Denon 2113 or Yamaha RX-V673 for 7.1 - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 25 Old 04-29-2013, 08:15 PM - Thread Starter
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I thought it worthwhile starting a new thread in the appropriate section

Will be paired with wharfedale diamond 10.1 fronts, wharfedale diamond 10CS centre, wharfedale diamond 10sr surrounds and rears and SVS PB-1000 as the sub. Almost entirely for home theatre, no music

Denon slightly cheaper but that would be me importing it so warranty risks etc

Thoughts? Opinions +/- justification?
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post #2 of 25 Old 04-30-2013, 03:22 AM - Thread Starter
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Cheeky bump to get a new timezone
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post #3 of 25 Old 04-30-2013, 04:18 PM - Thread Starter
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Not sure what the bump etiquette is on these forums but gosh I'd love someone's opinion on this!
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post #4 of 25 Old 04-30-2013, 06:39 PM
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Have you checked the features of each closely to see which one better matches your expectations...
Regarding reliability the Yamaha gets higher marks...


Just my $0.02... 👍😉
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post #5 of 25 Old 04-30-2013, 06:58 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M Code View Post

Have you checked the features of each closely to see which one better matches your expectations...
Regarding reliability the Yamaha gets higher marks...


Just my $0.02... 👍😉

Thanks for the reply M-Code

They are both sufficient for what I need. 4K passthrough is important to me for futureproofing (but not essential). 7.1 is essential if I'm going to have a 7.1 setup which both allow. Both have more than enough HDMI inputs. Both have component upscaling for my Wii. Both have HDMI-CEC (as they'll actually sit in a different room to the TV). They'll be networked with an ethernet port and plugged into a HTPC so I won't really use things like airplay etc on the actual receiver as the HTPC has a myriad of options like that anyway.

Which has better 7.1 movie performance. Music will be an afterthought (if that), the system really won't be called upon to play music at all.

Does that change your recommendation?
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post #6 of 25 Old 04-30-2013, 06:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Golfimbul View Post

...Denon slightly cheaper but that would be me importing it so warranty risks

You could try the Yamaha first, return it if you don't like it. Then look at import options.
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post #7 of 25 Old 04-30-2013, 07:22 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Badouri View Post

You could try the Yamaha first, return it if you don't like it. Then look at import options.

The yamaha would be an online purchase too so no easy return option (from about 3000km away).

It sounds as though there's no great difference between the two performance wise?

What is better for movies?

I understand the Denon is better for initial setup (Audyssey vs YPAO) or is that incorrect?
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post #8 of 25 Old 04-30-2013, 07:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Golfimbul View Post

The yamaha would be an online purchase too so no easy return option (from about 3000km away).

It sounds as though there's no great difference between the two performance wise?

What is better for movies?

I understand the Denon is better for initial setup (Audyssey vs YPAO) or is that incorrect?

This post sums it up...
Quote:
Originally Posted by afrogt View Post

The Yamaha 673 has a universal crossover whereas the Denon has separate crossovers for the front, center and surround speakers.

So if you have different size speakers with the Yamaha its going to set the crossover based on the smallest speaker. For instance with small satellites as surrounds it may set the crossover at 100hz or 120hz even if your larger fronts should be crossed over at 60hz or 80hz.

Plus the Denon with Audyssey MultEQ XT will EQ the subwoofer.
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post #9 of 25 Old 04-30-2013, 07:50 PM - Thread Starter
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Even now I'm likely to have a universal crossover anyway (of 80hz) with the 10sr and 10cs?
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post #10 of 25 Old 05-05-2013, 08:37 PM - Thread Starter
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Right so I've ordered the speakers! I went

Fronts: Wharfedale Diamond 121
Centre: Wharfedale Diamond 101c
Surrounds: Wharfedale Diamond 10.0
Rears: Wharfedale Diamond 10.0

Likely an SVS PB-1000 as the sub.

Denon 2113 still the best fit?
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post #11 of 25 Old 05-06-2013, 03:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Golfimbul View Post

Right so I've ordered the speakers! I went

Fronts: Wharfedale Diamond 121
Centre: Wharfedale Diamond 101c
Surrounds: Wharfedale Diamond 10.0
Rears: Wharfedale Diamond 10.0

Likely an SVS PB-1000 as the sub.

Denon 2113 still the best fit?

Based on a couple of reviews of other yamaha models the Denon would likely have more power with 5 or 7 channels driven. Enough to make an audible difference? Couldn't say. Of those 2, I would go for the Denon.

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post #12 of 25 Old 05-06-2013, 03:13 PM
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I would go with the Denon, Yamaha tend to lose power after two channels. so a hundred watt per channel at two channels might be 50 watts at 5 or seven channels.
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post #13 of 25 Old 05-06-2013, 05:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by donsboys58 View Post

I would go with the Denon, Yamaha tend to lose power after two channels. so a hundred watt per channel at two channels might be 50 watts at 5 or seven channels.

Hmmmm, would like to see the evidence on this statement.
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post #14 of 25 Old 05-06-2013, 05:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by donsboys58 View Post

I would go with the Denon, Yamaha tend to lose power after two channels. so a hundred watt per channel at two channels might be 50 watts at 5 or seven channels.

Every receiver loses power after 2 channels, and if the Denon 2113 is more powerful than the RX-V673, it's probably not by much. One is a 24lb the other is a 23lb amp, they are both pretty similar.
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post #15 of 25 Old 05-07-2013, 03:05 AM - Thread Starter
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Thanks guys, I went with the Denon in the end

It was virtually unanimously recommended over the Yamaha
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post #16 of 25 Old 05-07-2013, 03:48 AM
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Great! Join us in the 2012 Denon AVR-XX13 Owner's thread linked in my sig for more helpful information as well as reviewing posts #3-6 in that thread.

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post #17 of 25 Old 05-07-2013, 04:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Golfimbul View Post

Thanks guys, I went with the Denon in the end

So how is the Denon?

I'll be checking the thread that jdsmoothie recommended anyway, but I'm also looking for a 7.1 receiver, and it would also be entirely for home theatre usage. Being in Australia, my options are limited (and everything's so much more expensive), but the 2113 is at about the price I can afford. Either that or the 2313, if the missus will let me blow over a grand on this.

I haven't owned a Denon before, only Yamaha, Pioneer and (my current) Onkyo, but I must admit, I've been looking forward to trying one out.
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post #18 of 25 Old 05-07-2013, 09:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by highdefav1 View Post

Hmmmm, would like to see the evidence on this statement.

Close as I could find. The Yamaha should be compared with the 3313. And the lower end Yamaha 473/573 could not complete the test with more than 2 channels driven. In the end 5 and 7 channel outputs don't make that much difference for most applications but it does tell something about the amp and supporting electronics.

Denon AVR-2313CI A/V Receiver HT Labs Measures


HT Labs Measures
Two channels driven continuously into 8-ohm loads:
0.1% distortion at 126.8 watts
1% distortion at 152.1 watts

Five channels driven continuously into 8-ohm loads:
0.1% distortion at 77.7 watts
1% distortion at 90.8 watts

Seven channels driven continuously into 8-ohm loads:
0.1% distortion at 74.3 watts
1% distortion at 84.3 watts


Yamaha RX-A1020 A/V Receiver HT Labs Measures


HT Labs Measures
Two channels driven continuously into 8-ohm loads:
0.1% distortion at 113.5 watts
1% distortion at 129.2 watts

Five channels driven continuously into 8-ohm loads:
0.1% distortion at 63.9 watts
1% distortion at 73.2 watts

Seven channels driven continuously into 8-ohm loads:
0.1% distortion at 57.0 watts
1% distortion at 65.1 watts

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post #19 of 25 Old 05-08-2013, 02:10 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Venturai View Post

Being in Australia, my options are limited (and everything's so much more expensive), but the 2113 is at about the price I can afford. Either that or the 2313

I'm in Australia too. I have ordered it from amazon.de for $550au delivered!

I only ordered it two days ago though.

My setup has a receiver from Germany, speaker cable from the US and speakers from the UK

I got what I wanted for much less! I can't even find the Diamond 100 range for sale here yet!
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post #20 of 25 Old 05-08-2013, 02:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Golfimbul View Post

I'm in Australia too. I have ordered it from amazon.de for $550au delivered!

You've got bigger balls than me mate, I couldn't do that. Not for electronic equipment that big, no way. On the bright side, you're saving yourself a good $400au off of how much it costs over here, but when it's all wired up and you're ready to switch her on, I reckon I'd be crossing my fingers at that moment.

Of course, the Denon is, by all accounts, a trustworthy brand, but I'm in Perth, and a couple years back, I bought an Onkyo 1007 from Eastwood Hifi in NSW. Wouldn't you know it, the first unit they sent me was broken, and it wouldn't decode the hd audio tracks like Dolby TrueHD and DTS-HD MA properly. After a few days of emails back and forth, they eventually came to the party and replaced the unit, but I don't think I could ever bring myself to buy remote again, and certainly not overseas. If I have to pay more, then so be it.

Good luck. I'm not a believer, but when that thing comes, I'll be praying for ya anyway smile.gif
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post #21 of 25 Old 05-08-2013, 01:43 PM
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go look at reviews for Yamaha and Denon recievers in home theater mag or sound and vision and look at the output at 2 and 5 channels. I have been involved in audio for 30 years, I am not saying this just to hear myself talk. I'll look up the reviews and post the specs later this week. I'm just trying to help people get the best system for the money.
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post #22 of 25 Old 05-08-2013, 01:56 PM
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Denon AVR-3312CI this one is at the same price point as the Yamaha $1100-1200

HT Labs Measures
Two channels driven continuously into 8-ohm loads:
0.1% distortion at 122.9 watts
1% distortion at 143.3 watts

Five channels driven continuously into 8-ohm loads:
0.1% distortion at 82.9 watts
1% distortion at 103.0 watts

Seven channels driven continuously into 8-ohm loads:
0.1% distortion at 79.5 watts
1% distortion at 96.8 watts

Analog frequency response in Pure Direct mode:
–0.13 dB at 10 Hz
–0.04 dB at 20 Hz
+0.07 dB at 20 kHz
–2.65 dB at 50 kHz

Analog frequency response with signal processing:
–0.40 dB at 10 Hz
–0.14 dB at 20 Hz
–0.20 dB at 20 kHz
–58.93 dB at 50 kHz
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post #23 of 25 Old 05-09-2013, 01:38 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Venturai View Post

You've got bigger balls than me mate, I couldn't do that. Not for electronic equipment that big, no way. On the bright side, you're saving yourself a good $400au off of how much it costs over here, but when it's all wired up and you're ready to switch her on, I reckon I'd be crossing my fingers at that moment.

I'm in north Queensland so everything would be shipped to me.

I figure it would be a pain in the ass to ship it back to Germany but not THAT much worse than shipping it back to Melbourne/Sydney.

Who dares wins right?

Thanks for the positive vibes. Keep sending them!
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post #24 of 25 Old 05-09-2013, 01:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Venturai View Post

You've got bigger balls than me mate, I couldn't do that. Not for electronic equipment that big, no way. On the bright side, you're saving yourself a good $400au off of how much it costs over here, but when it's all wired up and you're ready to switch her on, I reckon I'd be crossing my fingers at that moment.

I've bought a SVS subwoofer from the US, and a Oppo DVD player...no problems, no damage.

Krell Evolution 900e x 7

Bose Jewel speakers.

 

Jealous of my speakers?

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post #25 of 25 Old 05-09-2013, 02:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fatbottom View Post

I've bought a SVS subwoofer from the US, and a Oppo DVD player...no problems, no damage.

Actually, your reply served as a reminder to me that I did infact purchase my own sub, the Seaton SubMersive, from the states. They go out of their way to include a power cable for whichever region it's being sent to, which did inspire a lot of confidence.

Still don't think I'd be willing to try it with a receiver, though, but good luck Golfimbul. Be sure to let us know how it's all going when it arrives smile.gif
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