Denon AVR-X4000 + Samsung ES8000 + Smart Hub setup - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 18 Old 08-24-2013, 08:54 PM - Thread Starter
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Hi;

I just got a Denon AVR-X4000 to hook up to my Samsung ES8000, and am having an issue trying to get this setup correctly. It seems that I'm either missing something or this is harder than I hoped to get working without unexpected quirks. I'm getting the sinking feeling I can't get it to do what I want..

I was wondering if there's a convenient way to get around a problem I'm having with the TV changing the AVR input to 'TV' when the T.V's turned on. (I want it to come up playing the cable video/audio but still be able to use the 'Smart-Hub' without having to manually switch the inputs).

I hooked up my various players to the AVR (Bluray, Cable box, etc) as well as the Samsung via HDMI cables..

The TV has a 'Smart-Hub' function to play Netflix, etc. So, I need to get the sound out of the T.V. (to the AVR) in some situations when it is 'playing' things. I was hoping to find a way to get the AVR to send the selected HDMI audio/video to the T.V., but use the T.V.s sound output to be sent to the AVR speakers.

Before I got the AVR I was using the Samsung as my HDMI switch and an old Stereo receiver to take the stereo analogue output from the T.V. and always use it as the sound source. This worked well, but would only do stereo. I could hear the sounds added by the T.V. and both normal and Smart-Hub audio.

But, I couldn't find a way to get the AVR to send the selected HDMI audio/video to the TV and then return the audio back from the AVR to be used as the source for it's amplifiers/speakers.

So, in order to get the T.V.s 'Smart-Hub' sound to automatically work when needed, I ended up using the ARC channel and HDMI-CEC/Anynet+ functionality. (Otherwise I would seem to need to manually switch the AVR input when starting/ending using the Smart-Hub for NetFlix etc.between 'Cable' and 'TV').

This mostly works fine. When I am watching normal TV, the Cable box sends the video/audio to the AVR (plays the audio on it's speakers), and the AVR sends this on to the T.V..

When I enter Netflix on the TV, the AVR automatically switches the input to 'TV' and gets the sound from the TV ARC and plays it on the main speakers. So far so good.

And, when I first turn the T.V. and AVR on, things come up fine playing the Cable input. But, within about 10 seconds the TV insists on changing the AVR input selection to 'TV' which shows me only the Denon AVR logo and no sound. Manually switching to 'Cable' fixes that (so I can get the normal T.V. video and sound).

So far the choices I've found seem to be to either

A) Use the anynet+ functions and live with it setting the wrong input on the AVR when turning the TV on, leaving Netflix,
turning off the bluray player, etc.

or

B) Turn off the anynet+ functionality, run an optical cable between the TV output and the AVR. But then I would need to manually
switch the AVR input when starting or ending the Smart-Hub functions on the ES8000, etc.

Is there a way to get this to work better while retaining the automatic functionality?

Thanks;
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post #2 of 18 Old 08-24-2013, 11:59 PM
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Option B would be my choice. I would add a Harmony or Universal remote into the mix that way the input switching would be easier.
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post #3 of 18 Old 08-25-2013, 02:17 AM
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This is covered in post #3 of the 2013 Denon E/X Models thread linked in my sig and below ...

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1465528/the-official-2013-denon-e-series-x-series-avr-model-owners-thread-faq/0_100#user_E4

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post #4 of 18 Old 08-25-2013, 10:57 AM - Thread Starter
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Thanks. I looked at the reference info. and as best as I can tell it still comes down to the two options I listed above. I didn't see a way to get it to work automatically and not have the AVR auto-switch to TV output 5-10 seconds after system power-up.

The delay makes it especially infuriating since I could otherwise just 'Get it over with' right at start-up. Instead I have to wait for everything to settle first. Or go full manual and try to get a programmable remote to cover the gaps.

I'm trying to keep this simple so my wife and kids don't need to know too much about the setup to make this work.

It's frustrating to know that I came so close to getting everything to work automatically only to be shot down by the lack of a setting. Maybe an option on the Samsung to either have the AVR auto-set the source to TV at power-up or not (not to be confused with when you activate the Smart-hub features where it would seem to almost always be needed).

Or perhaps even better, add the ability to let me choose what and if to auto-set on the AVR at TV power-up. But, I imagine the second option would be harder to pull off.

I can't even go back to connecting everything to the TV (and using it as the input selector) since it won't pass the 5.1 signal from any of the HDMI inputs to either Optical or ARC out of the TV as far as I can tell.

So,, even if there were a 'loop' ability to pass the source Audio/Video signal through the AVR and play the returned signal through the actual AVR speakers, it seems like this wouldn't be allowed for 5.1 anyway.
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post #5 of 18 Old 08-25-2013, 03:58 PM
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A Harmony remote can do wonders to raise the WAF (ie. programmed to reselect the correct source after a programmed delay to allow for the switching of the AVR to the TV source). smile.gif

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post #6 of 18 Old 08-25-2013, 04:35 PM
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Have the same problem with un65f800 and Yamaha a820. If someone figures out the harmony sequence it would be great!
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post #7 of 18 Old 08-25-2013, 04:42 PM
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You should be able to add a 7-8 second delay on the Harmony between powering on the AVR and changing the input source.

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post #8 of 18 Old 01-04-2014, 06:29 AM
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So first I thought I would try the first suggestion. In my watch tv activity in the harmony control app I went to program the delay and was able to add that step. When I went to add the step to change my avr input back to sat/cable I selected the device to add the step to (denon avr 591) and then the list of commands looked nothing like what I needed like "input sat/cable". What am I missing?

Finally, If I decide that one more cable (optical) is no big deal from TV to avr what is the exact description on the cable? Samsung UD557000 to Denon AVR 591. Is it plug and play or will I need to wander into the dreaded Denon setup and make changes.

Finally finally.... Is there a section where people have posted setup steps and templates for systems. In others words samsung tv / denon avr/ TiVo premier/ Panasonic BD player./ harmont smart remote
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post #9 of 18 Old 01-04-2014, 06:34 AM
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The optical input to the Denon is labeled "TV" so no setting change required, rather on the Denon side it should be plug and play. On the Samsung side you'll likely have to change audio to "External Speakers".

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post #10 of 18 Old 04-07-2014, 09:49 AM
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gbohn, did you find a resolution?  I have the exact same situation and also want to simplify the set-up for my wife and kids.  Denon 2311CI and Samsung UN55F7500.  I don't need or want another remote, let alone have the signal interrupted momentarily after you have started the TV (so, presumably, the Harmony remote can switch things to the proper settings)

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post #11 of 18 Old 05-25-2014, 09:22 AM
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I am also looking for a solution to this issue. Anyone get around this?

Do we even know if this is a samsung or a denon issue??

I have new HU9000 and X4000... This issue is very frustrating!
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post #12 of 18 Old 05-25-2014, 10:32 AM
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^^
It's not an issue at all, rather simply the result of using HDMI(ARC). And the solution has already been discussed as option B in post #1. Turn off the HDMI-CEC (Anynet+) feature on the TV and simply use an optical cable from the TV to the AVR. Then when you select TV on the Denon remote, it will play the audio from the TV.

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post #13 of 18 Old 05-25-2014, 04:06 PM
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I suggest you put a splitter on your cable line and run one to the tv and run to your box, when you what to use your apps set receiver to TV and when you use your cable box set receiver to cable/sat input. I have basic cable no box and it works for me.
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post #14 of 18 Old 05-26-2014, 03:50 AM
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^^
Which is the same result as simply adding an optical cable from the TV to the AVR.
T100 likes this.

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post #15 of 18 Old 05-26-2014, 08:12 AM
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Feature? I don't see that at all.

Anynet is useless if the wife and kids cannot turn off and on and watch directv input(anynet enabled). Love the new samsung gyro remote, but if the system cannot be smart enought (anynet disabled) to switch to tv audio automatically, it becomes cumbersome.

I am seeing posts on this that are 3 years old. How is this not fixed yet?

Can anyone answer this.

What is happening with anynet/hdmi control enabled when the receiver switches to tv audio... Is the tv initiating that control? Or is the denon switching on its own?
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post #16 of 18 Old 05-26-2014, 02:50 PM
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your tv initiates this input switch on the avr.
i think all samsungs do this, maybe some other brands too.
judging by the manual denon is adding this year a feature to their avr lineup
that ignores this input mode switch while still leaving hdmi cec on.
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post #17 of 18 Old 05-26-2014, 04:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ciukacz View Post

your tv initiates this input switch on the avr.
i think all samsungs do this, maybe some other brands too.
judging by the manual denon is adding this year a feature to their avr lineup
that ignores this input mode switch while still leaving hdmi cec on.

Is it possible that the x4000 came with such a setting, and when I updated the firmware it went away? Was strange, but I could swear this was not happening during the first day of operation. The. I let the denon take the update and have had this issue since.

Hmmm. Wait. If what you say above is true, then that wouldn't help either. Will it? If it ignores all input mode switches, then I would be in the same boat I am now with anynet and hdmi-cec off. Having to manually change input to tv audio, when accessing smart tv. ???
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post #18 of 18 Old 05-26-2014, 07:09 PM
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^^
No the X4000 did not come with such a setting.

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