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post #91 of 137 Old 04-20-2013, 12:31 AM
 
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Originally Posted by RomanBlade86 View Post

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Originally Posted by gostillerz View Post

For 2ch, the H/K will work great for you, and $340 isn't a bad price. Don't listen to people saying you need 500W amps and a preamp to get good sound. You won't be missing anything except a lot of money. Don't splurge on electronics, splurge on speakers. That and the room are much more important.

I only want the two Bowers & Wilkins 685 speakers that I own and nothing else. They're such nice speakers that I don't want to skimp too much on the machine that fuels them so I can bring out their full beauty. That's why I was thinking about getting a pre-amp + amp.

Anyway, here's an even better deal on the Harman Kardon HK 3490 for $249 but it's an open box and states "may have cosmetic blemishes or have been refurbished":

http://www.jr.com/harman-kardon/pe/HK_3490_hy_BS/

Refurbished HK 3490 from Harman themselves:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Harman-Kardon-HK-3490-Z-2-x-120W-per-channel-Stereo-Receiver-/151017641556?pt=US_Stereo_Receivers&hash=item23295a5654

Roman you know in your heart you want the separates..

if you dont get em you will be wondering the rest of your life what your missing... its only a few dollars more... not even expensive but you can grow with it as well..

cheers..
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post #92 of 137 Old 04-20-2013, 12:35 AM
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Originally Posted by deltadube View Post

Roman you know in your heart you want the separates..

if you dont get em you will be wondering the rest of your life what your missing... its only a few dollars more... not even expensive but you can grow with it as well..

cheers..
I think you want him to get the separates more than he does. And youre not so much concerned about his sound as you are in selling him an amp.

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post #93 of 137 Old 04-20-2013, 12:49 AM
 
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Roman you know in your heart you want the separates..

if you dont get em you will be wondering the rest of your life what your missing... its only a few dollars more... not even expensive but you can grow with it as well..

cheers..
I think you want him to get the separates more than he does. And youre not so much concerned about his sound as you are in selling him an amp.

i think you want to sell him a cheap sound system so he has to buy another...

i pointin out good benefits.. better sound.. out of his nice speakers...

he said in the beginning and his relative does recommend separates and he said he wanted separates...

he is better off with separates and just so happens emotiva got a secret sale till end of monday i think..10 %

free shipping and money back if not satisfied...but i think he has to pay the return shipping..

and if money is tight go with the upa 200 125 wpc x 2 into 8 ohms.. you can grow with this stuff 5 yr transferable warranty as well
upa could always be used in back channels of a ht in the future as well..

tonns of benefits to separates..

cheers..

cheers
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post #94 of 137 Old 04-20-2013, 04:54 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by deltadube View Post

Roman you know in your heart you want the separates..

if you dont get em you will be wondering the rest of your life what your missing... its only a few dollars more... not even expensive but you can grow with it as well..

cheers..

Yes, in my heart I do want the separates! An audiophile relative of mine who has been in this hobby for years and spends thousands looked at the Emotiva's specs and said stuff like this used to cost a lot more. He kept telling me separate components is the way to go and he too used to buy receivers but says he knows better now. He recommended the XDA-2 and XPA-200 combo and said I would be happy with the sound and that the XDA-2 would serve as a sound card for my computer but it can also be used as a pre-amp. Are there other companies that can offer a pre-amp + amp of this quality for a price near $808.20 that Emotiva is having thanks to the 10% off code? What are some alternatives as far as a pre-amp + amp goes from other companies?

HDTV: Panasonic TC-P50ST50
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Receiver: Sony STR-DA80ES
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post #95 of 137 Old 04-20-2013, 09:13 AM
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Originally Posted by deltadube View Post

i like how you cut up the reply to lose the important fact

you said there pre pros where not the best

give it up

cheers

I posted your reply in full - there was no editing or cutting, as anyone can see. Not sure why you feel the need to be intellectually dishonest to try to prove whatever point it is you're failing to make with logic and/or science.

Emotiva's history with pre-pros is very poor. Both of the pre-pro's they've released in the last 5 years have had major issues, particularly with EQ. There are also early reports that the UMC-200 isn't working as advertised. The UMC-1 had a fatally flawed approach to sub eq which is well documented on AVS. Emotiva denied it until the schematics were posted here showing it was impossible for it to work as advertised. Mysteriously, Emo then released a fix for a problem they claimed didn't exist.

What part of my post explaining that your assumption that Bob Carver was brought in to fix TACT was incorrect based on Carver's expertise did you fail to understand?

I won't bother with you going forward - you choose to ignore facts and reply with "da power". Sadly, it's a symptom of what's happened to AVS over the last 6 months - this place is a shell of it's former self as the more knowledgeable members have abandoned the site rather than repeat the same arguments with newbs who admit they aren't experts then think they've discovered new solutions that defy known physical and acoustical science.

The upshot of all of that is that people used to be able to come to AVS for good advice based on known science; it's now well on it's way to becoming a new Audio Asylum:

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post #96 of 137 Old 04-20-2013, 09:37 AM
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post #97 of 137 Old 04-20-2013, 10:24 AM
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post #98 of 137 Old 04-20-2013, 11:31 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RomanBlade86 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by deltadube View Post

Roman you know in your heart you want the separates..

if you dont get em you will be wondering the rest of your life what your missing... its only a few dollars more... not even expensive but you can grow with it as well..

cheers..

Yes, in my heart I do want the separates! An audiophile relative of mine who has been in this hobby for years and spends thousands looked at the Emotiva's specs and said stuff like this used to cost a lot more. He kept telling me separate components is the way to go and he too used to buy receivers but says he knows better now. He recommended the XDA-2 and XPA-200 combo and said I would be happy with the sound and that the XDA-2 would serve as a sound card for my computer but it can also be used as a pre-amp. Are there other companies that can offer a pre-amp + amp of this quality for a price near $808.20 that Emotiva is having thanks to the 10% off code? What are some alternatives as far as a pre-amp + amp goes from other companies?

think u will be pretty happy with that..

cheers..
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post #99 of 137 Old 04-20-2013, 02:07 PM
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think u will be pretty happy with that..

cheers..
No other companies at all that you can suggest that might make an amp suitable for his purpose? rolleyes.gif Surely with all your knowledge there is at least one alternative.
Whats wrong with Behringer amps?

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post #100 of 137 Old 04-20-2013, 02:21 PM
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No other companies at all that you can suggest that might make an amp suitable for his purpose? rolleyes.gif Surely with all your knowledge there is at least one alternative.
Whats wrong with Behringer amps?

Or Crown wink.gif

It's these cans! He hates these cans!
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post #101 of 137 Old 04-20-2013, 02:29 PM - Thread Starter
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Someone provide me with some links of a pre-amp + amp from other good companies other than Emotiva so I can compare. biggrin.gif

HDTV: Panasonic TC-P50ST50
Speakers: Bowers & Wilkins 685
Receiver: Sony STR-DA80ES
Blu-ray Player: Playstation 3
Power Center: Monster HDP 1800
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post #102 of 137 Old 04-20-2013, 02:37 PM
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What are your thoughts on that Yamaha 773 at Newegg? Thats a hell of a deal but doesnt last long.

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post #103 of 137 Old 04-20-2013, 02:53 PM - Thread Starter
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What are your thoughts on that Yamaha 773 at Newegg? Thats a hell of a deal but doesnt last long.

For some reason I keep thinking the Onkyo 818 is a better deal...

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post #104 of 137 Old 04-20-2013, 02:55 PM
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For some reason I keep thinking the Onkyo 818 is a better deal...
A mystery indeed...

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post #105 of 137 Old 04-20-2013, 03:08 PM
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Honestly for under $900, I can't think of any. Maybe someone else can. The XDA-2 and XPA-200 are good units of course. I just don't think the difference between those and the H/K you were looking at for instance justifies the extra $500+ just to go to seperates. You really can't go wrong with either since they both will do what you're looking for. Just depends on how much you want to spend.

It's these cans! He hates these cans!
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post #106 of 137 Old 04-20-2013, 03:17 PM
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Given their track record, I wouldn't bother with an Emo pre pro. The Denon 8500 is a dated beast that would produce beautiful sound if your room doesn't disagree with it. Still, it seems a shame to use it in small setups but time has past.

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post #107 of 137 Old 04-20-2013, 03:18 PM
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For some reason I keep thinking the Onkyo 818 is a better deal...

It's not a good deal if you're paying for features you won't use. No reason to get an HT receiver if you're only going to run 2 channels.

The best deal would still be a stereo receiver from Marantz, Denon, H/K, etc.

It's these cans! He hates these cans!
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post #108 of 137 Old 04-20-2013, 07:07 PM - Thread Starter
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Or Crown wink.gif

What are some other good pre-amps to go along with the Crown amplifier? How does the Emotiva XPA-200 compare with these Crown amplifiers?

Crown XLS2000
Crown XLS2500
Crown XLi 2500

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B003HZPKXC/ref=ox_sc_sfl_title_1?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B003HZV2OI/ref=ox_sc_sfl_title_2?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER

http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/XLI2500?utm_source=CSE&utm_medium=PPC&utm_campaign=none&utm_term=XLI2500&zmap=XLI2500&zmac=2&zmas=1&zmam=89202644&SID=0

HDTV: Panasonic TC-P50ST50
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post #109 of 137 Old 04-21-2013, 01:54 PM - Thread Starter
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Bump. Can anyone answer the above question?

HDTV: Panasonic TC-P50ST50
Speakers: Bowers & Wilkins 685
Receiver: Sony STR-DA80ES
Blu-ray Player: Playstation 3
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post #110 of 137 Old 04-21-2013, 02:12 PM
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Remember that those Crown amps are entirely different beasts from "traditional" audiophile amps. For one, they are Class D. A lot needs to be done to them to have decent sound over the full audio range. Those amps are really meant to provide power to live performance or PA applications rather than home theater. There are some decent Class D amps out there but they generally cost three to four times as much as those Crown products.

I think the XPA-200 would be better for home theater where the space is somewhat controlled and free of background noise.

As far as an actual system goes, I'm going to say just go with the Onkyo TX-NR818 and see if that will provide enough power for your needs. If it does not, then add an Emotiva amp into the mix. My belief is that a decent receiver with pre-outs is a decent jump-point in building a system with more amplification later on. This is where mass production has a benefit over separates. Way more receivers are sold so the cost will be lower than a pre-pro. I really don't buy into separates sounding noticeably better than receivers of similar cost and construction. Sure. There might be a subtle difference because of the circuits/paths being more isolated from the other components, but I doubt it is enough to pay the premium over a pre-pro + amp vs. a good AVR with pre-out + amp.

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post #111 of 137 Old 04-21-2013, 03:57 PM
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Remember that those Crown amps are entirely different beasts from "traditional" audiophile amps. For one, they are Class D. A lot needs to be done to them to have decent sound over the full audio range. Those amps are really meant to provide power to live performance or PA applications rather than home theater. There are some decent Class D amps out there but they generally cost three to four times as much as those Crown products.

I think the XPA-200 would be better for home theater where the space is somewhat controlled and free of background noise.

.

Have you actually tried any of those Crown XLS amps? I have used them and there is no way I could distinguish them from my XPA 5.
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post #112 of 137 Old 04-21-2013, 04:10 PM
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Lordy, you don't need power amps for B&W 685 BOOKSHELF speakers
In a 2.0 set-up!!!

Harman Kardon 3490 or the above Onkyo 818.

I've had these speakers and ran them with a 60 watt HK receiver.
Got them very loud with no distortion.
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post #113 of 137 Old 04-22-2013, 01:48 AM
 
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Someone provide me with some links of a pre-amp + amp from other good companies other than Emotiva so I can compare. biggrin.gif

http://www.wyred4sound.com/webapps/category/74030/117839/18046

cheers
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post #114 of 137 Old 04-22-2013, 03:30 AM - Thread Starter
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How does this compare with the Emotiva amp? Would I need to buy a pre-amp to go along with a monoblock amp? Would the cheapest one they have for sale be enough?

HDTV: Panasonic TC-P50ST50
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Blu-ray Player: Playstation 3
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post #115 of 137 Old 04-22-2013, 03:44 AM
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This thread has been going on for so long and has become so goofy that Im starting to think youre just messing with everybody. Youre obviously not in any hurry to listen to the speakers because practically anything and everything on the market would have no problems driving them. How can such a simple decision become such a monumental task?

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post #116 of 137 Old 04-22-2013, 04:09 AM - Thread Starter
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This thread has been going on for so long and has become so goofy that Im starting to think youre just messing with everybody. Youre obviously not in any hurry to listen to the speakers because practically anything and everything on the market would have no problems driving them. How can such a simple decision become such a monumental task?

Buying something to properly power my speakers is no laughing matter. I have a Panasonic ST50 plasma, Bowers & Wilkins 685 speakers and now I must decide on the final piece and this is a decision I do not want to rush. Some say some crappy receiver that launched near $400 retail will drive my speakers properly while others say a receiver isn't a great option and separates are better and will make everything sound better. I'm sure there are some great $400 receivers out there but initially they retailed for over $1,000 and some are saying that an entry level receiver will be more than enough to make my speakers shine which I have doubts. There's just too much denial, misinformation and disagreement among people in this hobby that it's hard to decide who to believe. I've read things from people on the internet that say that LED has a better refresh rate than plasma and is the way to go if you're a gamer which is clearly not the case and even have an audiophile relative that drops thousands on audio equipment and is a connoisseur on sound but yet prefers Samsung LEDs and talks negatively on plasmas. For me it's not simple because I have to discern through the responses as well as make an informed decision. There's too many people that don't know what they're talking about in every facet of life but they like to pretend that they're experts.

Articles like this further complicate matters for someone who is new to this hobby to try to discern what is truth and what is utter B.S.:

http://news.cnet.com/8301-13645_3-57573961-47/do-separate-components-sound-better-than-av-receivers-part-2/

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post #117 of 137 Old 04-22-2013, 04:28 AM
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Understood. You have gotten many different opinions but for the most part it seems that any decent receiver will work fine.
So, since you have always been leaning towards separates and obviously have plenty of money why not just spend $1000 on whatever it is you want. I get the feeling thats what youre gonna do anyway. Buy something that you can return and see how it sounds. Everytime someone suggests something you just suggest something else anyway. If you are waiting for someone to come along who has the perfect solution that absolutely cannot be debated then you will never buy anything. Youre speakers are not special in any way. They arent even some kind of expensive exotic or anything. Just basic, run of the mill, midpriced bookshelf speakers. Theres no reason to search the world over to find something to drive them.
But you have already been told this by several people here so Im just wasting my time. Good luck.
Why dont you call B&W and ask them what the perfect option would be? Surely you can trust them.
What about your audiophile relative? Is he full of BS too and cannot be trusted?

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post #118 of 137 Old 04-22-2013, 05:06 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Bond 007 View Post

Understood. You have gotten many different opinions but for the most part it seems that any decent receiver will work fine.
So, since you have always been leaning towards separates and obviously have plenty of money why not just spend $1000 on whatever it is you want. I get the feeling thats what youre gonna do anyway. Buy something that you can return and see how it sounds. Everytime someone suggests something you just suggest something else anyway. If you are waiting for someone to come along who has the perfect solution that absolutely cannot be debated then you will never buy anything. Youre speakers are not special in any way. They arent even some kind of expensive exotic or anything. Just basic, run of the mill, midpriced bookshelf speakers. Theres no reason to search the world over to find something to drive them.
But you have already been told this by several people here so Im just wasting my time. Good luck.
Why dont you call B&W and ask them what the perfect option would be? Surely you can trust them.
What about your audiophile relative? Is he full of BS too and cannot be trusted?

I don't know, I think the Bowers & Wilkins 685 speakers are pretty nice and according to my relative they have a much more expensive sound than their price suggests. He recommended them for me and I heard them in a showroom and loved how they looked and the price wasn't bad. The only place I was able to get them was from a high-end home theater store where my relative is a big-time customer and was able to negotiate and get them for me for a great deal. I can't trust all of his opinions obviously since he's against plasma and loves Samsung LEDs. He tried to convince me to get a Samsung LED and I wasn't having it since I'm a gamer and also I don't like the LED picture. I'm more of a Panasonic kind of guy and will always go plasma. He gave me an old Sony STR-DA80ES receiver from 1997 that I plan to use for a different setup but he said this old Sony receiver will power my speakers beautifully and today's receivers at Best Buy are junk. I'm just trying to make sense out of all of this.

HDTV: Panasonic TC-P50ST50
Speakers: Bowers & Wilkins 685
Receiver: Sony STR-DA80ES
Blu-ray Player: Playstation 3
Power Center: Monster HDP 1800
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post #119 of 137 Old 04-22-2013, 05:14 AM
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http://www.avsforum.com/t/755048/b-w-owners-thread
Ask someone who owns your speakers what they use.

No, Mr. Bond. I expect you to die!
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post #120 of 137 Old 04-22-2013, 05:23 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bond 007 View Post

http://www.avsforum.com/t/755048/b-w-owners-thread
Ask someone who owns your speakers what they use.

Thanks for the tip. I just created the message.

HDTV: Panasonic TC-P50ST50
Speakers: Bowers & Wilkins 685
Receiver: Sony STR-DA80ES
Blu-ray Player: Playstation 3
Power Center: Monster HDP 1800
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Reply Receivers, Amps, and Processors

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Onkyo Tx 8050 Network Stereo Receiver Black , Denon Avr 5803 Receiver , Onkyo Tx Nr809 , Onkyo Tx Nr818 , Denon Avr 4806 7 1 Audio Video Reference Receiver , Yamaha Rx A1020 7 2 Channel Network Aventage Av Receiver
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