yes it does clarify for me. Thank you so much.
The only devices connected to the reciever right now are the Panasonic Blu ray and the cable box. I may connect the cable box directly to the TV (Panasonic V10) if I still get the signal dropouts I mentioned in my first post.
You explained the Game setting very well so, if I understand correctly, I can set the video mode to either Auto or Movie. I watch primarily blu rays, and not so much TV so I'm not sure what setting would be best for that type of viewing or what the difference might be with those two settings. As you say, Auto would be fine.
I will leave the scaler off. How can you determine which device is doing the scaling? I don't know that I'd actually see the difference but I'm curious and would like to know anyway so I can make sure the TV and Blu ray player are set appropriately.
Again, thanks so much!
jdsmoothie's Avatar jdsmoothie 04:00 PM 03-28-2013
One of the three devices can be doing the scaling to include the cable box, AVR, or TV. Obviously if the "i/p Scaler" setting is set to OFF on the AVR, the AVR isn't doing it. If the signal leaves the cable box at 1080p then the cable box is doing it, while if it leaves the cable box at anything less than 1080p, then the TV would be doing it if it's a 1080p TV. In most cases there's not going to be much difference between the three devices.
Lxmarch's Avatar Lxmarch 04:38 PM 03-28-2013
Okay, thank you. I still have to test out whether turning off "Deep Color" as you suggested will solve my dropout problem or whether I will have to go the next step with the cable box. I am trying to avoid sending the Marantz receiver in for trouble-shooting as the problem is intermittent but I only have a few months left on the warranty so I don't want to be stuck.
I appreciate your advice very much.
jdsmoothie's Avatar jdsmoothie 05:11 PM 03-28-2013
These are likely source related issues in both instances (ie. not likely repeatable unless the repair facility has your exact model cable box and Blu Ray player) so a repair facility is not likely to resolve the issue. Also keep in mind that if you purchased with a credit card, your card issuer may add an extra (ie. 4th year) to the warranty (AMEX will for sure as will some MC/Visa).
Lxmarch's Avatar Lxmarch 06:03 PM 03-28-2013
Well, unfortunately, turning off "Deep Color" did not solve my problem as I had hoped. I watched a blu ray and there were three signal dropouts in about 1/2 hour. Quite annoying. I did not yet disconnect the cable box from the receiver and directly into the TV yet but do not think that would help with the dropouts during blu ray viewing, correct? Audio goes off, screen goes black, display on blu ray switches from timer to "HDMI" and receiver display, likewise, switches to read "Stereo." The dropout lasts 1-2 seconds and then switches back on.
Any other suggestions I might try? My HDMI cables are all the standard ones from Blue Jeans Cable (the shortest lengths and not the chinese-made ones) I actually don't recall this happening before I replaced my older blu ray player with this current one. I would sooner get a new player than try to ship the receiver out as I'm not too confident it would be easy to locate the cause of such an intermittent problem.
Lxmarch's Avatar Lxmarch 06:08 PM 03-28-2013
I saw your last post, Jdsmoothie, after I just posted. Sorry. I agree with what you say about trying to send the Marantz in for repair. I will try to swap out the blu ray player with my old one and see what happens.
jdsmoothie's Avatar jdsmoothie 06:44 PM 03-28-2013
You may also want to try connecting the BDP HDMI directly to the TV with optical or digital coax from the BDP to the 5005 as you are not likely to hear any difference from the higher bitrate lossy DD/DTS tracks on BDs vs. the HD audio tracks using HDMI.
Lxmarch's Avatar Lxmarch 07:09 PM 03-28-2013
I was hoping you weren't going to say that. I'd rather buy a new blu ray player than have to do that. Turns out that won't help probably as I just swapped to my old blu ray player and experienced the same dropouts. I had to have a new HDMI board installed in the TV a while back after a freak bolt of lightning hit the ground outside and wreaked havoc on my equipment, phones, computers.... (the trip-lite surge protector on my home theater equipment did not help in that situation). Since then I replaced my old receiver with the Marantz and my old blu ray player with the current panasonic model. Does this sound like a possible problem with the board in the TV? If not, I suppose I have no choice but to send the Marantz in to United Radio under the warranty and hope for the best. If that fails, I don't know what to do as the enjoyment I once felt with my equipment is fast fading to stress and anxiety such that I don't even want to turn it on and that's pretty sad.
jdsmoothie's Avatar jdsmoothie 07:36 PM 03-28-2013
Why? Especially if it resolves the issue? confused.gif

Also, if you haven't already, try resetting the 5005 microprocessor.
Lxmarch's Avatar Lxmarch 09:48 PM 03-28-2013
Well, because I think I will be able to tell the difference between the sound formats and I don't like the idea of having to limit myself in that way but, like you say, if it works, then I may just have to settle.
I will try your suggestion first of re-setting the microprocessor. Do you know if this can be done without losing the Audessy settings?
jdsmoothie's Avatar jdsmoothie 10:48 PM 03-28-2013
Most would not be able to tell the difference without very high quality speakers, so give it a try. Also you can save the settings to the unit's internal memory prior to resetting the microprocessor (p. 82 OM).
Lxmarch's Avatar Lxmarch 06:30 AM 03-29-2013
Well, I wouldn't say that I have extremely high quality speakers but they are SVS all around from a few years back and more than do the job for me. I like them and can hear the difference on a blu ray with HD Master. I'm picky that way so that is why this is such a pain for me.
Anyway, I'll try the reset and also might as well pick up new HDMI cables from Blue Jeans. Won't hurt to try I guess. I'll also re-connect as you suggest just to see if that solves the problem. That would be annoying to me, though, as when you buy equipment capable of utilizing a certain technology but find that it can not, I feel something is wrong. Also, I can't figure why the receiver would work fine for 1 1/2 years and then start having this problem.
Will check back in once I do more.
Thank you,
Selden Ball's Avatar Selden Ball 09:30 AM 03-29-2013

Have you tried power-cycling the TV? I mean have you tried unplugging it from the wall for a few minutes, not just putting it into standby with the remote. Sometimes a power-cycle reset can improve things since it clears out any garbage left in RAM and does other resets. (I've had to do that a few times with my Vizio TV -- maybe once or twice a year it stops responding to its remote and to its local buttons.)

Uncabling the cable box from the receiver is another thing to try. All of the HDMI-connected devices interact with one another in unpredictable ways frown.gif

Of course, although the difference in audible sound quality might be minimal, there's still the emotional impact of knowing you're not listening to the best quality available. (I watched the remastered Blu-ray edition of Baraka last night. The default audio was 640K 5.1 Dolby Digital, but the disc included a 96/24 DTS HD/MA track, too. Listening to that felt so much better!)
Lxmarch's Avatar Lxmarch 11:32 AM 03-29-2013
Okay, microprocessor reset as per Jdsmoothie's suggestion and and TV "power-cycled' as per Selden's suggestion. I will try it later and also with different connections to the TV (grimace!) while I wait for my new HDMI cables (currently using the Series F from Blue Jean's Cable by the way).
Thank you all so much! Nice to converse with others who actually care about this stuff.
Lxmarch's Avatar Lxmarch 03:28 PM 04-03-2013
This is a report back to all who helped me! I think my HDMI signal dropout problem has been solved.
I can't specify exactly what did it because I tried everything at once but I reset the microprocessor in the Marantz receiver, unplugged my Panasonic plasma for a while and changed out my HDMI cables. So far, no dropouts at all and I'm thrilled and thankful to all you guys who helped me out with such useful advice.
Thank you!
Selden Ball's Avatar Selden Ball 01:37 PM 04-04-2013

You're very welcome!
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