Pioneer Elite SC-72 or Denon X4000 - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 11 Old 07-16-2013, 09:34 AM - Thread Starter
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I currently have a SC-07 and want to upgrade. Would like to have bluetooth, 3D and use the receiver for my living room and patio and garage in the future. Ive read that the calibration is better on the Denon but how does the Pioneer compare since its the same as my receiver? I have Deftech Bp2002 towers, mythos 8 center and RSS 3 for my rears. I know that new receivers are coming out, is there last years models I should be looking for a good deal? We watch a lot of movies, football, tv, gaming and starting to get into music.
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post #2 of 11 Old 07-16-2013, 10:39 AM
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If you want the best-sounding receiver money can buy, look at the Cambridge Audio 551R and 651R.

IMO nothing on the market can touch their outstanding sound quality.

Their CAMCAS system does the system setup very well.

Home Theater magazine loves them; check out their reviews.

Denon is very good, but I wouldn't have a Pioneer if they were giving them away; they have cheaped out in their amplifier designs, and I think the sound quality is 2nd-rate.
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post #3 of 11 Old 07-16-2013, 12:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by commsysman View Post

Home Theater magazine loves them; check out their reviews.

Denon is very good, but I wouldn't have a Pioneer if they were giving them away; they have cheaped out in their amplifier designs, and I think the sound quality is 2nd-rate.

well there's an objective opinion rolleyes.gif

you conveniently forgot to mention that Home Theater Magazine also has been giving Pioneers 4.5 & 5 ratings out of 5, including sound quality, from the Ice amps to the new amp design for years.

http://www.hometheater.com/content/pioneer-elite-sc-68-av-receiver

http://www.hometheater.com/content/pioneer-elite-sc-57-av-receiver

http://www.hometheater.com/content/pioneer-elite-sc-37-av-receiver

you've been (ahem) "promoting" Cambridge every chance you get in nearly every AVR brand thread for several years so you don't have much credibility as an objective person giving advice rolleyes.gif

if you're going to use a source to back up your "claim", then you need to also mention that the same source gives the same high marks to top models from Denon, Marantz AND Pioneer

rolleyes.gif

o yes, if my memory is correct, aren't you a dealer or buddies with a dealer for Cambridge? just asking wink.gif

here's the cambridge

http://www.hometheater.com/content/cambridge-audio-azur-751r-av-receiver

while it also gets good & excellent ratings, for $3000, Cambridge doesn't even bother to use an advanced form of Audyssey.

In fact, Cambridge uses the absolute most basic form, entry level. 2EQ doesn't even do equalization!

comparing room EQ features alone, Pioneer's MCACC is far more advanced than Audyssey 2EQ, with EQ & reverb compensation, phase control & standing wave filters.

http://www.audyssey.com/audio-technology/multeq

gee, objectivity is a witch wink.gif

try again rolleyes.gif
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post #4 of 11 Old 07-16-2013, 01:07 PM
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Last year I replaced an SC-05 with a Denon 4311(with Audyssey XT32 like the X4000 has) and to me it was a definite improvement in sound quality. I have nothing bad to say about the SC-05 as it's a beautiful AVR that's built like a tank, but to my ears Audyssey XT32 is the clear winner over MCACC.

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post #5 of 11 Old 07-16-2013, 01:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ss9001 View Post

In fact, Cambridge uses the absolute most basic form. 2EQ doesn't even do equalization!

"Price: $2,999 At A Glance: Beefy but balanced performer • Top-of-the-line amplifier design • Entry-level Audyssey 2EQ "

eek.gif

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post #6 of 11 Old 07-16-2013, 01:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 02saleen346 View Post

I currently have a SC-07 and want to upgrade.

Top models from Pioneer, Denon, Marantz equivalents to Denon, and I'll throw in Onkyo, will all be good choices.

We all have biases, some have clearly more than others, to the extreme wink.gif

if I were to change brands from Pioneer top models, like the SC-68 I have or the latest SC-79, I would look at the Denon 4520 & Marantz 8801 prepro - they would be the next top models I'd consider.

I have nothing against Cambridge, but if I were spending $2500-3000 for another top model, I'd at least expect them to include the advanced version of room correction/EQ that they license, not the entry level.

In that price bracket, ALL of Cambridge's competitors that use Audyssey include MultiEQ XT32 or the next one down, MultiEQ XT. Audyssey 2EQ is the bottom of the heap - you get speaker distance, delay, preamp levels, that's all. You'd find that in a < $500 receiver!

shop wisely smile.gif

if you want to discuss the merits of MultiEQ XT32 vs MCACC, we can do that or you can visit the MCACC thread, Denon threads, etc. I can be objective, even owning Pioneer smile.gif

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post #7 of 11 Old 07-16-2013, 01:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by holt7153 View Post

"Price: $2,999 At A Glance: Beefy but balanced performer • Top-of-the-line amplifier design • Entry-level Audyssey 2EQ "

eek.gif

yup. pretty sad for a $3000 receiver nowadays! that defies belief, doesn't it? NAD at least uses MultiEQ XT.

if it had MultiEQ XT32, it could be a good alternative, but it doesn't.

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post #8 of 11 Old 07-16-2013, 03:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by commsysman View Post

If you want the best-sounding receiver money can buy, look at the Cambridge Audio 551R and 651R.

IMO nothing on the market can touch their outstanding sound quality.

Their CAMCAS system does the system setup very well.

Home Theater magazine loves them; check out their reviews.

Denon is very good, but I wouldn't have a Pioneer if they were giving them away; they have cheaped out in their amplifier designs, and I think the sound quality is 2nd-rate.
Cambridge is a odd sell to any potential buyer. While they provide decent amps and build quality, the inclusion of only Audyssey MultiEQ is comparable to more like a $300 AVR?

As you said "They didn't sell well in the USA because everyone is so hung up on Audessy (which I could do without, personally)." Well most AVR's owners do make use of room correction be it MCACC, ARC, Audyssey, YPAO.

In this a comparison, a Pioneer SC-72 or a Denon AVR-X4000 is greatly preferred over anything Cambridge offers, because Cambridge is just too small a company to license various technologies. From a networking and video standpoint Cambridge is fine for a audiophile, but a poor choice for anyone wanted a up-to-date 4k networked AVR. cool.gif

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post #9 of 11 Old 09-07-2013, 04:42 PM
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Hey Gang...

New to this forum and just picked up my Elite SC-72 this morning... I've only had an hour to play with it and need a lot more time. My first question though is that I thought the SC-72 had a TV "pass-thru" mode where you didn't have to power it up to watch Dora the Explorer on your TV. My 4 year just wants to watch TV. Is there a setting I'm missing to make the TV "pass-thru" working?
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post #10 of 11 Old 12-25-2013, 08:47 AM
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Did you ever resolve this?

Thanks, 2therock

 

My Setup

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post #11 of 11 Old 12-25-2013, 08:53 AM
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You have to enable 'Kuro-Link' on bot sets smile.gif
On your Pioneer receiver you have to enable 'Kuro-Link' or 'HDMI Control', and the same on your TV, you're TV has to support HDMI-CEC, if your TV does not support HDMI-CEC you're justout of luck.

The Passtrough mode is a feature of the newer HDMI versions, most TV's from 2011 onwards do support that feature.
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TV: Panasonic TX-P50VT30E
Audio | Receiver: Pioneer VSX-AX2AS-S (Pioneer Elite VSX-82TXS) | Speakers: 2x KEF Q900 for Fronts | 2x KEF Q700 for Rears
Audio/Video Sources | Panasonic DMP-BDT 310 | Pioneer PL-510 | HTPC using Intel i3-3220 16GB XBMC on Ubuntu 13.10
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