"Official" Emotiva UMC-200 Thread - Page 10 - AVS Forum
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post #271 of 394 Old 04-28-2014, 02:19 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Repdetect View Post

I am curious, have you ever been able to determine the stated "additional" processing that emotiva claims to take place when one runs emo-q, other than the eq'ing?

Understandable, they don't appear to want to disclose it, likely proprietary to them, like much else in their designs biggrin.gif

I suspect phase tweaks, but that's obviously a guess.

thanks

a) Emo-Q uses just a single mic location for a full range correction which is generally a bad idea and b) I've seen results of Emo-Q where it applied boosts only which again is a very bad idea. My conclusion: Don't waste your time with Emo-Q. Learn REW and use the built-in PEQ.

P.S. EQ-ing equals "phase tweaks".

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"In science, contrary evidence causes one to question a theory. In religion, contrary evidence causes one to question the evidence." - Floyd Toole
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post #272 of 394 Old 04-29-2014, 07:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by markus767 View Post

a) Emo-Q uses just a single mic location for a full range correction which is generally a bad idea and b) I've seen results of Emo-Q where it applied boosts only which again is a very bad idea. My conclusion: Don't waste your time with Emo-Q. Learn REW and use the built-in PEQ.

P.S. EQ-ing equals "phase tweaks".

Thanks.

If emo-q didn't sound so good on my system I would consider REW but I am happy with the sound, after a bit of tweaking.

I do have a well treated room which I feel ultimately has had the most profound effect on sound quality than I'd say most anything, except my speakers.

But again, I appreciate and enjoy your work & posts.

Mitsubishi WD73-742, Oppo BDP-103, Gallo 3.1/ Reference AV center/ Adiva-ti surrounds, Emotiva UMC-200/ XPA-5/ XPA-3, Toshiba HD-A3. Roku XS

 

"All rooms, speakers and ears are different, trust your own ears."

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post #273 of 394 Old 04-29-2014, 09:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by markus767 View Post

I'm using a USB audio interface and feed the signal to the analog input of the UMC-200. HDMI is a bag of hurt.

Sorry to bombard you with this stuff, but you seem to be the resident expert.

I don't have easy access to the back of my rack, so I'm trying to minimize the crawling, reaching, and unplugging. Please let me know if this sounds like a workflow that would work.

Macbook Air
UMIK-1
USB Audio interface
8-ch RCA snake (from USB audio to UMC)

For initial measurements in REW, can I connect all the 8 RCAs to the 7.1ch input on the UMC, connecting each one separately, getting initial readings, and then export the UMC PEQ settings?

I believe the 7.1ch inputs are direct and I won't be able to use them to check the PEQ results, but could I at least initially use them to read the initial curves?

After I've adjusted PEQ settings, what is the best way to remeasure to compare and analyze each channel individually?

Thanks!

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post #274 of 394 Old 04-29-2014, 10:03 AM
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Pulled trigger on UMC-200 + UPA-500.
Ordered Wed., standard shipping, received UMC-200 on Friday via FEDEX, and received UPA-500 via UPS following Monday. Much earlier than anticipated, free shipping of course!
All double boxed, perfect. No smell as some described.

Replacing dying Onkyo 806. I am about 90% Movies/Web Media 10% music

After running EMO-Q, distance was incorrect, but other than that, everything seemed reasonable.

Initial impressions? Very easy to use and set up. I read about the presets, direct vs all stereo,etc., so didn't get confused there.
Had some issues getting HTPC to output audio via HDMI rather than prior toslink (PC issue).
Had some issues with some media outputting MultiPCM, 2 channel, but with UMC-200 set to All Stereo OR PLII, neither matrixed for center channel output. I had to matrix on the HTPC, so ok there.
No issues with HDMI handshake. Rock solid.

Sound? I no longer have issues with center channel voice. Very well balanced between L/C/R from EMO-Q. Perhaps the Audyssey in the 806 never set the center well in the past. I could never tweak it to make it sound good.,
The sound across the 3 speakers was so transparent that I had some issues differentiating between just having L/R channels on, and L/C/R all on. I had to put my ear near the center channel to make sure that it was firing.
Definitely apparent when dialog came through though, which was again, very clear.

Definitely will be looking into working with REW.
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post #275 of 394 Old 04-29-2014, 02:30 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thrillcat View Post

I believe the 7.1ch inputs are direct and I won't be able to use them to check the PEQ results

Correct. That's why I use an analog stereo input for REW and simply swap the RCA preamp out to the speaker I'm testing.

Markus

"In science, contrary evidence causes one to question a theory. In religion, contrary evidence causes one to question the evidence." - Floyd Toole
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post #276 of 394 Old 04-30-2014, 06:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by markus767 View Post

Correct. That's why I use an analog stereo input for REW and simply swap the RCA preamp out to the speaker I'm testing.

Thanks!

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post #277 of 394 Old 05-06-2014, 06:17 PM
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I consider buying one but the manual has no mention about audio delay function. I thus assume it does not exist. can anyone confirm?
thanks
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post #278 of 394 Old 05-07-2014, 05:08 AM
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Check the Fusion 8100 manual, its much more complete than the UMC200 manual : http://emotiva.com/resources/manuals/fusion_8100_user_manual_v10.pdf
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post #279 of 394 Old 05-10-2014, 01:56 PM
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Is anybody using the UMC-200 with a Macbook Pro HDMI input? I just tried and it doesn't work. I am using a Mini DisplayPort adapter on the Macbook to connect to the UMC-200 via HDMI and the output of the UMC-200 is connected to a Sony Projector via HDMI. The Mac is handshaking with the UMC-200, because I see the video change to a darker blue and the mac shows a "UMC-200" window when I click "Detect Displays" in the Mac display preferences menu. Not matter what I do though, the picture is always just solid blue.

When I connect the macbook pro directly to the projector, it works fine. I'm surprised to have an issue because the UMC-200 is not supposed to do any video processing, so it seems like it should pass the Mac image through to the projector. I really need to be able to connect the Mac through the UMC-200 because it is too difficult to tap into the projector cable when I want to use the Mac and also because I don't get any sound when it is connected directly to the projector.
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post #280 of 394 Old 05-10-2014, 02:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pjp View Post

Is anybody using the UMC-200 with a Macbook Pro HDMI input? I just tried and it doesn't work. I am using a Mini DisplayPort adapter on the Macbook to connect to the UMC-200 via HDMI and the output of the UMC-200 is connected to a Sony Projector via HDMI. The Mac is handshaking with the UMC-200, because I see the video change to a darker blue and the mac shows a "UMC-200" window when I click "Detect Displays" in the Mac display preferences menu. Not matter what I do though, the picture is always just solid blue.

When I connect the macbook pro directly to the projector, it works fine. I'm surprised to have an issue because the UMC-200 is not supposed to do any video processing, so it seems like it should pass the Mac image through to the projector. I really need to be able to connect the Mac through the UMC-200 because it is too difficult to tap into the projector cable when I want to use the Mac and also because I don't get any sound when it is connected directly to the projector.

I've successfully sent video from a MacBook Air via hdmi but never got the audio to go.

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post #281 of 394 Old 05-10-2014, 02:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thrillcat View Post

I've successfully sent video from a MacBook Air via hdmi but never got the audio to go.

Interesting. The MacBook Air was routing HDMI through a UMC-200 to the TV? If so, this offers a glimmer of hope. I could probably live without HDMI audio if I had to and use analog audio from the headphone jack (though I'd really like the do 5.1 through HDMI) -- it's the manual video cabling I can't easily live with.
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post #282 of 394 Old 05-10-2014, 02:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pjp View Post

Interesting. The MacBook Air was routing HDMI through a UMC-200 to the TV? If so, this offers a glimmer of hope. I could probably live without HDMI audio if I had to and use analog audio from the headphone jack (though I'd really like the do 5.1 through HDMI) -- it's the manual video cabling I can't easily live with.

Yes, the adapter to hdmi 2 of the UMC 200 and out to a projector.

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post #283 of 394 Old 05-10-2014, 03:03 PM
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I'm not a Mac person, but I am running a Windows 7 HTPC with its HDMI out into the UMC-200, and from the UMC-200 to a HDMI computer monitor. It works fine, but the power-up sequence is a bit finicky. I first power up the monitor, then the UMC-200, then lastly the HTPC, with a few seconds wait between each step.
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post #284 of 394 Old 05-11-2014, 10:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thrillcat View Post

Yes, the adapter to hdmi 2 of the UMC 200 and out to a projector.

I'm running 10.6.8 on the MacBook Pro -- wonder if this makes a difference.

Quote:
Originally Posted by andyc56 View Post

I'm not a Mac person, but I am running a Windows 7 HTPC with its HDMI out into the UMC-200, and from the UMC-200 to a HDMI computer monitor. It works fine, but the power-up sequence is a bit finicky. I first power up the monitor, then the UMC-200, then lastly the HTPC, with a few seconds wait between each step.

More cause for hope. With the Mac, it works 100% reliably when connected directly to the projector regardless of power-up order. When the Mac is connected through the UMC-200, it is 100% unreliable -- it doesn't work at all regardless of the order the devices are powered up.
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post #285 of 394 Old 05-11-2014, 11:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pjp View Post

I'm running 10.6.8 on the MacBook Pro -- wonder if this makes a difference.
More cause for hope. With the Mac, it works 100% reliably when connected directly to the projector regardless of power-up order. When the Mac is connected through the UMC-200, it is 100% unreliable -- it doesn't work at all regardless of the order the devices are powered up.

My Air is my guinea pig- I'm always running the most recent OS on it to test the update before installing it on any mission critical machines.

I just did this a couple weeks ago, for that frame of reference. No OS updates since then.

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post #286 of 394 Old 05-14-2014, 01:48 PM
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Just picked up a UMC-200 for my theater. For the price, I couldn't beat it. All my devices are HDMI and I only have 4 of them so the limited connections are fine in my situation. If I get another device I can use one of the inputs on the Oppo I purchased with it until I feel the need to upgrade. For about the same as I was looking to spend on a receiver I was able to get a receiver AND the Oppo BDP-103D. If / when the XMC-1 is actually released I can get it 25% off now as long as I like the reviews. There seems to be some hate around here for Emo processors, but it seemed like a win/win to me. Cheap cost now if I like and 0 cost if I don't due to return policy and the opportunity to get any newer models for 25% less. That 25% will just about cover the original cost of the UMC-200. I'll see how I like it once it arrives.
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post #287 of 394 Old 05-15-2014, 06:11 AM
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just ordered one myself this morning - I believe I can overcome the quirks....smile.gif
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post #288 of 394 Old 05-23-2014, 09:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by markus767 View Post

Look what the cat dragged in smile.gif







I see you got the rack ears. How are you dealing with the odd sized space left above and below the UMC-200 due to the 1.5 RU size?
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post #289 of 394 Old 05-23-2014, 09:24 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by stoudtlr View Post

I see you got the rack ears. How are you dealing with the odd sized space left above and below the UMC-200 due to the 1.5 RU size?

It's not a bug, it's a feature smile.gif You get 0.75RU of space above and below for ventilation.
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post #290 of 394 Old 06-10-2014, 06:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by echo512 View Post

Pulled trigger on UMC-200 + UPA-500.
Ordered Wed., standard shipping, received UMC-200 on Friday via FEDEX, and received UPA-500 via UPS following Monday. Much earlier than anticipated, free shipping of course!
All double boxed, perfect. No smell as some described.

Replacing dying Onkyo 806. I am about 90% Movies/Web Media 10% music

After running EMO-Q, distance was incorrect, but other than that, everything seemed reasonable.

Initial impressions? Very easy to use and set up. I read about the presets, direct vs all stereo,etc., so didn't get confused there.
Had some issues getting HTPC to output audio via HDMI rather than prior toslink (PC issue).
Had some issues with some media outputting MultiPCM, 2 channel, but with UMC-200 set to All Stereo OR PLII, neither matrixed for center channel output. I had to matrix on the HTPC, so ok there.
No issues with HDMI handshake. Rock solid.

Sound? I no longer have issues with center channel voice. Very well balanced between L/C/R from EMO-Q. Perhaps the Audyssey in the 806 never set the center well in the past. I could never tweak it to make it sound good.,
The sound across the 3 speakers was so transparent that I had some issues differentiating between just having L/R channels on, and L/C/R all on. I had to put my ear near the center channel to make sure that it was firing.
Definitely apparent when dialog came through though, which was again, very clear.

Definitely will be looking into working with REW.

I see there haven't been to many posts on this thread lately. I am considering a purchase of a UMC-200 as I have an Onkyo PR-SC885P with a failing video section that I am at wits end with. Echo512 sounds pretty satisfied with moving from Onkyo to Emotiva. Despite Markus' reservations about the model being "dead", I am very interested in the unit, especially given the overall positive posts and helpful trouble shooting.

My "system" has been streamlined over the years. Now I have a rather simple setup of the Onkyo pre-amp, powered by Chiro c500 & c300 amplifiers, with Mirage speakers and subwoofer (3si, Csi, OM-R2, and BPSS-210). The only components are a PS3, AppleTV, and a Tivo Series 4 (Verizon Fios broadcast source) which accesses all of my digital music on my windows based PC.

So I have a couple of questions. Obviously, movies and TV are my primary use in this system. In particular, how is the HDMI switching and handshaking? I saw some posts relating issues, but were they more due to defective units and/or later solved by firmware upgrades? Is there a discernible pause when switching cable channels for those using cable set-top boxes, or better yet those using TiVo's? Echo512, do you think the UMC-200 performed better for you than your Onkyo in this regard?

My PR-SC885P runs HOT. From what I read, this is what led to so many Onkyo video board failures. Does the UMC-200 run hot? Have any users reading this experienced any video board failures akin to those of Onkyo receivers/pre-amps? I don't recall anyone posting such issues over the 10 pages of this thread.

Lastly, jumping on board this late gives me the virtue of past issues being already solved by firmware upgrades. But I'd hate to buy a "dead" model, if a new version is on the horizon. I don't see anything mentioned on the Emotiva website, but perhaps someone knows if a replacement (UMC-300 ?) is on horizon?

Thanks in advance for the advice and information. This is a great informative thread. smile.gif
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post #291 of 394 Old 06-10-2014, 07:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thos19 View Post


In particular, how is the HDMI switching and handshaking? I saw some posts relating issues, but were they more due to defective units and/or later solved by firmware upgrades? Is there a discernible pause when switching cable channels for those using cable set-top boxes, or better yet those using TiVo's? Echo512, do you think the UMC-200 performed better for you than your Onkyo in this regard?

Does the UMC-200 run hot?

Lastly, jumping on board this late gives me the virtue of past issues being already solved by firmware upgrades. But I'd hate to buy a "dead" model, if a new version is on the horizon. I don't see anything mentioned on the Emotiva website, but perhaps someone knows if a replacement (UMC-300 ?) is on horizon?

Welcome!

I have the UMC-200 and I think I can help.

I have had zero issues with the PS3 and AppleTV. It helps to wake up the AppleTV before you switch to that source, but the only real issue that happens is the OSD from the UMC-200 might show up in the wrong resolution and a different placement. Not a big deal, but just wake up the AppleTV first and you won't have it at all.

I have a TiVo Premiere - not a cable co. version, but the antenna version. I have had some issues with it, but they were easily handled, and not everyone has reported these issues. Occasionally, when watching TiVo w/audio via HDMI, the audio would lock onto a bit and repeat it loudly through all the speakers. It happened a few times in my first week, then I simply rerouted the audio with an optical cable (pairing video via HDMI and audio via optical is a simple process in the menu) and I haven't had the issue since. I wouldn't want to have to do this with a Bluray source, but I'm not losing any quality for television viewing, so I'm okay with it. As far as channel changing, that works great (with the new setup) and is very quick, no real delay at all.

The UMC-200 does not run hot at all. I can barely notice a difference on the top of the unit between off and after it's been running for several hours. Not a concern.

I wouldn't call it dead. I doubt we see any further firmware upgrades (though that could change after Emotiva gets the XMC-1 on the market), but I also don't think we'll see a replacement unit in the next couple years, either. Emotiva's business model does not entail releasing a new series of product every year. Of course, the XMC-1 is on the way, but it's not exactly a replacement at 4x the cost of the UMC-200.

I've been very pleased with the UMC-200 (I just purchased in April). I'm very satisfied with it, I feel like it was money well spent. I initially ruled it out because of only 4 HDMI inputs, and I bought an AVR instead. That only lasted 3 months before I went back to my initial instinct and bought the UMC-200 (and a UPA-700).

For more in-depth, here's my full review on the 200.
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post #292 of 394 Old 06-10-2014, 07:16 AM
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Ditto what thrillcat said. I haven't seen any overheating issues with mine and I've had in on over 12 hrs straight on numerous occasions since owning it. It actually runs quite cool. I'm glad that I purchased it when I did because most of the initial bugs seem to have been worked out with the firmware updates and I haven't experienced any issues with it. There isn't any word yet on a replacement product but when that does happen you get a 25% discount for being the owner of a previous model so that is a big plus IMO.
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post #293 of 394 Old 06-10-2014, 08:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thos19 View Post

So I have a couple of questions. Obviously, movies and TV are my primary use in this system. In particular, how is the HDMI switching and handshaking? I saw some posts relating issues, but were they more due to defective units and/or later solved by firmware upgrades? Is there a discernible pause when switching cable channels for those using cable set-top boxes, or better yet those using TiVo's? Echo512, do you think the UMC-200 performed better for you than your Onkyo in this regard?

The ONKYO model I had was the SR-806, and it was 7-8 years old. I never used it for cable box TV watching. My main gripes with that unit and HDMI was that it was painfully slow at switching from one input to another, as well as sometimes taking forever to lock on to my HDMI signal from HTPC.

With the UMC-200, it is pretty quick. Quick enough I can't complain about it, and no one has even commented about it at my house.
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post #294 of 394 Old 06-10-2014, 09:01 AM
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Ditto. I love mine. You cannot get a better value (price/features/performance) anywhere.
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post #295 of 394 Old 06-10-2014, 01:54 PM - Thread Starter
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Ditto. I love mine. You cannot get a better value (price/features/performance) anywhere.

There are many AVRs that are cheaper and have more features and "performance" (whatever that is).
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post #296 of 394 Old 06-10-2014, 01:58 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by thos19 View Post

jumping on board this late gives me the virtue of past issues being already solved by firmware upgrades.

Just that past issues haven't been resolved and they probably never will because Emotiva feels that the unit "works as designed" even if that design doesn't make much sense.
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post #297 of 394 Old 06-10-2014, 03:59 PM
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There are many AVRs that are cheaper and have more features and "performance" (whatever that is).

More features for sure. Most features only matter if you want redundancy. I have had many AVR's and none had better SQ. Of course it seems most jump at the latest feature and could care less about sound quality.
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post #298 of 394 Old 06-10-2014, 04:01 PM
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Originally Posted by markus767 View Post

Just that past issues haven't been resolved and they probably never will because Emotiva feels that the unit "works as designed" even if that design doesn't make much sense.

If it sounds as good as the so called properly designed units why change?

Almost forgot. You care more about design than sound quality.
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post #299 of 394 Old 06-10-2014, 11:47 PM
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Originally Posted by MUDCAT45 View Post

If it sounds as good as the so called properly designed units why change?

Almost forgot. You care more about design than sound quality.

Because it doesn't under several scenarios, such as no bass on the headphone output if you use bass management for your speakers, due to the design choices?


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post #300 of 394 Old 06-11-2014, 12:11 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by MUDCAT45 View Post

If it sounds as good as the so called properly designed units why change?

How do you know? Nobody ever did a properly conducted blind test.
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Originally Posted by MUDCAT45 View Post

Almost forgot. You care more about design than sound quality.

You can't have "sound quality" if the design is wrong. For example: the UMC-200 headphone output simply carries a channel downmix of the speaker feeds. All processing that is applied to the speakers ends up in your headphone. Is this what you call "sound quality"? In my book this is an example for how bad design choices make bad sound quality.

Markus

"In science, contrary evidence causes one to question a theory. In religion, contrary evidence causes one to question the evidence." - Floyd Toole
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Reply Receivers, Amps, and Processors

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Emotiva Umc 200 7 1 Home Theater Preamp Surround Processor , Onkyo Tx Nr3008 9 2 Channel Network Home Theater Receiver , Denon Avr 2312ci Receiver
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